Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #25

[WildWest]

Was the inside lock latched on the morning she came home? I did not know that. Why would he do that if he knew she was on her way home? Sounds suspicious to me. That makes me think he killed the girls before she came home if this is the case. Jmo

I apologize, I was jumping off a post a read here earlier, it seems either what I read was mistaken or I read/understood it incorrectly. Either way being knocked over by feather with all the above minus the errant inside lock, it does indeed happen.

At 14 weeks? Maybe because it was high risk. It still would have been the first one where you can see the little arms and legs. It's the one most people show off. At any rate, her friend said she was looking forward to it so I would think her husband would realize it was important. Then again he doesn't seem to value human life so it's not surprising at all. Imo

I understood she was 15 weeks. I have a similar ilk to lupus and had a high risk pregnancy, I had 2 ultrasounds per WEEK during my first trimester, then weekly til IIRC 4 months, anyway I heard my baby's heartbeat much earlier than her appt. that was 15 weeks and I heard healthy pregnancies have a 16 week ultrasound---which is also so sad because if it was indeed to hear the heartbeat for the first time that indicates to me that her and Nico we coming along quite well

 

[MyBelle]

Would the defense not suggest SW was offender ?

I think they will only if the forensic evidence introduces reasonable doubt CW was the girls' killer. If not, I think CW has no choice but to enter a plea to avoid the DP. JMO

 

[Whiteorchids]

It is true that CW wasn't wearing his wedding ring and lupus bracelet in interviews and that was discussed at length previously. It was odd about the lupus bracelet because CW always seemed to have it on in photos however, members on other threads did demonstrate the CW didn't always have his wedding ring on in photos. Some speculated because he lost 50 lbs that the wedding ring may be too big now. Some speculated that due to work regulations that he could not wear his wedding ring to work for safety reasons (snagging on equipment etc). But the lupus bracelet was odd for sure.

Thanks for that info. I wonder if he discarded her Apple Watch somewhere? you can even press a button on the Apple Watch to locate your iPhone. They did locate her iPhone between two cushions in a loft area.

 

[Jennifer17]

It could prove Shanann exaggerated their medical conditions demanding tests and procedures the doctor didn't think were indicated or necessary. The marriage was breaking up for a reason. The jury will want to know why. JMO

That is often a consequence of infidelity, hardly ever do marriages break up because a mother took her children to the doctors too often in some people's minds.

 

[MsBetsy]

I think we h

It could prove Shanann exaggerated their medical conditions demanding tests and procedures the doctor didn't think were indicated or necessary. The marriage was breaking up for a reason. The jury will want to know why. JMO

We have already discovered the kids had legitimate health problems. No Dr is going to order tests or procedures that are not necessary, and they certainly wouldn't include it in the file! Drs are used to worried parents. Parents read things on line, talk to family about symptoms and illnesses and bring questions into for Dr.s all the time. They are used to it! My Drs favorite line he tells his patients: " Stay off the internet!" Jmo

 

[MassGuy]

That is often a consequence of infidelity, hardly ever do marriages break up because a mother took her children to the doctors too often in some people's minds.

Yeah. A dad concerned with his wife taking his kids to the doctor’s too often, doesn’t exactly jibe with the actions of a man who dumped his children’s bodies in oil tanks.

 

[pocketaccent]

The Defense doesn't have to prove anything but if there are text messages or evidence CW wanted a separation and SW knew it prior to the murder, it likely will be introduced, imo.

It is the prosecution's job to prove CW murdered his children. There will be jurors capable of forming conclusions based on forensic evidence and won't care that he lied because he was having an affair. Convicting a man simply because he had an affair while his wife was pregnant isn't going to happen in this case. I'm confident the judge will not allow it to turn into a circus. JMO

If their text messages show that CW had been begging for a separation and SW had been resisting and threatening to kill their babies if he went ahead with the separation, then I'll jump the fence.

 

[MassGuy]

BBM
If their text messages show that CW had been begging for a separation and SW had been resisting and threatening to kill their babies if he went ahead with the separation, then I'll jump the fence.

Spoiler alert: they won’t.
In fact, I’ll eat my hat.

 

[Charlot123]

The purpose of psychological autopsies (PA) is not to diagnose mental illness. Not at all.

Shanann didn't commit suicide. We know she was at a safe place, her home, when she was killed.
There is no need to perform a PA on her. IMO, JMO

It does not matter. It would be interesting to know what mistakes she had made, financial and otherwise, but it is obvious that these two were very different people. It is also clear to me that several people saw her a few hours before she died and observed nothing out of the ordinary. If any of her Thrive colleagues saw something grossly off in the airport, or even before, they'd step forward and say something. I understand that she was ...well, OK for a pregnant, tired woman. So I do not believe she killed either of her kids, it is out of her character. Totally.

 

[MyBelle]

That is often a consequence of infidelity, hardly ever do marriages break up because a mother took her children to the doctors too often in some people's minds.

