CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #48

[Redhead72]

I think that it's possible when Mark talked to a Marshal in Bayfield that the conversation was about how Mark was looking for Dylan and he was unable to find him. In other words Dylan was missing and Mark was seeking help.

BBM
That's if MR actually spoke to a Marshal, and that is not proven. If the LE had confirmed that MR actually spoke with someone then it would be different. In fact, the last press release the SO specifically states that MR "attempted to contact" the Bayfield Marshals Office, so it puts MR's statement that he "contacted" someone, or "spoke to someone" in serious doubt, imo.

Would Mark consider talking to a police officer and asking for help about his missing child as reporting him missing? I think that it's possible. MOO.

Only if he actually spoke with someone officially do I think that would be possible. I can definitely agree that if he spoke in person to one of the Marshals he may be speaking more in terms of that he casually "told them DR was missing", and not specifically that he "reported him missing" in any official way, but used that wording anyway.

The LE in their statement really didn't give us much indication besides the words "attempted to contact" the BMO, but exactly what that means with no other detail, and with MR's own conflicting statements, and the press reporting that he called, I think everyone's opinion on how he "attempted" to contact the BMO will remain a matter of personal opinion.

BTW: I'm really not attempting to invalidate your opinion in saying the above, just wanted to point out that factually we can't exactly take MR's word for it that he showed up at the MO and actually spoke with anyone given that the SO says only that he "attempted" to contact them. So by your saying "when" it's not actually an opinion anymore, but instead is stating it as fact that he did when this isn't what LE has stated. It's only what MR has said.

"The truth is out there" in regard to the MO story, so to speak - we just aren't privy to it at this point. And I think we'll have to wait to know what truly happened in regard to the MO for whatever reason - whether MR truly did speak to someone at the MO or not.

 

[Redhead72]

IMO thats a little disparaging to MR, I don't believe that he is that stupid.

I was going to say the same, but expanded upon my thoughts a bit instead. I think MR would know better to say that he "reported" vs. that he "told them". When dealing with a Missing persons case it is pretty common vocabulary to state that you've reported someone missing once you've actually filled out an actual Missing Persons Report, and not just when you casually mention to an LEO that your child is missing.

I'm thinking the SO is more on target with what really happened in regard to the "attempted" portion of the story - I can't imagine a marshal these days ignoring a father missing a son in that neck of the woods... Too many things can happen accidentally, and time is of the essence if someone is even just lost in the woods. I could see him being told to contact the Sheriff if he ran into someone after-hours, or after they were off-duty, but not ignoring him as MR has suggested.

As always, all of the above is MOO though! :cow:

 

[Confusion]

I was going to say the same, but expanded upon my thoughts a bit instead. I think MR would know better to say that he "reported" vs. that he "told them". When dealing with a Missing persons case it is pretty common vocabulary to state that you've reported someone missing once you've actually filled out an actual Missing Persons Report, and not just when you casually mention to an LEO that your child is missing.

I'm thinking the SO is more on target with what really happened in regard to the "attempted" portion of the story - I can't imagine a marshal these days ignoring a father missing a son in that neck of the woods... Too many things can happen accidentally, and time is of the essence if someone is even just lost in the woods. I could see him being told to contact the Sheriff if he ran into someone after-hours, or after they were off-duty, but not ignoring him as MR has suggested.

As always, all of the above is MOO though! :cow:

My understanding of what MR said happened was that he talked to someone in the MO and was told that they'd watch for him, and tell him to contact somebody if they found him. My best guess is that they didn't file a missing persons report because it was out of their jurisdiction. I know that one of my problems is that I tend to hear what people "say" rather than the words they say, if that makes any sense. In most cases I "hear" them correctly, and usually get clarification if I don't. I'm possibly doing that a lot here without realizing it, and it's rather easy to misread someone you've never met or talked to and no way to get clarification. MOO

 

[aust amateur slueth]

I was going to say the same, but expanded upon my thoughts a bit instead. I think MR would know better to say that he "reported" vs. that he "told them". When dealing with a Missing persons case it is pretty common vocabulary to state that you've reported someone missing once you've actually filled out an actual Missing Persons Report, and not just when you casually mention to an LEO that your child is missing.

I'm thinking the SO is more on target with what really happened in regard to the "attempted" portion of the story - I can't imagine a marshal these days ignoring a father missing a son in that neck of the woods... Too many things can happen accidentally, and time is of the essence if someone is even just lost in the woods. I could see him being told to contact the Sheriff if he ran into someone after-hours, or after they were off-duty, but not ignoring him as MR has suggested.

As always, all of the above is MOO though! :cow:

thanks for explaining that so well. You got exactly what I meant, I think most people would realise that there is paperwork to be filled out when reporting anyone as missing.


