GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #64

[Thepoet]

Why would the state give her an immunity deal?

What key testimony could she provide to justify it?

Since she didn't and won't testify, we don't know.

She was awful quick to erase things and protect herself.

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

What was up with CW googling those Metallica lyrics? I don’t follow Metallica, so I have no frame of reference. Does anyone understand the meaning of that?
“Smashing through the boundaries, lunacy has found me” and “Pounding out aggression, turns into obsession/Cannot kill the battery/Cannot kill the family.”

I wondered the same thing. If you put that first phrase in Google, there is a site on "song meanings" with about 100 comments that were interesting to skim through. Some think it's just about feeling the energy of music, like being in a mosh pit (ugh), and others think it's about, well, rage and violence. I think the document said he looked up those lyrics around 10:30am shortly after disposing of his family?

 

[Ellamental]

My take on it was that NK is totally embarrassed and ashamed, she wants no association with CW, she doesn’t want to drag her friends into it, and she doesn’t think anyone will hire her for 5-10 years. She was also talking about changing her name and moving out of state.

I wonder if Wisconsin is on her list of states she's possibly considering? <to be read very tongue-in-cheek>

 

[mrjitty]

Since she didn't and won't testify, we don't know.

She was awful quick to erase things and protect herself.

Hard to see why she would be given immunity relating to a triple murder when they already had Watts dead to rights.

Can't see it myself.

 

[x_files]

Although his dream was to be a Nascar Mechanic, where all the action is. Imo

I do believe he was driven by power.

 

[Seenit]

Hello all, thanks for all the brilliant insights and information in this tragic and dreadful case.

I was looking around at stuff that might go towards explaining Chris Watts' behaviour. I am a retired unverified social worker, and these puzzles really interest me especially as my background is in child protection, and assessing abusers was my stock in trade.
A couple of observations that I have made suggests that Watts has an attachment disorder which has already been alluded to, he is attached to no-one deeply. He may have some surface feeling for his dad, but remember that his dad didn't save him from his mum, so he is probably angry at him subconsciously.
I don't think he trusts anyone, and the reason I believe this is at very early stage of life, his needs were not mirrored by his mum who saw him as an extension of herself. If you can't resolve this very early damaging issue, the chances are that you won't meet all the other individuation processes either. (Erickson). So he was underdeveloped emotionally, and very immature. That's kind of obvious lol. A toddler in a man's body.

As a child of a narcissistic parent, he had two choices beat them or join them. We can't beat narcissists especially ones who are responsible for our needs so we are stuck as children, you enter their skewed world, or you suffer. He joined them.
I don't think he was a good parent, just based on what I observed. His behaviour was likely superficial at best, and I can image that he was not a tolerant person who actually liked chicken nuggets being thrown at him. I believe Shan'ann probably thought it was funny (I would too). He was insulted. It's sensitive to him.
He is one of those narcissists who is an angel on the street and a devil at home. I think we know that from the neighbour.

I also think Shan'nan was the subject of domestic abuse perhaps not physical, but abuse nonetheless. Her declarations of love for him reminded me of the cycle of violence, almost like she needed to to keep him calm and engaged, she was sensitive to his needs. I just wish she hadn't chosen him, his behaviour would have affected the children, but I sense Shan'ann mediated this in some way.

I am horrified at the family Watts' behaviour and think Shan'ann was brave to take it on. They are a dysfunctional family of enablers who are incapable of self reflection or the needs of others, particularly children.

Narcissism is one of those things so damaging to children, but by it's very nature it actually causes narcissism. That's why it's not unusual to find one or more in the same family.

That's it from me, hope it adds rather than detracts from the discussion.

Mr Jitty I recognise you from the MK forum.
Dave are you masquerading as Harassed Wilsod? lol

Yes!
Thank you for sharing your experience.

 

[margarita25]

(I’m on the 4th video of him being interviewed by Agent Tammy and I literally see in my mind a Pinocchio nose on his face while he’s talking. Right now it’s so long it’s drilling a hole in the wall.)

 

[x_files]

Here we go again...today's version of Inmate Watts' location.

Murderer Chris Watts Transferred To Wisconsin Prison Notorious For Serial Killers
Wife and child killer Chris Watts has been transferred to the infamous Dodge Correctional Institution in Waupun, Wisconsin — where he will rot behind bars with other notorious murderers, RadarOnline.com can exclusively report.

