Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #41

[kirkassoc]

I would personally be going insane with just a bible to read to pass the time. I am really surprised that books are not allowed, given he is not yet in prison (not convicted). I know he is under suicide watch, but surely they could come up with some approved reading lists. Parts of the Bible are pretty dark, actually, from what I have been told.

Doesn't bother me at all. At least he can read, see and feel (and pray). He "admitted" he saw fit to take those rights away from Shanann and the baby she was carrying. He also admitted to stuffing his two little girls in oil tanks. There needs to be consequences for his actions...not rewards and passtimes, IMO. He showed absolutely NO remorse whatsoever, so I don't think him having their "family photo" is for anything but SHOW at this point or a ploy for sympathy from his attorneys. MOO

 

[idfinch]

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/D 039 Notice(1).pdf

"Ultimately then, because counsel can see no reasonable way in which the contents of the reports will not be explored in court by the parties, Mr. Watts leaves the decision about releasing the reports to the discretion of the court. However, if the court finds the government’s first proffered reason of not tainting witnesses to be compelling, Mr. Watts requests a hearing on that suspect claim."

"That said, Mr. Watts’ rights to a fundamentally fair proceeding and, ultimately, a fair and impartial jury at trial, have been so substantially damaged in this case, it does not seem that any prophylactic order, at least on the narrow issue of whether the autopsies should be released, can serve to salvage the wreckage of those rights which may remain."

Wow. Very strong wording here! Salvage the wreckage of those rights?!

 

[human]

In the affidavit it said the drone detected fresh dirt close to the towers.

What does detected mean, That is an unusual term.

The operator saw the grave?

 

[Medstudies]

Why dispose of them there? (Rock meet hard place.) He had to show up at work right? (Otherwise a huge red flag.) He had a very legitimate reason to be there. Absolutely no alarm for him driving to this remote area. Away from prying eyes.

MOO -I think this plan was set in motion within the period of NC trip and AZ trip. Further, The shallow grave for SW was just a half ***ed Plan Z due to her late flight. And I believe he may have gone back to remedy her burial site if not for the wrench thrown by NUA. (And I’m just a mere mortal who knows theory doesn’t mean fact.)

Last, just an observation:
Both calm and rage can, and often do, coexist in the same space. Look at the constellation Sagittarius, right smack in the middle of the Milky Way, is a raging black hole. And it holds the galaxy together.

 

[katydid23]

Welcome back everyone! I think it was really interesting to learn in the last thread (for me) that some see putting the girls in separate crude oil tanks as not that objectionable (unless they were forced/adjusted). I can see it even though I do not agree with it. My next question for those who are open to CW's confession is how can he explain the lack of a 911 call to save the children? How do you think the defense will handle the lack of a 911 call? Can you understand a rage taking over a man that results in a 5 minute strangle instead of trying to help the children when SW could have been disabled in seconds? In fact, by strangling, we hear that she could have been unconscious after just 10-15 seconds. Last, do you find it odd that he chose strangulation, the same method he said SW used? Are you thinking that he wanted to give her a taste of what she had done?

Good questions. Which brings up another question I have had.

IF CW is telling the truth, can he explain why SW would choose strangulation as a way to end her children's lives? I can understand the motive, that a spurned wife might try to hurt her husband by disposing of his children, as the ultimate revenge.

But she wasn't angry at the children. So why would she choose such a violent way to kill them? It's very hard for me to accept that, or see her doing that. JMO

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Oh, and New documents on the court site this morning - including interesting response by the defense. Happy reading!

Colorado Judicial Branch

"More to the point though, the contents of the autopsy reports will necessarily be revealed at the preliminary and proof-evident hearing, which will take place well in advance of any jury trial in this case. 8. Ultimately then, because counsel can see no reasonable way in which the contents of the reports will not be explored in court by the parties, Mr. Watts leaves the decision about releasing the reports to the discretion of the court. However, if the court finds the government’s first proffered reason of not tainting witnesses to be compelling, Mr. Watts requests a hearing on that suspect claim. "

 

[WildWest]

RSBM

I'd be interested to know his usual working hours too.

I wonder if @cailleach 's friend knows?

 

[Mellowmelly]

https://www.courts.state.co.us/userfiles/file/Court_Probation/19th_Judicial_District/caseofinterest/2018CR2003/D 039 Notice(1).pdf

"Ultimately then, because counsel can see no reasonable way in which the contents of the reports will not be explored in court by the parties, Mr. Watts leaves the decision about releasing the reports to the discretion of the court. However, if the court finds the government’s first proffered reason of not tainting witnesses to be compelling, Mr. Watts requests a hearing on that suspect claim."

Thanks for sharing, for someone like me who doesn’t understand legalities, does this mean the Defense are not against releasing the autopsy reports ? Does this mean they are more likely to be released now ? Ty in advance.

 

[human]

Doesn't bother me at all. At least he can read, see and feel (and pray). He "admitted" he saw fit to take those rights away from Shanann and the baby she was carrying. He also admitted to stuffing his two little girls in oil tanks. There needs to be consequences for his actions...not rewards and passtimes, IMO. He showed absolutely NO remorse whatsoever, so I don't think him having their "family photo" is for anything but SHOW at this point or a ploy for sympathy from his attorneys. MOO

He has not been convicted. He is only in jail. Yes, he is guilty of killing his wife but that has not been adjudicated, Why he cannot have other reading material is strange. Maybe he does not want any.

 

[dixiegirl1035]

Why dispose of them there? (Rock meet hard place.) He had to show up at work right? (Otherwise a huge red flag.) He had a very legitimate reason to be there. Absolutely no alarm for him driving to this remote area. Away from prying eyes.

MOO -I think this plan was set in motion within the period of NC trip and AZ trip. Further, The shallow grave for SW was just a half ***ed Plan Z due to her late flight. And I believe he may have gone back to remedy her burial site if not for the wrench thrown by NUA. (And I’m just a mere mortal who knows theory doesn’t mean fact.)

Last, just an observation:
Both calm and rage can, and often do, coexist in the same space. Look at the constellation Sagittarius, right smack in the middle of the Milky Way, is a raging black hole. And it holds the galaxy together.

I did not realize until I watch the TV show last night that the oil tanks had a berm around them. And you had to go over a ladder to get into the berm. I agree, the dirt that was put on her perhaps was from the berm or she was buried near the berm or in the berm. On the opposite side of the Porta-Potty where if somebody drove in, they would not be able to see it. My opinion only.

ETA, I scrolled more and saw the video of the fly over, so now I'm not sure. They were focused on another area where it appears the dirt was from.

 

[JudgeJudi]

The alleged secret gay lover said that he believes he was the first man Chris ever slept with—and that their affair was Chris’ first during his marriage to Shanann. The men would see each other before or after work, or sometimes after 10 p.m., he claimed. He added that they’d usually meet at the man’s place and never at Chris’ home. The man believes Shanann was unaware of their rendezvous, which he claimed ended in spring of this year.

The man said he’d been out of touch with Chris for months. The next time he saw his face was on national television, after CW’s arrest.

I don’t recall reading about the times they usually met before, but it seems CW’s usual start time is around 6-6:30. This suggests he doesn’t live very far away or else it becomes a bit problematic. He also says they would see each other after work or after 10:00 which is rather late. Maybe CW went for a "late night run" on those occasions, in which case more lies.

‘Everyone Liked Him’: Did Colorado Dad Chris Watts Lead a Double Life?

 

[NuttMegg]

There are aerial views of the site in the media thread. He didn't use the berm, you can see the area of "disturbed" ground just outside the site in the vegetation.

Thanks for posting that. It looked like a previously disturbed area, that flat area with no bushes on it, just short deadish looking grass. and apparently he went right to where the bushes meet the flat area, which is somewhat like a berm but not what I had been theorizing earlier, as it looks like it was pushed around earlier by whatever earthmover. It should have been a little softer, I'd think, than going out into the mesquite or whatever that dominant bush is where the ground would be harder. Thanks again, Marli, I hadn't seen that.

 

[JudgeJudi]

I wonder if @cailleach 's friend knows?

Marli has replied further up the page - 6:00-6:30.

 

[kkdj]

Cheating is cheating. I don't care if its with a man or a woman. It's betrayal.
Killing your own children is betrayal but imo on a much higher scale.
CW is a betrayer and he has no limits for how far he might take it. He has done the ultimate betrayal imo.

 

[MsBetsy]

Regarding the autopsy report debate:

This is what I *anticipate* happening (but of course I could be wrong)

FOIC has filed a motion disputing the prosecutor’s initial motion to seal the reports.

The motion states that the prosecutor was not the proper party to file, that the criminal action was not the proper forum for the request, and claims the court does not have jurisdiction. Before any determination is made regarding the appropriateness of the request to seal, the issues raised in the FOIC motion have to be addressed.

Because the FOIC motion was made within the criminal proceeding, I would anticipate the parties being given the opportunity to respond to the FOIC motion (regarding the issue of whether the prosecutor’s initial motion was properly made in the criminal proceeding, and whether the court has jurisdiction - *not* on the issue of whether the sealing itself is appropriate).

The court would then have to arrive at a decision as to where the motion is properly filed, and by whom. IMO, the parties could instead all agree (not sure they would, though) to stipulate that the criminal proceeding is not the proper place - rather than litigate that issue - in which case the custodian would refile the petition/motion to seal the records according to the usual statutory CORA process (separately from the criminal proceeding, and upon notice to anyone who has requested those records and who may wish to be heard on the matter).

After the petition is filed, the court would then schedule a hearing regarding the propriety of the custodian’s request to seal. I do not know for sure, but would *assume* that the CORA hearing would be public (or at least not closed), since transparency is the main issue involved in the first place - and the interested parties will have the opportunity to weigh in. Of course, the court will likely have to review certain things (autopsy report included) in camera in order to arrive at a decision on the matter.

Just my best guess at how it would play out... will be very interested to see how it goes.

I thought I read somewhere that the coroner was the only one who could request that the autopsy remained sealed. Or did I imagine that? In terms of it being harmful to the public.

 

[Medstudies]

I did not realize until I watch the TV show last night that the oil tanks had a berm around them. And you had to go over a ladder to get into the berm. I agree, the dirt that was put on her perhaps was from the berm or she was buried near the berm or in the berm. On the opposite side of the Porta-Potty where if somebody drove in, they would not be able to see it. My opinion only.

Well I just learned something new today. (Thanks dixiegirl1035!) In that case, perhaps he felt SW was well hidden? Seems legit.

...Except for the drone and the missing bedsheet waving like an SOS.

 

[Tippy Lynn]

What does detected mean, That is an unusual term.

The operator saw the grave?

My thoughts were that the operator was watching the live video captured from the drone and noticed the ground was disturbed.
jmo

 

[Amandaaa]

I thought I read somewhere that the coroner was the only one who could request that the autopsy remained sealed. Or did I imagine that? In terms of it being harmful to the public.

That’s the argument -
The statute says the custodian of records has to make the request... the coroner is the official custodian of autopsy records.

Despite any liberal interpretation of the word “custodian”, the coroner would be the one receiving the FOI requests for the autopsy report and therefore the one with the statutory duty to disclose them - unless and until the court orders the documents sealed.

 

[Backstroke10]

Cheating is cheating. I don't care if its with a man or a woman. It's betrayal.
Killing your own children is betrayal but imo on a much higher scale.
CW is a betrayer and he has no limits for how far he might take it. He has done the ultimate betrayal imo.

IMO Cheating, whether it be with someone of the same sex or not is irrelevant and not even on the same scale as murdering your children, wife and unborn baby.

 

[JudgeJudi]

"That said, Mr. Watts’ rights to a fundamentally fair proceeding and, ultimately, a fair and impartial jury at trial, have been so substantially damaged in this case, it does not seem that any prophylactic order, at least on the narrow issue of whether the autopsies should be released, can serve to salvage the wreckage of those rights which may remain."

Wow. Very strong wording here! Salvage the wreckage of those rights?!

He may be able to salvage those rights, but sadly no-one can't salvage the four lives he's destroyed forever.