Just thinking about how MR speaks, I'm wondering if he worked in sales at some point, salesmen are often good at diverting and deflecting questions they are asked. (no offense meant to anyone who might be a salesperson)

 

[Eileen730]

Exactly. Mark discussed the different options that he and Dylan could have used on Thanksgiving. I see nothing strange about that. MOO.

What I find odd is they were having this discussion the night he arrived not a week or a month before he arrived. Why didnt Mark discuss this before the trip?

Something like hey what would YOU like to do for thanksgiving want to go out, want to go to my relatives or want us to cook ourselves.

I just do not see an abundance of communication here.
jmo

 

[Eileen730]

I think MR asked the MO is anyone had seen Dylan.

I do not think he told them he was missing.


JMO

And If it was not their Jurisdiction they would have sent him over to the correct one.
Which says to me he didnt express his concern that his son was Missing.

Maybe he said LOST and this is why ELAINE keeps saying you lost Dylan.

All jmo

 

[TxLady2]

So, going with this why is it he did not report his son missing?..if he was in contact with someone at the Marshal office then why in the world was he not reporting his son missing.. no doubt whatsoever that the person with whom he would be in contact with would have absolutely assisted in getting a father immediate assistance if he'd come in contact with a father who told him that his son was missing.

jmo.

Probably because the marshal's office would have directed him to call the sheriff's office, since it was out of their (marshal's) jurisdiction. Possibly because by the time he did contact the SO, he was told that ER had already called them and given them an initial report.
Even if an LE agency's office doors are closed, there is always a way to contact them by phone. A dispatcher will direct those calls to the appropriate agency or to any patrolman who is nearby.
The point is, the marshal's office would not have taken the report, he would have been advised to contact the SO, and that is why there is no missing person's report at the Bayfield office. But I bet there is a record there of him contacting them, whether it was by phone or in person.

 

[TxLady2]

Hi everyone... You've all been busy talking today! LOL I'm catching up and I'll take it a page at a time. Apologies if these things have already been discussed/debated/etc... Not meaning to throw this in the middle of anything else.



BBM

The statement you're talking about he said, "When I went to the Marshal's Office, or Ryan's, or Fernando's or whatever...". As if he couldn't remember where he had been at all, and notice he didn't talk about going to T's house at all in that time - where many times previously he spoke about going to T's to see if D was there, said he spoke to someone there, and then later when B questioned him on the DP show he stated, "How could I talk to someone when no-one was there?"

His inconsistencies - and these are just two - I definitely take as signs of being untruthful. He's never stated anything like, "I don't really remember" and being exasperated with himself for mixing things up, either. It truly does seem at this point he's told so many versions of the events of that afternoon when he supposedly went looking for DR that he can't remember what he's said to who, or when!

All of the above is MOO - except for the factual inconsistencies referred to out of MR's interviews, and media statements.





BBM - I agree!

Just to buttress these posts - I had an acquaintance years back that was a CO County Sheriff in a "rich & famous" area. He, along with others from CO and elsewhere, participated in training at the FBI Academy at Quantico. He went through 2 weeks (iirc) of intensive training with the FBI's missing persons unit (specializing on missing children's cases). This was a little more than a decade ago (maybe further back) when they were just starting to really use technology to be able to network together when a child went missing.

So, it's definitely not uncommon for State Sheriffs, and others to receive specialized training, and it is offered to them from the most specialized units in the country (world). These LEOs are way more qualified than people seem to give them credit for.

As you stated the CBI and FBI are also involved in DR's case, so thinking that the LEOs would be uneducated to the point that they couldn't detect when someone was being evasive and/or untruthful is ridiculous, imo.

As always, all of the above is MOO! (With the exception of relating the experience of the Sheriff.)
:cow:

I am not aware that there are any sheriffs working for any state. The Sheriff is an elected official and there is only one for each county. Their officers are sheriff's deputies, but they are never called sheriffs... that title belongs only to the elected Sheriff.
LE working for the state may be agents like they are in the FBI, or state troopers, I don't know, but they are not called sheriffs, AFAIK.

 

[Eileen730]

That might not come out the way you think it would. Of course, people would explain away the digs/slights that ER made as the expressions of a saddened and grieving mother. There is not doubt that she started the public mud slinging and MR rose to the occasion and fired back. Not one bit of it was helpful, I don't care who did it or who started it.

With all due respect Elaine sent her son to his father, her Ex husband and now their son is missing.
It is obvious to all there is no love lost between them. So my feeling is
she knows this guy better than anyone and a Mothers instinct is usually spot on.
Dylan was not with Elaine when he went missing Mark was.
Why would Mark even make any digs at her?
Elaine is sad and greiving but I think she is angry also.
I would be too.


