CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #35

[Kamille]

I'm curious about your opinion and asking because I don't have kids, is 4 miles THAT far for a 13-14 year old to walk? Would it seem far to him?

I have physical limitations so anything over about a mile sounds far to me, but I know my husband's talked about how he walked, biked, etc. a lot as a teenager. 4 miles wouldn't have caused him to hesitate heading to a friend's house on foot. Calling first probably wouldn't have even occurred to him. I've lost track of how many times we've dropped by his friends' houses to say hi without even knowing if they were home, and that's him as an adult with me being a pest about "did you call and make sure they're expecting us?" As a teen I'm sure he'd have walked or biked to their house, and kept on going to the next friend's house until he found someone home.

Of course every person and every generation's different, but I'm trying to think of what's likely for Dylan. I do feel like if he could, Dylan probably would've tried to contact the friend first, especially now in the age of cell phones and texting when everyone's so reachable. But if he couldn't reach the friend for whatever reason - dead phone, didn't know the phone #, etc, would 4 miles seem like such a long walk that he wouldn't attempt it?

Sorry, I know I'm kinda all over the place, just trying to think of possibilities.

Well someone walking at a quick pace, without the added weight of a backpack and perhaps a little taller than Dylan and therefore longer strides, could probably walk 4 miles in about an hour. I don't know of many kids these days who would consider embarking on such a long trek. Especially if there isn't a real purpose for it other than to kill some time and not knowing if the person you are heading to see would even be there. Because that would be another hour to walk home.

MOO

 

[Kamille]

ER did not believe Dylan would walk anywhere. So, if that is the case that he decided to walk 4 miles. I think he would have called lst to make sure he wasn't walking all that way for nothing. MR had a landline & he could have looked the last name up or called info. If Dylan were to go to T's why would he have not taken the bike that was there? Also nobody saw Dylan walking, anywhere. His father was suppose to pick him up at 11:00 to take him to the friend he had planned to visit. To many weird things would have to happen for me to believe this.

Forgot about the bike...another good observation Dee10!

MOO

ETA: If Dylan was going to do any time killing around the area while waiting for his father to return I'd have to believe he'd be doing it on that bike. Not carting around a backpack and a fishing pole and walking around the area hoping for a lift into town. MOO

 

[tamild]

Forgot about the bike...another good observation Dee10!

MOO

Good point, but we don't know what condition the bike was in. The boys I know with bikes seem to have a lot of broken chains, flat tires, bent rims, etc. It could be why it's outside rusting away instead of in the garage.

 

[ColdHands]

Well someone walking at a quick pace, without the added weight of a backpack and perhaps a little taller than Dylan and therefore longer strides, could probably walk 4 miles in about an hour. I don't know of many kids these days who would consider embarking on such a long trek. Especially if there isn't a real purpose for it other than to kill some time and not knowing if the person you are heading to see would even be there. Because that would be another hour to walk home.

MOO

I'm 5 foot tall and I regularly walk a 4 mile an hour pace. I think my 12 yo son walks somewhere around 2.5 miles an hour though, unless I rush him. ETA: I think 2 miles is the furthest he usually walks. My 15 year old and his friends regularly walk 5 miles to the mall.

What if not T's house? What about walking to get a soda or something? I would imagine that RV park has soda/candy machines?

Just throwing out ideas.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

ER did not believe Dylan would walk anywhere. So, if that is the case that he decided to walk 4 miles. I think he would have called lst to make sure he wasn't walking all that way for nothing. MR had a landline & he could have looked the last name up or called info. If Dylan were to go to T's why would he have not taken the bike that was there? Also nobody saw Dylan walking, anywhere. His father was suppose to pick him up at 11:00 to take him to the friend he had planned to visit. To many weird things would have to happen for me to believe this.

BBM

Do we know the size of the frame that bike has? If the frame is too large for Dylan's height, it would be very uncomfortable to ride. MOO.

 

[rebeccaeee]

And know where MR lives. And that Dylan would be home alone.

Does anyone recall when this visit was confirmed by the courts?
Was it months before, a week before?
The shorter the timeframe, the fewer people who would probably know, IMO.

Also, when a child visits a parent they do not see often, who would expect the child to be alone?

Plane ticket was purchased in late September. Original date of arrival was Saturday but changed to Sunday due to airplane maintenance issues. Who knows how long the lawyer's appt had been set up? I think people close to both of them would have known about the visit since the court ordered it back in September. As far as knowing he'd be home alone that AM? Hard to say.

 

[nikb]

ER did not believe Dylan would walk anywhere. So, if that is the case that he decided to walk 4 miles. I think he would have called lst to make sure he wasn't walking all that way for nothing. MR had a landline & he could have looked the last name up or called info. If Dylan were to go to T's why would he have not taken the bike that was there? Also nobody saw Dylan walking, anywhere. His father was suppose to pick him up at 11:00 to take him to the friend he had planned to visit. To many weird things would have to happen for me to believe this.

