CO CO - Kelsey Berreth, 29, Woodland Park, Teller County, 22 Nov 2018 - #41 *ARREST*

[dixiegirl1035]

Correct there were other things besides the body in the trough, I’m not sure I was saying there wasn’t....I have no idea what else to say

I agree

I burn many things, and one of the things that I have learned never to do is to burn something that is loose plastic. She apparently burned seven bags of what she took away from the house. If it was dry Timbers and leaves around where that was, that was so dangerous and risky that that would have caught on fire. Light plastic goes up in the air in little Embers that could have started another fire.

I'm just so shocked at the whole darn thing. I just cannot fathom it. How can the friends stand by her and him, oh yeah, those are the friends that supported her and hit her while she was going to meet a guy who was going to kill the mother of his child.

They should all burn in hell. Even the agnostics and the atheists believe such!

Moo

 

[NoeticSoul]

I have never tried adding motor oil and that could definitely change the equation to make things hotter.

KK did mention though that he took some of the remnants after the fire and dumped it somewhere else. Either the dump or a river is what I think she said.

We will have to find those remarks she made. I found it very interesting that she was "vague' about where he took the final burnt remains after she knew specifics on everything else.

I think she knows exactly where he dumped the final burnt remains. Probably just bone fragments and small stuff.

My guess is the Arkansas river so remains would never be found. It runs rather fast in most parts. The Platte River in the other direction does not.moo

eta I think KK knows damn well where KB's remains went. She knew all other details! Why would he not tell her that?

 

[K9Enzo]

With no body, there is no way to prove what the weapon was. We do know it was a violent, bloody murder, but will likely never, ever know for sure what happened. I'm guessing PF is going to come up with a very different scenario.

jmo

Agreed. Stay tuned for the showdown between PF & KK.

 

[ajaylee]

With no body, there is no way to prove what the weapon was. We do know it was a violent, bloody murder, but will likely never, ever know for sure what happened. I'm guessing PF is going to come up with a very different scenario.

jmo

I agree. They have all the evidence we haven't seen. Right now, they're going through 3000 pages of it and looking for anything that is hearsay. That's where the weaknesses will be found and where PF can try to spin things.

If he can't prove KB was still alive when KK got there, he simply hasn't got a leg to stand on, IMHO.

I hope.

 

[Esma]

I agree. They have all the evidence we haven't seen. Right now, they're going through 3000 pages of it and looking for anything that is hearsay. That's where the weaknesses will be found and where PF can try to spin things.

If he can't prove KB was still alive when KK got there, he simply hasn't got a leg to stand on, IMHO.

I hope.

Unless he CAN prove KK was there already on the 22nd.

 

[Julia966]

With no body, there is no way to prove what the weapon was. We do know it was a violent, bloody murder, but will likely never, ever know for sure what happened. I'm guessing PF is going to come up with a very different scenario.

jmo

Quite true. But I wonder what scenario he will come up with. Or, will he simply stick to his story of knowing nothing, cast doubt on KK, point out that there's no body that even proves she's dead, and make the prosecution prove its case.

I'm a little worried about it.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

KB may well have had a bat in the house since PF took her gun. Regarding KB's gun. It seems that PF was the one that sent the text to CB posing as KB stating that she got her gun back and now felt safe with PF. Why? Did he think KB told her mom she did not feel safe?

Chills, reminds me of the chase Messner case. Sending messages posing as the user of the cell phone. In the old days, they used it to verify where somebody was, these days, they use it to show that somebody else had their phone.

I feel bad, I have not followed that case to it's fruition.

 

[PrairieWind]

I have never tried adding motor oil and that could definitely change the equation to make things hotter.

KK did mention though that he took some of the remnants after the fire and dumped it somewhere else. Either the dump or a river is what I think she said.

We will have to find those remarks she made. I found it very interesting that she was "vague' about where he took the final burnt remains after she knew specifics on everything else.

I think she knows exactly where he dumped the final burnt remains. Probably just bone fragments and small stuff.

