Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #36

[flourish]

“It’s possible that putting the girls in separate tanks may have been some sort of symbolic thing done with a loved one after death.” I thought it was so interesting when AB and her guest discussed this, yesterday. Creepy, but interesting. It’s the only reason both of them could come up with for CW placing the girls in separate tanks. I’ve never heard of murderers offering meaningful, symbolic gestures to their victims before. Has anyone else?

I've mentioned it here. It was not a popular idea nor one which was willing to be considered by many.

We have heard of killers wrapping their victims and or covering them up. IIRC, that's somewhat common with mothers who kill their children and with killers who knew their victims. I don't have time to go find a link, so that's just my opinion.

My mentioning it as an idea is not a reflection on my opinion about it. I've been having nightmares about oil covered babies for weeks. However, as I've also mentioned, people have different ideas about what constitutes a proper burial (for example, in the culture of the religion of my family of origin, cremation is unacceptable). I don't find his disposal method remotely acceptable, but I am not a mind reader and can't presume to know what his thought process was. I suppose it's possible, although unlikely, that he viewed the girls as protected from elements and animals.



Again, I can't stress enough that I don't think he made a good choice, I don't support his disposal method, nor do I personally take issue with cremation nor am I indicating that CW has any opinions about cremation. I am not defending his actions.

But he may have viewed the disposal different than others do.

 

[Mrspratcher]

I have to say, when my hubby saw CW interview, he looked at me and said did Shanann know she married someone who was gay? I ignored him, but, who knows?

Yes, my Hubby is also an attorney, and I asked him what he thought - he said SW found out CW was gay, confronted him, and he murdered her to keep her from outing him.

I disagree. IMO, CW is your typical family annihilator, who, contrary to the way he committed the crimes, was very smart, and thought he committed the perfect crime. NUA threw a wrench in his plans.

 

[Lady Justice21]

The most common pattern is wife first, as she is the object or “primary target” as you put it.

If you think about it in purely practical terms, it makes sense that the wife would come before the kids.

Your plan is contingent upon killing them all, and the wife represents the biggest threat (fighting back, calling authorities, escaping).

Thank you. I keep going back and forth between theories, and this helps.

 

[human]

You raise some very valid points regarding health coverage, and the potential for exclusions or higher premiums in the future for SW should a divorce have had occurred. However; if a consumer has prior creditable coverage and there were no lapses in coverage, any pre-existing health condition would be eliminated.

I have had the privilege to participate in several state and federal insurance panels recently. While the information and article you reference (great information), are proposed, they have not yet been put into place. It may have affected SW in the future, if she remained self-employed.

Because CW has claimed a discussion occurred regarding a possible separation, SW would have been eligible to remain on his company group plan. I am fairly certain (I think ), that health insurance was not even something that either thought about or discussed.

If separated, no problem to stay on his plan. But if I had all of those health issues, I would be watching the healthcare info.

 

[Backstroke10]

I have to say, when my hubby saw CW interview, he looked at me and said did Shanann know she married someone who was gay? I ignored him, but, who knows?

Very interesting BabyButterfly! My son (who is gay) also said he thought he looked gay. hhhmmm can't wait to see CW text messages, etc.

 

[human]

I don't believe we have any evidence at all that they were discussing bankruptcy.

I was curious as although people have given ideas why they did not pay their HOA money, it could be because of other reasons than having no money.

Quite frankly, I have more income than they do and I could not afford what they had in their life. So it is a mystery.

 

[MsBetsy]

Money problems don't normally lead to murder and since CW has already admitted to killing (2people) as well as to lying, cheating, and obstructing justice, I would think any logical investigation into motive and stress-inducers, would be into him and his actions/behavior. I would be interested in his financial life BEFORE he met SW. We know SW did well and was a homeowner BEFORE she met CW. The onus seems to be on CW.

It's interesting that you say that because I have been thinking of the kind of person CW was before he met his wife. We know he was quiet and didn't have girlfriends in high school. He was shy. Or maybe just antisocial. Maybe he had little confidence in himself. It does appear that his wife at times tried to build it up by always complimenting him. Maybe he was an underacheiver, and regretted not living up to his goal of being a NASCAR mechanic. I wonder why he picked "relationships" as his topic in the Communications class. Maybe he was looking to have a marriage and children and was trying to figure out how intimate relationships work. He may be the kind of person who depends on direction or someone to run things in a relationship. He seemed to be compliant, and SW was the more dominant partner. Maybe he felt like he was a failure. One of the interesting things I read about family annihilators is the type who murders his family to "save them" from his own failures, in other words, himself. It's more complicated than that but it might be something to consider. Jmo

 

[pocketaccent]

IMO, CW would’ve thought that an “I was asleep all night” alibi would have been easy enough to avoid suspicion.

When he did see her, apparently it was at 2am, and was “real quick,” per one of his interviews.

So imagine CW in bed from around 2am-5am 2am-4am

Why would CW have pushed the conversation as far out as he could, but not as far as the time in which his truck backed into the garage? And why not say they had an emotional conversation way earlier, when she arrived at 2am?

IMO, seems he might have been trying to divert LE attention away from something that may have occurred between 2am - 4am. Jmo

Yah, something did happen between 2-4 am most likely.

I think that there's no reason why the bedding would be stripped off the bed unless she was killed there, which leads me to believe she was sleeping when he killed her.

Perhaps after arriving home, she woke him up and asked him to sleep in another room (emotional conversation maybe). Maybe he decided to kill everyone then.

So many possibilities, so little information...