Good points. I'm not sure I believe either parent's account of what DR is (or isn't) like or what he would or wouldn't do at this point. I don't think either of them is lying, I think he's just likely very different with each of them plus they have different perceptions (sorry I know this is repeat info, wasn't sure how far back that post is at this point).

I completely agree he probably would've called first unless he had no way to do so, though. Also the bike in particular throws me off. Even supposing he locked himself out, his cell was dead, and he decided to head out to the friend's house, I can't figure out why he wouldn't at least take the bike. IIRC it was sitting out in front of the house, so it should've been accessible to him. Hmm...

 

[YidArmyRach]

Thanks for playing ! I wondered this in the last day or so. They come home somewhat late -ish on Sunday. Who's to say Dylan ever' unpacked' his backpack and therefore the next morning imagining him gather all his stuff before he leaves is eliminated. Maybe he just put his phone in his pocket, picked up his backpack. Because I have been thinking why / or WHO would take the time to gather all his stuff. Maybe there was no gathering. Maybe it was all still in one place from the night before. Could be ?

That's what I've always believed. If you look at the cctv photo of Dylan, the backpack isn't very big. About the size of the bags my kids take to school each day.

I think it only contained the things that most teens carry round with them on a daily basis - phone, charger, ipod etc and maybe a snack for the trip, a magazine and toiletries. So, nothing to unpack, if he hadn't bothered to shower in the morning (which isn't unusual for a 13 year old boy!). The bag would be ready to grab when he left in the morning. I don't find it unusual that its missing.

 

[rebeccaeee]

I'm 5 foot tall and I regularly walk a 4 mile an hour pace. I think my 12 yo son walks somewhere around 2.5 miles an hour though, unless I rush him. ETA: I think 2 miles is the furthest he usually walks. My 15 year old and his friends regularly walk 5 miles to the mall.

What if not T's house? What about walking to get a soda or something? I would imagine that RV park has soda/candy machines?

Just throwing out ideas.

Then MR did not buy enough snacks at the WalMart. :floorlaugh:

Seriously, off to the vending machines with a backpack? Can't see it.

 

[Confusion]

BBM

Do we know the size of the frame that bike has? If the frame is too large for Dylan's height, it would be very uncomfortable to ride. MOO.

In addition to the size, it's been said that he liked the "trick bikes". From what I remember, those bikes may be great for doing stunts and having fun, but they're usually horrible for long distance riding. It's possible that his bike there is more of a sprinter than a distance runner. MOO

 

[cluciano63]

I think there are too many circumstances pointing away from a planned abduction by someone close to ER or MR in any way, mostly the idea of finding Dylan alone.

If anything, I would more suspect a perverted neighbor who just happened to see MR leave and knew Dylan had come to visit. This type of person could have, I guess, coaxed Dylan into accepting a ride, and this person could have been back home or wherever he was supposed to be within an hour or two, so that no one noticed him missing. If this happened, Dylan is not alive. And maybe LE even interviewed this person, but if he had never been accused or charged with anything before, they would have no reason to pursue him. Maybe he even allowed a search of his home, since he knew Dylan had never been inside.

I would believe this type of scenario before some idea of a plot to take Dylan away from his warring parents, or one of his parents arranging to "hide" him for no reason I can imagine.

But then we still have to believe that his phone conveniently died before he was taken by the unknown neighboring pervert who just happened to be looking out the window at all of the right times.

 

[YidArmyRach]

Well someone walking at a quick pace, without the added weight of a backpack and perhaps a little taller than Dylan and therefore longer strides, could probably walk 4 miles in about an hour. I don't know of many kids these days who would consider embarking on such a long trek. Especially if there isn't a real purpose for it other than to kill some time and not knowing if the person you are heading to see would even be there. Because that would be another hour to walk home.

MOO

My kids wouldn't think 4 miles was a long trek, and I would expect a 13 year old to easily manage that distance in under an hour, with or without a backpack. Kids in Africa walk further than that to school each day, and back!

I have a 16 year old who has regularly walked longer than that to see friends, to kill time or even to avoiding being bored waiting for a bus. At 14 he'd walk 4 miles home from a friends house if he knew I wouldn't be home for a lift, rather than wait. Just recently, he walked 9 miles home from the train station, rather than hang round for 2 hours waiting for me to finish work! My youngest has walked 3 miles with us on our designated dog walk route, from about 5 years of age, and that only took him an hour on his little legs!

I don't have a problem with believing a 13 year old would attempt that distance if he had somewhere he wanted to be.

 

[Kamille]

BBM

Do we know the size of the frame that bike has? If the frame is too large for Dylan's height, it would be very uncomfortable to ride. MOO.

Do we have a screen shot of the bike in front of the house? Might be good to take a look at it to see if we can tell it was a functioning bike I suppose.

 

[Kamille]

Plane ticket was purchased in late September. Original date of arrival was Saturday but changed to Sunday due to airplane maintenance issues. Who knows how long the lawyer's appt had been set up? I think people close to both of them would have known about the visit since the court ordered it back in September. As far as knowing he'd be home alone that AM? Hard to say.

