Found Deceased CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW GUILTY* #56

[Tortoise]

Yes, I remember it being discussed here and on the podcast. I may have misunderstood the OP - I thought it was being suggested that the first plea deal presented by the defense was an Alford Plea. If so, I don't think that's correct, but that's JMO.

Ah, it may take us a while but we always get there in the end lol

Oh and eta, I was the OP and I was saying that the DA seemed to backtrack during the presser when he said they were only approached one time by the defense with his guilty plea.

 

[Pi Thoughts]

I mostly agree. I think he's human but very defective.

I don't think he feels fear like a normal person does. I don't think he was shaking none bit. Not at all.

I think he couldn't stand to sit there and listen to these things being said about him. I think he couldn't stand to be unmasked in front of everyone.

I do believe that these annihilators feel some sense of shame or panic. But not for normal reasons.

He's not driven by fear of prison or being harmed, really. He's not capable of remorse. But I think he is capable of a sort of shame. And narcissistic panic that his true self will be revealed.

And it was. And he couldn't take that. IMO.

It was all narcissism on display. Not worry about how he will fare in prison.

I still remember the description of scott Peterson on his way to death row. He was acting differently than normal. He was asked how he felt. He said he felt "jazzed." "Jazzed"? Wth!!!

No. This dude has spent a lifetime, I believe, having his identity subsumed and having to maintain a carefully crafted mask of a good guy. A sweet and almost neutered son who was such a good mama's boy he didn't even date. He then became a wonderful husband and provider and a devoted and loving daddy.

But this not being who he really was, there's always the pull between maintaining the facade and giving in to his deeper instincts and desires.

Like all annihilators who don't kill themselves, he wanted to figure out how to do both - how to indulge the desires of his secret, internal self while maintaining the carefully constructed facade.

There was no way under the circumstances without making his family disappear.

Anyone who can carefully smother to death and strangle his loved ones and then callously and calmly dispose of their bodies, has no fear and no empathy.

He is indeed a monster. Human but inhumane. Defective.

Absolutely and to think that if his dirty, murderous deeds had not been discovered he would have possibly been working at the disposal site on a regular basis. That in itself is so sick/twisted/depraved/defective. What sort of mentality reconciles with that?

 

[NuttMegg]

I interpreted that bit of word salad was communicating that the Watts are looking for him to tell them exactly what happened, because before the plea was entered counsel did not what him talking about case specifics to his parents. imo

Word salad is apropos, they worked it in, as I quoted before, that he should explain the "responsibility", (like maybe it was shared?) That's what I took from it. And I think they specifically had the advocate say that part. To avoid, er, "responsibility" for their own words.

 

[Jupiter05]

In my opinion, the sealed HIPPA document was the result of his psych evaluation and he did not want that to get out. It took the remote possibility of the insanity plea off the table. This is a man who obviously has never, ever had to take responsibility for anything except doing laundry, playing with his children and working part time. He went from his mommy to Shan'ann. I wonder why all of the secrecy about his jail visitor logs? What is that about?

 

[cailleach]

Why did he want the visitor logs kept secret? I looked back but couldn’t find an answer....

If the case had continued to trial they didn't want anyone to know what experts were visiting him. Personally, I've always felt he imagined in his twisted mind that NK would decide to visit if it was private.

 

[NuttMegg]

Yes, I remember it being discussed here and on the podcast. I may have misunderstood the OP - I thought it was being suggested that the first plea deal presented by the defense was an Alford Plea. If so, I don't think that's correct, but that's JMO.

Anyway IIRC it was presented as a possibility, not as a fact.

 

[Mitch11]

He is too stupid to get a credit card in his own name so his wife won't see his charges for luxurious dinners for 2?

It's interesting that you mention that. Most people who have affairs are sneaky. To actually just go spending money off a joint account, knowing your wife will be informed seems completely opportunist, self centered and completely lacking in foresight.

This behaviour definitely could be considered narcassistic

 

[Tortoise]

Word salad is apropos, they worked it in, as I quoted before, that he should explain the "responsibility", (like maybe it was shared?) That's what I took from it. And I think they specifically had the advocate say that part. To avoid, er, "responsibility" for their own words.

I think "opportunity" was a euphemism for something else, can't think of a word without seeing the original sentence in front of me, but wtte he isn't prepared to speak the truth yet.

 

[gitana1]

Oh yes, what was it, something about Allen..sorry gitana was teaching us and I'm not a very good pupil at times. Brain cells are dying.

Yes. An Alford Plea. It is nolo contenderé. And I'm betting he offered that.

 

[cailleach]

Yes. An Alford Plea. It is nolo contenderé. And I'm betting he offered that.

I agree. And that was a instant "NO" from the DA who had more than enough to win at trial in just a matter of weeks with plenty of time to gather more.

 

[Mitch11]

There is a lot that DA Rourke didn’t share in the press conference, or have to share. Yet he made a point to let everyone know that NK wiped her phone of photos and texts from Chris before she came into the police station. I bet she did that Monday afternoon or Tuesday. It would only have been a mattter of time before LE contacted her. Rourke didn’t have to say that. He could have simply stayed with she was interviewed, and there were texts and photos. And left it at that. No matter what anyone says, it was a small jab. And what was LE able to get off Chris’s phone? And Shanann’s phone? Who knows.

