Cell Phone Activity Discussion Thread #2

[Sparklin]

With the cell phone internet browser being accessed, we don't know.

Megyn Kelly: Was the internet succesfully accessed, do we know?
John Picerno: I believe so, I don't believe there would be a record of it.

The browser was activated 5 times according to Picerno.

I guess if I were to rack another item up into the fact column, it would be John Picerno inaccuratly giving the correct distance that the cell phones never made it more than 1/3 mile away from the house.

Megyn Kelly: How far away from the home did the cell phones get?
John Picerno: Anywhere from 1/5 of a mile up to 1/3 of a mile in a uh, sort of a if you can visualize a baseball field from their house uh that's in the wooded area behind their house all the way down to the banks of the Missouri river.

The bank of the Missouri river is a little over a 1/3 mile away from the home, but Picerno states they made it to the banks of the Missouri river.

I don't see him saying it pinged at the river. It seems more like he is describing the length of the baseball field as being from the house to the bank of the river.

 

[Detective Klimpt]

I've opened up my mind to all possibilities. I think everything here is important just based off of the cell phone information.
As you've said, we cannot even be certain that the 1/5 to 1/3 mile radius is correct, since the only mention of it came from the defense team. Do we even know if the 3:17 calls are accurate? Did that come from LE or from 'sources'? Do we know if other calls were attempted that we weren't told about? At some point, we have to trust some of what is being told is true; otherwise, sleuthing is a waste of time.

It's very easy to get to the river. I'll always be open minded and know that there are some really great flashlights available on the market today, even the kind you can strap to your head. If you say so. I'm not from the area, so have to believe what you locals are saying. The problem is that the locals differ in opinion on how easy it is to get to the river. DB may well have a head mounted flash light, but somehow I would bet she does not.

In the video I took driving from the home on Lister to the river area, you can drive all the way back to the tracks. Once you get to the tracks, you can drive along a dirt/gravel road that runs east along the tracks. I can personally throw just about any cell phone that's on the market from the tracks into the river and I'm no major league pitcher. Keeping my mind open, I know there was a white Lincoln at the residence that night that the family is still driving today. At 3:00 in the morning, all of the neighbors appeared to be sleeping. I'm sure at that time of night/morning someone could easily leave in a vehicle and return in a vehicle. Someone could have also drove west on that same road where it dead ends and been even closer to the river. Any vehicle could have drove down in that area, we don't even have to consider it being a white Lincoln. This is the time during the night where most people are asleep and traffic is very very minimal. I'm simply implying cell phones got thrown into the river. It could have been from that particular road, or it could have taken place off of the I-435 bridge. Once again, who knows how often a cell phone pings? I can drive from Brighton and 210 highway and be on the I-435 bridge within 90 seconds. There are at least 3 easy access points to toss phones into the Missouri river. Two of these are without a doubt possible to do undetected. One near the tracks on Birmingham, the other on I-435. The only difference between the two is the fact that one situation has you driving a vehicle across a bridge, and the other has you outside of your car doing it. If nobody was awake to hear someone prying a screen off of a window, I think realistically driving away in a car would be just as easy. Pulling back in killing the engine takes away half the worry. DB driving a car to dispose of BL is not something I've considered probable. A possibility? Almost everything is a remote possibility.

I also take into consideration that from 11:57pm through 3:17am, if a phone call attempt was made to Megan Wrights cell phone looking at this from an intruder standpoint, you would have to believe the cell phones had already left the residence along with Lisa in order for someone to try to make a telephone call and not worry about alerting the homeowner who was reported to be passed out in her bed with all of the lights off in the residence. So for 3 hours and 20 minutes, I am certain without a doubt if someone took Lisa at 11:57pm or just prior to, those phones would have shown some indication of travel at some point in the 3 hours and 20 minute window. If we try to go with another theory of Lisa being taken prior right around 11:57pm, did someone sit in the woods for over three hours using an internet browser? I'm sorry, but if I were only going to the grocery store to steal a pack of bubble gum, I think i'd want to get the heck out of dodge and right away. An even more serious crime of this nature? I really don't think I'd be hanging out in the neighborhood for more and a minute.

