Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #36

[Gardener1850]

Yah, something did happen between 2-4 am most likely.

I think that there's no reason why the bedding would be stripped off the bed unless she was killed there, which leads me to believe she was sleeping when he killed her.

Perhaps after arriving home, she woke him up and asked him to sleep in another room (emotional conversation maybe). Maybe he decided to kill everyone then.

So many possibilities, so little information...

I agree he most likely strangled her in bed not long after she got home. MOO based on the sheets.

I think it's possible he wanted sex when she got home and she said she was too tired from travel and being pregnant. And then she may have rolled over to go to sleep. Perhaps he became enraged by the rejection and strangled her in bed. The line he said in the porch interview where he stumbled over his words seeming to say "She barely let me..." and then changed what he was going to say makes me think this is plausible. I watched the interview before I knew much about this case and my first thought when I heard it was that he started to say "She barely let me kiss her" or "She barely let me have sex with her" but stopped himself because he knew that would be an inappropriate thing to say. I'm wondering if the autopsy will show signs of sexual assault. That would be a shocking revelation to those who knew them and may be why the prosecution doesn't want it out there before they interview everyone. Friends and family will be asked about how they were to each other-- did they show affection in public, did they ever talk to anyone about their sex life, etc. If there was any sexual assault component of the murder, that may change some people's answers on certain questions. MOO.

 

[Mellowmelly]

Not about blame or justification. I liked Ann Rule books because they go into the family dynamics. Not as an excuse but as a window to issues.

I would like to know what kind of situation all of this was. Otherwise, I would not be reading here.

I have read quite a few Anne Rule books, she goes into great detail about everything.

 

[human]

I think sadly he killed his babies and removed them from the house before she returned and he ambushed her as soon or not long after she came home. If the babies were still alive and he killed SW first, I presume there may have been a struggle which could have awoken Bella and Cece. I don’t think they would have been quiet on witnessing their mother being attacked. I think there would have been lots of screaming and crying, which the neighbors could have heard. JMO and speculation.

He had arms of steel. Choking her would not have her making a sound

 

[akazia1978]

Bluff said: ↑
@Amandaaa Can you advise whether an incarcerated inmate who is on suicide watch would be permitted private citizen visitors (non defense experts)?




@ZsaZsa I am sure CW has an "approved visitor list" as you suggest and I believe that list is based on his lawyers legal advice to him about whom he can visit with and whom he should not visit with. The point I was inquiring on with @Amandaaa is whether CW would be permitted private citizen visits (in general) if he was on suicide watch.

In this area yes. You don't even have to have approved visitors, that's for prisons within the state of Colorado. Usually you can just show up at the jail during visitor hours. He would not be in the contact area but through the glass or via video. He's obviously in Max/Special precautions so it would be over the phone or video.
Also, generally anyone can visit in prison unless they are on probation, or got off probation or parole within the last 6 months. Prisoners can refuse visits.

 

[MKZoo]

New court doc:
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/U Peoples Notice.pdf

People have autopsy reports and have provided them to defence

I wonder if the media will re-petition to have them released. Didn't AB/HLN make a big deal that the judge ignored their request or at least didn't think their request was a formal one?

 

[MassGuy]

Have we had anyone who knew CW speak negatively of him?

We only had one person who knew him over her.

The evidence does all the talking in regards to him.

 

[NuttMegg]

I completely agree. It confounds me, to see so many people who have "everything".

Not that it has anything to do with her or her children being killed.

Maybe CW thought he was a failure. And didn't want to let his kids down. Who knows? Other family annihilators have actually killed their families and subsequently committed suicide. However, CW didn't follow through on this. I truly think his "fantasy", just thought he would live happily ever after.

He is a coward. I wish he had committed suicide.

 

[Deleted member 182072]

Because it has to do with their finances and for no other reason I’d be interested to know how much SW earned. Does anyone know for certain? We don’t know how much inventory she bought, or freebies for marketing strategies, or airfare for the VIP mini getaways. There’s an up to $800 monthly bonus to put towards a luxury car at the 12k or above VIP rank. But that doesn’t include insurance and if you dip below that 12k the lease is in her name so she would be responsible for that month. It’s a new company (2013) and she apparently was a go getter so I imagine for those two reasons she was doing well. But what happens when the company becomes saturated with promoters? That is a moot point because she’s been killed. I honestly feel like the constant live videos affected this family adversely. I may not be thrilled that I’m now “older” but when I think back on my youth, families were closer. When I go out to a restaurant all I see are people on their phones. It’s sad, really.

This was posted by SW's verified friend on a previous thread:
@isalybra

"The ranks go from 80k to 200K, a big jump. In April her monthly sales were about 130k"​

The Le-Vel rewards plan:
https://media.le-vel.com/Documents/RewardsPlan.pdf
If I understand their lingo correctly, SW would have earned 20% on her direct sales, 12% on her level 1 customers and 4% on level 2 & 3 customers.

There are also Uni-level team commissions. SW was 80K VIP sales (monthly), so she would have earned 4% for 8 levels down.

There are other bonuses as well like "Infinity fast start", auto bonuses, all inclusive trips, etc.

I'll bet CW's sales were mainly from SW's effort and they did so to maximize their overall family income because they would be essentially doubling their downline commission to a point. JMO

 

[NuttMegg]

Have we had anyone who knew CW speak negatively of him?

