Clinton David Brink, 43 & Cristen Amanda Brink, 41 found on trail - Devil's Den State Park, AR- 26 July, 2025 #3 *Arrest*

  • #461
IIRC, it has been posted on this thread before (I can't remember by who). It's a pdf with a very basic synopsis.

Thank you
I see this Preliminary Report is referred to in some articles, looking for the report itself.

KNWA Fox 24 July 31, 2025 Court docs: Springdale man admits to fatally stabbing couple at Devil’s Den This is a wonderfully written synopsis of early events, and quotes a prelim report and prelim autopsy results.

Case 72CR-25-1428 State v Andrew James McGann- players are listed and schedules, docs that are in but not links to those docs.

Def Att Katherine Sanderson Streett- court appointed I think, and she has another capital murder case in progress this year and a handful of felonies in this court dated last year.

IMO
 
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  • #462
A picture is starting to emerge, giving off Kohberger vibes. His fellow classmate from OSU Tulsa:

“We would get together on the weekends or after class some nights, we were never able to build that with Andrew,” she said. The woman, who asked to remain anonymous, says their cohort of 10 to 15 students formed close bonds during their teacher training, but McGann remained distant.

This teacher goes on to say that he never spoke in class, always being standoffish, never allowing them to get to know each other better.



So he was a loner, unable to connect with other students.
 
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  • #463
Thank you
I see this Preliminary Report is referred to in some articles, looking for the report itself.

KNWA Fox 24 July 31, 2025 Court docs: Springdale man admits to fatally stabbing couple at Devil’s Den This is a wonderfully written synopsis of early events, and quotes a prelim report and prelim autopsy results.

Case 72CR-25-1428 State v Andrew James McGann- link to available court documents. I assume as they update they will be here.

IMO
I amended my post with a link. It has "Preliminary report form" on top of it.
 
  • #464
IIRC, it has been posted on this thread before (I can't remember by who). It's a pdf with a basic synopsis.

ETA: It's the preliminary probable cause affidavit

Got it, I had only seen that first page.
Thank you!
 
  • #465
Some more parent accounts (BBM):

Megan Perkins, another parent whose child attended Donald Elementary, described McGann as “odd.” She recalled that he was unnecessarily competitive with the kids during field day athletic contests. She said other parents would chat about his strange behavior, though not everyone was necessarily alarmed and some believed he was simply insecure as the new guy in the community.
...
In an interview with NBC News, a woman whose son was in McGann’s class at Spring Creek said he was “pretty quiet, but all the kids loved him.”

The woman, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of concerns about potential harassment, said her son admired his teacher and started wearing polo shirts to school “because that’s how Mr. McGann dressed.” McGann expressed an interest in wrestling, hiking and the outdoors, and at one point he started a running club for the kids.

She noticed that McGann was frequently “awkward around the parents” and “struggled to make eye contact during parent-teacher conferences.” He once joked that he taught elementary school students because he was “afraid of adults,” she said.


 
  • #466
Some more parent accounts (BBM):

Megan Perkins, another parent whose child attended Donald Elementary, described McGann as “odd.” She recalled that he was unnecessarily competitive with the kids during field day athletic contests. She said other parents would chat about his strange behavior, though not everyone was necessarily alarmed and some believed he was simply insecure as the new guy in the community.
...
In an interview with NBC News, a woman whose son was in McGann’s class at Spring Creek said he was “pretty quiet, but all the kids loved him.”

The woman, who spoke on the condition of anonymity because of concerns about potential harassment, said her son admired his teacher and started wearing polo shirts to school “because that’s how Mr. McGann dressed.” McGann expressed an interest in wrestling, hiking and the outdoors, and at one point he started a running club for the kids.

She noticed that McGann was frequently “awkward around the parents” and “struggled to make eye contact during parent-teacher conferences.” He once joked that he taught elementary school students because he was “afraid of adults,” she said.



