CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #19

[TxLady2]

It's not a strange distinction to me. Kidnapping or abduction doesn't necessarily end in murder. When they say foul play, they mean murder to my understanding.

The way I understand it, according to my detective son, foul play means inflicting bodily harm on the victim, which could result in murder, but not always. Some have been known to survive abductions.

 

[SCHMAE]

I just wish that LE had done a proper job and had done DNA testing the first few days .

The bowl , the bed sheets , tv remote for finger prints and so on should of been done straight away IMO

It would of made things different in this case if this had happened IMO

I am still hopeful that LE did collect good evidence in those first few days and have just not let us in on what they know. COuld they still be waiting on test results all this time later?

 

[The Cheese]

When did the FBI come in to the case ?

Coz it's the first lot of LE that took a week to do a full search of the house I have a issue with . The fact that a possible suspect says that he was amazed that thy took a week to do a full out search of the house sums up how lax LE was at the beginning .

IMO

November 26 FBI arrived. November 29, 10 days, until house search.

It seems to me it's usually about a week until they search the house last seen. 10 days does seem a couple days longer than usual.

The local police has admitted they had no experience with this kind of case. I'm glad they brought in FBI and CBI and the other agencies on the task force.

I wish the police would it make it standard to search the place last seen within 24 hours. Even 12 hours. I think it would help in cases like Lisa Irwin and Ayla Reynolds and Isabel Celis. I don't think their houses were searched for a week or so, but I haven't gone back and checked.

 

[TxLady2]

I just wish that LE had done a proper job and had done DNA testing the first few days .

The bowl , the bed sheets , tv remote for finger prints and so on should of been done straight away IMO

It would of made things different in this case if this had happened IMO

It's called probable cause. They have to have a warrant signed by a judge before they can do a full forensics search.
What good would DNA testing have done in the beginning, unless there was blood? If they found Dylan's hair, fingerprints, saliva on the sheets, the remote, the cereal bowl, etc. how would that have helped? His DNA would just prove he was there.
It would have had to be blood found for it to be any benefit to LE towards making Mark a suspect. No blood, no probable cause.

 

[asyousay]

It's called probable cause. They have to have a warrant signed by a judge before they can do a full forensics search.
What good would DNA testing have done in the beginning, unless there was blood? If they found Dylan's hair, fingerprints, saliva on the sheets, the remote, the cereal bowl, etc. how would that have helped? His DNA would just prove he was there.
It would have had to be blood found for it to be any benefit to LE towards making Mark a suspect. No blood, no probable cause.

It's about proving Dylan was there that night . When MR can not prove one way or the other If Dylan was at the house then LE have to do there job and prove MR was telling the truth or lying . And hence they should of done a full out search at the house . MR said he expected that so I am sure he would of let do that in the search for his son .

 

[TxLady2]

A random crazy person grabbing a child walking/riding a bike down a street in a neighborhood is very different than taking a child in a house in the woods.

This person would have had to stalk MR's house, wait for Dylan to arrive, wait for MR to leave than have to sneak in, grab Dylan, gather all of Dylan's stuff and leave no trace...Oh.. and stolen a fishing pole as an after thought.

The only way they would have known that Dylan was in there was if they knew MR or Dylan's friends... and in that case, they aren't random strangers.

Sorry... it just doesn't fit this case.
JMO..

His house was not in a remote spot in the woods all by itself. There were other houses up and down that road, maybe not smack up against each other but close enough.
It could be a relative of someone who lived on that road. Or someone on the pretense of looking for a relative and got lost. It could be someone posing as a delivery person, a log cutter looking for work.... any number of things.
Predators take opportunities. They can be out and about for other purposes and come upon a likely victim and pounce. Many of these crimes are not planned, even though some of them do stalk victims, not all of them do always.

 

[The Cheese]

This is interesting. Lisa Irwin disappeared October 3 and they didn't search her home until October 18. 15 days.

I can't find the date for Isabel Celis. I'm going to look up Ayla Reynolds.

