CO - Jessica Ridgeway, 10, Westminster, 5 Oct 2012 - #10

[SapphireSteel]

I believe the poster was referring to concealing the remains while transporting the body to the dump site...not concealing the identity of the remains. It is much easier to transport a non-descript trash bag as opposed to transporting a whole body.

Then where is the rest of her body?

If he did it just for convenience, the pieces would not be missing.

(I still assume the skull is missing due to lack of dental ID).

Even if animals had've got to it, the skull is too heavy for them to drag far, they would have found it.

Where are the pieces of trashbag?

:waitasec:

She's also pretty small, and portable.

Physically removing parts of a body is hard work. It would add to the inconvenience, not relieve it in my opinion.

:cow:

 

[peeples]

not unusual for vehicles to be there, but the neighbors saw suspicious vehicles they have not seen before, doing unusual things.

Do you have a link, I haven't read that before

 

[NC Analyzer]

not unusual for vehicles to be there, but the neighbors saw suspicious vehicles they have not seen before, doing unusual things.

Link? I haven't seen that reported anywhere.

 

[b2alicia]

I think that you would be more noticed on the back dirt roads than you would be on that main paved one. It isn't smooth terrain, so it would show every headlight movement (up and down). I really do think he came in on the main road and was in and out of there in less than a minute.

I agree.

 

[Footwarrior]

Yeah, but he described a number of things that were only at the crime site, including the fire truck and boom.

If you stand at the place where the body was found, you can't see any houses. The guy who called Nancy Grace lives at least a mile away from where the body was found. He may have been able to see the boom when it was extended up, but it was impossible for him to have seen the investigators working around the body from his kitchen window. What he probably did see was the staging area which would be roughly 1/4 mile from his home. He may have even seen the fire truck while it was at the staging area.

The real lesson here is that eyewitness accounts are often inaccurate. Not because people are lying, but because our memory doesn't work like a TIVO machine. We reconstruct our memories every time we dredge them up, often unintentionally enhancing them with information that we learned later.

 

[TheTruthWillOut]

Link? I haven't seen that reported anywhere.

I remember mention of a green truck. Sorry, don't have a link.....

Anyone else remember?

 

[SapphireSteel]

I have a few thoughts I'd like to bounce off everyone. And my thoughts assume remains were intentionally put in the condition they were found, not by animal activity.

1. the abduction - perp has his/her own vehicle, unless it's someone that lives on Jessica's route to school and he/she lured her into to the house/garage. An exception would be someone who drives a company type vehicle: i.e. delivery truck, school bus, carpeting, utility company, etc.

2. Because of the condition of the remains, perp needs a secondary location as I doubt he would be able to accomplish "dissection" in a vehicle. It's also difficult to think that the perp went to the trouble of dissection unless it was absolutely necessary for the disposal of the remains. It would be necessary if the perp lived in an apt building for instance and he would have been seen carrying a body size object out of the building. But, I also don't see how the perp would have gotten her into the apartment building without the same concern. So that leads me to think they either have a home or a facility to take her to. I can't see him taking her to an outside location to do all of this, but I suppose it's a remote possibility. If he could take her to a warehouse for instance, why would he not be able to get her out of the warehouse without being seen? What really puzzles me at this stage is if he was able to get her into a location without being seen, why then couldn't he get her out without being seen?? So, why else would he dissect the body if not for the fear of being seen? What if he didn't have the use of a vehicle after the initial abduction? Perhaps his vehicle broke down, or perhaps he drives a company type vehicle for work and either walks or bikes (or motorcycle) back and forth to the job. If the only way he can dispose of the body is by foot or bike, that would make it necessary to dissect the body into more manageable parcels...sorry

I do not subscribe to the theory that he modified the remains to make identification more difficult. Why would he go to all of the trouble to do that and then deposit partial remains right along side the road? It didn't matter if it took police longer to make a positive ID because of it....what benefit would he have gained from that? Cops were outl looking for a perpetrator from the moment Jessica was reported missing. If cops made a ID from the 1st moment the remains were discovered or 2 to 3 days later, I see no advantage for the perp in the 2 or 3 days scenario. Everyone knew it was JR's remains...but to be 100% sure they had to DNA test it. I see no benefit gained from modifying the remains other than for transport purposes.

3. Another issue that supports the no vehicle theory is....why didn't the perp just take the body further out of town and dispose of it in a body of water, dumpster, etc. etc? It may be true that he wanted her to be found....so then why not leave the body intact??

MOO

The hearsay from the journalists, that it was a bloody scene, implies the disarticulation occured where she was found, which makes it even more of a risk taken by the perp.