And from your article there is more information about the encounter at Lupita’s Hair Salon that I had not heard or read.

IMO

NBC News Aug 2 Teacher suspected of killing Arkansas hikers alarmed parents with ‘odd’ behavior

Ruiz Avalos said she tends to have a good read on the customers who stream into Lupita’s, an unassuming family-owned beauty salon in the Arkansas town of Springdale. That’s why her guard went up when a tense-faced 20-something in baggy khakis stepped into the salon on Wednesday afternoon and tersely asked for a high-fade haircut.

Ruiz Avalos, 28, started snipping away but kept a close eye on her customer. She had been following news reports about the frantic search for the suspect in the Devil’s Den killings. The man in front of her seemed timid, barely saying a word and keeping his head down.

Roughly five minutes into the haircut, a law enforcement officer walked inside. He was looking for the driver of the car parked outside, and he had a few questions for Ruiz Avalos’ quiet customer.

Before long, McGann was handcuffed and taken away.
 
  • #467
RSBM
Respectively, I think you're splitting hairs here. As I cited from the ADATA.org link:

"Examples of psychiatric diagnoses include anxiety disorder, depression, attention deficit/hyperactivity disorder (ADHD), bipolar disorder and schizophrenia."

The ADA protects people with ALL forms of psychiatric diagnoses, including what you or I might call 'serious' mental illness, like schizophrenia. And it protects against hiring, promoting / demoting and terminating decisions. Per the ADA, disclosing any psychiatric diagnosis is voluntary. So employers can't ask unless a person asks for accommodations.

Anyone is welcome to read more from that fact sheet to learn all about how the ADA relates to mental health issues.

ET: fix typo

Mental illness may impact the outcome of this case-
Can a district fire a teacher due to mental health issues? Not alone, but if they interfere with their ability to do this job.
We know statutory laws is crafted and worded carefully, but time and testing determines how a law will be interpreted and applied in the real world. That is case law.

What is case law? Library of Congress
Case law
is the body of law developed from judicial opinions or decisions over time (whereas statutory law comes from legislative bodies and administrative law comes from executive bodies).

What is a classroom? A classroom is an adult with authority over minors, where that adult has a moral and legal obligation to protect those minors.

Here is one related case, a teacher dismissal with mental illness related to religion.
Lockhart vs. Marietta City Schools- Justia Law

A synopsis in a law article
Can disability- related misconduct serve as grounds for termination?
A teacher was dismissed and she sued that her dismissal was a violation of ADA.

What an employer can’t do as per this case:
An employer may not rightfully fire an employee for disability-related conduct that is not related to work performance and does not violate some work-place or societal rule,” the 6th Circuit said in its analysis, referencing a 1997 case. “Rather, an employer should tolerate eccentric or unusual conduct caused by the employee’s mental disability, so long as the employee can satisfactorily perform the essential functions of his job.”

What the employer could do as per this case:
There are limits to this prohibition, the court pointed out. “An employer may legitimately fire an employee for conduct, even conduct that occurs as a result of a disability, if that conduct disqualifies the employee from his or her job,” the 6th Circuit opined.

The case is now part of case law- it add strength to all school districts ability to terminate a teacher based on actions related to mental illness that show they are not doing their job.

Lewisville ISD chose not to dismiss AJM and protect elementary students despite signs he was not doing his job. If a mental illness had come up- related or not- the district could have dismissed.

So in some cases not only can a school dismiss a teacher, who isn’t doing their job, due to mental illness or any other reason, they must do so. Lewisville failed to protect.

Let’s imagine worst case scenario- If pedophilia was defined as a mental illness. We surely know a school would not be legally bound to keep a teacher on staff if they had such a mental illness.

