Casey & Family Psychological Profile #3

[Kat]

I'm not sure where to post this. So I will post this here. I was looking at the pictures that Momtective posted in another thread (post #852)

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78135&page=24

Can someone explain to me (in very simple terms) why it looks as though KC is experiencing glee watching CA suffer? What compels KC to do this to someone? I have seen others on other threads say she is evil. I understand that, but I am looking for more of an explanation. TIA for anyone that has the patience to explain some of this to me.

 

[stilettos]

Heck, Debs, I'll give you $5.00 for this! And, you win today's Woolworth Award for Dimestore Psychology!

I disagree with you on only one point. I don't think she is capable of love, not even for her child. Sociopaths are not "developed" enough. They are missing parts of their personalities. For that reason, I don't think she tried to spare Klee from CA's enmeshment. I think she just saw Klee as a power icon, in the war between the Queen Bees.

But, I'll bet you are right, in that she observed and mimicked other moms! If you put KC on a couch, she'd turn into an accent pillow, in a harmonizing color.

I think, like you, that once she gets used to the idea of being in jail for decades, she'll be the perfect prisoner. She might even end up a trusty. She won't agitate for extras, but she will manage to get them.

And, the structure might even be good for her. Might make her feel secure and protected. Three hots and a cot, time scheduled for her, every day.

I think they might have only two danger areas: 1) seducing males in the system, and 2) cageing people who write to her out of money.

Like most notorious criminals, she is likely to have "fans." Like many other notorious criminals, I think she's likely to marry a fan, to have someone outside to send her things.

Pesonality Disordered people do much better in structured enviornments. You are correct about the seduction of males in her enviornment. I think you'd have to plant her in the ground to stop that behavior.

 

[kiki the parrot]

I'm not sure where to post this. So I will post this here. I was looking at the pictures that Momtective posted in another thread (post #852)

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=78135&page=24

Can someone explain to me (in very simple terms) why it looks as though KC is experiencing glee watching CA suffer? What compels KC to do this to someone? I have seen others on other threads say she is evil. I understand that, but I am looking for more of an explanation. TIA for anyone that has the patience to explain some of this to me.

In the simplest terms, and IMO only of course, it doesn't strike me as so much evil as immature--and fleeting, as we just as quickly see this front evaporate. (As incredible as this is under these circumstances, it's obvious there must have been a long history after many even serious violations or infractions by KC, when pouring on the charm alone worked--and she was gonna "work it," because a narcissist has only a limited number of tricks up their sleeve and weapons in their arsenal.) Overall, in keeping w KC's manipulation of her family, this was in order to: put up a facade, try to appear unburdened, feign having no further knowledge, thus avoid further questions, deflect responsibility (beyond that is being too "innocent and naive" as to leave your child in the care of a trusted "kidnapper..." :boohoo, divert attention from any immediate reality of impact on family, and/or downplay the gravity of the situation in general. So far, so good! JMO

 

[Searchfortruth]

That is the problem once they reach their majority. When she was a child she was placed on about 20 or so different cocktails of medications. The only one that had ANY effect was Zyprexa. As soon as she reached 18 and was allowed to refuse medication, she did so. She feels (according to her) that her mind is stronger than others who had (according to her) this disorder in childhood. In the meantime, she is wreaking havoc on her life and the lives of others w/out it. IDK about Casey's NPD. Our daughter has the same tendancy to think she is omnipotent and "above" others.

I believe the lack of insight is a common thread that runs through most of the personality disorders, making treatment ineffective. My heart goes out to you and your family, I can't imagine the stress that is involved. I wonder about Casey and her family, and imagine that the "battles" have been fought for many years now. Cindy's description of her perfect family to the FBI, really didn't help them in answering the questions they must have had as to why. If anything, hopefully this case will broaden the discussion of personality disorders and the family's that have to cope with those that are affected.

 

[stilettos]

I think that is another thing that confuses me about Cindy. How could she not suck it up and face her daughter's issues and get the girl some help. These behaviors did not just start in adulthood. So, why as a mother do you look the other way? How it looks? Who cares when it comes to your children. Their needs come first. Even when it's painful. JMO

 

[kiki the parrot]

That is the problem once they reach their majority. When she was a child she was placed on about 20 or so different cocktails of medications. The only one that had ANY effect was Zyprexa. As soon as she reached 18 and was allowed to refuse medication, she did so. She feels (according to her) that her mind is stronger than others who had (according to her) this disorder in childhood. In the meantime, she is wreaking havoc on her life and the lives of others w/out it. IDK about Casey's NPD. Our daughter has the same tendancy to think she is omnipotent and "above" others.

