Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #26

[AmaranthaRuth]

Wow, this thread is moving so fast it’s impossible to keep up with, even while spending way too much time checking it morning & night...

One thing I noticed, in one of SW’s FB videos caught my attention & I’m wondering if anyone else noticed (& forgive me if it’s been mentioned and I missed it.)

The Saturday morning, half-hour or so vid: (“Saturdays with Thrive” or something.) She’s wearing lavender shirt or Pj’s and the girls are vying for her attention... CW is in the background playing with them off & on but there’s no little to no interaction between SW & CW.

Shan’ann looks to me like she’s been crying or perhaps is really sleep deprived (maybe both.) Still, she’s troopering along because that’s who she is — and it’s part of her job to make these upbeat vids, too. (Which can’t be easy in a difficult situation like theirs.)

She eventually goes out on the deck to keep talking. (The girls are inside with CW in this one.) IMO she doesn’t feel safe saying what she has to say in front of him.

It looks to me like she’s flustered, worried, preoccupied. She keeps saying she’s ‘rambling...’ — which is a bit unusual in this case based on what I’ve seen. She’s generally pretty darn articulate.

It strikes me that there’s almost a cry for help type element. There’s a touching genuineness in this video (and others.)

She mentions something about ‘the haters, like...’ and then casts an eye pointedly in the direction of CW, inside the house.

It’s a pretty telling microexpression IMHO. Especially watching the whole video & taking in the context.

Did anybody else notice this?

Lest I seem to be ‘blindly’ siding with SW, I’ll also say that after watching a batch
of videos with CW, I could see a gentle side to him which could be endearing and compelling. I felt somehow bad for him. And I was confused, unsettled and even a bit shocked to realize I felt this.

I want to think there’s a human person inside him. But, if so, how could he do what he did?

I realized that all this left me asking unanswerable questions like some I still wrangle with regarding my ex, who had a charming, gentle side... and a nightmarish side behind closed doors.

I got away; it’s been over two years and I still struggle with the trauma. But after following this case, I am so glad I managed to leave. (At great cost to my quality of life, I might add. It was a long and sordid saga. But, I am still alive, with a chance to rebuild.)

It really looks to *me* like SW was in the process of leaving. And, I do believe she greatly valued her marriage and family (and not just because they ‘made her look good.’ I believe she loved her sweet little girls and her husband, with all her heart.) So this makes me wonder what else was going on.

This is just so heartbreaking, all the more so because there are no simple answers.

Sure, it looks to me like CW is guilty as sin for all the murders. And yet, he looks to be doing his best to be a good husband and dad in many of the videos. (Certainly not the porch LE interviews, though. He looks like he’s trying to look calm, but his voice is shaking, he’s gulping & his breathing is unsteady.)

This is just a heartbreaker of a case.

Sorry so long!

 

[Whiteorchids]

I thought sausagepizza meant the sheets were soiled because the children released their bowels upon death.

LE looked at the bedding and didn’t see any evidence of foul play. DNA would need to go through a lab such as fluids from intercourse and hair, fibers etc.

 

[katie565]

Actually babies have been killed. In Persia as late as the late 1800’s a girl baby was killed because girls were not valued.

In Polynesia, babies were killed as a sacrfice as late as the late 1800’s or maybe even later than that.

I forget about China and girls? It was not too long ago.

Those are quick examples right off of the top of my head. Most places didn’t have oil wells until fairly recently . So the fact that there are crude oil spas sure paints a different picture than I have of crude oil as in, “No thank you very much.”

We have a couple posters saying oil has an important meaning to them. No one can say to them, “No, you cannot have that viewpoint. “ They have it.

It is not my viewpoint but to castigate someone for that viewpoint is denying them the right to express themselves

My mother’s entire family is in Texas and her wealth is from oil royalties that her father set up. Every quarter she’s rolling in it, especially the last couple years. She LOVES oil! Believe me! I believe she loves it more than her own children. I’ll ask her tmrw how she’d feel about being dumped in an oil well when she’s dead and get back to you all.

If you’re cool with it, Ok. But it is not a normal custom for families from Texas, NC or any other place I’ve ever heard of in the world. Even when they’ve earned millions from that liquid gold.

Edited to ask: do those of you with different views of oil want to see your parent, child or self thrown in an oil tank? If not, why?

