CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #20 *ARREST*

[susiQ]

Sunset in Colorado on November 22, was 4:40 pm.

Earlier than I thought. Thanks!

 

[SandyQLS]

I don’t think the investigators know nearly as much as we’ve assumed they do. They file two separate murder charges, one for each theory - I’d think they’d have enough confidence in one to eliminate the other. At this point I don’t have a whole lot of confidence they can build a case to convince a jury beyond reasonable doubt - if it even gets that far.

ITA.

- no body
- a consumptive DNA test
- two competing theories of murder
- had to enter KB townhome 3 separate times
- delaying tactics, eg, won't unseal probable cause AW

I smell Swiss cheese.

 

[susiQ]

If there are witnesses, they would be read the riot act about remaining silent in order to protect the integrity of the investigation. They would be allowed to talk to family and counselling services, and that's it.

But once you tell a family member, you know how it goes. Eventually it ends up on SM

 

[susiQ]

Signing off! Sleuth on insomniacs or if you live on the West Coast

 

[SuziQ]

Looks to me that the original plan of robbery gone wrong was to have a body discovered. Usually a body is needed for financial reasons such as life insurance. Originally, financial gain was not my theory. It totally is now. But something went wrong.

 

[NanZDrew]

I know it deteriorates but I’m curious what the sample is? Tysm. Or what it might be. We obviously don’t know.
Consumptive definitions I've found only refers to ‘that that can be consumed’.
So I GUESS bodily fluid. Jmo

Yes, it is a root of consumer. I believe what they mean is that the evidence, any tissue, is in such a small amount that it would require all of the evidence be used up in the testing. There would be no evidence left for future testing or storage.

 

[justpeachy22]

I read it wrong somewhere. Thought they met in 2016 and she moved to CO in 2017. I can’t keep up with the fast moving threads. Sorry. But yeah, I don’t think he ever did anything with his money but spend it on himself. I think Mom took care of him completely. And he needed to make sure he kept the baby for mom and stayed in her good graces.

Totally agree with this Love never fails!! I think the murder/motive had everything to do with “keeping the baby for his mom and staying in her good graces”. (Money, possible gf, not as much of a factor imo). By a local’s report (I need to find that one) SF was a tough lady, divorced (maybe not putting up with any crap), raised 4 kids on a ranch by herself..., if mama wants baby and vocalizes continued frustrations about KB.

 

[mustloveco]

It wouldn’t be that difficult if he did it late at night.

I definitely don’t think he did it during the daytime, although that’s when I think the murder occurred.

But why not get rid of the rolls?! If he went back?!

 

[GordianKnot]

I am new to post but lurk often. So I hope I get this post correct never mind content! I believe he killed her she wanted him to leave his mother. If he killed her, that leaves his mom w the baby and the baby inherits her money now. So the child is probably worth at least moms estate and life insurance. (As a pilot) I don't believe for one minute he loves the baby. It's the money.

The charges say robbery. I think he stole her ring. That engagement ring I saw in one of her pics was a beautiful size! I am thinking they found her ring on him. Or with him. Maybe he pawned it. The charges also say three counts of solicitation. It would make sense that he approached someone to harm her, they refused but took the phone from him and sent the texts.
I believe she was killed over those cinnamon rolls. I would wonder if there is blood or DNA in them. What farm boy do you know leaves fresh roles ? Doesn't happen.
Sort of sloppy leaving evidence around when he had all sorts of time to get rid of it.
To me, he looks frightened now. Earlier he appeared almost cocky. I d o love love our FBI and the work they are turning out. That phones data is with them. Thank you for letting me post. I love reading the posts of you who are seasoned.

Welcome, didyouhearme!

Re: the ring, you make some great points. Apparently, PF did claim that he and KB broke up on Thanksgiving....IMO, if PF does have her ring, perhaps he intended to use the break-up story as the explanation for the fact that the ring was back in his possession? Food for thought, for sure.

 

[Writestuff]

ITA.

- no body
- a consumptive DNA test
- two competing theories of murder
- had to enter KB townhome 3 separate times
- delaying tactics, eg, won't unseal probable cause AW

I smell Swiss cheese.

I think you can add "uneventful search of PF property" to that list

 

[MassGuy]

But why not get rid of the rolls?! If he went back?!