 

[human]

@gitana1 - correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe SW and CW could have come to an agreement as far as insurance coverage goes. It would have been in CW's interest to keep the family on his plan, as a private/non-employer provided plan would have been quite costly. CW/SW would have needed to factor this additional cost when it came to spousal/child support calculations.

If they were divorced, I do not think he could have her on his plan. The kids yes. Her, no

 

[kkdj]

It seems to me that CW might be lying about who wanted the separation. Think about this for a second. SW went to NC for 6 weeks, leaving CW alone for 5 of those. If she already knew he was having an affair then I'll bet she went there to set up plans for moving back. Imo a person doesn't leave their mate alone for 5 weeks, knowing that person is having an affair, without thinking it's over. Plus SW told others they were going to separate. CW did say they had an emotional discussion that early morning because he wanted to separate. That fits into his tale of her freaking out and killing the girls. I'll bet it's the opposite. She wanted the separation, he freaked out and killed them all. imo

 

[Tippy Lynn]

If I could ask CW 3 questions that could only be answered truthfully I would ask:
Who killed the girls?
Why did you dump your daughters bodies into the oil tanks?
What was the reason for the 4am emotional conversation?

What would you ask?

 

[human]

Right, but the laws would enable her to maintain healthcare for herself and her children.

The kids could be on his plan. She would be on her own. It depends on what state you are in because some governors refused to sign on creating huge problems for people.

Many people I know have policies with huge deductibles. It would not be wise for her to have a huge deductible policy

 

[Best of What's Around]

I've mentioned it here. It was not a popular idea nor one which was willing to be considered by many.

We have heard of killers wrapping their victims and or covering them up. IIRC, that's somewhat common with mothers who kill their children and with killers who knew their victims. I don't have time to go find a link, so that's just my opinion.

My mentioning it as an idea is not a reflection on my opinion about it. I've been having nightmares about oil covered babies for weeks. However, as I've also mentioned, people have different ideas about what constitutes a proper burial (for example, in the culture of the religion of my family of origin, cremation is unacceptable). I don't find his disposal method remotely acceptable, but I am not a mind reader and can't presume to know what his thought process was. I suppose it's possible, although unlikely, that he viewed the girls as protected from elements and animals.



Again, I can't stress enough that I don't think he made a good choice, I don't support his disposal method, nor do I personally take issue with cremation nor am I indicating that CW has any opinions about cremation. I am not defending his actions.

But he may have viewed the disposal different than others do.

Even though the society (ours) that CW lived in would not consider dumping in oil tanks a symbolic nor protective gesture, I would give some thought to it if CW hadn't followed it up with calculated texts/calls all morning to his dead wife (according to what he said in media interview) and his lack of any clue of devastation/grief in said interviews/time with Thayers that we have heard of to date. When I take this into consideration, it makes it implausible to me that the placement was anymore than a dumping and hiding of evidence of his crimes. But who knows what he tells himself...in fact, I would not be surprised at all if he tells himself it was a loving thing to do.

 

[kkdj]

If they were divorced, I do not think he could have her on his plan. The kids yes. Her, no

I think this could be worked out at least temporarily thru the court for her to remain on it.

 

[MassGuy]

It seems to me that CW might be lying about who wanted the separation. Think about this for a second. SW went to NC for 6 weeks, leaving CW alone for 5 of those. If she already knew he was having an affair then I'll bet she went there to set up plans for moving back. Imo a person doesn't leave their mate alone for 5 weeks, knowing that person is having an affair, without thinking it's over. Plus SW told others they were going to separate. CW did say they had an emotional discussion that early morning because he wanted to separate. That fits into his tale of her freaking out and killing the girls. I'll bet it's the opposite. She wanted the separation, he freaked out and killed them all. imo

I tend to agree with you on this. The only reason he said that he asked for a separation, is that it played into the story he was trying to sell, that she up and left with the kids.

After the bodies were discovered, he tweaked this to blame her for the murders.

 

[human]

Imo if he provided health insurance for them through work and it was a job benefit would he just be ordered to keep that as to interest of both parties financially ? Or if not covered at work I would think the judge would attribute some distribution of funding to keep current plan in place. Moo

I do not think insurance allows someone to be ona policy who is not a child or a spouse

 

[Mrspratcher]

If they were divorced, I do not think he could have her on his plan. The kids yes. Her, no

I'm not certain about this. He would have to notify his employer he was divorced, and then she would would be removed from his plan. But, if he never removed her, she could theoretically stay on the plan.

 

[Best of What's Around]

If I could ask CW 3 questions that could only be answered truthfully I would ask:
Who killed the girls?
Why did you dump your daughters bodies into the oil tanks?
What was the reason for the 4am emotional conversation?

What would you ask?

Honestly, nothing, because there is no guarantee that they would be answered truthfully IMO. But if there were a magical way to do so, it would not be these three questions for me because I believe firmly he killed the girls, dumped them to hide them in the best place he could think of, and there was no 4 am emotional convo, IMO. I guess I would ask WHY he did this and WHAT was his plan to get away with it? And, does he have true remorse now - not for doing it, but does he wish at least the girls were back in his life?

 

[Mellowmelly]

If I could ask CW 3 questions that could only be answered truthfully I would ask:
Who killed the girls?
Why did you dump your daughters bodies into the oil tanks?
What was the reason for the 4am emotional conversation?

What would you ask?

Why did you kill your daughters, your wife and unborn son ?
Why didn’t you just walk away ?
What gives you the right to play God?

 

[dixiegirl1035]

That was actually my Hubby's take on the case.

As was a family member of mine. Would the common denominator be the demographic that reads People magazine? Because that was the only information that the person knew about the case, was the original article in People magazine about the other guy.