Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #20

[Sleuthine]

A Late Edit to my post above: I'm not on FB and don't know if these are the most current instructions as I'm told that FB updates changes to settings and/or policies often. Those more familiar may be able to add to this. TIA....

I just changed my own FB account, thanks so much for posting this. I didn't know before that it is possible to set this on your own.

It is under Settings/ Account Ownership and Control

 

[Mo Thuairim]

Are the homes in SW’s neighborhood close together? One thing I noticed in the XMAS video was that Cece’s crying can be heard from one end of the house to the other. Makes me wonder whether there was a struggle when CW committed the murders or if he killed them while they slept. Surprised neighbors have not commented on loud crying coming from their home (just Dieter’s barking).

They appear to be very close together from the map (if you zoom in a bit). The images are old (2012) — there are more homes there now. So it appears neighbours heard nothing, only the dog.
Google Maps

 

[Sleuthine]

This goes back many, many threads, but just wanted to state that I personally don't find the six weeks vacation from home without husband that extremely unusual. I did it myself with my girls when I was on maternity leave for both kids (both sets of grandparents live overseas). Did not see my husband for six weeks, but my parents who helped me with the girls. My husband just visited shortly and helped with the flights.

IIRC BW was supposed to start Kindergarten this summer. Perhaps one of the last opportunities to go on a longer vacation.

 

[searchinGirl]

CBD oil lacks THC. They say that you don't need THC for pain relief, but I find it's not useful without it. For many of us, the CBD oil just doesn't work.

Ive noticed lately there are blends of CBD and THC.

 

[gitana1]

Do we have a verified insider?

Yes. Isalybra.

 

[Jeng1810]

IMO the videos are from SW . They are valuable bc they show interaction of not only CW with girls but SW with the girls as well. They also show how she interacts with CW and he with her. We not only have videos but the words of her family saying he was a great dad and father . We have the neighbors and friends saying the same . I don’t understand what actual evidence we have before the murders , that he was not a good dad. There has never been a DV call. SW even calls CW the calm one and herself the fiery one. That’s the shocking part about this case .

For all intents and purposes he was a great dad prior to this. You are correct there is no proof to say otherwise. It’s easy for others to use the 20/20 hindsight vision and pick apart anything he has done to “prove” he was not a good dad. I think for anyone we could find things in the past to “prove” that.

 

[Coolmomof4]

Here’s an article about a talk he gave in which he discussed the possibility of having another child, in order to repair a deteriorating relationship.
Christopher Watts video talks about relationships

At that point in their marriage though, I don't think it makes sense that he would be actively having an affair AND trying to repair the marriage by having another baby.

 

[gitana1]

I hope, by now everyone knows how I feel about CW. He is a biggest and is guilty as charged.

Yet, in the whip cream to the face video, I saw a loving, caring, fun-loving and attentive dad. My true feeling. I was surprised.
Our verified insider said the same thing about CW.

Is this a big giant problem for the State? No, but it's an obstacle they have to over come in order to prove premeditation. JMO.

What can I say? He knew how to act. He also appeared like a devoted, in-love husband. But he was having an affair. Maybe multiple.

And the day after he murdered his kids or she did if anyone wants to consider his claims, he smirked and smiled and laughed as he stood calmly lying about their whereabouts on the porch of his house.

How can a man who really loved his kids and just possibly lost his mind, regain it so quickly and not be devastated once he snapped back out of it?

Those interviews communicate more than his performances as father of the year ever could, IMO, as we know now what happened while he stood there showing off his t-shirt.

They tell me all I need to know about who the real Chris Watts really is.

 

[Seattle1]

Are the homes in SW’s neighborhood close together? One thing I noticed in the XMAS video was that Cece’s crying can be heard from one end of the house to the other. Makes me wonder whether there was a struggle when CW committed the murders or if he killed them while they slept. Surprised neighbors have not commented on loud crying coming from their home (just Dieter’s barking).

In thread #19, there are some real estate photos of house next door that's for sale, and in confirming a gated fence alongside the Watts' garage, I'd say the homes are built close to each other.

 

[gitana1]

For all intents and purposes he was a great dad prior to this. You are correct there is no proof to say otherwise. It’s easy for others to use the 20/20 hindsight vision and pick apart anything he has done to “prove” he was not a good dad. I think for anyone we could find things in the past to “prove” that.

The proof that he was not a good dad is he murdered his children, dumped their corpses in separate crude oil vats and as they swirled and rotted he stood on the porch of his home, lying through his teeth, smiling and laughing, the very day after their deaths.

Good dads don't act like that.

He may have played a part and well. But we have a lot of serious evidence that what he portrayed -happy husband and loving father- was not reality.

 

[Jeng1810]

Thank You for that information

Yes my mom has the same scar. Noticed it right away on some of the photos.

 

[human]

It's pretty incredible.

If people saw me in my home I guess they'd think I'm a serial killer based on how people are reacting to some cherry-picked videos on here.

