CO - Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #39

[The Cheese]

In response to CHEESE question last thread (im way behind) this is the link for my "killed in 3 hour" reference:

http://www.justice.gov/oig/reports/FBI/a0908/chapter3.htm

Thanks. This says -

in 76 percent of the murders of an abducted child, the child was murdered within 3 hours of the abduction;

That's not at all the same as what you said last thread - specially when statistics show most abducted kids are killed within 3 hours. [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=8914431&postcount=1066"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CO CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #38[/ame]

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For anyone interested, statistics show most abducted children are returned alive. Here are the stats I posted in the last thread -

These are the statistics that the U.S. Dept of Justice and NCMEC go by, the NISMART 2 statistics. I've included all 3 types of abductions - family abductions, non-family abductions, and stereotypical kidnappings -

For non-family abductions in the U.S. including stereotypical kidnappings -

Episode outcomes
Non-family abductions - Child returned alive - 99%
Stereotypical kidnappings - Child returned alive - 57%

Page 10 Table 7
Nonfamily Abducted Children: National Estimates and Characteristics
http://www.ojjdp.gov/publications/P...usPage=PubResults&strSortby=&p=&strPubSearch=

For family abductions in the U.S. -

Episode outcome - Child returned - 91%

Page 7 Table 6
Children Abducted by Family Members: National Estimates and Characteristics
https://www.ncjrs.gov/pdffiles1/ojjdp/196466.pdf

 

[scorekeeper]

I also don't get it...
What would be the reason any LE would not want them especially after LE is at what appears to be a stand still? How could TE hurt their investigation at this point? TE has many resources and the area to be searched is so vast, you would think they would welcome the extra manpower.

I have wondered about their reasoning also but I don't think we have an official statement from LE about TE. Some of the possible reasons could be:

1. LE thinks Dylan is in the lake and is waiting til spring

2. LE thinks Dylan is not in the area

3. LE isn't sure where Dylan is....

4. LE wants to take care of the investigation/searching themselves

I believe LE was not aware of K-9 Forensics searches but they did not forbid their current searches. I do not know if the searchers and LE met before the searches began....

I also wonder what will happen today if the dogs do get numerous hits today at the lake....

JMO/MOO

 

[asyousay]

I would of thought if LE thought Dylan was in the lake they would not want the dogs there today .

 

[aust amateur slueth]

EXACTLY OtherEyes - they have people/resources/equipment that local LE doesn't...and a heart for the missing. The crime scene isn't where they are going to find him. IMO - the crime scene is either a vehicle or house...

we know MRs vehicles were sent to forensics, but I wonder if any work vehicles he had access to were tested.

 

[scorekeeper]

http://www.facebook.com/pages/K-9-Forensics/249798878409404

taping dogs paws for the ice - using gas augers to drill holes
about 1 hour ago

(comment under post)

lease: lease:

 

[deoneta]

I don't believe they would try to dive again until spring when it's warmer. It was hard for them in November to be down very long. But I do wonder if there are groups who are trained specifically for diving in icy water. IMOP

Divers went into icy water during the Ayla Reynolds investigations. The divers couldn't stay in for very long intervals and obviously, this is risky diving. You'd think LE would have reason to believe the dives could be productive before they'd proceed. The dives in the Ayla case didn't turn up anything, however. All MOO

 

[BeginnersLuck]

I agree that the callers wouldn't have said who they were, that doesn't mean that LE couldn't find out where the call originated from.

for one LE could have had a trace on MRs line, secondly the telecommunications companies can track where calls originate from.

using any telephony or computer leaves a trail.

here its an offence to use a telecommunications device to harrass or threaten someone, its part of the telecommunications act, do you not have laws covering that?

Most people that make threatening phone calls or threats over the internet know how to do in so it can't be traced. There are a lot of crazy things that happen when cases get a lot of publicity. I saw where they had prosecuted a guy in UK for doing horrible things over the internet. Here they just call it freedom of speech. I expect to this kind of behavior grow here in the US if some kind of action isn't taken.

