GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #58

[Thinker Belle]

It’s quite disturbing imo that NK google searched Shannan Watts for hours and then also searched “can cops trace text messages” before the murders. I also saw in the documents she had mentioned to a friend that CWs kids mage her uncomfortable and also that she wanted to be with a man who didn’t have kids or hadn’t been married. I sincerely wonder if she told CW this and planted a seed in his head. I just don’t trust this woman at all. I’m not saying I think she murdered anyone but she definetly isn’t just the innocent bystander that she tried to come across as.

 

[Johnny1181]

I know this post was in jest, but i lived in fayetteville from 2007-2010. i moved 3 times, and would have moved more if i hadn't found a landlord that knew my SO's family. rents were being really weird and a lot of the apartments in the area at the time were run by people that were only a little better than slumlords. add a HUGE military population, and it was fairly easy to find a new place if your old one was unacceptable.

We do the best we can with what we have. Never expecting to be scrutinized and judged by strangers on a website after being found buried with our beloved and unrecognizable son because he was covered in dirt. Unrecognizable as a fetus.

We all do the best we can. Sorry for the graphic post. jmo

 

[Madison418]

How dare someone in their early adulthood rent a crappy apartment, work hard to get a better apartment, and buy a starter home and then sell it to buy a better home......etc etc. I have no idea if SW did this or not, but I believe it’s very common for young adults to do. Who knows though I’m just an amateur sleuth....

I moved like 11 times in my twenties. Completely normal, completely explainable. Why is this even a discussion

 

[katikaboom]

We do the best we can with what we have. Never expecting to be scrutinized and judged by strangers on a website after being found buried with our beloved and unrecognizable son because he was covered in dirt. Unrecognizable as a fetus.

We all do the best we can. Sorry for the graphic post. jmo

exactly. she did the best she could. she tried pretty d*mn hard, even after she had to start over after a divorce. and living in the area during that time, i KNOW it wasn't easy. she did well. it's terrible that a monster took it from her and her children.

 

[MassGuy]

It’s quite disturbing imo that NK google searched Shannan Watts for hours and then also searched “can cops trace text messages” before the murders. I also saw in the documents she had mentioned to a friend that CWs kids mage her uncomfortable and also that she wanted to be with a man who didn’t have kids or hadn’t been married. I sincerely wonder if she told CW this and planted a seed in his head. I just don’t trust this woman at all. I’m not saying I think she murdered anyone but she definetly isn’t just the innocent bystander that she tried to come across as.

FWIW those Google searches in regards to the ability of LE to recover text messages was performed on August 14. That was the day after the murders.

Page 2129

 

[nwmouse]

One thing I am still on the fence about, even after reading through these zillion pages of docs....

Did he have other previous affairs/flings, or was NK the first one?

I have a feeling he dipped his toe in the water before, so to speak.
Perhaps just experimenting.
I don't think Thrive was the motivation for his new buff look, I think he was on the prowl for a couple of months.

moo

 

[scdiv]

Didn't @trinket say the exact opposite, that Shanann always went through his phone. I just wonder if CW complained to his family or was this made up, like the 'letter'?! Who was responsible for it?

I do remember that VI posted that! I remember reading that SW was posting for CW on facebook, mostly his Thrive promotion things. So she probably had access to his account before he deleted it, whether she used the app on his phone or hers.

Page 2107 -
Addy asked if Shanann has gone through Watts' phone, asking if he was having an affair. Shanann replied, "I did, he denied. No I didn't look. He's deleting messages from his dad l'm sure he's not that stupid."

I think SW meant she asked, he denied. She didn't look at his phone. I guess she figured he would delete any evidence anyways. I think she would have been honest with one of her best friends if she had looked. I mean they were basically helping her google restaurant menus and figuring out potential meal combos to figure out if his dinner story added up. It's just what good friends do - we get it. No reason to lie if she had looked at his phone or not.

I'm sure SW did have access to CW's phone and just because someone has access doesn't mean they go snooping through it!

I will say SW was very wrong on one thing - CW IS that stupid.

 

[chi123]

Imo.... we have over 2000 pages of facts.

Right, we have 2000 pages of facts and not even a single text or email to suggest she was seeing anyone else. In fact almost all of her communications the last 4 months was solely on trying to fix her marriage, take care of her children by herself for the most part and work to make a living. All while being pregnant no less.

I don't even see how she would have possibly squeezed in an affair anyway with what we know about her last few months. That's pretty ridiculous speculation there.

 

[Thinker Belle]

FWIW those Google searches in regards to the ability of LE to recover text messages was performed on August 14. That was the day after the murders.

Page 2129

Thanks MassGuy. I thought I read that that search was before the murders. After looking at documents for awhile it all becomes a blur I suppose. Something still seems off about NK nonetheless. Jmo

 

[Dum-Dum Sucker]

Actually I’m not sure they chose a middle name.

I found the name in the docs. Discovery page 2109:

"2112 hours: Shanann told Utoft and Cassie, "Chris wants to move to Brighton." Shanann announced their son will be named "Niko Lee Watts." shanann cautioned they were not going to tell anyone the name until Monday and to keep this a secret. Shanann told the women the conversation she had with Watts this evening, "Has been the best talk yet.""

 

[PommyMommy]

Did the girls go to daycare 5 days a week? I thought they only went 2 or 3 days.

She reviewed Primrose School via FB in March, 2017 - at that time, Bella was attending two days a week. Shanann Watts

Didn't @trinket say the exact opposite, that Shanann always went through his phone. I just wonder if CW complained to his family or was this made up, like the 'letter'?! Who was responsible for it?