All JMO

 

[Eileen730]

This is from MB interview....
BBMYou know, I spent 45 minutes… an hour… trying to get Dylan to wake up and, you know, and helping him… saying, you know, “Dylan, I’m going down,” ‘cos he had talked to me about going to see his friend, Ryan …that morning, but he wasn’t having no part of it…


WHY didnt MR say I was supposed to take mark to Ryans because I told him no the night before ?

what's this he spoke to me about it?

 

[TxLady2]

I would think they knew without a doubt that MR obviously didn't report him missing at the MO from the first moment ER called and reported him missing to the SO. If there had already been a missing child report filed within the county, there is no way the SO wouldn't have already known about it, and the report wouldn't have been in their system. The SO would have already been "on the case" as the Bayfield MO isn't equipped to handle something like this on their own due to their very limited jurisdiction, and wouldn't handle something like this on their own due to SOP of getting the SO, CBI and the FBI involved.

The only information they could get from the MO after the fact of ER reporting to the SO, was to try to confirm if MR ever spoke to, met with, or called someone at the office and mentioned DR at all on Monday afternoon (before or after the office closed).

Possibilities: An officer at the MO could have said "yeah I saw him and he mentioned he was looking for DR", or confirmation could be in the form of him calling and leaving a message (if there was an answering machine), or if MR did try to call after office hours and didn't leave a message then perhaps the record of calls from his cell phone could confirm that he "attempted" to contact the MO's office.

While we're back "at" the MO topic:
Something I brought up the other day that bothers me about MR's statements of what he and the MO supposedly talked about was that he mentions "maybe they could do a welfare check" - if DR was supposed to be at MR's home where would they do a welfare check, and why would they offer to do one in that case?

There was another comment MR made in reference to what the MO supposedly told him, but I can't remember it exactly right now - I'll have to go and look back at my posts. (I'll link my post on this comment, when I find it as I explained what was said, and why I thought it was so strange on that comment, and I don't want to repeat it all here.)

As always, all of the speculation in this comment is MOO! :cow:

ETA: Here is a link to the post I was speaking of. I had thought there was another portion of MR's statements about speaking with the MO that I had addressed, but this one focuses solely on the "wellness check"/welfare check statement.
Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - CO- Dylan Redwine, 13, Vallecito, 19 November 2012 - #48

BBM: It could be possible that MR was asking them if they could check at Dylan's friends' homes to see if Dylan was possibly there, maybe because he didn't know where they lived. Welfare checks are not only done where the person lives, they can be carried out at places one thinks a missing person could be, i.e., a school, a park, a kids' hangout, a neighbor, etc. My observation is that MR likes to insert $2 words into phrases when a 50 cent word would suffice.
JMO.
As to the earlier question about there being no report of Dylan missing at the MO.... they would not have filed a report, it was not their jurisdiction. They would have told him to contact the SO, and IMO, he could have, but ER had already started the proceedings by calling them before he did, so her name would be on the report, not his.

 

[Bayou Mistress]

This is from MB interview....
BBMYou know, I spent 45 minutes… an hour… trying to get Dylan to wake up and, you know, and helping him… saying, you know, “Dylan, I’m going down,” ‘cos he had talked to me about going to see his friend, Ryan …that morning, but he wasn’t having no part of it…


WHY didnt MR say I was supposed to take mark to Ryans because I told him no the night before ?

what's this he spoke to me about it?

I don't know. It seems odd to want to tell MR what he should have said. Furthermore, I do not think it is out of line at all for a father getting a holiday visit to postpone friends for 12 hours, especially too, since Dylan's flight was already delayed by a day. At that point, the week stretched before MR and Dylan...options to be decided, friends to visit.

 

[TxLady2]

I believe (I might be wrong) but all sheriffs are called State Sheriffs!

No, ma'am... they are elected by the people in that county, they do not work for the state. There is only one sheriff for each county.

 

[Bayou Mistress]

No, ma'am... they are elected by the people in that county, they do not work for the state. There is only one sheriff for each county.

City town LE have names--police, marshal's
Counties LE -- sheriff
State LE -- state patrol and CBI

[ame="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_law_enforcement_agencies_in_Colorado"]List of law enforcement agencies in Colorado - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/ame]

(not a fan of wiki, but this lays it out very clearly)

 

[Eileen730]

Family members and friends sometimes become worried about the well-being of a person in their lives. They get concerned after an individual is not heard from or seen for a period of time.