Here is the UK case:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...acebook-internet-troll-Sean-Duffy-jailed.html

This response from FB in the link is a bunch of bull.

Facebook said last night: ‘There is no place for trolling on Facebook. When abuse is reported to us, we react swiftly, and we will disable accounts that are found to be in breach of our terms.’

 

[IHAVENOCLUE]

I also don't get it...
What would be the reason any LE would not want them especially after LE is at what appears to be a stand still? How could TE hurt their investigation at this point? TE has many resources and the area to be searched is so vast, you would think they would welcome the extra manpower.

LE doesn't have to fund TES, do they?

Having TES come to search... With their specialized expertise... sounds like it could only be a win-win situation, to me!

I wonder what reasons LE would NOT want TES to come in...

JMO

 

[BeginnersLuck]

Divers went into icy water during the Ayla Reynolds investigations. The divers couldn't stay in for very long intervals and obviously, this is risky diving. You'd think LE would have reason to believe the dives could be productive before they'd proceed. The dives in the Ayla case didn't turn up anything, however. All MOO

I know they got hits by the dogs previously in the water. One of our posters that is a verified SAR expert commented on the difficulty of doing the water searches on the last thread.

It just really makes me sad that they can't completely clear the water area due to the weather conditions. It must be horrible for the family to know Dylan may be in that water.

 

[MissJ]

BBM I'm quoting my own post:

This is not meant to criticize anyone's parenting methods. Some people helicopter parent, some give their children lots of freedom, and most probably fall somewhere in between. This isn't about what I consider the right or wrong approach, but rather about consistency. From MR's uncut interview:

All I need to know is that he’s safe and where he’s at, and how to get a hold of him, and it’s likely I’ll pop in on him -- Check to make sure he’s at where he says he’s at. Those things were important to me. You know… when he’s with me – it’s me and him, with the exception of his friends. You know… I know those are important to him, but … you know… I monitor what he does, where he’s at. You know… it’s just me and him. There’s not people coming and going in my life ‘cos everything I focus on is him and us being together spending that time.

This sounds like MR believes in keeping pretty close tabs on Dylan. I don't see his actions on Nov 19 as being consistent at all with what he's said here. For me, it's not about whether I would panic or be unconcerned in this situation, but rather how MR himself describes his parenting style.

I grew up in just such idyllic surroundings where you didn't have to be home on summer nights until the lightning bugs started coming out. In 1955, I was 6 years old. My father was a police officer. This is what happened to the little girl who lived next door to us:
She was abducted at gunpoint right out of her own back yard in broad daylight, raped and murdered by Willie Grady Cochran.

http://news.google.com/newspapers?n...hRNAAAAIBAJ&sjid=hjEDAAAAIBAJ&pg=6406,1135920

The idea that there is a safe place or safe time is an illusion. Whether parents are hyper vigilant or relaxed, they can't keep 24 hour watch or control every situation. Sometimes, there is no defense against evil.

Completely OT, but when I researched this, it struck me how much things have changed and how much they remain the same. The crime took place June 20, and Cochran was convicted by July 15 and executed the following spring in April of 1956. These were the days before Miranda. There was a huge outcry and a call for parole reform because Cochran had just been released after serving only 7 years of a 20 year sentence for rape.
All MOO

Interesting post. Thanks. I have much respect for police officers. My father was a homicide officer in a large city on the east coast. I know that they usually have a POI but play their cards close to their vest. I'd be thinking they have an unofficial POI here and are watching him closely. Him being a general term.:moo::twocents:

 

[aust amateur slueth]

Most people that make threatening phone calls or threats over the internet know how to do in so it can't be traced. There are a lot of crazy things that happen when cases get a lot of publicity. I saw where they had prosecuted a guy in UK for doing horrible things over the internet. Here they just call it freedom of speech. I expect to this kind of behavior grow here in the US if some kind of action isn't taken.