Trinket78 said she had complete access to his phone. Found Deceased - CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *Arrest* #19

When C.W. 's life sentence was announced, that signalled the end of my participation in this thread.

This was a very shocking and deeply saddening thread from the beginning and I greatly appreciated all of the deep compassion we all shared together on this.

I want to say thank you to everyone on this thread, for not only your insight into this case, but your empathy and compassion.

While Shanann's family will continue to endure the tremendous loss of this beautiful family, Shanann's and their beautiful grandchildren's lights will shine forever in their hearts.

My heart goes out to them and to all loved ones who are suffering great losses in their lives.

Thank you for being here, Zen!

 

[opalonyx]

He tries to brush her friend Cassie off. Says "I don't want you to think I am a bad person". She says she doesn't care about him, she's concerned about his wife.

Good for you Cassie! I am glad her friends weren't putting up with him.

Honestly, I feel like Chris viewed reality in such a way, it was like the saying "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?" I feel like that's how he was able to live with it. He convinced himself that if no one else found out what he did, it's like it never happened. That's the only way I can understand him having the gall to say that knowing what he did.

 

[ReckoningDay]

I don't understand people who say they don't judge. Do they mean there should be no punishment for crimes? They remind me too much of the Watts family dishing out forgiveness and absolution, before the ink was even dry on the court papers!

Yes! Good judgment is one of the earmarks of
maturity.

 

[BabyButterfly]

It didn’t say why in the documents. I would imagine SW and CW didn’t tell them.
jmo

ETA: sorry I misread your question. It says in the documents they weren’t aware of their financial stress and they were never asked to borrow them money.

I am way behind here, and the documents. Didn't CW say they were behind? I'm not sure I believe him. He also mentioned the August mortgage payment was due, if they were behind...I don't know, makes no sense to me.

 

[Tuliptiptoe]

He tries to brush her friend Cassie off. Says "I don't want you to think I am a bad person". She says she doesn't care about him, she's concerned about his wife.

Good for you Cassie! I am glad her friends weren't putting up with him.

Honestly, I feel like Chris viewed reality in such a way, it was like the saying "If a tree falls in a forest and no one is around to hear it, does it make a sound?" I feel like that's how he was able to live with it. He convinced himself that if no one else found out what he did, it's like it never happened. That's the only way I can understand him having the gall to say that knowing what he did.

One of her friends also texted that same day she went missing that police needed to check CW cell and computer. Everyone knew right away.

Moo

 

[CalmSeas]

What would be great is for someone to compile a book of RED FLAGS that all young women should read.
The first red flag Chris showed (that we know of) is his toxic and troubled yet enmeshed relationship with his mother and his inability to stand up to his own mother.
Many refer to it as a Norman/Norma Bates relationship. Emotionally abusive possibly incestuous emotionally.

I haven’t been able to stay current on this thread, sorry if this has already been mentioned. “The Gift of Fear” is an excellent book that discusses how to recognize “red flags”, along with tips on how to avoid or extricate yourself from dangerous relationships and situations. I’ve gifted it to many new college students.

 

[Layla123]

She’s still a victim. She had nothing to do with the murders. I think most of the somewhat sketchy things she did were an effort at self-preservation. I think she was afraid of being implicated if she was too close to CW. But whatever she knew going into the relationship , she did not know she was getting involved with a murderer. MOO.

I think she was probably very embarrassed and didn’t realize her sex life would be such an important part of the investigation. CW did tell her his marriage was over, and when he was with her, he behaved like it was. You don’t normally get to spend time with a committed married man and father 4-5 times a week, or talk on the phone and text as often as they did. When she gave her interview to the newspaper last week, I can’t imagine she realized so much of her personal information was going to be released to the public contradicting what she said, she was trying to protect her reputation. If CW didn’t murder his family, who knows, she might have married him. I don’t think the police should have released all this. For example, I don’t think we needed to see the texts between NK and her friend. It was personal and private to her. They’ve destroyed her life. This is shaming.

 

[tmar]

5 MONTHS AGO (from the time of the murder)

Discovery page 757

"BROWN said now that he has had a chance to think about the situation he thinks WATTS may have been dating a girl in the Anadarko office. BROWN said he thought WATTS was dating a girl named ³NIKKI´. BROWN said he saw WATTS and ³NIKKI´ standing near the break room talking together. BROWN said he thought WATTS and ³NIKKI´ were standing e[tremely close and BROWN thought that was unusual. BROWN thought that happened about five months ago."

*So, this coziness at work between CW and NK would have been observed, around March??

Thanks Dum Dum.
That's the article I remember.
My incorrect name David, I cannot explain: to save face, both are common, and have 5 letters. (my apology with name).
Perhaps a common name, went into my memory.
MOO.

 

[ReckoningDay]

One other thing that stood out to me in the reports is that SW never even went through CW's phone. Even when her friends asked and encouraged her to go through his phone, she said she had not. Granted he was storing things in "secret calculators" but it just shows how that showed him trust and respect, gave him the benefit of asking, etc. Not exactly signs of a controlling, dramatic, narcissistic wife.

Totally agree! I.am not a particularly jealous or paranoid person, but if my hubby froze me out like that , I would probably be doing a bit of " research" on his phone . she doesn't come across at ALL as overly controlling

 

[NuttMegg]

I moved like 11 times in my twenties. Completely normal, completely explainable. Why is this even a discussion

I moved about 10 times throughout college, LONG time ago. And one of the places I lived was called Sin City. And have lived in 3 other states and 2 foreign countries since then. And on 3 different houseboats, 5 cabins in the Alaska bush for 20 winters. I guess if some creep murders me it's my own damn fault.