Edit - 6 days for Ayla. December 16th missing. December 22 house search.

Edit - Jessica Ridgeway went missing October 5th, home searched October 9th. 4 days.

Edit - Hailey Dunn went missing December 27th, home searched January 6th. 11 days.

Edit - Isabel Celis went missing April 21st. House searched April 23rd. 2 days.

 

[Redux]

I just find it really hard to believe that a random stranger manged to get in and out without nobody seeing anything odd in that area when its such a small place and there only one way in and out .

This is not Dylan's home and he is not normally there. So what are the odds a random pedophile just happened upon Dylan Monday morning and snatched him and in doing so nobody saw a weird car that should not of been in the area and Dylan did not put up any resistance and leaving no evidence behind ?

The odds i think would be slim to none MOO!

MOO

It happened 28 years ago in roughly the same area as where Dylan went missing. 14 year old boy went out to walk his dog and never came home. No trace of him. No one saw anything. Never been found.

Of course that long ago there were probably even less houses in that area than there are now so less people to see anything (though also more likely that a stranger to the area would stick out). But my point is it does happen in America, sad to say.

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

November 26 FBI arrived. November 29, 10 days, until house search.

It seems to me it's usually about a week until they search the house last seen. 10 days does seem a couple days longer than usual.

The local police has admitted they had no experience with this kind of case. I'm glad they brought in FBI and CBI and the other agencies on the task force.

I wish the police would it make it standard to search the place last seen within 24 hours. Even 12 hours. I think it would help in cases like Lisa Irwin and Ayla Reynolds and Isabel Celis. I don't think their houses were searched for a week or so, but I haven't gone back and checked.

I SOOOOO agree with you... Homes should be the first place scrutinized while parallel investigations are being done in other directions...

this does not mean the guardians are implicated...

It just would provide so much needed information...

Seems like Sleuthing 101.... If you ask me!!!:banghead:

 

[TxLady2]

It's about proving Dylan was there that night . When MR can not prove one way or the other If Dylan was at the house then LE have to do there job and prove MR was telling the truth or lying . And hence they should of done a full out search at the house . MR said he expected that so I am sure he would of let do that in the search for his son .

They did not have probable cause to do a full-out forensics search of his house that night. NO judge will sign off on a warrant for a full forensics search without probable cause. Proving he was or was not there is not sufficient for probable cause. At that time, all they were required to do is a walk-through of his place to assure them Dylan was not hiding in a closet or laying dead in the bathtub. Once they did that, it took time to get a warrant to do the forensics search.

There is a process to follow in any investigation. They always have to consider possible prosecution from the minute they walk into a case. If they don't follow that process, the entire case can get thrown out. All it takes is a good defense lawyer to knock holes in their investigation, and it would all have gone up in smoke.

 

[TxLady2]

November 26 FBI arrived. November 29, 10 days, until house search.

It seems to me it's usually about a week until they search the house last seen. 10 days does seem a couple days longer than usual.

The local police has admitted they had no experience with this kind of case. I'm glad they brought in FBI and CBI and the other agencies on the task force.

I wish the police would it make it standard to search the place last seen within 24 hours. Even 12 hours. I think it would help in cases like Lisa Irwin and Ayla Reynolds and Isabel Celis. I don't think their houses were searched for a week or so, but I haven't gone back and checked.

Read my posts above, below yours. It's not entirely up to LE to make these rules. The DA has to give them the go-ahead to get a warrant, and then they have to get a judge to sign it. So it takes time. LE works under the directive of the DA and the DA is under the directive of the judge. Nothing is done in any investigation without the okay from them. Period. LE doesn't make the rules, but I think in some instances they wish they could. But it's all part of the process and this process has to be done by the book to be successful.

 

[Redux]

The way I understand it, according to my detective son, foul play means inflicting bodily harm on the victim, which could result in murder, but not always. Some have been known to survive abductions.