 

[Amonet]

Hi everyone... I was a member a few years back and got busy with life. I've lurked on cases that I've followed but never posted so my profile was deleted. Anywho… I had to come back and post my thoughts on this case. MOO
Perhaps this has been put out there, maybe not, so here is my theory:

SW comes home early Monday morning, the house is quiet and she checks on the girls, everything is fine and she goes to bed thinking that CW is asleep. He is faking sleep and waits for her to fall asleep. Perhaps she takes sleep inducing medication which knocks her out. Then he suffocates her by putting something over her face or strangles her and she doesn't struggle because she's knocked out. He then goes in and does the same to the girls; he may have given them something to induce deep sleep too. It's a couple of hours after SW came home (4am-ish) when he finishes and needs to move the bodies downstairs to his truck. In a panic, he's trying to tie up all the loose ends but he needs to get rid of the bodies before the sun rises, so he leaves the house in disarray (bedding on the floor, etc). He had preplanned where he was going to take them and had the grave already dug for SW. He didn't go back home but went directly to work afterwards. He may have thought he'd have time to get home and cleanup the house, take out the trash, etc. before anyone suspected SW and the girls were missing.

He didn't count on N being on high alert based on what she knew from SW. *Thanx N!

Yes, I think his main focus was on hiding the bodies, and then maybe thinking he'd finish clearing the crime scene after work and possibly call a few friends and say "I think she's walked out on me and taken the girls...has she told anyone where she's going, I'm so scared for my girls!" Maybe a friend would say to report them missing to LE, and by then he'd have got rid of her purse and the sheet and pillowcase in the trash, and maybe the suitcase at the bottom of the stairs would have been dumped and he'd say "well her case was there when I went to work". But maybe he wouldn't have even reported them missing as he'd hope everyone would assume she had left him and that there was no reason for police investigation.

 

[Gardener1850]

Sorry, accidental post. Carry on.

 

[BabyButterfly]

I don’t think anyone is happy that four people lost their lives, but I definitely have gotten the impression there’s some glee w/some people when it comes to picking into SW’s FB videos and other elements of her personal life. My opinion only, but that is the way it has come across to me.

I totally agree.

 

[Whiteorchids]

I'm not discounting it yet

No it’s possible but I think he wanted to get rid of the entire family.

 

[MsBetsy]

I could kiss you for posting this! thanks

I would like to know how one would explain the defense is claiming the fingerprint , DNA,and palm print is unreasonable? Why wouldnt they want to eliminate him as a suspect for the murder of the children? Maybe I just can't see it because I think he is guilty. Maybe someone who believes SW killed the children have some ideas? I don't get it. One of the lawyers?

 

[Mrspratcher]

Maybe not til trial.

@gitana1 , @amandaa , @Mrspratcher . Tia.

For now, all of our information will come via filings with the Court. We probably won’t get the autopsy results until trial.

 

[FlossyMay]

Not saying that CW did this, but I know someone who was having an affair and the AP routinely rode in the homeowners back seat under a blanket, he would pull his car into the garage and shut the garage door before the AP got out. In the morning they’d reverse the process and the AP would get back in their car parked a few miles away. Two years, lots of neighbors and no-one ever found out.

That seems a little out there to me, but I'm sure weirder things have happened. It looks like it would be a lot easier to go to a hotel, the AP's house or even parking in the woods, but to each his own. I don't really know why that matters anyway, unless you think she was there during the murders. I find that highly unlikely, but that's all just my own opinion.

 

[NuttMegg]

The judge likely denied both parties' motions because he evaluated the probative value of swabbing the girls' necks for parental prints, against the prejudice this evidence could pose to either parent. In this case, either parent's prints could be on one or both girls' necks, as well as on other parts of their bodies. This would only prove that one or both parents touched the girls' necks, or bodies, in the areas swabbed, unless there are bruises ripe for fingerprint/palm print analysis. So, there is little probative value in this evidence, but the possibility of great prejudice to the parent whose prints might incidentally be on the girls' necks.

So ME doesnt decide what evidence to collect?

 

[nwmouse]

LE looked at the bedding and didn’t see any evidence of foul play. DNA would need to go through a lab such as fluids from intercourse and hair, fibers etc.

Oh, because I was reading Layla123's HLN AB summary and it says:
"5. Defense not happy about leaked information People Magazine printed and actually quoted them in motion. Motion cited that C.W. “showed no emotion when he was being booked,” “no evidence SW killed kids” “CW had been thinking about this for quite some time,” “evidence found in CW’struck.” “Evidence found in bedding, clothes, computers, phones, text messages, and search histories” Defense is not happy about this info getting out there." So I assumed evidence in the sheets to be from the children.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

Does anyone put any stock into the theory that on CW's watch, something accidental happened to one of the girls, which threw CW into a tailspin of panic and shock?

