CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #17

[NanZDrew]

On last night's thread, someone was looking at the video that was a stock video that was not the actual CERVI 319 well site. I went to the county website and input the coordinates. I first made a photo of the entire parcel. It best shows how remote the site was. Then I zoomed in a little more and made a shot of the well site. Then I zoomed in more and made a photo of the tanks. You can see a catwalk between the tanks, and the hatch should be near the catwalk (walkway, ladder). This has more detail than the Google photo but it still does not let you see that much definition on the tanks, such as the openings. Hope this gives you a little more visual understanding of the site.

 

[cailleach]

Since the issue of TBI has been brought up, here's an interesting piece on the topic as related to violence: In his study, “Brain injury and criminality,” Virkkunen concluded that “sociopathy, alcoholism, and drug abuse are the types of psychiatric disorders associated with criminal behavior, not organic brain syndrome.”1 (There's info for the defense as well.) https://www.mdedge.com/psychiatry/article/66123/somatic-disorders/does-traumatic-brain-injury-cause-violence

 

[Bill Carson]

On last night's thread, someone was looking at the video that was a stock video that was not the actual CERVI 319 well site. I went to the county website and input the coordinates. I first made a photo of the entire parcel. It best shows how remote the site was. Then I zoomed in a little more and made a shot of the well site. Then I zoomed in more and made a photo of the tanks. You can see a catwalk between the tanks, and the hatch should be near the catwalk (walkway, ladder). This has more detail than the Google photo but it still does not let you see that much definition on the tanks, such as the openings. Hope this gives you a little more visual understanding of the site.

You should post that on the media thread also.

 

[The Saint]

Yes, and I am not trying to diagnose CW with any of the diseases and afflictions I have mentioned. I would like for someone who is qualified to look into the possibilities we have mentioned. I wish that we could learn more about CW's childhood, his mental and physical health and all of that.

And the thing to keep in mind that that attempting to EXPLAIN the factors that may have contributed to this crime is not the same as EXCUSING the crime or the person responsible. The fact is that psychologists and criminologists have been studying abnormal psychology and examining the brains of criminals for many, many years. This is no different.

Say it, brother!

 

[MyBelle]

<modsnipped comment> And it’s not an opinion that they “employ award winning investigative journalists,” I think the “award winning” is proof in and of itself.

None of this changes the fact that we are allowed to discuss their reporting on this forum. Everyone is entitled to believe what they want to believe. I tend to believe that their reporting is accurate on this story, but I take nothing as fact, until there is evidence (that I can see) to back it up.

<modsnipped> When People Magazine wins the Pulitzer Prize for Investigative Journalism, I'll take it and its "unnamed sources" seriously. Until then, not so much.

 

[Bill Carson]

Since the issue of TBI has been brought up, here's an interesting piece on the topic as related to violence: In his study, “Brain injury and criminality,” Virkkunen concluded that “sociopathy, alcoholism, and drug abuse are the types of psychiatric disorders associated with criminal behavior, not organic brain syndrome.”1 (There's info for the defense as well.) https://www.mdedge.com/psychiatry/article/66123/somatic-disorders/does-traumatic-brain-injury-cause-violence

Fascinating. I'll have to bookmark that and go back and study it later. It was from 2002, so I wonder if there has been further research. Ooooo....and I notice that there are opposing viewpoints and arguments made. Even more fascinating. Thank you for posting that!!

 

[ZsaZsa]

Yes, and I am not trying to diagnose CW with any of the diseases and afflictions I have mentioned. I would like for someone who is qualified to look into the possibilities we have mentioned. I wish that we could learn more about CW's childhood, his mental and physical health and all of that.

And the thing to keep in mind that that attempting to EXPLAIN the factors that may have contributed to this crime is not the same as EXCUSING the crime or the person responsible. The fact is that psychologists and criminologists have been studying abnormal psychology and examining the brains of criminals for many, many years. This is no different.

As an academic exercise, okay, scan away, but I don't care what paid experts will find, he had free will and chose to destroy his whole family. Nothing they could find would explain why he made that choice or prevent others from doing the same in future. Some people are just evil. It's a choice they make.