I disagree. I think there are many factors which contribute to marriages breaking up and one of them is disagreements on child rearing, food, medical, sleeping, etc. JMO

 

[MKZoo]

It could prove Shanann exaggerated their medical conditions demanding tests and procedures the doctor didn't think were indicated or necessary. The marriage was breaking up for a reason. The jury will want to know why. JMO

Which medical conditions do you think were exaggerated? I ask that sincerely and without snark. I’m curious because conditions such as asthma, peanut allergies, etc., require a medical diagnosis that no doctor is going to give to appease a worried mom.

 

[Jennifer17]

It does not matter. It would be interesting to know what mistakes she had made, financial and otherwise, but it is obvious that these two were very different people. It is also obvious to me that several people saw her a few hours before she died and obviously, there was nothing abnormal. If any of her Thrive colleagues observed something grossly off, they'd step forward and say something. I understand that she was ...well, OK for a pregnant, tired woman. So I do not believe she killed either of her kids, it is out of her character. Totally.

Yes, and we did observe him two days after the deaths of his wife and children and that said plenty about his character.
And the Thayers. Talking about selling the house two days after they had been gone.

 

[MyBelle]

I think we h

We have already discovered the kids had legitimate health problems. No Dr is going to order tests or procedures that are not necessary, and they certainly wouldn't include it in the file! Drs are used to worried parents. Parents read things on line, talk to family about symptoms and illnesses and bring questions into for Dr.s all the time. They are used to it! My Drs favorite line he tells his patients: " Stay off the internet!" Jmo

Every medical chart has "notes" placed by doctors and nurses. I think that might make for some interesting reading. JMO

 

[Jennifer17]

I disagree. I think there are many factors which contribute to marriages breaking up and one of them is disagreements on child rearing, food, medical, sleeping, etc. JMO

And affairs with multiple partners is one of the major reasons for marriage break ups.

 

[MyBelle]

Which medical conditions do you think were exaggerated? I ask that sincerely and without snark. I’m curious because conditions such as asthma, peanut allergies, etc., require a medical diagnosis that no doctor is going to give to appease a worried mom.

I agree. Which is why it will be interesting to learn if the conditions SW claimed the children had were actually diagnosed. JMO

 

[PrimeSuspect]

The purpose of psychological autopsies (PA) is not to diagnose mental illness. Not at all.
Shanann didn't commit suicide. We know she was at a safe place, her home, when she was killed.
There is no need to perform a PA on her. IMO, JMO
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
An individual can become a victim due to two types of exposure… lifestyle and situational. The two aforementioned terms are defined by Turvey & Petherick (2009) and are as follows… lifestyle exposure holds that some people are more prone to being victimized due to their behavior, habits, or customs which exposes them to a greater amount of contact with crime and criminals (i.e. prostitutes, narcotics users). Situational exposure is the amount of one’s exposure to harmful elements experienced by the victim that results from their environment and personal traits at the time of their victimization (i.e. “being in the wrong place at the wrong time” such as tourists in a foreign country).
Whether a victim’s exposure is due to their lifestyle or is situational in nature, an analysis of these concepts is very much prudent when conducting a PA in order to ascertain as to how this contributed to an individual’s victimization in that either form of exposure allows an offender to gain knowledge of their victim and also assists them in seeking out the appropriate opportunity also. Exposure analysis during the course of a PA can give investigators insight into the mindset of an offender.

Thanks pocketaccent, this article doesn't apply to SW, I read nowhere about domestic incidents/murders.
This is about why a victim is chosen by a perpetrator in the above examples. Very interesting though.

“to know the offender, you must know the victim.” “ exposure vs. blame”

 

[MassGuy]

Every medical chart has "notes" placed by doctors and nurses. I think that might make for some interesting reading. JMO

There is NO evidence that Shanann was harming her children. There is NO evidence that she was struggling with mental health issues. There is NO evidence that she murdered her children.

You can’t just make things up in order to support your belief that C.W. is innocent of the murder of his children, and that Shannan did this.

If you have evidence with which to opine, I’m all for hearing it. But the narrative should be based on the facts, not the other way around.

 

[Whiteorchids]

Did CW have any guy friends he regularly hung out with other than the couple he stayed with after murdering SW and unborn baby Niko and allegedly the girls.

 

[MyBelle]

And affairs with multiple partners is one of the major reasons for marriage break ups.

Marilyn Lemak murdered her kids over one affair her husband had. I've seen no evidence of multiple affairs in this case. One would be enough. JMO

 

[Jennifer17]

Every medical chart has "notes" placed by doctors and nurses. I think that might make for some interesting reading. JMO

Of course they do, but they belong to the doctor. A doctor can, if he wishes give a summary, but not the records.
A doctor would never write anything derogatory about a patient in his files. The notes for one visit are usually only one line, describing the symptom and treatment.