No. I personally have no belief in that theory. And lots of commenters on here have eloquently given personal accounts of their own experiences dealing with a child's sudden death, none of which involved murder and an ensuing bizarre cover-up.

 

[sun16]

Does anyone put any stock into the theory that on CW's watch, something accidental happened to one of the girls, which threw CW into a tailspin of panic and shock?

No.

 

[MsBetsy]

I thought sausagepizza meant the sheets were soiled because the children released their bowels upon death.

I don't think that is always true. It also depends on whether or not their has been food digested or not. Imo

 

[MyBelle]

Ok, let's say she does make disparaging remarks about CW: its no justification to murder her and the kids. A normal person would file for divorce, even if the wife said no. Millions of husbands and wives are ribbed or insulted many times during a marriage but they either stay and work things out or get a divorce. They (usually) don't murder their wife, toddlers and unborn son.

There is never any justification for the murder of children. And there is no justification for verbal abusing anyone whether it be spouse, child, neighbor.

Verbally poke at someone repeatedly and you might get an unexpected reaction. Unfortunately, horrific tragedies can result. JMO

 

[katie565]

I would like to know how one would explain the defense is claiming the fingerprint , DNA,and palm print is unreasonable? Why wouldnt they want to eliminate him as a suspect for the murder of the children? Maybe I just can't see it because I think he is guilty. Maybe someone who believes SW killed the children have some ideas? I don't get it. One of the lawyers?

I think the job of the defense is to protect the client and keep any and everything that is potentially incriminating out of the record.

 

[nwmouse]

I think the job of the defense is to protect the client and keep any and everything that is potentially incriminating out of the record.

Hopefully it won't be like the Jodi Arias defense who objected to everything!

 

[Amandaaa]

I clearly have an opinion that matches the prosecution’s account, but welcome your thoughts otherwise if it’s based on facts. Above all, this is supposed to be a forum where we can discuss different theories. I for one only take exception when theories are based on speculation about the victim and not facts. Ditto the defendant, though admittedly I have speculated the role the AP played in his motives. I’m way behind on reading all the posts but if you haven’t already expounded on your theory, and it fits w/published facts I encourage you to share it.

Yes it’s based on facts... but it fills in the gaps in a way that - IMO - tells a story that’s aligned with CW’s innocence (relating to the 2 girls).

People have assumed that if something isn’t listed in the affidavit, it didn’t happen - which is not necessarily true - and, IMO, are underestimating the nervousness and anxiety and panic of a man who’s just killed his wife.

This is not MY position - I am not demonizing anyone or victim blaming - and I am not looking to get into any back and forth about the details - I just thought it would be an interesting exercise to pretend this was MY case, and these were the only facts in existence. How would I tell the story?

And I was quite surprised at how well it came together - in a way that I think could be relatable to a jury.

It’s a good (necessary) exercise for an attorney - but it’s a good exercise for anyone, actually. Strip away all your assumptions and look at the bare facts - not the conclusions you have drawn from them - and ask yourself how you would tell the story from the other side’s point of view, acknowledging the facts we have but also filling in the gaps in a way that is not inconsistent with those facts. How might you explain his actions in a way that aligns with his innocence (regarding the girls)? Same with his demeanor during the interview? His choice of disposal site?

I would rather challenge others to do this than give you my narrative - because I’m sure there are actually endless variations on it, with details I wouldn’t have thought of.

 

[MKZoo]

Yes, I think his main focus was on hiding the bodies, and then maybe thinking he'd finish clearing the crime scene after work and possibly call a few friends and say "I think she's walked out on me and taken the girls...has she told anyone where she's going, I'm so scared for my girls!" Maybe a friend would say to report them missing to LE, and by then he'd have got rid of her purse and the sheet and pillowcase in the trash, and maybe the suitcase at the bottom of the stairs would have been dumped and he'd say "well her case was there when I went to work". But maybe he wouldn't have even reported them missing as he'd hope everyone would assume she had left him and that there was no reason for police investigation.

This is pretty much where I fall in terms of a theory. IMO, he was going to claim the emotional conversation caused her to run away with his kids. I don’t think it would have worked for long because her family probably would have raised hell in short order if they didn’t hear from her - but I think it was the basic plan.

 

[Amandaaa]

Triplicate deleted!
What on earth happened???

 

[Amandaaa]

Duplicate deleted