Now, he will serve five life sentences alongside Chris Coleman, an Illinois man who was convicted of crimes eerily similar to those of Watts. The former bodyguard to televangelist Joyce Meyer is serving a life sentence for killing his wife and two children to run off with his mistress.

Disturbing serial killer Ed Gein — who was the inspiration for Psychocharacter Norman Bates — also was an inmate at DCI before his 1984 death.

Though the Wisconsin Department of Corrections would not confirm or deny Watts was transferred to DCI, the killer is included on the prison’s commissary listing.

He'll be right at home! Then Mother can visit.

 

[mrjitty]

Some think it's just about feeling the energy of music, like being in a mosh pit (ugh), and others think it's about, well, rage and violence.

It's all of that.

When thrash broke out in the 80s via bands like Metallica and Megadeth, there was heavy imagery of death, insanity, murder, the occult etc

It was a thing for angry boys and disaffected men living boring lives in the burbs

And of course your parents hated it.

Thrash differentiated itself from glam rock via the shock factor

 

[x_files]

Narcissists/sociopaths and abusers don't come from nowhere. Sometimes how those pieces came together for a certain perp is a bit of a mystery. NOT HERE.



Layla123, I beg you to read "The Sociopath Next Door" by Martha Stout. I think everything will become much clearer. These people really do believe they are so much smarter than everyone else, or so charming, or they just simply have so little concern with consequences, that they just assume they will get away with everything. The sad part is that sometimes actually they do! Their brains work totally different from normal people. I get how hard it is for normal people to wrap their heads around this, I do: I stayed with my abusive sociopath ex-husband for 8 years because I refused to believe that he could really have no compassion or empathy. I truly believed that everyone has good in them that could be drawn out if you just tried hard enough. (I even gave him the exact same book SW gave CW.) TO THIS DAY and even after going to jail and now being on probation for DV my ex still feels no empathy or compassion or true remorse for any of his cruel behavior. Even toward his own children! And he still blames everyone but himself for his problems and thinks there is nothing wrong with him.

We will all be so much safer once we admit these people do exist and will not change, and that we cannot "get through" to them and make them feel empathy or compassion or remorse no matter how good and kind and loving we are. We cannot give them the benefit of the doubt. Their brains are different. They are predators, even if they never become physically violent. We cannot make them stop being predatory with love or reason. We can only protect ourselves by refusing to engage with them! Knowledge is power. Knowledge is protection. Spread the word and protect yourselves and everyone you love.

He learned it from his parents that's for sure. Cold hearted.

 

[Madison418]

Do you think any news organizations will have interviews with NK? Like 20/20? Do you think there would be a way for the Rzuceks to block that from happening or ensure she doesn't profit from the deaths of their family?

ETA- IMO SW's family probably wouldn't want a potential catalyst to all this horror to profit...but I could be wrong (it happens from time to time)

 

[margarita25]

It's all of that.

When thrash broke out in the 80s via bands like Metallica and Megadeth, there was heavy imagery of death, insanity, murder, the occult etc

It was a thing for angry boys and disaffected men living boring lives in the burbs

And of course your parents hated it.

Thrash differentiated itself from glam rock via the shock factor

(Ummm, I’ve been a huge Metallica fan since the early 80s and I’m not an angry boy or disaffected man living a boring life in the burbs??)

(Angry woman maybe...haha)

 

[Trudie]

I believe this was clarified to specify that Jeffrey Dahlmer requested GP

I don't think we know if that is even an option for CW or if he has any say in the matter.

Almost any state prison, upon intake, will ask the inmate if he feels the need for

Here we go again...today's version of Inmate Watts' location.

Murderer Chris Watts Transferred To Wisconsin Prison Notorious For Serial Killers
Wife and child killer Chris Watts has been transferred to the infamous Dodge Correctional Institution in Waupun, Wisconsin — where he will rot behind bars with other notorious murderers, RadarOnline.com can exclusively report.

During orientation his case worker will address specific fears CW might have regarding his safety. As much publicity as he’s had they might as well change his name to “Target”, because everyone wants a shot at him. It’s not only his safety it’s the safety concerns of those escorting him around the facility. If CW is attacked the guard with him is as well. His case worker will advise him in ad seg he will be away from all other inmates at all times & will be pretty much confined to his cell. If he chooses ad seg they can assure his safety, in GP they cannot. There’s other inmates with crimes as severe (or worse) in the max pen’ he will ultimately end up at. The prison CANNOT dole out additional punishment to CW w/o just cause. As much as we dislike it, he has the right to decide. His case worker will inform him of the media saturation surrounding him & I assume suggest ad seg, RHU or the pedo’ pod. Mom Watts has prob’ already called his case worker to add her three cents.

Mod, please delete this. Having tech issues. Tysm

 

[Tortoise]

I’m wondering if there is a connection between any of these behaviors;

1. Trying to get Shanann to instigate the divorce that he wanted by telling her he didn’t love her anymore.

2. Planning the murders to be a disappearance, rather than murder - staging an intruder sex attack and murder of the children as witnesses which would be easier to stage if he just left the back sliding door open. This way he has no problem with cameras not picking up her exit out front, the car being in the garage, possessions in the house etc.

3. Murdering them all (most likely) in their sleep so they don’t see him as the attacker.

4. Hiding their bodies. Rather than leaving them somewhere to be discovered, like gassed in the car. This way (assuming they’re not found) he gets to not have to deal with them again, no funerals.

I think it all looks like hiding and diversion. Is it passive-aggressiveness? He described himself to the FBI agent as being non-confrontational and I think that was the general consensus of everyone who knew him too. The shouting his neighbor talked about could have been him starting to leak aggression, producing an internal crisis and destructive or rebellious behaviour such as starting an affair, because the alternative might mean facing the death of easy-going Chris. Forbidden feelings surfacing from childhood maybe, so blame it on current circumstances, wife, marriage and kids, all lumped in together as one - his current life. The threat of facing the repressed rage he felt at his mother was maybe surfacing and he re-packaged it.

 

[Mellowmelly]

Yes that happened as well. I was too naive at first. Didn't want all the politics. Big mistake

We see CW had been doing that

I have also been naive, have had the sister of my daughters dad on the phone mouthing off at me about how I should stop moaning on at him on the phone for letting me bring his child up on my own, telling me I shouldn’t be upset that his family had a party and they didn’t invite me, yet random woman were there. He can do no wrong in his family’s eyes and I am , was the crazy girlfriend moaning all the time. I know how frustrated SW must have felt with in laws and a husband like that.

 

[cybervampira]

What was up with CW googling those Metallica lyrics? I don’t follow Metallica, so I have no frame of reference. Does anyone understand the meaning of that?
“Smashing through the boundaries, lunacy has found me” and “Pounding out aggression, turns into obsession/Cannot kill the battery/Cannot kill the family.”

Quoting the Metallica Wiki:

The theme of the song revolves around the San Francisco thrash scene of the 1980s. The most prominent club played by Metallica was the Old Waldorf located at 444 Battery Street in downtown San Francsico. The tone of the song is one of familial ties and the positive release of energy through the common interest of metal. The lyric "Cannot kill the family, Battery is found in me" is a statement that while society at large doesn't understand the scene, those within it (i.e. "the family") will fiercely defend it as a show of solidarity against the glam scene that was popular in the Los Angeles area.

 

[cybervampira]

It's probable he misunderstood the lyrics

I was a teenager in the 80s - these songs had a lot of resonance with young men. The whole thing about thrash was its shock value

The theme of the song revolves around the San Francisco thrash scene of the 1980s. The most prominent club played by Metallica was the Old Waldorf located at 444 Battery Street in downtown San Francsico. The tone of the song is one of familial ties and the positive release of energy through the common interest of metal. The lyric "Cannot kill the family, Battery is found in me" is a statement that while society at large doesn't understand the scene, those within it (i.e. "the family") will fiercely defend it as a show of solidarity against the glam scene that was popular in the Los Angeles area.

Battery (song)​

Oops, didn’t see you had already answered that.

 

[mrjitty]

(Ummm, I’ve been a huge Metallica fan since the early 80s and I’m not an angry boy or disaffected man living a boring life in the burbs??)

(Angry woman maybe...haha)

LOL! No offence intended.

I was a teenager in the 80s and listened to Metallica, Megadeth etc. Started out via the UK scene Motorhead, Iron Maiden

 

[Thepoet]

How many, if any, news outlets, are trying to get an interview with CW? Could it happen and what would it be like?

 

[Steelhead]

Another thing I thought was freaky was when CW searched Google for Mount Colima and "preserved an image of the volcano spewing lava and smoke" He did that on 8/12 at 10:45 a.m., right after sending SW photos of the girls. (Discovery pg. 2116).

Things were about to erupt. Was the search a coincidence? Or was he expressing what was about to happen?