2 who claim to be APs And I bet more will show up as witnesses.

 

[mtnlites]

It appeared to me that SW mostly belittled him on SM rather than build him up.

I disagree. I saw her mostly talking him up, almost going overboard in her gushing of compliments. I saw a couple of instances in which people have accused her of "belittling" him, but I didn't interpret those instances in the same way. To me, they were just playing around.

 

[Mellowmelly]

New court doc:
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/U Peoples Notice.pdf

People have autopsy reports and have provided them to defence

Has it been confirmed for definite that the results of the autopsies will be sealed from the public ? I’m wondering if the results will be released.

 

[MassGuy]

New court doc:
https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/U Peoples Notice.pdf

People have autopsy reports and have provided them to defence

Huge. Let the legal fight commence.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

I wonder if the media will re-petition to have them released. Didn't AB/HLN make a big deal that the judge ignored their request or at least didn't think their request was a formal one?

IIRC the judge hasn't yet decided on that and is going to have an in camera hearing first

 

[katydid23]

I am going to make a post offering my observation of a published news article and comments in the article but to preempt any push back towards me directly for this post, I want to make it clear that I do not have any loyalty or sympathy towards CW. I simply want to suggest that CW is receiving private citizen visits in jail and as a result of those visits, the consensus towards him is not favorable in CW's mind and he is not getting the support from those private citizens as he was hoping for.

Based on the paragraph below in the news article and the "direct quotes" within the article, I get the distinct impression that CW has received visits from private citizens since his incarceration.

It would appear to me that CW is referring to intimate conversations he has had with private citizens while in jail and not the conversations he has had with his defense team. If it was conversations with his defense team, those interpretations would remain confidential and CW and his defense team would not want those interpretations brought out in the media. I think these quotes support the idea that CW has had private citizen visits and as a result of those visits he feels the following:

"He feels like no one understands him, and nobody knows what happened," an insider told PEOPLE of Watts' current emotional state. "He thinks if they did understand, they'd realize he's not the monster everyone says he is."

Colorado man accused of murdering his wife and two daughters thinks that 'no one understands him'

From this quote below, you think it means he is speaking to visitors, who think he is a monster?

"He feels like no one understands him, and nobody knows what happened," an insider told PEOPLE of Watts' current emotional state. "He thinks if they did understand, they'd realize he's not the monster everyone says he is."


What I get from the above, is that he is talking about the general public.

If a 'private citizen' visited him, they'd likely be a good friend or family member. If so, then if he felt they dandy know what happened, and didn't understand him, he could explain and clarify.

I do not believe that anyone who made the effort to visit him in jail, believes he is a monster. JMO MOO

 

[Best of What's Around]

Huge. Let the legal fight commence.

Attorneys, am I correct to assume that the party we want to pay attention to in this fight is the defense? I am assuming (perhaps incorrectly) that they would be in favor of releasing the autopsy IF there is anything that could be construed as exculpatory for CW and NOT in favor of releasing if there is not. Or could there be other reasons for whether they choose one side or the other? TIA!

 

[human]

I think this could be worked out at least temporarily thru the court for her to remain on it.

The imsurance companies do not allow it, do they?

 

[MsBetsy]

I've mentioned it here. It was not a popular idea nor one which was willing to be considered by many.

We have heard of killers wrapping their victims and or covering them up. IIRC, that's somewhat common with mothers who kill their children and with killers who knew their victims. I don't have time to go find a link, so that's just my opinion.

My mentioning it as an idea is not a reflection on my opinion about it. I've been having nightmares about oil covered babies for weeks. However, as I've also mentioned, people have different ideas about what constitutes a proper burial (for example, in the culture of the religion of my family of origin, cremation is unacceptable). I don't find his disposal method remotely acceptable, but I am not a mind reader and can't presume to know what his thought process was. I suppose it's possible, although unlikely, that he viewed the girls as protected from elements and animals.



Again, I can't stress enough that I don't think he made a good choice, I don't support his disposal method, nor do I personally take issue with cremation nor am I indicating that CW has any opinions about cremation. I am not defending his actions.

But he may have viewed the disposal different than others do.

In my opinion, he did not put any thought at all to the proper burial. He was just desperate to get rid of the bodies in the most unlikely place they would be found.

 

[human]

I'm not certain about this. He would have to notify his employer he was divorced, and then she would would be removed from his plan. But, if he never removed her, she could theoretically stay on the plan.

The insurance company would not pay for her, would they?They ask each year if you have had any changes.

 

[Thepoet]

Not about blame or justification. I liked Ann Rule books because they go into the family dynamics. Not as an excuse but as a window to issues.

I would like to know what kind of situation all of this was. Otherwise, I would not be reading here.

I'd like the some thing myself, with CW being examined as closely and as stringently as SW.

 

[MsBetsy]

Attorneys, am I correct to assume that the party we want to pay attention to in this fight is the defense? I am assuming (perhaps incorrectly) that they would be in favor of releasing the autopsy IF there is anything that could be construed as exculpatory for CW and NOT in favor of releasing if there is not. Or could there be other reasons for whether they choose one side or the other? TIA!

I think either way it could have an effect on public opinion. Imo