Pedophilic Psychiatric Disorder- MSD Manual Online

IMO
 
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  • #468
A picture is starting to emerge, giving off Kohberger vibes. His fellow classmate from OSU Tulsa:

“We would get together on the weekends or after class some nights, we were never able to build that with Andrew,” she said. The woman, who asked to remain anonymous, says their cohort of 10 to 15 students formed close bonds during their teacher training, but McGann remained distant.

This teacher goes on to say that he never spoke in class, always being standoffish, never allowing them to get to know each other better.



So he was a loner, unable to connect with other students.
I'm making a guess that his fellow students in teacher training were women. I don't think he wanted to hang out with grown women, fwiw, even when invited.

jmopinion
 
  • #469

“Vermont State Police said that they're looking into possible connections between a recent double murder in Arkansas and the 2023 murder of Honoree Fleming in Castleton.”



“Fleming was shot and killed on the Delaware and Hudson Rail Trail.

Multiple witnesses reported saying that they witnessed the person believed to be involved in Fleming's death as a young man in his 20's with red hair, standing at 5'10".

Link to case thread:
 
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  • #470

“Vermont State Police said that they're looking into possible connections between a recent double murder in Arkansas and the 2023 murder of Honoree Fleming in Castleton.”



“Fleming was shot and killed on the Delaware and Hudson Rail Trail.

Multiple witnesses reported saying that they witnessed the person believed to be involved in Fleming's death as a young man in his 20's with red hair, standing at 5'10".
Vermont? Whoa.

jmo
 
  • #471
Page 2 of the Affidavit of Indigency is below. His rent is listed at $1700 (?). And car payment (presuming is "transportation") of $200 (?).

There are other monthly expenses for a total ~$2500 (?). With no income until he started teaching this fall and cash to his name of $1,050 (?), I suspect he was very close to going broke.

That's lot pressure. Unless he didn't care.

IMO.

ET: tighten format
View attachment 606340
OK, but he could have money saved to get him through the summer. And $2500/mo is $30K per year - a teacher with 6-7 years of experience is going to be making at least $50K (IMHO plus a little internet research).

I'm not understanding the focus on his finances - was there somehow a financial motive for these homicides?
 
  • #472

“Vermont State Police said that they're looking into possible connections between a recent double murder in Arkansas and the 2023 murder of Honoree Fleming in Castleton.”



“Fleming was shot and killed on the Delaware and Hudson Rail Trail.

Multiple witnesses reported saying that they witnessed the person believed to be involved in Fleming's death as a young man in his 20's with red hair, standing at 5'10".

Link to case thread:
Not seeing a connection IMHO. More than 1,000 miles away, different weapon and it's an older woman who was by herself (i.e. she wasn't hiking with elementary-school-aged girls). Suspect had red hair. Sounds nothing like this guy.
 
  • #473

“Vermont State Police said that they're looking into possible connections between a recent double murder in Arkansas and the 2023 murder of Honoree Fleming in Castleton.”



“Fleming was shot and killed on the Delaware and Hudson Rail Trail.

Multiple witnesses reported saying that they witnessed the person believed to be involved in Fleming's death as a young man in his 20's with red hair, standing at 5'10".

Link to case thread:
Wow, very telling that LE are seeing a possible connection!
 
  • #474
OK, but he could have money saved to get him through the summer. And $2500/mo is $30K per year - a teacher with 6-7 years of experience is going to be making at least $50K (IMHO plus a little internet research).

I'm not understanding the focus on his finances - was there somehow a financial motive for these homicides?
He didn't save money. He stated $1000 in cash (with a question mark) plus a smaller figure in another account.

And, it's expensive to move from state to state so any savings, if he had any, would likely disappear with the expenses of moving essentially every year.

The focus on his finances isn't to show a financial motive in that he wanted to steal, but that it's a clue that he was not controlling his life well. It's an indication, perhaps, he was stressed and/or unaware of how to manage money.

