GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #57

[escape2sc]

Except his affair started AFTER she went to NC.

IIRC, according to texts from SW to her friends, SW did not mention CW was not sleeping in the same bed as her until he visited NC and when they returned from NC ?

 

[nwmouse]

I don’t think CW changed. I think he just started revealing more of who he really is. I believe he is a sociopath and his mask just unraveled finally. He was never a good guy. He was pretending until he could pretend no more. His behaviors may have changed, but he was just going through the motions most of his life, IMO. Who he has shown himself to be is who he always was.

I agree.

And although Mother Watts loudly proclaimed that Baby Bates is not a psychopath because he didn't "torture animals" just means she possibly didn't see him doing it or find out about it.

I believe CW is a secretive, sneaky individual living in a fantasy world, who started carefully keeping his unsavory urges and behaviors under wraps, probably from an early age.

Its easy for parents like Mother Watts to deliberately turn a blind eye to their offspring's disturbing behavior.

moo

 

[Johnny1181]

I don’t think CW changed. I think he just started revealing more of who he really is. I believe he is a sociopath and his mask just unraveled finally. He was never a good guy. He was pretending until he could pretend no more. His behaviors may have changed, but he was just going through the motions most of his life, IMO. Who he has shown himself to be is who he always was.

I think you are so right.

 

[NuttMegg]

Regarding NK losing her job with Anadarko. (She may have another one, IDK). DP 697

 

[liltexans]

I do not want to jump the gun here and I will contact the mods first. I have a lot going on right now with my health and animals health but I think she might not be far from me. It was hard to read her last name, I could not tell if the o's were a's or o's.
Either way someone did come up and it list her as a massage therapist. Not sure if it is her.
If someone could look at that doc for me and tell me what you think the last name spelling is I will think I have the right person.
Her reading for SW and the girls left my hands shaking.
Again I will not do or post anything without contacting the mods if I go forward with this.

I’m not sure what you’re asking. Are you asking to post the name of the supposed psychic? Or sleuth her?

If the name is in the documents, it’s public record, but we aren’t going to sleuth this person. And psychic discussions are not allowed, per TOS. Only what is in the discovery documents regarding that particular psychic report may be discussed here.

 

[x_files]

In NK’s Denver Post interview. So fascinating to re-read it now.

Christopher Watts girlfriend Nichol Kessinger speaks about Frederick murders

filled with lies...

 

[ACE422]

Interrogation

Per CW, "Shanann recently took out $10,000 from his 401k to catch up on their mortgage payments. (Chris believed the loan against his 401k was taken out approximately five months ago.)
* They were three months behind on their mortgage payments.
*They had received a letter from Chase Bank pertaining to their delinquent home loan.
*He and Shanann were stressed out about their financial situation.
*He currently owes his mortgage payment for August, which is due tomorrow (August 16, 2018)
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
OK, I have some problems with his statements.

-Shanann cannot take out any loan from CW's 401k, period, without his consent and signature. The rules on 401k are very strict. Although it's considered marital property, it is not joint account. If the loan was really taken out, I'm willing to bet that he took it out to spend for his pleasure, and he probably did it more recently, not five months ago.

-He says that his morgage payment for August is due August 16th. Sounds like they are current.

-Is he saying Shanann took out the loan to pay for 3 months of morgage payment they were behind of? If this is the case, then they did not pay Dec, Jan, Feb payments since the loan was taken out 5 months ago to pay for those 3 months. Ugh, I think he is lying.

-"He currently owes his mortgage payment for August."--He should have said they currently owe..., since at this point, his family is just missing, not dead.

There is some deviation in some of the documents as far as wording in a few different places. I believe I remember reading in one document that CW was the one that took money from the 401K to help pay for medical expenses for SW and the girls that had accumulated.

 

[tmar]

I'm just reading through the discovery and early on, a stake out cop noted CW putting flowered print things in a bag in a car and moving some things already in the car to the bag....then later I read that the authorities gave CW's father his "gym bag" out of the Lexus (which the authorities noted as Chris Watts'). Did daddy remove some things for CW and it wasn't noticed? I mean, it doesn't really matter now, I just found it interesting.

Wonder what/if anything was placed into the gym bag and now removed?
Was this some type of evidence?
MOO.

 

[Gardenista]

Where did we hear (prior to these documents being made public) that CW told NK he had been in NC to finalize his divorce? It's not supported by the discovery docs I've read so far.

I specifically looked for this and found it by searching the word finalize

 

[Tortoise]

In NK’s Denver Post interview. So fascinating to re-read it now.

Christopher Watts girlfriend Nichol Kessinger speaks about Frederick murders

WOW. That's a big fat lie then. I thought I must have somehow latched on to an unfounded rumor which I'm usually careful not to do. So straight from the horse's mouth then.

 

[liltexans]

I agree.

And although Mother Watts loudly proclaimed that Baby Bates is not a psychopath because he didn't "torture animals" just means she possibly didn't see him doing it or find out about it.

I believe CW is a secretive, sneaky individual living in a fantasy world, who started carefully keeping his unsavory urges and behaviors under wraps, probably from an early age.

Its easy for parents like Mother Watts to deliberately turn a blind eye to their offspring's disturbing behavior.

moo

I think torturing and killing animals is often in the background of serial killers, but I’m not sure about family annihilators. FAs seem to have other commonalities, such as coming from disordered, enmeshed families of origin.

 

[ZsaZsa]

oh my goodness, the deceased child's hand "degloved" as they were removing her from the tank. This is quite an information dump, that's for sure.

Yes, three things ( at least) will stay with me about this case. Celeste's skin on her hand came off and all her little finger nails came with it. Bella's mouth and tongue were torn and bitten. Staff from M.E. office had to hand a box containing little Nico's remains to the Rzuceks.

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

I still think that his hand was probably forced, that night, because if he told her he had a new girlfriend , SW probably said 'ENOUGH, Get Out!' Either you leave or I will take the girls and leave in the morning.

HE COULDN'T LET THAT HAPPEN.

He would not be able to carry out his plan, of calling them in as 'missing', if she left with the kids or kicked him out. She would go ahead and have the 3rd baby, file for divorce, ask for primary custody and want child support for 3 kids.

So he really had no options at that point but to go for it that night. JMO

Yes. This explanation is spot-on.

jmo

 

[Tortoise]

25 and 30 July prior to the murders.

Quote by me: 25 July:
During that conversation Kessinger called Watts and left a voicemail. Following an eerily disconcerting childlike giggle she told Watts, "l miss your face. I was just calling to say hi. Call me back, bye." [41. - TL: 6513 - 5514. Audio: 250.amr]

D0622018CR002003 DISCOVERY PAGE 2092

Thank you nwmouse!

 

[Johnny1181]

If he wasn't on psych meds then, he is now for sure. And he will get constant taunting by the other inmates. It will be worse in prison than in jail. That's because the people Watt was with in jail were pre-sentence. They wouldn't wanna get a write up from jail staff before they went before the Judge. People he will be in Prison with won't care.

Do you think that he could benefit from the creation of legal cover documents advertised to sex offenders on your website in your bio to hide their true crime while in prison or do you think he's just too well known at this point?

 

[The Farm]

I’m not sure what you’re asking. Are you asking to post the name of the supposed psychic? Or sleuth her?

If the name is in the documents, it’s public record, but we aren’t going to sleuth this person. And psychic discussions are not allowed, per TOS. Only what is in the discovery documents regarding that particular psychic report may be discussed here.

Yes the name is in the docs and I understand your response. No sleuthing her. Thanks for the response so I will end it here.
But she sure hit the nail on the head which was amazing.
I do believe in them and have met one maybe two real ones in my entire life. They were both old Portugese women. They are very rare but the experiences I had made me a believer when I was not. The others are mostly scammers.
Thank You liltexans.

 

[Inthedetails]

Sorry if already posted:
August 8, 2018 From pdf page 1911:

2219 hours: Shanann told Utoft and Cassie, "l will fight for full custody." Shanann said Watts told her he does not want to divorce right away
2240 hours: Shanann told the women, "l can't afford three kids alone in Colorado." Shanann said their current home loan is "on Chris' name." Her friends rallied around Shanann
​

Chance encounter with licensed CO attorney (OH) with SW and unidentified female friend of SW at a restaurant in March or April 2018:
From pdf page 1345, 1346

OH said SHANANN WATTS seemed to be interested in what could happen to children in divorce proceedings. OH said he told SHANANN WATTS about the Spahmer doctrine in Colorado which specifically addresses the out of state relocation of children in a divorce occurring in Colorado. OH said
he told SHANANN WATTS that the presiding judge can’t tell the custodial parent where to live, but the judge can decide on which parent gets custody of the children. OH continued and told SHANANN WATTS that the courts will make decisions which they think is in the best interest of the children.
OH said SHANANN WATTS seemed concerned about this doctrine because she had two children from her current marriage, two girls.

OH said he asked SHANANN WATTS if she was thinking about getting a divorce and OH said SHANANN WATTS did not answer the question directly but he did see her smile in response to the question. OH said he also noticed the unidentified friend smile as well.

OH said after everyone at the table finished eating, they all stood up and SHANANN WATTS approached him and asked a few more questions about divorce. OH said he thought it was about 10:00 p.m. OH said SHANANN WATTS asked if it was possible for the courts in Colorado to give custody of the children in a divorce to the man in the case. OH confirmed it was a possibility for the courts to grant the man custody of the children in a Colorado divorce case. OH said SHANANN WATTS asked if divorce with children is a messy process and OH said he told SHANANN WATTS that unless there is infidelity in the marriage, he would recommend doing everything

possible to save the marriage rather than file for divorce. OH said he got the feeling that SHANANN WATTS wanted to ask more in-depth questions about divorce, but he thought she was a little hesitant because her friend was there.

OH said he remembered SHANANN WATTS talked about wanting to have another child, but she pressed concern for her health because the last time she was pregnant she had issues with her Lupus flaring up. OH said SHANANN WATTS may have mentioned that her husband wanted a baby boy.
​

So SW would have gone for full custody and moved back to NC to be with her family if she divorced him.

This conversation was in the spring, March or April, according to the witness. That's before she left town for the summer. Things were on the rocks before the summer.

I wonder if CW was stringing her along at that point, saying whatever he thought would get her "off his back" about the relationship. And, then she got pregnant....and he panicked about the added responsibilities...and then he met NK.

jmo

 

[Bravo]

Yes there is a whole other side to CW that loved one's and the world is now privy to. It's always been part of who he is. I'm sure there is much we will never know. IMO

 

[mickey2942]

Regarding NK losing her job with Anadarko. (She may have another one, IDK). DP 697

Fired on August 22, 2018. One week after CW was arrested. Interesting. What is with women who date men at work?! Always a bad idea.

Given the probabilities, she was less likely to meet a family annihilator on Match dot com!

Poor SW, reading her frantic texts. It was painfully obvious that CW was just not into her any longer.

 

[Larry Levine]

Do you think that he could benefit from the creation of legal cover documents advertised to sex offenders on your website in your bio to hide their true crime while in prison or do you think he's just too well known at this point?

Too many people know who he is and that only works for Federal Offenders. Thanks for your question!