CO - Gannon Stauch, 11, found deceased, Colorado Springs, El Paso County, 27 Jan 2020 *Arrest* #62

[Riggamorris]

Forgive me for asking, but do we know that is spilled candle wax? As opposed to burnt carpet or even a blood stain?

I've never thought it was blood. It definitely looks like wax. What I can't figure out is, if the white wavy pattern is in fact a pattern on the jar, or the candle was layered with maroon or red and white wax, or it's white wax poured over blood(staging a picture) which created the maroon color. The placement of the spilled wax is different than where she actually cut the carpet out IMO. ( I posted pictures a couple of pages back)

 

[Riggamorris]

I wonder if Laina or Landen will testify. I’m guessing no.

I'm interested more in Laina testifying. She was actually in the house during some of these events. I don't think Landen could provide much info other than LS character really.

 

[Riggamorris]

Listening to the TS interview with Grusing and hearing her say that at the end of all of this she will never have to work another job made me almost hurl. I know she was referring to some wild idea that she would win some lawsuit. But, I keep thinking that she won't work another day in her life because she will be in prison for life..... if it wasn't so tragic for Gannon and his loved ones, it would feel relieving and a little pleasurable for me. Justice for Gannon!

She could get a prison job. But she wouldn't be able to call in to that one.

 

[Hollypine]

Witness: FBI Device Analyst Dwight Falkofske

Edited: clarification of title

VT

 

[Seattle1]

I'm interested more in Laina testifying. She was actually in the house during some of these events. I don't think Landen could provide much info other than LS character really.

IMO, she will probably be allowed to contribute during the victim impact statements. Unless Laina saw something nobody else saw, I don't think the state will go there. I believe they will leave her out if it's not necessary to convict LS. JMO

 

[kittythehare]

IMO, she will probably be allowed to contribute during the victim impact statements. Unless Laina saw something nobody else saw, I don't think the state will go there. I believe they will leave her out if it's not necessary to convict LS. JMO

Hopefully they have enough without her testimony.
She never needs to see that woman again or even testify via video link...
she needs to put it behind her..

 

[Error505]

Oh come on electric shock belt…..do your thang

BBM
We can pray

 

[kaen]

IMO, she will probably be allowed to contribute during the victim impact statements. Unless Laina saw something nobody else saw, I don't think the state will go there. I believe they will leave her out if it's not necessary to convict LS. JMO

I agree with you. She won't testify but she has been a part of this trial. Just in the the mention by Grusing that she helped clean up blood and LS saying that she had helped with many of the clean ups for Gannon....we know that TS has on many occasions used her as a pawn to humiliate Gannon and be on the side of TS (unwittingly, of course). Imagine being an 11 year old who has bowel issues, nose bleed issues and more, then in a moment when you are vulnerable your step-monster gets your sister to clean up after you. Now, to take that further if it is implied LS had her clean up blood on the walls, well then, as a juror, it is one more data point that the woman was abusive and horrible to Gannon and, tangentially, his sister.

Again and again in this trial, the jury has heard TS's own words--- no information if AS doesn't come back to her, not ever speaking about the absence or sadness about Gannon, his sister is beyond bereft about the absence of her brother (according to AS) and TS responds that, of course, she wants to see the sister, her attack is worse that Gannon being missing, and yada, yada, yada. It is clear that humiliation and harm to Gannon was her hallmark. No need for his sister to say that. HH already gave us a glimpse into her mothering skills.

 

[kaen]

She could get a prison job. But she wouldn't be able to call in to that one.

Then, again, she might be able to be a flight attendant on Con Air.....

 

[iamshadow21]

I wonder if Laina or Landen will testify. I’m guessing no.

Nobody on either side of a case likes putting young kids on the stand. It can turn a jury against you without warning. It reads as very traumatising/retraumatising for the kid, and they only tend to do it if the child witness is key to a conviction or acquittal.

IMO, they have so much damning conclusive evidence, most of it rope the defendant herself provided. They don't need Little Sis to convict, so there's next to no chance she'll be on the stand. The only possibility I can see is if there was some kind of prerecorded testimony or interview done in a less traumatic setting that they could enter into evidence.

I think what's key, too, is nobody in that courtroom is trying to say LS didn't do it. It's just about her sanity. So that's why we've got the psychs duking it out at the end. Little Sis can't offer anything that any other witnesses haven't in terms of speaking to LS's sanity at the moment of Gannon's death. She spent the day at school, then rode her bike outside for most of the cleanup. She may well have witnessed or been victim herself of abuse from LS, but her giving testimony about that in front of her abuser won't help the case and may harm her more in addition to how much she has already been harmed.

If Gannon was still missing, then yeah, for a no body case, even with all the blood evidence, they may have been more dependent on her experience. But they really don't need her, and she needs to heal more than she needs to testify.

Very much my opinion only.