Of course, it's not direct evidence.

jmopinion
 
  • #475
I'm making a guess that his fellow students in teacher training were women. I don't think he wanted to hang out with grown women, fwiw, even when invited.

jmopinion

We can see the makeup of the cohort of graduates for OKU Spring 2022 here

OKU Spring 2022 Commencement Program
Elementary Education is p. 52-53 and AJM’s name is there.
Total Elem Ed Grads 57
Females- 52
Males- 4
Unknown- 1

Only 57 in their program, that is small enough to get to know people well.
IMO
 
  • #476
Not seeing a connection IMHO. More than 1,000 miles away, different weapon and it's an older woman who was by herself (i.e. she wasn't hiking with elementary-school-aged girls). Suspect had red hair. Sounds nothing like this guy.
Killers change weapons, for instance David Berkovitz's first attack was an attempted stabbing of two women, later he switched to a gun, Ed Kemper killed some victims with a gun and some with a knife.

The other thing is that although we know this dude has some unhealthy interest in girls, it is not carved in stone the Brink girls were what make him attack. More, according to the LE Mr. Brink was ambushes by AM, which makes me think he was not hunting for children, he was after violence.

As for the hair, AM's hair have pretty distinct reddish tint. Seen in certain light they might appear red. Also, the composite looks an awful lot like AG. I would not be scratching hom out as a suspect that easily.
 
  • #477
Killers change weapons, for instance David Berkovitz's first attack was an attempted stabbing of two women, later he switched to a gun, Ed Kemper killed some victims with a gun and some with a knife.

The other thing is that although we know this dude has some unhealthy interest in girls, it is not carved in stone the Brink girls were what make him attack. More, according to the LE Mr. Brink was ambushes by AM, which makes me think he was not hunting for children, he was after violence.

As for the hair, AM's hair have pretty distinct reddish tint. Seen in certain light they might appear red. Also, the composite looks an awful lot like AG. I would not be scratching hom out as a suspect that easily.
The first step, to state the obvious, would be to find out if AM was in Vermont at the time of the other attack.

jmo
 
  • #478
Interesting fact: sixteen miles from Castleton, where Mrs Fleming got murdered, lies Ruthland. Guess what is in Ruthland? A rugby club.
 
  • #479
Hmm. Maybe so. I was looking more at the arrest video from hair salon. I can’t make much out in trail cam image. I do feel like AM is a bit of a shape shifter.
Well, I can't disagree with you there. Others here have used the term 'shape shifter' to describe AJM.

He is an enigma, IMO.
 
  • #480

“Vermont State Police said that they're looking into possible connections between a recent double murder in Arkansas and the 2023 murder of Honoree Fleming in Castleton.”



“Fleming was shot and killed on the Delaware and Hudson Rail Trail.

Multiple witnesses reported saying that they witnessed the person believed to be involved in Fleming's death as a young man in his 20's with red hair, standing at 5'10".

Link to case thread:

Well…isn’t that interesting!
Suspect
  • White
  • Male
  • Age 20’s
  • Height 5’10”
  • Red hair
  • Park/Trail
  • Time of day 4:30PM
  • Multiple witnesses to a man exiting the trail
  • Shot in head
Did they collect DNA? Not likely from a gun unless the gun was left there.
Did the perp leave shell casings? DNA from Shell Casings Dept of Justice
Can they collect DNA from a fired bullet? I don’t think so

News ABC7 Chicago7 news footage near time of shooting Oct 5, 2023
News in Brief: Former Middlebury professor Honoree Fleming killed in Castleton, Vt
4;30PM Shot in the head while walking on trail a mile from Vermont State University
Witnesses heard a gun shot
Police arrived 30 min later
Retired University of Vermont Dean Dr. Honoree Fleming, professor of chem/ biochemistry
Castleton, Vermont

She was shot Oct 5, pronounced dead Oct 7

When was he in Chicago showing his former home to that ‘girlfriend’??
Still Chicago is 13 hours away from Castleton

I’m blown away at how little I can find on this case.

How senseless
IMO
 
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