You are assuming that BL's disappearance and the cell phones are connected. That is where my theory differs from others. I do not think DB used the phones and I do not think the person that used them took BL. Until someone can give me a better choice, Jersey made the phone call at 11:58 to MW's number. He was in possession of the phones all evening in the area nearby DB's house. I think the phones were stolen earlier in the day/evening.

 

[madge]

indepmo .. you touched all the bases The river is key to this whole thing IMHO

 

[Whisperer]

You are assuming that BL's disappearance and the cell phones are connected. That is where my theory differs from others. I do not think DB used the phones and I do not think the person that used them took BL. Until someone can give me a better choice, Jersey made the phone call at 11:58 to MW's number. He was in possession of the phones all evening in the area nearby DB's house. I think the phones were stolen earlier in the day/evening.

I don't think the cells are with Lisa either but how did you connect jersey to all three phones?

Are you making the leap of the call at midnight to MW as Jersey being the culprit? Do you think it was just a coincidence that he stole the phones and somebody else stole Lisa? Or are you saying he took Lisa also?

 

[Whisperer]

There is certainly enough dots to connect DB to the crime. Leaping to Jersey is more difficult. I bet there was more than one call made that entire evening....and one is all we heard about.

 

[Whisperer]

Are people thinking Jersey did the crime? Are they disregarding the cadaver hit to do this? If not, that may mean Lisa died in the house before he took her and the cell phones. If you kill a baby and decide you need cell phones and turn on all the lights and take the deceased baby with you also? This is some crazy insane person. Typically crazy insane perps don't do well when hiding a body.

For Jersey to take a live baby, that means one doesn't believe the cadaver dog. It also means the clothing described by DB for Lisa is disregarded also, since LE has taken what was described. Some believe the witness who saw jersey tell that the baby was not dressed as described but was wearing nothing but a diaper.

So did Jersey kill lLisa in the house or wait till he was hiking to kill and hide her body?

 

[Whisperer]

To come to the conclusion of Jersey took the cell phones and the baby, one has to deny many clues...such as cadaver hit and DB failing the poly. If they also buy into he was walking around with the baby, that means he undressed her and took her out almost naked and she never cried.

Arriving at this deduction, one has to completely dismiss every event regarding DB and her strange behavior and her alibi. One has to believe DB completely and accept everything she has told as true and above reproach. Then they must believe and attribute that Jersey is indeed a crazed maniac to have done this AND very fortunate that he wasn't caught. They also may believe he is very clever and maybe a pedophile/and or killer. (if they think Lisa is dead).

To separate the two crimes (Lisa and stealing of phones) as two different events doubles up the preposterous circumstances surrounding this crime and is not likely.

 

[Elley Mae]

What I get out of the phones never being father than 1/5 or 1/3 mile from the home is that they stopped pinging and that's the farthest they where when they stopped.

the phones where with in 1/3 radius of and including the Irwin home when they died, or their life was cut short by removing their batteries.

 

[Sparklin]

Are people thinking Jersey did the crime? Are they disregarding the cadaver hit to do this? If not, that may mean Lisa died in the house before he took her and the cell phones. If you kill a baby and decide you need cell phones and turn on all the lights and take the deceased baby with you also? This is some crazy insane person. Typically crazy insane perps don't do well when hiding a body.

For Jersey to take a live baby, that means one doesn't believe the cadaver dog. It also means the clothing described by DB for Lisa is disregarded also, since LE has taken what was described. Some believe the witness who saw jersey tell that the baby was not dressed as described but was wearing nothing but a diaper.

So did Jersey kill lLisa in the house or wait till he was hiking to kill and hide her body?