Identification



A police welfare check occurs when a report is made to law enforcement about an individual who may be in some sort of peril, usually in that person's residence



Read more: What Is a Police Welfare Check? | eHow.com http://www.ehow.com/facts_5823955_police-welfare-check_.html#ixzz2PmpyIheI

 

[Eileen730]

I don't know. It seems odd to want to tell MR what he should have said. Furthermore, I do not think it is out of line at all for a father getting a holiday visit to postpone friends for 12 hours, especially too, since Dylan's flight was already delayed by a day. At that point, the week stretched before MR and Dylan...options to be decided, friends to visit.

I never said it was out of line to postpone seeing his friends but im not so sure i would have refused only because i had to be up early and do stuff the next morning and dropping him off would have been way easier than waking up extra early and taking him all the way back.... I think it was more of a big deal than he was making it to be.

I would have said I told him he couldnt go the night he arived and would take him the next morning. MR it seems goes in a roundabout way to say something. I do not think it went over well that dylan could not go see his friends.

but thats just how I see things!

The on

 

[Eileen730]

No, ma'am... they are elected by the people in that county, they do not work for the state. There is only one sheriff for each county.

Is that just Colorado?
when you google Sheriffs office you get State sheriffs offices

buy ya know thats neither here nor there is it?

 

[Eileen730]

I don't know. It seems odd to want to tell MR what he should have said. Furthermore, I do not think it is out of line at all for a father getting a holiday visit to postpone friends for 12 hours, especially too, since Dylan's flight was already delayed by a day. At that point, the week stretched before MR and Dylan...options to be decided, friends to visit.

Are you saying im odd?

Wouldnt you say I told him he couldnt go the night before. It seems MR is trying to be the wonderful dad never said no to his son.... didnt he say that?

Well he said no the night before.

To me I would have said I wanted to spend time with him myself and told him id take him the next morning... But if he said that everyone knows Dylan would have been up and ready to go.

JMO

I know you feel this guy didnt do anything wrong here but I see sings you dont and feel alot is going unsaid.

JMO

 

[rosesfromangels]

MR is certainly hard to follow, that is for sure. Whether he sounds inconsistent due to intellectual capacity, deception, or stress (or combinations there of), the net result is the same.
I spent some time dwelling on this case last night, and the current status. Here are my random thoughts, and present conclusion:
*At first, I thought Dylan ran away because he couldn't stand the stress of his family situation. I thought all the vitriol towards the ex-husband was probably standard for ex's who went through an ugly divorce
*After watching the Dr. Phil segment, I realized there was much, much more to the dynamics than angry ex's. The impact of the son who was on stage was powerful. No kid is going to put himself on the line like that in front of millions of people without believing it was a necessity. I have tremendous respect for that young man. It was a very difficult, and brave thing to do.
*The additional information that was revealed about MR's peculiar lifestyle choices added weight to suspicion. Odd lifestyles bring odd people in to the picture. Was Dylan threating to expose MR in some way and a heated argument transpired? Was MR such an immature, bitter man that the only way he could punish his ex wife was to rob her of her precious son?
*Dr. Phil and the polygraph guy all but came out and said "dude, you're guilty as sin, confess now". (My interpretation and opinion only!)
*The dogs hit on the lake. (Do I have it right that it was 2 separate teams of dogs?) This can not be ignored, those dogs are absolutely amazing.

So what does all this lead me to conclude?
Well first, I have learned over the past few years on this forum that the predictable happens about 98% of the time. There are 2% miracles, and that is what we must hold on to. (My casual statistics by observation). That said, it appears to me (guess only), that LE knows what happened, and they are hoping to find remains to bring this matter to closure and insure a much higher probability of conviction. It will be very interesting to learn what evidence was collected in that home/car, etc.

I will continue to pray for that long shot miracle. It's what we must do, as anything is possible.

God Bless Dylan, his mother, and brothers.
One other thing. *IF* the father did indeed harm this beautiful child, there is no way he will be able to get away with it. Despite his attempts at deflection, it's not working. He will crack. If he has any brain cells, and *IF* he harmed that child, he will lead them to the remains and spare himself from the ultimate punishment.

 

[Bayou Mistress]

Are you saying im odd?

Wouldnt you say I told him he couldnt go the night before. It seems MR is trying to be the wonderful dad never said no to his son.... didnt he say that?

Well he said no the night before.

To me I would have said I wanted to spend time with him myself and told him id take him the next morning... But if he said that everyone knows Dylan would have been up and ready to go.

JMO

I know you feel this guy didnt do anything wrong here but I see sings you dont and feel alot is going unsaid.


JMO

No, not you in particular. Several people have said what they think MR should have answered. Suggesting what someone should have said is odd and attempts to imply that there is only one correct way of saying something.
Again, not calling you odd, but yes, the behavior of thinking you know a better answer than the person who said something is peculiar to me.

Nothing that MR said about Dylan not getting up the next morning strikes me as odd. Again, at that time, Dylan and MR had the week and it's options ahead of them.