I'd love the answer to that too. I think there's more to it. I listed to Levi's podcast and wow, his guest speaker (sorry forgotten her name) alluded to NK knowing more about CWs family status. Eg SW being pregnant and still being married.

I'd say she feels embarrassed about that now.. Which is understandable. Sadly a crazy learning lesson for her about getting involved with a married man.

 

[NuttMegg]

I agree. And that was a instant "NO" from the DA who had more than enough to win at trial in just a matter of weeks with plenty of time to gather more.

Ain't no way the Ruzceks would go for that. Or any other level headed individual.

 

[BabyButterfly]

Great list. Thought of another. Did Andarko fire him before or after he was arrested, and if before, why was he terminated?

I'm extremely interested in this question, also. In the very beginning, it was said by one of his friends that he was fired the week before on Thursday.

 

[cailleach]

Ain't no way the Ruzceks would go for that. Or any other level headed individual.

Nope, because Shan'ann was super excited for justice. (I still love how her dad got that in.)

 

[Mitch11]

I remember at some point that I posted, as well as many others, that when all was said and done, we would still be saying, "WHY? I just don't understand." And that is what we are all saying. You just can't apply logic to illogical people or illogical situations. There was nothing about the Watts situation that was unlike anything that 1000s of people per day are going through every day, and many go through much worse things. Even if CW had a disconnect with his mother...that is no excuse. There are kids that are abandoned by their parents, beaten by their parents, have cigarettes put out on their arms by their parents, yet they don't do what Chris did. There are, on this very day, children that are living in cars because they do not have a shelter over there heads. There are invisible kids out there that nobody notices, but they don't do this. As an adult Chris found a beautiful, loving wife and children who he tired of, and went on to try to replicate what he was looking for in someone else. I heard a commentator call Chris Watts an empty vessel, and I thought that was a good description. He sat around expecting others to pour into him, to make him whole. Truth is, you can never fix another person. Many of us have learned that the hard way. You can be supportive and positive with other people, but you cannot "fix" them. It is up to each of us to "fix" ourselves. That is hard, but most of us muddle our way through it the best that we can and at least succeed to the point that we don't destroy others. There are no signs that Chris tried to do that. Like a temperamental child that tires of a toy and destroys it when it ceases to satisfy and then screams for a new one, so Chris destroyed his family and looked for a new replacement. It doesn't make sense. It won't make sense to us. Chris just wasn't quit human and ALL of this is on him.

I love this post!

 

[Tortoise]

I mostly agree. I think he's human but very defective.

I don't think he feels fear like a normal person does. I don't think he was shaking one bit. Not at all.

I think he couldn't stand to sit there and listen to these things being said about him. I think he couldn't stand to be unmasked in front of everyone.

I do believe that these annihilators feel some sense of shame or panic. But not for normal reasons.

He's not driven by fear of prison or being harmed, really. He's not capable of remorse. But I think he is capable of a sort of shame. And narcissistic panic that his true self will be revealed.

And it was. And he couldn't take that. IMO.

It was all narcissism on display. Not worry about how he will fare in prison.

I still remember the description of scott Peterson on his way to death row. He was acting differently than normal. He was asked how he felt. He said he felt "jazzed." "Jazzed"? Wth!!!

No. This dude has spent a lifetime, I believe, having his identity subsumed and having to maintain a carefully crafted mask of a good guy. A sweet and almost neutered son who was such a good mama's boy he didn't even date. He then became a wonderful husband and provider and a devoted and loving daddy.

But this not being who he really was, there's always the pull between maintaining the facade and giving in to his deeper instincts and desires.

Like all annihilators who don't kill themselves, he wanted to figure out how to do both - how to indulge the desires of his secret, internal self while maintaining the carefully constructed facade.

There was no way under the circumstances without making his family disappear.

Anyone who can carefully smother to death and strangle his loved ones and then callously and calmly dispose of their bodies, has no fear and no empathy.

He is indeed a monster. Human but inhumane. Defective.

That's where I'm at in my understanding of him too. I thought he looked totally exposed and didn't know where to put himself with his mask ripped off.

 

[Gardenista]

Word salad is apropos, they worked it in, as I quoted before, that he should explain the "responsibility", (like maybe it was shared?) That's what I took from it. And I think they specifically had the advocate say that part. To avoid, er, "responsibility" for their own words.

IMO, it was dumb for their attorney to have memorized/paraphrased their "apology" statement. It was a mess.

 

[Tortoise]

Yes. An Alford Plea. It is nolo contenderé. And I'm betting he offered that.

Except the DA says no, he only made one approach and that was the plea that was accepted.

 

[Tortoise]

I'd love the answer to that too. I think there's more to it. I listed to Levi's podcast and wow, his guest speaker (sorry forgotten her name) alluded to NK knowing more about CWs family status. Eg SW being pregnant and still being married.

I'd say she feels embarrassed about that now.. Which is understandable. Sadly a crazy learning lesson for her about getting involved with a married man.

What connection did the guest speaker have to the case if you don't mind me asking since I haven't listened?

 

[Tortoise]

I'm extremely interested in this question, also. In the very beginning, it was said by one of his friends that he was fired the week before on Thursday.

But yet he texted his coworker on the Sunday. I think that must be incorrect.