I was interested to learn that there are elements of narcissism, ie it is the common denominator, in all of the personality disorders. I am personally not a professional and so couldn't presume to say whether this is the extent of her pathology, give any dx much less a comprehensive one including what other coexisting disorders may be present (oy...), have just learned to recognize signs of pathological narcissism. Btw, I'm really sorry too for the years of heartbreaking trials with your daughter, it sounds like you have waged a really long battle on her behalf and have had to be very strong. JMHUO

 

[Searchfortruth]

I think that is another thing that confuses me about Cindy. How could she not suck it up and face her daughter's issues and get the girl some help. These behaviors did not just start in adulthood. So, why as a mother do you look the other way? How it looks? Who cares when it comes to your children. Their needs come first. Even when it's painful. JMO

I shake my head in confusion when it comes to Cindy. I don't know how a mother can turn her head for so long and then make up a new reality to live by, especially when a child is involved. Someone said that George had said at one point, when Casey was home on bail, that he was tired of living a lie. How a family can function, wake up day after day ignoring the truth, living in a false world, I do not know. How long has Cindy lived like this, in denial and enabling her daughter ? Would there have been a different outcome for Casey without Cindy ? I can't know for sure, but I tend to think the answer is yes.

 

[stilettos]

I was interested to learn that there are elements of narcissism, ie it is the common denominator, in all of the personality disorders. I am personally not a professional and so couldn't presume to say whether this is the extent of her pathology, give any dx much less a comprehensive one including what other coexisting disorders may be present (oy...), have just learned to recognize signs of pathological narcissism. Btw, I'm really sorry too for the years of heartbreaking trials with your daughter, it sounds like you have waged a really long battle on her behalf and have had to be very strong. JMHUO

I was not strong at first. Her violence reminded me of my childhood. I would hide in the tub with the door locked while she took every picture off the walls and broke things. One day I woke up knowing that I was just making it worse and not helping the daughter I loved. So Mom became the strong one. While most of the time she hates my guts because I call her on EVERYTHING, she will tell you her name for me is Mominator because I take care of my kids at all costs. She will also tell a new foster child to be careful, my mom calls the popo at the drop of a hat!! You gotta laugh when you can!!

 

[kiki the parrot]

I shake my head in confusion when it comes to Cindy. I don't know how a mother can turn her head for so long and then make up a new reality to live by, especially when a child is involved. Someone said that George had said at one point, when Casey was home on bail, that he was tired of living a lie. How a family can function, wake up day after day ignoring the truth, living in a false world, I do not know. How long has Cindy lived like this, in denial and enabling her daughter ? Would there have been a different outcome for Casey without Cindy ? I can't know for sure, but I tend to think the answer is yes.

(bold mine) How can they function like this... you got me! They are all living a lie--and CA seems to be at the heart of them, protecting and perpetuating those lies, and there were so very many of them. Deception also causes continual conflict. I just could never stand it. KC didn't have a birth defect or any dna which programmed her to deceive, exploit and manipulate: KC learned this. A different outcome? For KC--AND for Caylee. There is not a doubt in my mind. JMO

 

[passionflower]

There may be some psychological significance to Bella Vita. Lindsey Lohan sings La Bella Vita. I assume Casey Anthony would be a fan. I won't post the lyrics - here is the link:
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/lindsaylohan/beautifullifelabellavita.html

after reading the words to the song, it is depressing........IMO

 

[kiki the parrot]

I was not strong at first. Her violence reminded me of my childhood. I would hide in the tub with the door locked while she took every picture off the walls and broke things. One day I woke up knowing that I was just making it worse and not helping the daughter I loved. So Mom became the strong one. While most of the time she hates my guts because I call her on EVERYTHING, she will tell you her name for me is Mominator because I take care of my kids at all costs. She will also tell a new foster child to be careful, my mom calls the popo at the drop of a hat!! You gotta laugh when you can!!

The po-... lol. Omg it is an awful position to be in. I am a single mom of four and when my youngest son was 14 or 15 I had to do this once--he was as big as me and so one day lost his mind and thought that he was in charge... LOL!! It made me so mad because, while I'm a pretty strict, no-nonsense parent and he knows it, on this occasion he was defying and daring me and I just knew if he'd had a dad around all those years to put some fear in him or woop his rear when he needed it, he would never have dared speak to me like he did that day. Wouldn't you know, they sent a lady po-po... (sigh...) Anyway he's 16 now and since I called his bluff, he's back to being pretty behaved... and at least now he knows Moms won't play if it comes down to it! Gotta show 'em whose boss Hang in there "Mominator," continue finding w/e humor you can in everything (I know I have to!) and hope you don't have to call for anymore "back-up" lol!