Here is the UK case:
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...acebook-internet-troll-Sean-Duffy-jailed.html

This response from FB in the link is a bunch of bull.

the average person doesn't have a clue about the digital path they leave that leads directly to them.

one I found in the uk was a policeman
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ase-mother-subjected-months-online-abuse.html

the first internet troll prosecuted in Australia was in 2010. http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2010/s2919105.htm

it really does need to be taken seriously.

 

[Eileen730]

I have wondered about their reasoning also but I don't think we have an official statement from LE about TE. Some of the possible reasons could be:

1. LE thinks Dylan is in the lake and is waiting til spring

2. LE thinks Dylan is not in the area

3. LE isn't sure where Dylan is....

4. LE wants to take care of the investigation/searching themselves

I believe LE was not aware of K-9 Forensics searches but they did not forbid their current searches. I do not know if the searchers and LE met before the searches began....

I also wonder what will happen today if the dogs do get numerous hits today at the lake....

JMO/MOO

How can the dogs hit on anything aftera all this time.
I thought 6 weeks was the longest.

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tEG-bF0c-i0"]Dylan Redwine still missing a month after disappearance - YouTube[/ame]

 

[deoneta]

Interesting post. Thanks. I have much respect for police officers. My father was a homicide officer in a large city on the east coast. I know that they usually have a POI but play their cards close to their vest. I'd be thinking they have an unofficial POI here and are watching him closely. Him being a general term.:moo::twocents:

I keep thinking of recent high profile investigations where LE has made it pretty clear where their focus lay, Ayla, Hailey Dunn, Kyron, Baby Lisa, etc. and those under suspicion stopped talking. I don't know if LE has a particular focus, but like you, it wouldn't surprise me. Either way, frustrating as it is, I think it's for the best that LE is being tight lipped. All MOO.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

the average person doesn't have a clue about the digital path they leave that leads directly to them.

one I found in the uk was a policeman
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ase-mother-subjected-months-online-abuse.html

the first internet troll prosecuted in Australia was in 2010. http://www.abc.net.au/am/content/2010/s2919105.htm

it really does need to be taken seriously.

I wish it was. Something needs to change. Here in the US it is considered a civil matter if you wish to pursue a defamation case. It costs big bucks to do and most people don't have that kind of money. I'm watching a situation right now that has been going on for months. Blogs and SM sites need to take more responsibility. They need to verify members accounts.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

How can the dogs hit on anything aftera all this time.
I thought 6 weeks was the longest.

Dylan Redwine still missing a month after disappearance - YouTube

I don't think the dogs could pick up on live scent after all this time. The HRD dogs could still pick up a scent though.

 

[asyousay]

Even if Mark had gotten some "threats" the woman interviewing him was clearly not a threat and so therefore no need for the gun on the table.

 

[asyousay]

I don't think the dogs could pick up on live scent after all this time. The HRD dogs could still pick up a scent though.

What dog was it that got a hit at the lake ?

I can remember the woman saying one the dogs hit on something but she did not believe Dylan was in the lake .

 

[SuperMom1995]

:thumb: thanks score for the video link. I just don't know what to think. I see Elaine as a very angry woman rightfully so, her son is missing. My heart breaks for her.

I know many of us here don't want to judge the way someone should react when their child goes missing because we all have different personalities, different life experiences, different cultures and backgrounds BUT with all that said IMO there is still a broad range of normalcy that allows for all those factors and IMO ER is acting as expected and MRs reactions and statements ARE NOT as expected...RED FLAGS A FLYING' ALL OVER! JMO.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

What dog was it that got a hit at the lake ?

I can remember the woman saying one the dogs hit on something but she did not believe Dylan was in the lake .

I beleive 2 different HRD dogs hit on the water.

 

[Eileen730]

I keep thinking of recent high profile investigations where LE has made it pretty clear where their focus lay, Ayla, Hailey Dunn, Kyron, Baby Lisa, etc. and those under suspicion stopped talking. I don't know if LE has a particular focus, but like you, it wouldn't surprise me. Either way, frustrating as it is, I think it's for the best that LE is being tight lipped. All MOO.

I think the cases where LE and the FBI say nothing are the cases where they know who did it but without the body cant prove it!

All JMO