If so, he took the parts with him.

Dead bodies don't bleed much...she may have still been alive.

 

[peeples]

The hearsay from the journalists, that it was a bloody scene, implies the disarticulation occured where she was found, which makes it even more of a risk taken by the perp.

If so, he took the parts with him.

Dead bodies don't bleed much...she may have still been alive.

We had a med student post I think her/his name began with a D and they stated that even their specially prepared cadavers still bleed

 

[NC Analyzer]

Then where is the rest of her body?

If he did it just for convenience, the pieces would not be missing.

(I still assume the skull is missing due to lack of dental ID).

Even if animals had've got to it, the skull is too heavy for them to drag far, they would have found it.

Where are the pieces of trashbag?

:waitasec:

She's also pretty small, and portable.

Physically removing parts of a body is hard work. It would add to the inconvenience, not relieve it in my opinion.

:cow:

There is what appears to be a trash bag on the scene. Not sure, but I also believe this was confirmed by LE.
We don't know if it was in fact the skull or what body parts were missing. We can assume all we want, but you know what they say about that.
I don't dispute your thinking about this guy taunting LE though, and I do have some concerns that "other" body parts may still turn up. Or even that some things may be kept as a trophy. There is also the possibility that smaller remains were disposed of in another manner. Hate to say this, but could be tossed out with the weekly trash at home. Things go into those crushers straight from the receptacle and no one is the wiser.

 

[alexandra]

The hearsay from the journalists, that it was a bloody scene, implies the disarticulation occured where she was found, which makes it even more of a risk taken by the perp.

If so, he took the parts with him.

Dead bodies don't bleed much...she may have still been alive.

Is it not possible that the bag w/torso was dragged about by prey after the fact and perhaps the bag contained a good deal of fluid? I'm trying not to be too graphic, but it's difficult in order to convey what I mean

 

[hollyblue]

First time poster, been lurking for some time, and have a point of clarification and a bit of information I have not seen yet in this thread.

1. It was suggested by Otto that some one might have driven around the loop of roads off of 82nd to hide their car, etc. This is not possible as there are gates at both entrances to these dirt roads.

2. No one has pointed out the fact that the backpack was found just a few 'feet' from the former home of a mother who suffocated her newborn... Stephanie Rochester.
This reporter seems to be the only one who has picked up on this detail (at the end of the article):
http://www.denverpost.com/news/ci_2...ca-ridgeway-moves-superior-backpack-discovery

This story was heartbreaking in the Boulder area and received some metro attention, but not much out side of the area. I cannot help but wonder if the backpack location is more than just coincidental....

This is what I believe the connection is between the BP and where her remains were found rather than the street names. Uncommon deaths. The Rocheser baby and the miners. The miners who would be part of well known history, hence ghostly stories and the kids hanging out there...and a local perp would have heard about the infant as well. I do believe the perp is "young"...atleast not over 30 or + a few years..probably into the macabe, etc. So in that thinking, as there been other historical deaths or murders in the area that a perp would consider placing other remains or evidence?

**One other question. Are there any apartments/condos up on the ridge/mesa that would have a view of where her body was found? TIA

 

[palaminodee]

Cain killed Abel with a rock. Europe has plenty of violence, they just use knives because they can't guns. Guns don't make people bad, bad people use what they have access to.

I have to put my 2 cents in, they don't say in the report how many criminals have been taken care of because of CTCarry.

If a person wants to do something bad, they will find a way.

Look at poor J, we don't even know if a gun was used, but it's obvious other tools were used. Just horrible.

 

[NC Analyzer]

We had a med student post I think her/his name began with a D and they stated that even their specially prepared cadavers still bleed

Bodies still bleed, but they don't bleed enough to make a large "bloody scene". Journalism isn't always at its finest when it comes to media reports on cases like this one. They could have been referring to anything.

 

[absentia]

timing was in range. maybe a little late.

Yes, interesting. I thought that fire was odd, as we had cool wet weather during the days before -- not typical for wildfire weather. Hmmmm.

 

[Theforeigner]

Thanks for sharing the interview. That was interesting.

JMO of course....
Got to thinking about the homes overlooking that area. We have seen and heard about cases in the past where perp(s) would leave evidence or bodies where they can keep an eye on it, so just was thinking along those lines.

When we look at the pictures previously posted of the road showing the East + West view, we can see that the person had a pretty clear shot of anybody coming from either direction, so they could duck down and hide until a car passed. But also got to thinking about maybe if it was someone who lived in one of those houses on the hill, they could have even walked down there if only carrying the bag with her remains.