And just as 'odd' 'strange' or 'unlikely' would be that DB killed her daughter while her boys were still awake and/or sleeping with her...took off her clothes (then later describes those exact same clothes to LE) and left them in the house for LE to find, went on a cell phone spree (including the net with a computer right there) until almost 3:30 am, disposed of Lisa and the cell phones, while the boys were up and/or sleeping with her ~ or left them alone in the hopes they wouldn't wake and scream bloody murder for mom...or that Jeremy wouldn't come home at any time...and still be in bed when Jeremy did get home at 3:45. This isn't Samantha and Tabitha we're talking about...she couldn't just wiggle her nose to make all this magically happen. In my opinion, it isn't possible in any scenario, including happening earlier ie: before Jeremy left or shortly after. I've seen 'cool as a cucumber' but as you are prone to point out, Deb had anxiety. Doubtful she could know that little Lisa was passed away and sat out front hoping none of the children would sneak into her room...laughing and chatting and drinking with neighbour.

"It's like they disappeared into thin air" seems that way!

ETA: I don't totally discount the cadaver dog, but on the other hand, there has been absolutely nothing to back that up as far as I have seen/heard. It was one of the reasons given for a request for the warrant, but there was nothing mentioned in the warrant afterwards. And giving us the info of ONE hit by the bed? No where else? Crib, bath, yard, car?? Cadaver dog hit in one particular spot gives absolutely nothing without anything else.

 

[indepmo]

Who owns the white lincoln? I saw an SUV parked at the end of the driveway on the first day or so. Are these two cars attached to Jeremy and DB. I find it odd she doesn't have a license. I wonder if it is the result of a conviction. Did she drive regardless of not having a license? Did she drive that night? Did DB dispose of the phones or take them to someone to dispose?

October 4th (a view from the north, and a view from the south)
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/824/whitelincoln.jpg/
http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/600/whitelincoln2.jpg/

Indepmo, you make a good case for the disposing of the cell phones, but do you believe that Lisa could have been gotten rid of as easily?

There are too many theories regarding Lisa and where she could be. I hope she is alive and well. I think the cell phones were disposed to destroy evidence vs. someone acting bold enough to steal three tracking devices to attach to an abducted child. It would be pointless to steal three cell phones if you are going to destroy them or dispose of them anyway. We can all talk about the "removing the battery theory" all day long. Why would you do that? So you can't be tracked. Why steal three cell phones in that case when you know it would never be safe to power them up again?

I don't see him saying it pinged at the river. It seems more like he is describing the length of the baseball field as being from the house to the bank of the river.

Then why did he even mention the river? One would describe a baseball field by saying "the same size of the Kansas City Royals baseball field. Instead, he describes the playing field for the pings going from behind the home to the river.

You are assuming that BL's disappearance and the cell phones are connected. That is where my theory differs from others. I do not think DB used the phones and I do not think the person that used them took BL. Until someone can give me a better choice, Jersey made the phone call at 11:58 to MW's number. He was in possession of the phones all evening in the area nearby DB's house. I think the phones were stolen earlier in the day/evening.

I can't picture two seperate events for two seperate people to break into this house to steal two different things. If the phones were stolen earlier in the day or evening, I'm sure both Deborah and Jeremy would have told law enforcement this information.

 

[Detective Klimpt]

I think the cell phones were disposed to destroy evidence

What evidence were they trying to destroy? Now that they know what calls where made on them, that evidence hasn't been beneficial to LE.

 

[indepmo]

What evidence were they trying to destroy? Now that they know what calls where made on them, that evidence hasn't been beneficial to LE.

That could be anything. Photos, contact list, browser cache, all internal data on all of the phones. Things that won't show up on a statement or activity they can internally look at already.

 

[DeAnn]

What evidence were they trying to destroy? Now that they know what calls where made on them, that evidence hasn't been beneficial to LE.

If a text was attempted to be made requesting someone come serve as an accomplice.....would that show up on a phone bill or through the provider or only through the phone itself?

ETA: My assumption has always been that the phones were destroyed because of text activity but that may have been fueled by those initial so far unfounded rumors.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

If a text was attempted to be made requesting someone come serve as an accomplice.....would that show up on a phone bill or through the provider or only through the phone itself?

ETA: My assumption has always been that the phones were destroyed because of text activity but that may have been fueled by those initial so far unfounded rumors.

I wonder what kind of incriminating evidence would be on all three of the phones? Or, perhaps the evidence was on only one phone and all three phones were destroyed to throw everyone off? It appears we may be dealing with a very sharp individual.