 

[10ofRods]

Listening to the TS interview with Grusing and hearing her say that at the end of all of this she will never have to work another job made me almost hurl. I know she was referring to some wild idea that she would win some lawsuit. But, I keep thinking that she won't work another day in her life because she will be in prison for life..... if it wasn't so tragic for Gannon and his loved ones, it would feel relieving and a little pleasurable for me. Justice for Gannon!

She may be another one of those criminals who actually prefers containment, and being in jail. Plenty of room for drama, as long as she can contain herself somewhat. Lots of room to brag and gaslight. No work. And since apparently she was okay with a +1 female in her threesome, she might even find a romantic partner of some kind. No cares about daily life, no putting up with little kids or errant husbands.

Just the place for her and her own plans. But completely tragic for Al and Landen - and for Gannon.

I hope she gets no commissary funds and has to work for them. Of course, she doesn't really care about hygiene, either. And she appears to be getting enough to eat.

IMO.

 

[10ofRods]

IMO, she will probably be allowed to contribute during the victim impact statements. Unless Laina saw something nobody else saw, I don't think the state will go there. I believe they will leave her out if it's not necessary to convict LS. JMO

An 8 year old would give little meaningful testimony as to whether LS is sane or insane. So, I think you are very right.

IMO.

 

[10ofRods]

In Dr. Lewis's documentary (Crazy: Not Insane), she seems very reliant on two tests -- an MRI and EEG.

I thought the Motion by the EPCJ's medical contractor (Wellpath) shared some insight about both tests that are likely typical evidence that's used to refute Lewis's stance.

IMO, unless there's a baseline, what's to say that an imperfection revealed on a test after the fact did not exist until after the murder, or that it was a defect since birth, and it did not cause LS to murder anybody before?

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/04th_Judicial_District/El_Paso/Stauch/10-12-2022%20Wellpath%20Position%20Re%20Deft%20Motion%20for%20Second%20Evaluation.pdf

More in an Abstract by Lewis: Child Abuse and Dissociation in 12 Murderers With Dissociative Identity Disorder

https://ajp.psychiatryonline.org/doi/10.1176/ajp.154.12.1703

I find it so hard to connect EEG results to any particular mental states (worked several years way in the past, trying to do that for research on the mental states of normals vs. other DSM diagnoses). EEG's are really old fashioned - kind of like the work on brain measurements (without MRI's to measure brain function). Even MRI's are no longer the gold standard.

From what I can tell, neither MRI nor PET nor SPECT can differentiate DID from depression or other common mind/brain issues.

Horribly formatted abstract on this issue here.

DID patients distinguished from normals here. However, there was no attempt to distinguish the DID people from depressives, etc (so...well, not exactly a slam-dunk for the defense or Dr Lewis).

DID and PTSD - closely related in findings here.

And of course, DID sufferers who plan murders and cover-ups are virtually unstudied. "Abnormal" PET and MRI and SPECT results do not yet differentiate among various disorders (IMO). Including depression, which is widespread.

Can we imagine a world in which someone like Chris Watts could give "proof" that he was depressed and get a NGRI???

I suppose we could be heading in that direction...I hope not.

IMO.

 

[iamshadow21]

I find it so hard to connect EEG results to any particular mental states (worked several years way in the past, trying to do that for research on the mental states of normals vs. other DSM diagnoses). EEG's are really old fashioned - kind of like the work on brain measurements (without MRI's to measure brain function). Even MRI's are no longer the gold standard.

From what I can tell, neither MRI nor PET nor SPECT can differentiate DID from depression or other common mind/brain issues.

Horribly formatted abstract on this issue here.

DID patients distinguished from normals here. However, there was no attempt to distinguish the DID people from depressives, etc (so...well, not exactly a slam-dunk for the defense or Dr Lewis).

DID and PTSD - closely related in findings here.

And of course, DID sufferers who plan murders and cover-ups are virtually unstudied. "Abnormal" PET and MRI and SPECT results do not yet differentiate among various disorders (IMO). Including depression, which is widespread.

Can we imagine a world in which someone like Chris Watts could give "proof" that he was depressed and get a NGRI???

I suppose we could be heading in that direction...I hope not.

IMO.

I will say, I have seen people using scanning technology to try to show brain pattern differences between different alternate identities in people with DID. I can't link to a paper, but I know they showed it in the series Many Sides of Jane. The system who was the subject of the show had some kind of testing in the last episode with a specialist who was studying people with DID this way. Jane's therapist had recorded a vocal prompt suggestion to allow one of the other system members to come out, so that they could get data with another system member "fronting". So I guess it depends what she's looking for with her scanning and imaging. Is she comparing LS with norms for brain scans, or LS with LS?

MOO

 

[Megnut]

I find it so hard to connect EEG results to any particular mental states (worked several years way in the past, trying to do that for research on the mental states of normals vs. other DSM diagnoses). EEG's are really old fashioned - kind of like the work on brain measurements (without MRI's to measure brain function). Even MRI's are no longer the gold standard.

