CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #16

[Herat]

This was discussed on an earlier thread, but to summarize, the test is for decomposition. It would not be able to tell time of death, but would potentially prove/disprove the claim that SW & the girls died in the same day/night. For example, if he killed the girls the day before she got home, there would be signs of decomposition in their hair but not SW’s. It won’t show any difference if they died within hours of each other.

Yes, this test isn't anywhere near that sensitive.

We are talking a matter of less than 12 hours between the earliest possible time of death (ie: just after the Sunday birthday party) and the 5:57 am time they were placed in the truck from where the hairs have been sampled.

This won't be able to give us really precise information

 

[Seattle1]

Really? LE can distinguish the time of death from hairs? We are postulating the times were something like minutes to hours apart. That sounds like some TV CSI stuff to me, not reality

No, that is not what I said in my post that you selectively clipped in your reply. Hair will be tested to help prove or disprove CW allegation -- hair will reflect if girls died long before SW, or if all dead around the same time as CW claims.

 

[MerryB]

Really? LE can distinguish the time of death from hairs? We are postulating the times were something like minutes to hours apart. That sounds like some TV CSI stuff to me, not reality

No.

 

[Thepoet]

the only way that springs to mind is a body of water.

That's what I thought, but in todays world with all the CCTV, etc., and LE looking for missing family. How long could it remain hidden? Any big bodies of water around there? When he dumps it. how does he get home? Can't call Uber! Or a friend. "Hey, I'm dumping my wife's car in the lake. Can I get a ride home?" Was he just making it up as he went along?

 

[molly1255]

But couldn't he have still left the sheet by accident even if he went to Hudson? From all the (at least known-at-this-time) pieces of evidence, for me it keeps pointing to him haphazardly forgetting about that sheet. I can't come up with any other plausible explanation as to why it wasn't buried with her, or disposed of.

I'm pretty sure the bodies were dumped at the work site near Hudson. The same place he told officers he had been.

 

[Seattle1]

If SW and the girls ever rode with him in the truck, how can LE be sure the hairs collected are from that night/morning?

They will first test whether hairs found fell out before death or postmortem.

 

[Layla123]

Why would CW use a work truck if he knew it was equipped with GPS? Couldn’t he have used a personal vehicle?

He needed his work truck because he drove straight to work after dumping the bodies.

 

[Seattle1]

Did cw have a truck of his own, ie the "ford" mentioned by the AP guy? Why would non-working employees be allowed in the company truck? So I wonder if having the girls' hairs being in the company truck is a clue all on it's own. Does anyone know if the company car is the ford? Ie the ford mentioned on BA?

I recall CW was said to have sold his personal vehicle (ford explorer?) probably in anticipation of new Thrive auto. The brown truck impounded and believed used to transport the bodies to CERVI site was Anadarko truck but I cannot prove it to you. Also, hair is tested first to determine if it fell out before death or postmortem.

EDIT: substituted sales company name

 

[MCDRAW]

No I don’t think so. I think he had to get accredited in the United States to testify again. He must be now. That situation wasn’t about bad science.

DA: DNA expert discredited at Denver Trial; forensic scientist Richard Eiklenboom disputes report That's the title on Denver7. I don't know how to copy a news article.

 

[pocketaccent]

I really find it very interesting to read everyone's different thoughts and theories! I am still trying to come up with one and I’m just not sure yet. As of now I’m leaning more towards a “snapped but thought about it for a while” type scenario.

I didn’t sleep a wink last night. I thought about this family all night.

A sound murder plan might look like this (If CW premeditated prior to SW arriving from AZ trip):

-Contruct a believable storyline that SW left voluntarily, taking the girls, without his consent.
-Write (type in this case) a good bye note 'written' by SW.
-Think carefully about how he will carry the bodies out of the house. Investigate possible cameras in the neighborhood, possible witness. Turn off cell phone. Don't use company truck (GPS).
-Procure a good burial site. For heaven's sake, don't ditch them at a place that has a strong ties to him. However, if decided upon oil tanks, make sure all three will fit and that he is able to carry out the task.
-Have a good plan to stage the scene. A lot of SW's and children's items should be gone. SW's car gone. Maybe leave her car at an airport parking lot, train station, whatever.
-There would be so much more to do, but the above is only some I thought of for now.

Well, he didn't do any of those above. Doesn't matter if SW's plane was on time or delayed. Also doesn't matter if NU showed up too early for him or not showed up. CW didn't do any of the above and those tasks take time to accomplish.

IMO, he did think about how good it would be if his family didn't exist anymore for some time. Then something happened when SW arrived home from AZ. Then he decided to kill all his family. Still premeditation. Just an unprepared one.

 

[Seattle1]

Question, would Shanann have wanted to take a bath before bed I wonder? I know she would have been tired and was not feeling well...

That crossed my mind too (as well as opportunity for CW to drown SW as in Drew P).

 

[dixiegirl1035]

That's a really good timeline, MerryB!

There are a few things that I would correct, but I don't have documentation for. You could be right, but this also makes some sense to me. See what you think---

2010, CW and SW (then SK) meet. Not sure when they start living together.