 

[eddeva]

There may be some psychological significance to Bella Vita. Lindsey Lohan sings La Bella Vita. I assume Casey Anthony would be a fan. I won't post the lyrics - here is the link:
http://www.azlyrics.com/lyrics/lindsaylohan/beautifullifelabellavita.html

i can't see casey being a fan of lohan, i mean, well that would be embarrassing to someone like casey. after all she saw herself as cool.
all the same lohan has the same tattoo but on her lower back.

 

[Brini]

Pesonality Disordered people do much better in structured enviornments. You are correct about the seduction of males in her enviornment. I think you'd have to plant her in the ground to stop that behavior.

Planting her sounds like a GREAT idea! ;-)

 

[radio]

i can't see casey being a fan of lohan, i mean, well that would be embarrassing to someone like casey. after all she saw herself as cool.
all the same lohan has the same tattoo but on her lower back.

Lindsey Lohan and Casey Anthony have the same tatoo of Bella Vita?? Casey might like the music.....

 

[BuzzieCat]

ITA I think Casey is alot like her father.I would not be suprised if it was him who was looking up escorts and neck breaking.I honestly do not know how Cindy could live with the two of them.Didnt George have a sister with Mental problems? I think Casey inherited her problems from George.If CA is the controller of the family why the heck was she the only one supporting the household then coming home to take care of Caylee,plus shop ,cook and clean for 2 adults who both should have had jobs.JMO

CA may very well like being in charge and being the martyr, but I do think she has an awful lot to do and not much help from GA. If he's not able to keep a steady job he could at least do more around the house and for the family. He just squicks me out! IMO. She supports his lazy behind, it would appear, and he just stands around in the driveway looking smug. Blech. Casey has learned that mom will pay for stuff IMO.

When Casey said in the video that GA had already failed to arrange a meeting - if that wasn't true, why didn't he say so or at least pretend not to remember it? I can't remember exactly what he said but he seemed to be agreeing that it had fallen through before. He didn't miss a beat or seem surprised that she was saying it already fell through.

In that video I just see a horrible, conscienceless person. I'm no psychiatrist/psychologist but I just really see hardly any feelings there except for herself. It's scary and I can totally see her doing something horrible on purpose if pressed to it.

I'm really curious about those of you who say you're not absolutely sure she did it. Is there some other candidate you have in mind in particular or not? You don't have to say who you think if it's someone specific, I just wonder. Especially after that video, I just can't see it as anyone but her. As messed up as the rest of the family is, I don't think they would do that.

 

[Searchfortruth]

(bold mine) How can they function like this... you got me! They are all living a lie--and CA seems to be at the heart of them, protecting and perpetuating those lies, and there were so very many of them. Deception also causes continual conflict. I just could never stand it. KC didn't have a birth defect or any dna which programmed her to deceive, exploit and manipulate: KC learned this. A different outcome? For KC--AND for Caylee. There is not a doubt in my mind. JMO

I so agree. I have read so many articles that say sociopaths, narcissists are not made, they are born that way. I have problems thinking that Casey got to this station in life without the help of Cindy. There are too many bizarre behaviors in the mix.

 

[Brini]

I so agree. I have read so many articles that say sociopaths, narcissists are not made, they are born that way. I have problems thinking that Casey got to this station in life without the help of Cindy. There are too many bizarre behaviors in the mix.

I think it's both. Latest theory is that the mirror neuronal network that enables us to empathized turns inward, instead of outward, in sociopaths. Aso, something's wrong with the pre-frontal cortex.

But, I think bad parenting can nurture and develop innate sociopathy.

 

[txanmom]

do y'all think it would be appropriate/interesting to add a poll to this thread re: kc born this way or kc made this way?

don't know how to do it or whether it would be a good idea in all of your opinion, but i think it would be very interesting to see the numbers.

it could have options such as

kc born a sociopath parenting doesn't matter
kc born with a personality disorder that parenting made worse into sociopath
kc born normal and parenting made into sociopath
kc born normal but some trauma happened and along with parenting caused it
etc??

if someone thinks its a good idea could they start it? i don't know how.

 

[radio]

after reading the words to the song, it is depressing........IMO

I've never heard it I guess, but after reading the words -- I couldn't even imagine a tune to go with it.:waitasec:

 

[kiki the parrot]

Until I know further details about circumstances of her daughter's death, I've yet to be convinced KC is a sociopath. What we do know from research, clinical and behavioral studies is that it is well-established one needn't be born w any particular genetic disorder, birth defect, innate sociopathic neuronal network, or malformed pre-frontal cortex to respond to narcissistic parenting, or a personality disordered home eg, the way in which KC appears to have. JMHUO
arrot: