Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #37

[human]

At the very least we know he didn't hit his alarm panic button nor did he call 911 or go for help next door or even alert anyone that his wife was actively murdering their children.

He had the little teeny tiny problem that he had killed his wife and son. That puts a different problem

 

[gitana1]

With all due respect, this is not evidence. MOO

Yes it is. How a person acts is evidence. What the weight that's given is up to the jury.

In the family annihilator case of Michael Blagg his demeanor took center stage.

It is absolutely evidence. Which is why testimony is allowed and argument may be made about a defendant's demeanor.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.9n...ichael-blaggs-demeanor&contentId=73-527356549

 

[human]

I'm not clear on whether the sheet and pillowcases were seen on the first walk through or not until later.

On the day Shanann and the girls were reported missing there wasn't just one officer who came, but two? We can't really guarantee neither looked in the trash can. CW could have been planning to burn them or discard them when he got home from work.

Cadaver dogs were going through the house on Tuesday, is that the day he did the interviews? They might have smelled the sheets in the trash can if Shanann was killed in/on the bed? It might not have been possible to collect them until CW was arrested if they preferred to wait for a warrant and they didn't think they could get a warrant at that point in time. If they were watching CW anyway, then it might have been better to say, "yes, that's a good idea for you to stay at your friends' house tonight and have their support instead of being in an empty house, we can keep an eye on the house in case they come back and we'll call you immediately" instead of tipping their hand and telling him they'd found the sheet and pillowcases.

Besides, if there was evidence on those sheets, it's probably not the best idea to throw them in the trash with dirty ... trash? Given that LE saw the bedding on the floor during the walkthrough on the first day, and that the bottom sheet was found out at the oil site, I can't help suspecting CW put the matching pillowcases and sheet into the trash with the idea of concealment on his mind.

I suppose what one could say is that the concealment, with regard to the sheet and pillowcases, could be connected solely to the disposal of the bodies and not to the deaths. But did he know, when he left the house in the morning that the bottom sheet would never be found at the oil site and connect their deaths to the house and to him? At the very least I think we have to say that it does show that before the house he wasn't just thinking of getting the bodies out of the house, he was already thinking deeply about how to get away with it.

Did LE come on Weds? Can’t remember

 

[NuttMegg]

He had the little teeny tiny problem that he had killed his wife and son. That puts a different problem

He hadn't murdered her yet when he saw Bella, blue on the monitor. He could have instantly called 911 then ran across to the rooms he had just walked past without noticing anything. They lived in such a developed area the paramedics and cops could have been there while 2-3 of the family were still alive, he could have held her off by her hair or sat on her. Most of those high scale subdivisions also have emergency clinics very near.

 

[PommyMommy]

Hi everyone, this is my first post, but I have been reading a lot on this case. Random thoughts that are all just IMO:
1. Smoking and consumption of caffeine during pregnancy has decreased as more women have become better educated on the harm to the fetus. However, many still do both and have fine babies that are ok ( although nicotine addicted newborns have their own set of issues for a bit).
2. SW brother has been quoted as saying CW WAS a good husband and father~sorry, no link to the article ( hope okay to state something w/o link). So was CW putting on a show when around SW family?
3. I don’t know if the patches have any ingredients that would be harmful to a pregnant woman. I think it depends on the OB if use of the patch was documented in SW medical record. As an RN for nearly 4 decades, I’ve reviewed many a medical record and the documentation varies greatly.
4. Those patches look large. Does anyone know if SW regularly wore the patches while pregnant or just for her SM videos?
5. Because IMO CW is a murdering coward, I think part of his defense will be his use of the patches, how the ingredients are not FDA regulated. IF he’s on any meds, I think he’ll claim that he experienced an interaction that caused him to fly into a rage, strangle SW and not render help to his children.
6. I’ve been watching SW SM vids with CW in them. Both of the little girls were in them, too. They didn’t appear to have any fear of their daddy.
7. I think CW murdered them all, and VERY compelling evidence would have to be presented for me to believe SW harmed her baby girls. I think she came in late, kicked off her shoes, set her luggage down and CW ambushed her.
8. A soulless person disposes of their loved ones in tanks of oil, and a shallow grave. I’ve honestly thought of the evil implications of his actions. I think he never loved them, but acted the part. I’m just so sorry that SW encountered him ever.

Welcome to Websleuths, Mandi3020!
Thank you for joining us and great first post!​

 

[MsBetsy]

I meant to add this which is also from WebMD:

Pregnancy and breast-feeding: There is not enough reliable information about the safety of taking green coffee if you are pregnant or breast feeding. Stay on the safe side and avoid use..

Don’t most expectant mothers stop using caffeine? And most certainly I would hope they don’t smoke!

As far as I know, there is no reason to avoid caffeine altogether. Just not in excess. My OB/ GYN never told me to stay away from caffeine. Jmo

 

[pocketaccent]

Did LE come on Weds? Can’t remember

They came Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday. To CW's horror.

 

[Mellowmelly]

I meant to add this which is also from WebMD:

Pregnancy and breast-feeding: There is not enough reliable information about the safety of taking green coffee if you are pregnant or breast feeding. Stay on the safe side and avoid use..

Don’t most expectant mothers stop using caffeine? And most certainly I would hope they don’t smoke!

I drank coffee throughout my pregnancies and my babies were fine. IMO caffeine is ok during pregnancy as long as it’s in moderation. I even drank a little alcohol before I found out I was expecting although once I found out I didn’t touch any more. Personally I think these substances only have adverse effects when taken too much during pregnancy, and that’s just things that are being ingested. Those patches I highly doubt would have had the slightest effect on her pregnancy. IMO those patches were not worth the money as I don’t think they worked. JMO

 

[gitana1]

I hope nobody took from my post that I'm about anything but constitutional justice!! I'm very clear about my feelings about prison justice and/or vigilante justice (against).

Yes. Don't worry! I didn't get that sense from you.

 

[gitana1]

I drank coffee throughout my pregnancies and my babies were fine. IMO caffeine is ok during pregnancy as long as it’s in moderation. I even drank a little alcohol before I found out I was expecting although once I found out I didn’t touch any more. Personally I think these substances only have adverse effects when taken too much during pregnancy, and that’s just things that are being ingested. Those patches I highly doubt would have had the slightest effect on her pregnancy. IMO those patches were not worth the money as I don’t think they worked. JMO

Ya'll. She had whatever patch she was using approved by her doctor.

 

[MKZoo]

He had the little teeny tiny problem that he had killed his wife and son. That puts a different problem

This is the very crux of my issue with his BS story, IMO. The problem of having killed his wife had a solution. It would have been justifiable. No jury would convict and all that... He had killed in defense of others - his babies. That could be a normal reaction. Except that’s not how he reacted. He didn’t call 911 and try to save the kids or his wife and unborn son. He didn’t explain his understandable rage and grief to the police. He loaded everyone in his car and he threw them away like garbage. Jmo.

 

[human]

It would have been far easier for SW to maintain her lifestyle and income, albeit with relatives, and maintain or increase her sales. There is no proof at all that he was leaving her for another relationship. Speculation is easy, but the only "proof" of that is when HE SAYS he asked for a separation, which he came up with after he killed her.

Except for the woman in NC talking about how they might separate. It has been on here several times I believe

 

[WildWest]

this is interesting. Just wondering if you think that CW ate edibles? or are you using that statement as a comparison like, 'if marijuana edibles can make a husband murder his wife, maybe these patches can too?' I have never thought about the possibility of CW having any type of substance abuse issue- but people have all kinds of hidden character flaws, I guess one could argue that if he has multiple AP's (thus showing a propensity to lie/engage in risk taking behavior) maybe he DID use legal/illegal substances and we just haven't heard yet? Not that it excuses or defends the horrible events of that evening...

I cannot make heads or tails of any of this. Personally I have zero doubt about the patches or nutritional stuff SW did. I do however have many questions about CW.

 

[human]

The ingredients have some research that indicates health benefits. We don’t know the exact amount of each ingredient in each patch, if they truly work at all, or if they work in patch form.

The company doesn’t cite clinical trials, instead it relies on people describing their experiences. It’s shady, but legal.

I am stunned that something so insignificant, could carry any weight at all here. We are talking about multiple murder.

We have been down the Casey Anthony road so anything is possible

 

[MerryB]

I think if the Prosecution introduces these tapes as evidence and plays them for the court they will be evidence, don’t you?

I suppose so, but honestly IMO it would be as subjective as playing the SM videos I find so alarming & some others don’t.

 

[MsBetsy]

Both nicotine and caffeine cross the placenta so there is absolutely no way any OB can know whether it is harmful just by checking the heart rate of the mother. I do not believe any OB handling a high-risk pregnancy is going to approve of patches containing caffeine and vitamins in unknown quantities. JMO

Yet apparently many do not believe the thrive products are unhealthy, and do not advise against it. Do we know that it was a high-risk pregnancy? Just being under 17 or over 35 is high risk, but it doesnt necessarily mean there are any restrictions or any special treatment. Jmo

 

[gitana1]

He turned it over to LE. They wouldn’t need a warrant at that point.

That's right. They weren't building a criminal case at that moment and no one was a suspect. They were trying to find a missing family.

He gave permission. He is married to her so it's his marital property and he had a right to give consent. No search warrant needed.

I imagine he had her password and gave it to them.

 

[MassGuy]

I suppose so, but honestly IMO it would be as subjective as playing the SM videos I find so alarming & some others don’t.

They’re not as subjective because of the context. He was lying over and over again. He was calmly recounting a fabricated story as his children rotted in oil tanks, and his wife in a shallow grave.

This carries far more weight than some Facebook videos of innocent victims.

 

[human]

Why would it be tax free for capital gains?

I think you can sell a house every two years without declaring capital gains.

 

[Slayer Girl]

Lol I understand your position but this has nothing to do with him being guilty - or not.

I would not expect charges to be dropped unless/until there was some kind of MAJOR exculpatory revelation like a video of SW killing the girls, or google search on her phone (while in Arizona) regarding strangulation etc. (and even then I’m not sure that would affect the charges).

An autopsy report is just one of many pieces of this ridiculously complicated puzzle. Assuming the manner of death is actually determined to be strangulation, that fits within the story of EITHER side.

Other details (size of hands or fingernail marks etc) would not result in the charges being dropped (there is no “reduced” - they either allege he killed them or not - and I don’t see this relating to premeditation)... they would be utilized by the defense in order to try to introduce reasonable doubt.

Hi Amandaaa, I have been reading all your posts on this case and I just wanted to say that they really have helped me to better understand the legal process and what as a layperson, I should be aware of in this case. Having you as a VI Attorney on this thread is very helpful.