People don’t always think clearly after committing a crime like murder.

He may have been so focused on cleaning up potential forensic evidence (like blood), that it never crossed his mind.

This all comes down to what he intended to make this crime look like. If for instance, his goal was to make it look like she left on her own volition, then the rolls were the least of his concern.

The car was a much bigger deal.

Whoopsies.

 

[otto]

ITA.

- no body
- a consumptive DNA test
- two competing theories of murder
- had to enter KB townhome 3 separate times
- delaying tactics, eg, won't unseal probable cause AW

I smell Swiss cheese.

There are no competing theories of murder. The prosecution has charged PF with two counts of murder. One relates to intent to murder, the other relates to intent to rob and the victim died. Both convictions are first degree murder. The prosecution lays charges to ensure that all options are considered by the jury and in anticipation of all possible defenses.

Evidence warrant information was withheld, but we don't know whether it was damp evidence in a sealed bag, saliva on a cinnamon bun, the DNA analysis process, or connecting two pieces of evidence. Speculation is pointless.

The body is missing, but PF has leverage in terms of making a deal to shorten his sentence by revealing the location of the body. Maybe he could get away with a good story and 10 years in exchange for the body and relinquishing custody.

DNA evidence detection takes time, and it's not unusual for investigators to return to a crime scene to use luminol, or to look for a particular item.

The only delay tactics that are evident at this time are the delays that PF used to interfere with the discovery of the crime my Kelsey's parents.

 

[SandyQLS]

I think you can add "uneventful search of PF property" to that list

They did release the property sooner than expected, and then that crater they dug that revealed nothing.

 

[otto]

But once you tell a family member, you know how it goes. Eventually it ends up on SM

The riot act tends to clearly state that witnesses are responsible for the the information. If they tell a blabbering relative, they are subject to legal consequences.

 

[justpeachy22]

But why not get rid of the rolls?! If he went back?![/
Maybe I’m off the mark here, but I don’t think a guy, or anyone for that matter, is thinking ‘Ok now that I’ve finished with all of that, I should get rid of her cooking on the stove here.’ I don’t think the rolls will present any dna as some have suggested, I think the dna is on that Sheetrock that they cut out and took with them.

 

[CrimeAddict]

They did release the property sooner than expected, and then that crater they dug that revealed nothing.

Are we sure they didn’t get something small out of all of that digging? How do we really know? They haven’t said jack about it. I just dont see why they would dig that huge thing, I saw the pictures, it really seemed like they were after something in that spot. They could have found 1 tooth. She could have been burned there.

 

[GordianKnot]

People don’t always think clearly after committing a crime like murder.

He may have been so focused on cleaning up potential forensic evidence (like blood), that it never crossed his mind.

This all comes down to what he intended to make this crime look like. If for instance, his goal was to make it look like she left on her own volition, then the rolls were the least of his concern.

The car was a much bigger deal.

Whoopsies.

Yup. IMO, PF tried (multiple X) but failed to get anybody to help him carry out the murder. I'm thinking part of what he had in mind was exactly that...to have somebody help him move her vehicle with her body. I'll bet in the end he used Plan B or C vs. Plan A.

 

[Didyouhearme]

Totally agree with this Love never fails!! I think the murder/motive had everything to do with “keeping the baby for his mom and staying in her good graces”. (Money, possible gf, not as much of a factor imo). By a local’s report (I need to find that one) SF was a tough lady, divorced (maybe not putting up with any crap), raised 4 kids on a ranch by herself..., if mama wants baby and vocalizes continued frustrations about KB.

Oh I think Oedipus complex is all over this! He is thirty years old! I have this feeling they met online and she didn't know about mamma on the ranch until she arrived to find her living in the home she thought was his! Now that's scary. I wonder if he killed for the mother.

 

[NanZDrew]

I do not see PF as in control of his emotions, but more of a shut down and I am so mad at myself for getting caught . His demeanor and blank looks interpret anger to me.

I think you are spot on. You can see the rage boiling in him. At first, before arrest, he spoke arrogantly and smugly because he thought he had gotten away with it. Now he is just seething.

 

[WildWest]

It leaked a week or two ago, but the dam has broke this week.

Oedipus?