 

[matou]

I found a reference to HLN that I posted on here live (Jim Spellman) where he shows two cars in the driveway: an SUV and a white car on blocks, FWIW. People were wondering about vehicles.

 

[indepmo]

I found a reference to HLN that I posted on here live (Jim Spellman) where he shows two cars in the driveway: an SUV and a white car on blocks, FWIW. People were wondering about vehicles.

Those vehicles are in the rear of the residence. One of the vehicles is another white Lincoln, and appears to be a parts car for their other (Lincoln) daily driver.

 

[matou]

Those vehicles are in the rear of the residence. One of the vehicles is another white Lincoln, and appears to be a parts car for their other (Lincoln) daily driver.

I found this interesting tidbit:

VELEZ-MITCHELL: And let me say this.

Jim Spellman, CNN correspondent, this is not happening on some farmland. This is a suburban community. We`ve seen video of it where people are seeing what`s going on in other neighbor`s houses. There aren`t even shrubs or bushes that hide it.

I mean, if somebody`s going to get rid of a child, it`s very possible that somebody would have noticed that. They`re not seeing any of that, are they?

JIM SPELLMAN, CNN CORRESPONDENT: No. Absolutely not. And there`s not even a tree in the front yard of the baby Lisa`s house. It`s wide open there. But once you got into an automobile here, I think you would blend in very quickly. Lots of cars coming and going all times of day.

VELEZ-MITCHELL: But did the mother even have a car?

SPELLMAN: She doesn`t have a driver`s license but we understand she knows how to drive and there is another car besides the one they drive on a normal basis.

http://transcripts.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/1110/18/ng.01.html

 

[Whisperer]

DB is good at spinning. She has honed the craft...but what surprises me is JI and his support. He had a phone the whole time. Yet when DB states her "Drama"..."we were looking for a phone to call 911.."I was screaming, "Call 911"..JI had a phone in his pocket. In his type of work that cell is his life line. It would be on him almost all the time.

There had to be some communications between them that evening. Maybe JI is the perp. Maybe he has a bad temper. I get that impression and it is my opinion.

One or both of these parents are covering for somebody. There are many dots and most can be connected to the parents. In fact, the only dot that doesn't fit is the MW cell phone call...but every other dot leads you right back to a parent.

The cell phones were disposed because they would ping at the house and anywhere they traveled to dispose. In order to make it seem like an intruder, they had to dispose of them. LE would want to know if JI/DB left, why they didn't take their cells with them, so to get over that hurdle, they tossed them...so they couldn't be tracked.

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

DB is good at spinning. She has honed the craft...but what surprises me is JI and his support. He had a phone the whole time. Yet when DB states her "Drama"..."we were looking for a phone to call 911.."I was screaming, "Call 911"..JI had a phone in his pocket. In his type of work that cell is his life line. It would be on him almost all the time.

There had to be some communications between them that evening. Maybe JI is the perp. Maybe he has a bad temper. I get that impression and it is my opinion.

One or both of these parents are covering for somebody. There are many dots and most can be connected to the parents. In fact, the only dot that doesn't fit is the MW cell phone call...but every other dot leads you right back to a parent.

The cell phones were disposed because they would ping at the house and anywhere they traveled to dispose. In order to make it seem like an intruder, they had to dispose of them. LE would want to know if JI/DB left, why they didn't take their cells with them, so to get over that hurdle, they tossed them...so they couldn't be tracked.

BBM Why not just leave the phones at home IF they were disposing of Baby Lisa?

 

[matou]

BBM Why not just leave the phones at home IF they were disposing of Baby Lisa?

"We were running around the house and were screaming for [Lisa] and she was nowhere," Bradley said. "Then I said, 'Call 911, call 911.' But Jeremy couldn't find the cell phones. They were gone."

"They took her and took all of our phones so we couldn't call anybody," Irwin said, according to ABC News' Kansas City affiliate KMBC.

http://abcnews.go.com/US/missing-ba...g-making-lists/story?id=14679914#.TvB8ZVa8g8s