 

[ZsaZsa]

I have never in my long life seen a ray of sunshine come down like that. I have seen it in religious paintings or altered photos.

There's a baby superimposed on the cloud.... Sad but maybe it comforted them a little.

 

[Bill Carson]

As an academic exercise, okay, scan away, but I don't care what paid experts will find, he had free will and chose to destroy his whole family. Nothing they could find would explain why he made that choice or prevent others from doing the same in future. Some people are just evil. It's a choice they make.

Respectfully, there are lots of evil people, but very few of them feel the need to exterminate their entire family. In response to your statement I would ask, "If it's just a choice evil people make, why don't crimes like this happen more often?"

 

[MyBelle]

It costs money to view many news programs.

No, it doesn't. Broadcast news networks and radio news programs are free.

 

[Jennifer17]

As an academic exercise, okay, scan away, but I don't care what paid experts will find, he had free will and chose to destroy his whole family. Nothing they could find would explain why he made that choice or prevent others from doing the same in future. Some people are just evil. It's a choice they make.

Yes, it is like the 'boys will be boys' excuse that has been made for male violence and cheating.

 

[Jennifer17]

Respectfully, there are lots of evil people, but very few of them feel the need to exterminate their entire family. In response to your statement I would ask, "If it's just a choice evil people make, why don't crimes like this happen more often?"

Have you not been following. They do happen over and over again.

 

[The Saint]

No, it doesn't. Broadcast news networks and radio news programs are free.

Not if you have to have cable, a satellite dish, or internet service to get those news broadcasts.

 

[The Saint]

Have you not been following. They do happen over and over again.

NC men especially like to kill their pregnant wives.
Without Florida, there wouldn't have been Court TV.

 

[MassGuy]

Have you not been following. They do happen over and over again.

I think he means in terms of overall numbers. Not all “evil” people wipe out their entire families, although evil people do it far too often.

 

[Layla123]

Yes and the National Enquirer paid for it. Legit news organizations don't pay for their stories.

I really don’t understand your point. Truth is truth, it doesn’t become any less true if it’s paid for. I look at People Magazine with eyes open wide. I look at everything I read with eyes open wide. If it makes sense I think it might be true, but I’m open to circumstances changing, and a new truth being revealed. Unfortunately, The Denver Post hasn’t written anything on the topic of CW and multi sexual partners, so we’re left with what we’ve been given. It may be true, it may not be true, and in that spirit we are discussing it. I think the track records for truth for People Mag and AB are pretty good, and since there’s nothing else out there, we’ve got to take what we get, and some of the things they say are worthy of discussion. One more thing, I’ve read my allotment of articles at The Denver Post. I can’t read any more for awhile unless I subscribe.

 

[Bill Carson]

Maybe we should experiment with positive psychology---hand out badges for men who haven't killed their family (yet).

 

[Thepoet]

I agree with you. Not only does she not seem the type to do that, but even if she had some “red flags” in terms of past behavior, I still wouldn’t believe CW’s insane story. His coverup, destroys even the smallest chance of it being true.

I agree also. Shanann was a fighter and a winner and what the accused her of, isn't possible!

 

[ZsaZsa]

Respectfully, there are lots of evil people, but very few of them feel the need to exterminate their entire family. In response to your statement I would ask, "If it's just a choice evil people make, why don't crimes like this happen more often?"

They exercise free will. Just as CW did. Some ( a lot) act on their desires and others don't .Just scan the index of cases on this site, there are enough cases to keep you reading for years.

 

[cailleach]

Fascinating. I'll have to bookmark that and go back and study it later. It was from 2002, so I wonder if there has been further research. Ooooo....and I notice that there are opposing viewpoints and arguments made. Even more fascinating. Thank you for posting that!!

You're welcome! I wanted to bring a well-rounded view to the topic. I believe we're stretching it as a consideration since the person stating he had a personality change didn't correlate it to an injury that she likely would have known about. Interesting information nonetheless though.