From what I can tell, neither MRI nor PET nor SPECT can differentiate DID from depression or other common mind/brain issues.

Horribly formatted abstract on this issue here.

DID patients distinguished from normals here. However, there was no attempt to distinguish the DID people from depressives, etc (so...well, not exactly a slam-dunk for the defense or Dr Lewis).

DID and PTSD - closely related in findings here.

And of course, DID sufferers who plan murders and cover-ups are virtually unstudied. "Abnormal" PET and MRI and SPECT results do not yet differentiate among various disorders (IMO). Including depression, which is widespread.

Can we imagine a world in which someone like Chris Watts could give "proof" that he was depressed and get a NGRI???

I suppose we could be heading in that direction...I hope not.

IMO.

I think this is my problem with DID vis-a-vis NGRI. Who determined that DID equals insanity? Because it seems like the same argument could be made for any mental illness or personality disorder then. And for me, these aren't matters of insanity. In fact, they aren't even excuses. To me, they're just explanations -- for why a person behaves the way they behave.

Perhaps as disorders are studied more and better understood, the concept of insanity will fade. And we can talk about degrees of disorder. But again, not so much to exonerate under NGRI but to make sense of the why when looking at crimes committed.

T was fully present throughout the entire interval. It's as simple as it is horrifying -- she didn't stop herself because there's something she wanted more. That's not insane, that's just disordered as hell.

 jmo

 

[arielilane]

@Curious Me, could you please transcript what RA talked about right after webex cutoff? If not, I will later when transcript is available. TIA

Court dismissed for the day early. Someone that is attending in person to the trial called into Recovery Addict's channel says Letecia's hair is greasy disgusting looking in person. She's shackled to the chair with an electric shock belt on under her top. ​

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Sorry, @arielilane, can't, I didn't catch it all. Concentrating on pic shots more because not sleeping well. I have pain from pinched nerve, so typing kinda hurts. Hard to think straight when not sleeping well, so I enjoy all of you expounding on the evidence results and your thoughts. Such astute, smart people here. ​

@Curious Me, your 2nd post captured some of what caller conveyed to RA. Take care of yourself.

Here is the rest of it:

2:29 time stamp
This person attends trial periodically. The back of her hair looks almost balding. The book that she is reading is the Bible. The big black binder is labeled FBI Stauch. One day I waited for her to leave and she looked back at me and her cheeks are very chubby, eyes are dark and soulless. A bailiff sits behind (podium) her and never takes his eyes off of her.
Moo

 

[Soulmagent]

I'm guessing they meant LS was taking his medicine. Which I think at least sometimes she did. But basically all ADHD medicine that's a stimulant will suppress your appetite.

I should not have to guess at the what is the states evidence . I root for them but them making me guess at what they are trying to show is not the game and actually is counter productive to their responsibility . JMO..AN ALL. Saying this as a human an stuff.

 

[iamshadow21]

I think this is my problem with DID vis-a-vis NGRI. Who determined that DID equals insanity? Because it seems like the same argument could be made for any mental illness or personality disorder then. And for me, these aren't matters of insanity. In fact, they aren't even excuses. To me, they're just explanations -- for why a person behaves the way they behave.

Perhaps as disorders are studied more and better understood, the concept of insanity will fade. And we can talk about degrees of disorder. But again, not so much to exonerate under NGRI but to make sense of the why when looking at crimes committed.

T was fully present throughout the entire interval. It's as simple as it is horrifying -- she didn't stop herself because there's something she wanted more. That's not insane, that's just disordered as hell.

 jmo

I think it's a case law, precedent thing. It's been done, and done successfully, so people still try it.

It is incredibly rare for it to be successful. I think Billy Milligan& was one of the few to use it successfully, one of the first, but virtually no one since. And Milligan& was a rapist, not a serial killer or a child murderer.

(Henry Hawksworth& was actually the first to use it, not by much, but he was before Milligan&. Nobody but people who read deeply about this topic even know Hawksworth& exists. Hawksworth& was up for charges of drunk driving, though, which are far less interesting to the tabloids than charges of rape. He was also found not guilty. His case came up for trial after he had spent considerable time in therapy. I think Ralph Allison hypnotised him in the courtroom and called out the misbehaving alternate identity and made him tell the court he was responsible. This was in 1975.)

MOO

 

[Soulmagent]

Sherrie Holes is a forensic serologist and DNA analyst. (And wife of Paul Holes, yes, that Paul Holes.)

OMG that is my daughter's first husband!
She said she wont marry anyone else..

 

[Teche]

Court dismissed for the day early. Someone that is attending in person to the trial called into Recovery Addict's channel says Letecia's hair is greasy disgusting looking in person. She's shackled to the chair with an electric shock belt on under her top. ​

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Cool about the shock belt. This judge isn't playing.