We have to remember a few things:

1. She is holding the camera and trying to film a situation or narrative or whatever. It's her "show" so she's directing. I do the very same thing in videos. "Move there. Come here. Smile!"
2. We literally have the benefit of viewing this family from only one lens. Why? Because the murderer deleted his Facebook a week before the slaughter. He would be likely to post his own videos from his own phone. But that's gone. So we don't know what it looks like when he's on the other end of the camera or when he's running the show. We are getting only one picture. Dissecting this poor dead woman and her family from only one view and cherry-picked videos people are posting in an effort to show she's a monster of some sort.
3. Some people don't parent or treat children with kid gloves. They know kids that age cry a lot. They cry when they want something or don't want something or think something is scary or get mad. So some people don't make a big deal about kids getting upset for a second and try to teach them to be a bit tougher. It's not my style but it's not abuse.
Reminds me of a dear friend of mine. Actually is similar to Shanann in personality. She and her mom. Lots of joking and ribbing. She sort of downplays it when her kids cry or act upset over little things. But the minute they're truly hurt or upset, she's the one they run to. Her husband is a very quiet, stoic person. She is half Italian and outgoing and seems to run the house. But it's not true. He actually does.

It also reminds me of me versus my ex. Scenario? I hear yelling and whining as my ex is roughhousing. "Put him down! He doesn't like it! He's upset!"
"Oh he loves it."
"Damn it put him down!" (It really annoys me).
"If he's upset why isn't he trying to get away? And why does he keep coming back when I put him down?"
(Totally true).

I don't like squirting anyone in the face with anything. I worry about their eyes. And a child can get the idea that a bottle that sprays is a toy to use on another kid's face, not understanding that that's windex or whatever.

That beings said, anyone analzying any good parent for long enough can find things to criticize. And damn it, they do.

It's amazing how harsh people can be about other people's parenting. The Sanctimommies out there just freaking out over every last thing people do with their kids that's shown on tv or online. Just losing their minds over "My God!! You're holding the baby wrong, using the baby sling wrong, using the car seat wrong, you should have done this or that or the other!"

It's endlessly eyerolling to me. We have become a generation of sanctimonious judges of others due in part to the ability to monitor people's parenting on the internet and partly because we are the hysterical "safety" generation and exposing children to the tiniest bit of danger of discomfort is now a cardinal sin.

And it's creating a bunch of kids who don't know the limits of their own bodies or how to problem solve or socialize without their parents' constant supervision and interference and it's creating a bunch of adults who think it's acceptable to pick someone to death over the tiniest flaws they see in photos or videos posted online.

One thing I will say though is that yes, how she interacts in these few, cherry picked videos with her schlub of a husband lurking around in them, may be indicative of a relationship-dynamic that he grew to resent, loathe and eventually to hate her over.

But not because she was a nasty woman, or controlling or mean-spiritited or because he was cowed or abused or a victim or anything else that I've been seeing on here.

Nope. It's because IMO the intensely strong reaction on here and elsewhere, to a woman who is pretty normal, just not a submissive, shrinking violet (reminds me a bit of Leah Remini's character in her tv show. I guess she's a psychopath), tells me that a woman who doesn't adhere to certain societal expectations about gender - that a woman doesn't give directions or instructions to a man, that a woman can't make jokes at a man's expense about winninng or she's a monstrous, emasculating shrew, that a woman can't be in control, decisive and a leader in her relationship with her man or other men, that a normal woman is always exceedingly maternal, soft spoken, submissive, sweet, supportive and yielding- women who don't adhere to those "norms" are soundly punished by society.

I feel Shanann is being punished here for daring to step outside those norms. She's a shrew. She pushed him to murder. She may even have murdered the kids herself.

But what's important is that those norms clearly exist. And if educated, informed people here react to them harshly, what about a man who may not be as educated? What about a man from a traditional family or area? One who is more quiet and introverted? Might he quietly seethe at his woman daring to make decisions or give commands or make an impression or get attention?

I never forget someone on here posted a video SW took of her thrive people dancing. She was giggling and laughing and in the background her husband stood quietly, standing sideways, but his head turned, just silently watching his exuberant wife.

The poster explained that it reminded her so much of her ex husband. Who was a secretly abusive creep. He would watch her like that and I guess count the ways her behavior dislpleased him. He was jealous of her and he punished her later for it.

Well maybe CW wasn't secretly abusive. Maybe he never vocally expressed any displeasure toward her at all. But he clearly punished her in the end anyway. He took away almost everything that mattered to her. He took away her babies her precious children, and he took away her life, the very breath from her body.

She dared to step outside of societal gender norms. People deem that emasculating. IMO far from it but it makes a point. If that's how some normal people view her behavior, what about a person with a secret defect of character?

So in the end, after this long rambling post, in a way I agree with many who say this dynamic might explain some things.

It does. For me it explains that women who dare to veer from certain gender norms are still punished by society. They're deemed not to be good mothers. Bad wives. Wives who pushed their hapless men to violence.

The incredibly strong negative reaction to these cherry picked videos by some who seem to be turning the tables here and deeming the victim to be the abuser and the murderer to be the victim, tells me that the reaction to this strong, decisive woman could be much more deadly on the part of a defective monster who quietly seethed at all she dared to be, and all he never was.