I wonder if he intentionally didn't let her know where he dumped the final remains.
I would think at a minimum there would have been some bones (femur) and skull portions, teeth. Plus he would want to get rid of all the ash that he could.

 

[ajaylee]

He may simply not know how to strangle someone, or not feel comfortable what he would succeed. I don't know how, and I'd wager a lot of people don't. He's used to handling large animals, but he doesn't strangle them (I hope). He's a brute, and may very well not be acquainted with the fine points of strangulation. I'm personally not surprised by his choice.

I have no knowledge that women are more likely to kill with a baseball bat. Is that a fact?

I initially thought he would have used physical force or something medical from KK to avoid a mess because he was so much bigger and stronger than KK.

Now that we have a better idea of the kind of guy he seems to be, I'm wondering if he was avoiding physical contact with KB when he killed her.

You're right, he's used to handling big animals and may have put one down before. However it was done, it wasn't done manually.

 

[SuziQ]

I keep looking at KKs mugshot and thinking about her story. Something seems off to me with all of this and I can’t pinpoint what. Looking at her defiant and angry face again tonight, I started thinking about the possibility she made large chunks up with bits of truth so enough could be verified that the story wouldn’t be questioned. But why? What am I missing?

IMO. She's pissed off that she got caught and that her nastiness would be exposed to the world. And IMO she also was actively involved in the planning, and wanted kb dead as much as pf did.

 

[Inthedetails]

Quite true. But I wonder what scenario he will come up with. Or, will he simply stick to his story of knowing nothing, cast doubt on KK, point out that there's no body that even proves she's dead, and make the prosecution prove its case.

I'm a little worried about it.

I think there is enough blood in the house to prove KB couldn't have survived that amount of blood loss. So I think they can prove KB is deceased. And I think the cover-up and disposal of the body can likely be pinned on PF. So....how is PF going to pin the actual murder on KK?

jmo

 

[MassGuy]

I agree. They have all the evidence we haven't seen. Right now, they're going through 3000 pages of it and looking for anything that is hearsay. That's where the weaknesses will be found and where PF can try to spin things.

If he can't prove KB was still alive when KK got there, he simply hasn't got a leg to stand on, IMHO.

I hope.

Yeah, I already don’t see a path where the defense can claim that KK killed Kelsey. For a couple reasons:

Evidence supports that Kelsey was killed on the 22nd, and there is a specific time window of 2 hours, in which she was almost certainly killed.

A time window that he lied about, as he claimed to have last seen her when they handed the baby off.

For the defense to point the finger at KK, they have to do so without implicating PF.

That’s laughable.

He was driving around with her phone, gave her phone to KK, left evidence at both the barn where he stored her body, and his home where he burned her body.

He didn’t report her missing, lied to Kelsey’s mother, lied to her workplace, lied to his friends, and lied to law enforcement.

Good luck with that.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

It's weird, imo, that PF would play that game. And with a sweater. While holding a bat. Sorry...I think that combination weird.

jmo

PF is going to end the love relationship on TG; KB is going to end the love relationship on TG; the night before TG Kelsey with child is driving around caring for PF's cattle until morning; PF has ulcer and has to be nursed by Kelsey; in the afternoon 2 people, who are willing to cut their engagement on TG are playing games with candle cents; PF kills KB in a violent way with a bat. All that within circa 1,5 days?

Where do I have to place my misunderstanding?

* TG= Thanksgiving

 

[dixiegirl1035]

All we have right now is a small amount of information from LE about what their determination of the burn site held: Melted black plastic with an accelerant.....

The rest is from statements by KK. I think we should all be careful about assuming what she has said to LE was the truth, and the complete and honest truth

I would think that most of us here think she is not telling the entire truth. I have no doubt.

What most of us are going from is the evidence. Which reinforces what she said.

The same things That we doubt so much, will be used by the defense in my opinion

 

[ajaylee]

Quite true. But I wonder what scenario he will come up with. Or, will he simply stick to his story of knowing nothing, cast doubt on KK, point out that there's no body that even proves she's dead, and make the prosecution prove its case.