Most likely that person in the interview just wanted their 15 minutes of fame, but some comments were concerning using the words "actually" and "obviously" a lot. They could have been very nervous in the interview too which could explain some of it, but one part in particular regarding seeing vests just sounded strange to be able to see an FBI vest from a 1/4 mile away unless they were using binoculars maybe.

That person mentioned that area having like a "park" or open area where people would ride horses and stuff. Is it possible that if the perp did live amongst those houses on that hill, maybe they wanted to dump the body there to scare off people from using that area anymore. Maybe they were tired of people using that area that was close to their home, and they wanted to frighten people away so they had the whole open area to themselves and keep traffic out of the area in which they live.

If the place already had some stories about it being a scary place, maybe they thought by dumping a dismemebered body in the area, it would surely frighten away anybody else from ever coming back. I realize that would be a sick person, but I think we are dealing with a sick + twisted individual. They could have had a dual motive of perversion with a child and then dumping the body to keep people away from what they considered their public land.

Anyway, just hope LE pursues all leads and interviews all people on that hill to see what they may have seen.

Also wondering if we ever found out who first spotted the remains and brougt LE out to that area? Maybe that has been discussed already? If it was an anonymous tip, then someone living on one of the houses on the hill theory would be more of a possibility.

According to timelines Jessica´s remains was announced:

Wednesday, October 10, at 7:30 PM-Police announce a body was found in Arvada field/Pattridge Park Open space.

HOWEVER!!! police and investigators was alleged out there
as early as 11 o'klock that morning of Oct 10, 2012 :

http://www.thedenverchannel.com/new...at-missing-10-year-old-girl-jessica-ridgeway#

At 1:39 into this video Journalist Don Chapion says:
(the video in question is the one with a green area map with a big red triangle over the area marking Jessicas home, where her backpack was found and where her remains were found):

Quote:
"I spoke to several neighbors out here tonight, and they tell me, one of them told me, that they actually saw a police and investigators out here as early as 11 o'klock this morning so that would be certainly somthing that would have to be followed up with police on, what exactley lead them out here to the scene out here this morning, another neighbor told me they saw a lot more activity building up as the day went on out here..."

 

[izzyblizzy]

**One other question. Are there any apartments/condos up on the ridge/mesa that would have a view of where her body was found? TIA[/quote]

No. There are no developments of that type.

 

[TxLady2]

Your probably right Im just tossing out other options!

I think he panicked because he couldnt keep her in his home any longer the neighbors would start to complain.

I think he got rid of the body first and then the backpack and i think the backpack was a diff location because he forgot about it!
I just hope to God they catch this beast!

It never hurts to explore other options.

I caught a little blurb on HLN today with NG talking about Jessica. She says she believes Jessica was killed at the spot her remains were found. I'm not sure why she thinks that, other than something she has heard from her 'sources' but it makes sense to me. If so, he would not have to worry about getting rid of blood, etc., except for his clothes and shoes, and he could easily discard those. Or he could have stripped everything off and went naked. (I think I read something like that in a book somewhere.)

 

[Jules71]

I was interested in the guy who saw events from his kitchen window and talked with NG.

I did a search on the Jefferson County Property Assessor's site (which is kind of a two-part process). Looks like he owns two properties in Arvada, the one near 80th & Quaker and the other a bit south and east of there.

In doing a google search, it looks like he's involved in retail property management or development.

So probably nothing of much interest.

Is this the guy who was quoted in the news who saw a green truck? Last name starts with M I think.

Sent from my Kindle Fire using Tapatalk 2

 

[Kat]

There is what appears to be a trash bag on the scene. Not sure, but I also believe this was confirmed by LE.
We don't know if it was in fact the skull or what body parts were missing. We can assume all we want, but you know what they say about that.
I don't dispute your thinking about this guy taunting LE though, and I do have some concerns that "other" body parts may still turn up. Or even that some things may be kept as a trophy. There is also the possibility that smaller remains were disposed of in another manner. Hate to say this, but could be tossed out with the weekly trash at home. Things go into those crushers straight from the receptacle and no one is the wiser.

I agree and while I was reading your post I thought to myself (if there is still missing body parts) --he might still have possession of them. Just throwing that out there too.

 

[Madeleine74]

Then why display the body? If he wished to hide evidence, he would also hide the body. Colorado is a big place.

It's not consistent.

It's like he's giving the finger to LE.

:cow:

:waitasec:

Was the body "displayed" or was it dumped? Displayed to me implies a specific arrangement meant to convey something. I have no information that suggests a "display."

Maybe the perp didn't care about hiding the body so much as making it more convenient for him to carry/dispose. Afterall, if he wanted a display, he picked a somewhat remote-ish area.