In 2012, CW gets the job at the dealership in Colorado, prompting the move. From article quoted below, "Linda Biggers, a realtor who listed Shanann’s home, told The Daily Beast she believes the couple moved because Chris got a job out West."

According to the Daily Beast article, "Alore (their boss at the Ford Dealership in Colorado) said the Wattses moved to Colorado after Chris accepted a job as a mechanic at the dealership in 2012. Shanann was hired by the company’s internet sales department and, according to online reviews, was a talented salesperson."

https://www.thedailybeast.com/everyone-liked-him-did-colorado-dad-chris-watts-lead-a-double-life?ref=scroll

So SW puts her house in NC up for sale. Remember that the real estate market was really bad at that time--it was close to the bottom of the market, and it may have taken a while for the house to sell. But according to the same article, "A deed for the house was signed in August 2012 while Shanann was living in Colorado, property records show."

Then they get married in November of that year in North Carolina. "Shannan King became Shanann Watts on Nov. 3, 2012. She and Chris married at the DoubleTree Suites by Hilton hotel in Charlotte, North Carolina." Same article.

Bella was born in December 2013, 13 months after they married.

So in this timeline, did her house sell after he purchased the new house and that is why only he is on the mortgage because she already had too much debt because she had not sold the house yet? I don't see that in your timeline

 

[searchinGirl]

DA: DNA expert discredited at Denver Trial; forensic scientist Richard Eiklenboom disputes report That's the title on Denver7. I don't know how to copy a news article.

I think there are some politics at play between Morrissey and Eikelenboom. I saw that his credentials were not allowed for that trial. I presume each case is reviewed separately by a Judge. I didn’t read anything about him being forbidden as an expert.

 

[margarita25]

I recall CW was said to have sold his personal vehicle (ford explorer?) probably in anticipation of new LeVel auto. The brown truck impounded and believed used to transport the bodies to CERVI site was Anadarko truck but I cannot prove it to you.
Also, hair is tested first to determine if it fell out before death or postmortem.

“Also, hair is tested first to determine if it fell out before death or postmortem”

Wow. I never knew this. In all these cases here...

You can bet I’ll be asking about this in other cases.

 

[Thepoet]

In regards to the sheet; He used the sheet to move her into and out of the truck. When he buried her, he threw the sheet in the back of the truck. When he was done, he was in a hurry and drove off and the sheet blew out of the back of the truck and he never noticed. I was driving down I20 from Dallas to Ft. Worth at about 2:00 in the morning and watched a very large fork lift roll off the back of a flatbed 18 wheeler, and come whizzing at and then past me. The trucker never noticed and kept going. If you can lose a forklift and not notice, you can lose a sheet and not notice. And I feel certain he was busy congratulating himself on the perfect crime. Narcs don't make mistakes. Right?

 

[Seattle1]

ok wait...when was the b-day party?

The Parents hosting birthday party spoke on TV, and confirmed party was Sunday.

 

[NuttMegg]

In regards to the sheet; He used the sheet to move her into and out of the truck. When he buried her, he threw the sheet in the back of the truck. When he was done, he was in a hurry and drove off and the sheet blew out of the back of the truck and he never noticed. I was driving down I20 from Dallas to Ft. Worth at about 2:00 in the morning and watched a very large fork lift roll off the back of a flatbed 18 wheeler, and come whizzing at and then past me. The trucker never noticed and kept going. If you can lose a forklift and not notice, you can lose a sheet and not notice. And I feel certain he was busy congratulating himself on the perfect crime. Narcs don't make mistakes. Right?

Wow. Ive always felt queasy driving behind those car carriers, the ones that carry about 10 on them.

 

[MJPeony]

Chris Watts' daughters' bodies were submerged in crude oil for 4 days (just a link that mentions this DNA info)

I'm still very perplexed as the why the defense would ask for DNA from the girls' necks. How on earth would this help CW's defense? I'm of the very strong opinion that he killed all of them. Wouldn't this DNA only confirm CW strangled them? I see no upside for the defense in this request.

Is it possible for a defense team to ask for something that they know they won't be able to get (no usable DNA after being in the oil) merely to cast a "reasonable doubt"?

 

[Misy]

I think there are some politics at play between Morrissey and Eikelenboom. I saw that his credentials were not allowed for that trial. I presume each case is reviewed separately by a Judge. I didn’t read anything about him being forbidden as an expert.

It's in the media sticky thread posted by Pommymommy. The article is dated aug 18. I don't know how to transfer it over here

 

[molly1255]

Last paragraph in this article states he confessed to loading their bodies into his truck and dumping them at a work site near Hudson, Co.

The arrest affidavit states he told officers on Monday afternoon that he left the house at 5:27 a.m. to check on a work site near Hudson.

This is really bringing back memories of Scott Peterson in that his alibi is the same place where he dumped the bodies.

Colorado murder suspect claims pregnant wife strangled 2 young daughters

Here is the specific paragraph:

"During an interview with police two days later, Christopher Watts asked to speak to his father, saying he would tell the truth after doing so. At that point he claimed that his wife had strangled his children and he, in turn, strangled her before loading their bodies into the back seat of his truck and dumping them at the work site northeast of Hudson."