Just jumping off your post as I see more than one post about the term "foul play".... to me (moo), foul play means something happened to him not of his own volition, so anything done by MR or someone else (including but not limited to kidnapping, abduction, injury, murder) would fall under that category. IE. running away would not be foul play, but just about anything else would be. Again, this is just what I think of when I hear "foul play".

I said all that to say that I'm wondering if the term "foul play" has a standardized meaning across all law enforcement agencies or if it's kind of thrown around based on the individual LE's idea of what it means.

 

[The Cheese]

Read my posts above, below yours. It's not entirely up to LE to make these rules. The DA has to give them the go-ahead to get a warrant, and then they have to get a judge to sign it. So it takes time. LE works under the directive of the DA and the DA is under the directive of the judge. Nothing is done in any investigation without the okay from them. Period. LE doesn't make the rules, but I think in some instances they wish they could. But it's all part of the process and this process has to be done by the book to be successful.

I know they need search warrants, and can't do a search without probable cause. I was just expressing a wish for these missing child cases. Same as I wish there was a charge to bring for all the moms who won't say where their missing babies are, but I understand why they can't per the laws.

 

[asyousay]

Thank you for explaining as i did not know this .

They did not have probable cause to do a full-out forensics search of his house that night. NO judge will sign off on a warrant for a full forensics search without probable cause. Proving he was or was not there is not sufficient for probable cause. At that time, all they were required to do is a walk-through of his place to assure them Dylan was not hiding in a closet or laying dead in the bathtub. Once they did that, it took time to get a warrant to do the forensics search.

There is a process to follow in any investigation. They always have to consider possible prosecution from the minute they walk into a case. If they don't follow that process, the entire case can get thrown out. All it takes is a good defense lawyer to knock holes in their investigation, and it would all have gone up in smoke.

 

[fred&edna]

I haven't followed this case from the beginning but I've gone back and read (a lot!) in an effort to be informed. One thing I'm confused about is the tracking/hits by the dogs. It appears the dogs hit on "something" near the water... what was that? Am I understanding correctly that the father had nothing of Dylan's that could be used to "track" him?

 

[Redux]

Curious if anyone knows any studies that show age breakdown of children victims of filicide?

This whole thing got me to thinking of the age range distribution of children killed by their parents. When I read about parents killing their children, it seems mostly to me to be infants or young children involved. I'm sure older children are victims too, I'd just like to read more about the likelihood.

I have found a few study summaries, but I'd like to see more detailed information. Statistics can be misleading on the surface sometimes.

 

[mmmagique]

I agree with you. I totally do. But I have to think if MR is responsible, why hasn't LE found enough on him to pin it to him , yet? Here again, either he's innocent or he's the craftiest mastermind and pulled off a perfect crime. So which is more likely ? If he's so crafty and great at manipulation AND evading detection, why did none of the court cases go in his favor ? Mind boggling the whole mess.

Were the people in baby Ayla's life crafty? Haleigh Cummings or Hayley Dunn? What about in baby Lisa's case?

It seems given the right circumstances and a fair amount of time, you can just disappear someone, and never have to pay the price. Sadly.

 

[scorekeeper]

They did not have probable cause to do a full-out forensics search of his house that night. NO judge will sign off on a warrant for a full forensics search without probable cause. Proving he was or was not there is not sufficient for probable cause. At that time, all they were required to do is a walk-through of his place to assure them Dylan was not hiding in a closet or laying dead in the bathtub. Once they did that, it took time to get a warrant to do the forensics search.

There is a process to follow in any investigation. They always have to consider possible prosecution from the minute they walk into a case. If they don't follow that process, the entire case can get thrown out. All it takes is a good defense lawyer to knock holes in their investigation, and it would all have gone up in smoke.

Well we know from MR's statements that he wanted everyone to focus on Dylan and not him.....and he accomplished that for awhile with LE because the SW wasn't issued within the first 5 or so days....and it being a holiday week....

 

[cluciano63]

Child missing from last place said to have been should always equal probable cause, IMO.

 

[scorekeeper]

Child missing from last place said to have been should always equal probable cause, IMO.

I totally agree!!