Shanann Watts

As a teacher of children who had many hours of training to provide safe and respectful classrooms for children, I am not sanctimonious. I stand for children and I always will.

People uses children to fulfill their needs. For instance, the parents at children’s athletic events that scream at the coach and their children.

Ask yourself, “ Is this for you or for your child?”

Gone are the days when kids played outside with peers and came in for lunch and dinner. Now parents are over involved in their kid’s lives. Ask any college prof if they get parents calling about their child's grade.

Children are not some kind of props or ego extensions for adults.

There are many fine examples of teachers and teachings to follow such as Magda Gerber , Bev Bos, Adverse Childhood Experiences.

If what parents are doing is all right, we would not have so many adults with issues from childhood.

Children need to be respected as much as adults. Their bodies, feelings, boundaries, likes and dislikes are to be valued not subjegated by adult needs

 

[Mamamerced]

You can buy CBD over the internet, for pain management. Don't need to move house...

That would be hemp CBD oil which is not nearly as effective as MJ-CBD oil.

 

[Jeng1810]

The proof that he was not a good dad is he murdered his children, dumped their corpses in separate crude oil vats and as they swirled and rotted he stood on the porch of his home, lying through his teeth, smiling and laughing, the very day after their deaths.

Good dads don't act like that.

He may have played a part and well. But we have a lot of serious evidence that what he portrayed -happy husband and loving father- was not reality.

I’m talking about prior to the murders of course!!! There is no prior proof IMO that he was going to do this.

 

[Jennifer17]

I’m talking about prior to the murders of course!!! There is no prior proof IMO that he was going to do this.

Scott Peterson, by all accounts was a loving husband who was looking forward the birth of his child too.

 

[Jeng1810]

Scott Peterson, by all accounts was a loving husband who was looking forward the birth of his child too.

Exactly!! UNTIL “it” happened. Her family even supported him from what I recall.

 

[Davia18]

As a teacher of children who had many hours of training to provide safe and respectful classrooms for children, I am not sanctimonious. I stand for children and I always will.

People uses children to fulfill their needs. For instance, the parents at children’s athletic events that scream at the coach and their children.

Ask yourself, “ Is this for you or for your child?”

Gone are the days when kids played outside with peers and came in for lunch and dinner. Now parents are over involved in their kid’s lives. Ask any college prof if they get parents calling about their child's grade.

Children are not some kind of props or ego extensions for adults.

There are many fine examples of teachers and teachings to follow such as Magda Gerber , Bev Bos, Adverse Childhood Experiences.

If what parents are doing is all right, we would not have so many adults with issues from childhood.

Children need to be respected as much as adults. Their bodies, feelings, boundaries, likes and dislikes are to be valued not subjegated by adult needs

All 100% my opinion but in the xmas video I didn't understand why push the kids to see Santa, they didn't want to and that is OK.
I have zero pictures with my youngest with Santa because he just didn't want to. Now if my kids don't want to go to school well to bad they are going. I have 3 children 14,13 and 6 and it's very hard to parent and do everything correctly so I'm not judging but just didn't understand the push in the video. For CeCe to cry that much and long just broke my heart MOO MOO

 

[The Saint]

Once again, here are the closest floorplans that we have of the Watts house. PommyMommy posted them flipped so them so they would match the orientation of the Watts house . I revised those floorplans by flipping the room titlesm so you could easily read them and added a few more titles.

There is a side door to the garage (according to the floorplan of the ground level). The door sits far enough back, that it wouldn't appear in the photos of the house for sale next door that Bill Carson posted on Thread #19.

 

[Jeng1810]

All 100% my opinion but in the xmas video I didn't understand why push the kids to see Santa, they didn't want to and that is OK.
I have zero pictures with my youngest with Santa because he just didn't want to. Now if my kids don't want to go to school well to bad they are going. I have 3 children 14,13 and 6 and it's very hard to parent and do everything correctly so I'm not judging but just didn't understand the push in the video. For CeCe to cry that much and long just broke my heart MOO MOO

I agree. I never pushed my kids to do things to have the “happy video or picture”. I did though make them visit the Easter bunny and Santa as long as they were not terrified just to keep the spirit alive. IMO her business revolves around exactly what she posted and so she did her best to make those “perfect memories”. My husband owns a business and he would “kill me” (no pun intended) if I tried to post so many videos of our crazy family!!!

 

[Mo Thuairim]

What can I say? He knew how to act. He also appeared like a devoted, in-love husband. But he was having an affair. Maybe multiple.

And the day after he murdered his kids or she did if anyone wants to consider his claims, he smirked and smiled and laughed as he stood calmly lying about their whereabouts on the porch of his house.

How can a man who really loved his kids and just possibly lost his mind, regain it so quickly and not be devastated once he snapped back out of it?

Those interviews communicate more than his performances as father of the year ever could, IMO, as we know now what happened while he stood there showing off his t-shirt.

They tell me all I need to know about who the real Chris Watts really is.

For all the criticism levelled at Shanann for portraying an idealised image on social media, it's clear to me CW was really the image-obsessed one in that couple — rewatching those videos of himself over and over again on his phone while everyone else searched for his family.