CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #8

[Lore Listener]

Very interesting as this is your professional area- thank you.

Can I ask you if you're expecting to see any prior DV from CW or coercive control ?
What would your hunch be Lore?

Coercive control, emotional abuse, manipulation, jealously, absolutely yes. Physical violence, probably not. Family annihilators usually maintain control of the family through coercive means until they feel like they're losing control forever and that's when the violence happens. If there was any physical violence, I would expect that both CW and SW to have taken great pains to conceal it.

However, I do think there's a chance of a previous relationship partner coming forward to say she was abused by CW. Either that, or one who says he is the greatest guy ever and never laid a hand on her and would never harm a fly. But she will be lying. That because either she and CW never got out of the honeymoon stage to the point where he felt he "owned" her, or he stayed in contact with her and used triangulation with her and Shanann.

Just my hunches.

 

[TTF14]

The sloppiness of it all lacks premeditation/planned.

Only because his timeline got all messed up by her flight delay and then Nicole messed it up further by arriving on the doorstep.

 

[MerryB]

This might interest you re the Denver7 interview too
Dr. Jack Brown on Twitter

Dr Jack Brown does a review”nonverbal and paralanguage analysis” of the CW video. Best analysis I have seen.

Oooo I love that analysis! Thanks for posting, Cotton!

 

[Herat]

I find it strange that he put girls into two separate tanks tbh.

Early on, when LE first announced the bodies were in the tanks, I recall LE using the term "mostly-full" to describe them. Perhaps he didnt want them to overflow

 

[DAdvocate]

bbm

Totally agree and damn, that grin. Why didn't he just shout "I killed my entire family"?

Nervous reactions come out in various ways in interviews. When I prepped people for media interviews in a previous job, I would ask them about various scenarios. The nervous ones would smile while talking about a serious topic. They wouldn't know they were smiling until I showed them the video in replay.

 

[Davia18]

Am I the only one who thinks there was no discussion about separation that night? I just don’t believe him. I suspect that when LE interrogated him and confronted him with “we know you have a girlfriend” that he decided to make up the story about wanting a separation. I doubt he wanted a separation at all.

While there’s a 0.01% chance that his story is true, I don’t believe him at all.

SW seemed like motherhood was everything to her, besides Thrive. Her SM is so full of her kids, it’s almost extreme. I wonder if CW was feeling relegated to de minimis status in the household and resented being the least important one.

She had told a friend they were separating and that she thought he was having an affair. I however don't believe he asked for a separation, I believe she may have. I feel he was content with having a mistress and wife. Then I lean the other way that he didn't want any responsibility at all and just a new women, no kids, no debt. The debt wouldn't have went away unless got away with this, but then again they would have to be found deceased to collect insurance. YEP I'm still all over the place and just don't know.

 

[Natusry]

The sloppiness of it all lacks premeditation/planned.

Do you understand premeditation, in the legal sense, or do you mean he didn’t spend weeks carefully thinking through the details?

 

[Deleted member 229213]

bbm

Totally agree and damn, that grin. Why didn't he just shout "I killed my entire family"?

Right around that 1 minute mark of that denver 7 interview...I knew. It gives me chills. That grin. It is the same grin of the man that killed my Aunt and Uncle, their murderer was their son in law, and he was in our family for 8 years...same sick grin. Absolutely disgusting. Lied just like CW does, literally the same grin.

 

[Herat]

Question for those in the know about Oil & Gas operations:

In a small well like the one he used, in what sequence do the tanks fill?

Does one fill entitrely first then the second in sequence? Does that leave one to fill w the second one empty?

For a small remote well like that, how much us pumped, say per day?

How long would it typically take to fill enough to empty the tank?

What's the procedure to empty the tanks to harvest the crude oil?

How do they know it's full enough to harvest?

 

[DAdvocate]

Do you understand premeditation, in the legal sense, or do you mean he didn’t spend weeks carefully thinking through the details?

I'm saying that no one was suppose to die that night.

 

[Herat]

The sloppiness of it all lacks premeditation/planned.

The legal term premeditation doesnt mean what you think it does

 

[BayouBelle_LA]

The sloppiness of it all lacks premeditation/planned.

Premeditation can be formed in a moment. It doesn't require extensive thought or planning.

 

[Mamamiamaria]

I was responding to the poster who asked if we, the public, knew for sure that CW was having an affair. The answer is yes; we know because it is in the affadavit. As far as Shanann knowing, who knows.

My apologies, I quoted the wrong post.....I am still finding my way here

 

[PommyMommy]

Don't we often try to get people close to the crime to join us? Like family? Let's say SW's brother or mother signed up for an account here. With them already raw, how might they feel about their deceased loved one, a victim, being referred to as one of the worst mothers ever? There are lots of other sites out there that that are a little looser on what can be posted. They have many people complaining about SW and critisizing her videos, posts, etc. Some are sticking up for SW. Personally, I come to WS because it IS victim friendly.

Yes, in Lucas' case we had a family member as well as a missing person's advocate, and their contributions were invaluable. I understand Tricia's reasoning that members be allowed discuss CW's accusation that SW killed her children, however preposterous that seems to us, but the victim bashing is another matter. Report and scroll/roll.

 

[cottonweaver]

Right around that 1 minute mark of that denver 7 interview...I knew. It gives me chills. That grin. It is the same grin of the man that killed my Aunt and Uncle, their murderer was their son in law, and he was in our family for 8 years...same sick grin. Absolutely disgusting. Lied just like CW does, literally the same grin.

Really sorry to hear this Juniper. Horrific.

Interestingly Dr Jack ( previous link) says there's a special term for that, it is called Dupers Delight

 

[MrsWatson]

bbm

Totally agree and damn, that grin. Why didn't he just shout "I killed my entire family and I'm glad I did"?

Ha! I said that way back when I first saw that video. He may as well have been holding a sign.

 

[Deleted member 229213]

The legal term premeditation doesnt mean what you think it does

In case anyone out there doesn't have a martindale hubble or westlaw book of legal terms available like I do, here is a cliff note version of 1rst degree murder, including premeditation...and premeditation can also happen with in moments of the crime, it does not necessarily mean it was planned out for weeks, albeit in this case it might have been IMO... If this becomes a death penalty case then premeditation will be very important in proving the aggravating factors in this case.

First Degree Murder Overview - FindLaw

 

[dgfred]

Only because his timeline got all messed up by her flight delay and then Nicole messed it up further by arriving on the doorstep.

Yes, but from about 2am to 5am would have been his window... maybe he just over-thunk it at that time believing he would come home and make things like he wanted after disposing of the bodies.

 

[Lore Listener]

Sure it makes sense! My psychpath of an ex, asked for a divorce, then when he found out I was dating, months later, held a gun to my head. He was living with his new girlfriend, but still had to be in control of me.

Just wanted to say I am so sorry you had to go through this, BabyButterfly. You are a survivor.

 

[Jax49]

IMNSHO, Chris Watts is trying to use the most obviously made up alibi ever known to humankind.