I'm a little worried about it.

At the very least, I'd be surprised if he doesn't claim KK was the one who started the talk about killing KB and KK was the one who kept at him to do it. He didn't want to go to the authorities because Florissant is a small town, embarrassment, he still had tender feelings for KK from long ago, never realized she was psycho, tried to appease her, etc.

 

[Mom24]

I would think that most of us here think she is not telling the entire truth. I have no doubt.

What most of us are going from is the evidence. Which reinforces what she said.

The same things That we doubt so much, will be used by the defense in my opinion

I don't think anyone doubts KB is dead and that PF killed her. I think where the doubt lays is how much involvement KK had in KB's death.

 

[SharonNeedles]

Can you guys talking about a burn barrel vs. a trough elaborate?

As anybody with a burn barrel can tell you, the problem with burning things that aren’t meant to be burned is that you need a lot of air intake to build heat.

I’ve built an incinerator in my back yard, and the difference is that air flows freely from the bottom. Rising heat draws more air in and I can ever blow the leaf blower into the intake. I get my temp upwards of 2000 degrees, I’ve even melted the barrel used for a burn chamber.

You just can’t build that kind of heat in an enclosed space. Period.

 

[Julia966]

I think there is enough blood in the house to prove KB couldn't have survived that amount of blood loss. So I think they can prove KB is deceased. And I think the cover-up and disposal of the body can likely be pinned on PF. So....how is PF going to pin the actual murder on KK?

jmo

There was blood in several places, but I'm not sure there was that much in quantity. But I don't know. Unless there is more information on PF, it seems like the case will hinge on KK and her credibility.

I suspect KK was at a Thanksgiving celebration on 11/22 (though I haven't actually read that). So, if they're going to try to pin it on her, the date of death would have to be assumed to be on a date they know she was in the area...11/23 or 11/24, I guess. I don't know what challenges that would pose but I doubt they can successfully infer that.

 

[Esma]

Are you guys thinking it is KK they want to ask her about?
The defense called Sheila Frazee, Patrick Frazee’s mother, to the stand to testify. She refused and exercised her fifth amendment rights. District Attorney Dan May said Sheila Frazee would know about a defendant showing up to her house on the day Berreth was last seen, however, Judge Scott Sells ruled in favor of Frazee’s refusal to testify.

 

[MassGuy]

Are you guys thinking it is KK they want to ask her about?
The defense called Sheila Frazee, Patrick Frazee’s mother, to the stand to testify. She refused and exercised her fifth amendment rights. District Attorney Dan May said Sheila Frazee would know about a defendant showing up to her house on the day Berreth was last seen, however, Judge Scott Sells ruled in favor of Frazee’s refusal to testify.

It would have been PF. The testimony from Slater, and the affadavit, shows that they believe KK didn’t arrive in Colorado, until the morning of the 24th.

Sam Kraemer made a rare mistake, when he speculated that the testimony would have involved KK being at that Thanksgiving dinner at Sheila’s house.

 

[Sweetsbeach]

i was thinking the same. for instance the 2 where out late the night of 11/21-11/22 supposedly to "check on cattle" i read. the farm would seem to me to be a better location. all i can think of is something happened to prevent an attempt there, so then the 2 were at his farm later and she was making trips to get medicine, could have been another opportunity blown. so all i can think of is the condo was a easy kill zone, KB was captive there, he was really angry about not getting it done and blew up. just my opinions.

IMO he wanted to wait until after KB spoke to her mom on Thanksgiving, knowing they would talk on the holiday. If he killed her the night before Thanksgiving, alarm bells would have gone off much sooner for CB, and PF needed time on his side.

I bet anything one of the first things out of PF's mouth when he met KB at her house that day was, "so have you talked to your parent's today? What are they doing for Thanksgiving?"..or something to that effect to confirm she'd chatted with her mom already.

 

[Esma]

i Think more than half of her story is BS. It stinks.