Why did I think there was a court hearing in November?

 

[jjenny]

My kids wouldn't think 4 miles was a long trek, and I would expect a 13 year old to easily manage that distance in under an hour, with or without a backpack. Kids in Africa walk further than that to school each day, and back!

I have a 16 year old who has regularly walked longer than that to see friends, to kill time or even to avoiding being bored waiting for a bus. At 14 he'd walk 4 miles home from a friends house if he knew I wouldn't be home for a lift, rather than wait. Just recently, he walked 9 miles home from the train station, rather than hang round for 2 hours waiting for me to finish work! My youngest has walked 3 miles with us on our designated dog walk route, from about 5 years of age, and that only took him an hour on his little legs!

I don't have a problem with believing a 13 year old would attempt that distance if he had somewhere he wanted to be.

Dylan was not in Africa. Why would he take off on foot, and without letting anyone know? He didn't even try to arrange for a ride from his friends? He didn't try to wait for MR to come back so MR could give him a ride?

 

[Confusion]

Why did I think there was a court hearing in November?

It was said at least a few times that she was given primary parenting time in September, and he went in November to get his parenting time awarded. MOO

 

[cluciano63]

So was the November visit arranged in November?

 

[SCHMAE]

okay, i'm going to try to redo my "x-files" into one post that's easier to follow. Using the name x seems a bit weird, so i'm going to change it to pat. I know it's poor grammar to use "plural" pronouns when referring to one person, but i'm going to do it anyway.

Sunday night, dylan texts with his friends until about 9:30, while he and mr are on the way home and later watching the movie. He's also playing a game, and shortly after mr goes to bed (around 10-10:30) the battery dies and he just turns off the light and tv and goes to sleep.

Pat knows both of dylan's parents and has been aware of their conflicts for quite a while. One of the parents mentioned to pat that dylan would be going to vallecito for the week of thanksgiving, and pat thought it would be a good chance to prove their friendship. Mr had mentioned to pat that he had to go to durango early on monday morning and pat decided that would be a good time to make a move. Not knowing that dylan was supposed to be in bayfield that morning, pat stops at the house about 9:00 that morning and talks to him saying that one of the parents had asked them to make sure he was okay.

He's watching tv, charging his phone and eating a bowl of cereal when pat gets there, and just hurries and grabs his things when he's offered a ride to rn's house after talking for a few minutes. When dylan mentions letting his dad know where he is, pat says it's ok because they're going to be talking to him shortly and would let him know where he is and convince him it's okay for him to spend the night. Since it is still fairly early, and he'll be there soon, dylan decides to wait until they're almost there to let rn know he's coming. When they get out to the vehicle, pat throws dylan's things in back and they take off.

Dylan leans back and is half dozing as they drive, and doesn't realize at first that they're heading the wrong way. When he does mention it, pat just tells him they have to stop for a minute because of something that was forgotten at home. When they get there, pat invites dylan in for a glass of juice, or something, and he's not allowed to leave. Because the home isn't in the bayfield area, the home isn't searched, at least not immediately. Eventually dylan could be moved somewhere else and stay with someone pat completely trusts, while they try to figure out how they're going to return him without going to prison.

I think i forgot a bunch of details, but it's probably more than most people want to read anyway! Do i win the game? :great: I think i made it fit mr's statements. Moo

good !

 

[ColdHands]

I'm struggling with the Pat scenario, because I can't think of a good motive for Pat to do all that.

Possible motives for a premeditated acquaintance abduction:

Love - a lover or wanna be lover.
Money - Hostage situation because MR or MR owes someone. Ransom scenario - took Dylan thinking MR or ER would pay to get him back.
Revenge - Getting back at one of the parents for something. Possibly an ex.
Rescue - "I know Dylan hates it at his dad's so I'm going to go get him." "No kid should have to be in the middle of all that hate so I'm going to protect him"

Any more?

 

[eileenhawkeye]

My kids wouldn't think 4 miles was a long trek, and I would expect a 13 year old to easily manage that distance in under an hour, with or without a backpack. Kids in Africa walk further than that to school each day, and back!

I have a 16 year old who has regularly walked longer than that to see friends, to kill time or even to avoiding being bored waiting for a bus. At 14 he'd walk 4 miles home from a friends house if he knew I wouldn't be home for a lift, rather than wait. Just recently, he walked 9 miles home from the train station, rather than hang round for 2 hours waiting for me to finish work! My youngest has walked 3 miles with us on our designated dog walk route, from about 5 years of age, and that only took him an hour on his little legs!

I don't have a problem with believing a 13 year old would attempt that distance if he had somewhere he wanted to be.

Do you live in a city...like a downtown area? I live in the 'burbs and I can't see anyone walking 4 miles. You barely ever see people walking on the highways. There are no sidewalks. People drive everywhere. I feel like it would be similar in a rural area. Plus, Dylan was living in the CO Springs, in a suburban area. I think most kids who grow up in the suburbs would not be walking 4 miles.