GUILTY CO - Shanann Watts (34), Celeste"Cece" (3) and Bella (4), Frederick, 13 Aug 2018 *CW LWOP* #64

[Gardener1850]

My take on it was that NK is totally embarrassed and ashamed, she wants no association with CW, she doesn’t want to drag her friends into it, and she doesn’t think anyone will hire her for 5-10 years. She was also talking about changing her name and moving out of state.

I can understand those reactions as first immediate reactions. One of the issues I have with NK's interviews is that she never seems to move on from that first reaction to realize why the police are asking her for things like her friend's info and for all the data from her phone. She is offered counseling and a lady came in to talk to NK about the positive things she could do to try to get new employment and move on with her life before her name came out in the press. From what I saw, NK was not receptive to the advice being offered. She spoke to LE for hours and over several days. She had multiple chances to change her tune and days to think about why they were asking for all this info from her. They were investigating a quadruple homicide and she was going to be a main witness. They had to verify what she said.

Unless there are more interviews not released yet, it seems NK never gave them "Jim's" last name. They clearly would have that when they got her phone records though. So why bother holding that back and freaking out that LE might contact Jim? She cooperated but only when really pushed by the investigators-- the giving over of her phone, for example, came with a bunch of delaying and drama on her part. She used it as an opportunity to complain about her situation and how it was affecting her personally instead of just saying-- can your tech transfer my contacts to my new phone? Everything she said seemed to be very self-centered and not at all recognizing what had happened and why she was there. The investigator didn't care about all the details of her conversation with her "drunk" friend Charlotte! They just wanted to know what was said about the kids. But NK seemed to lack understanding of why they wanted those texts. By stonewalling and dramatizing everything she is creating more work for the investigators and guaranteeing that LE will look into the people she says she doesn't want them to interview. There's a reason the DA said she was "mostly forthcoming" and I think her interviews reveal it. MOO.

 

[margarita25]

LOL! No offence intended.

I was a teenager in the 80s and listened to Metallica, Megadeth etc. Started out via the UK scene Motorhead, Iron Maiden

(I’d be lying if I said there was no rebelliousness going on during those years, :wink: LOL)

 

[Trudie]

Do you think any news organizations will have interviews with NK? Like 20/20? Do you think there would be a way for the Rzuceks to block that from happening or ensure she doesn't profit from the deaths of their family?

Let’s hope not. She should have nothing to say. Remember, she hadn’t known him long
We should know, from her interrogation transcripts, all that she knows.
I don’t see how the Rs could prevent her from profiting if some rag mag offers her a few bucks. She’s free to do as she chooses. Not sure she’s bright enough to recall what she told LE. She could slip up if she did an interview for a rag mag.

On another note, many years ago, a guy I went to school with caught his wife in bed with his hunting buddy. He promptly shot his once buddy in the head, killing him. He then phoned 911 & waited on his porch for the MSP. He served 20 years in Ionia State Pen. His story received some media attention. Not like the crimes of today. Anyway, he has 6 brothers and at the time his parents were alive and lived in a small town in WI. They ended up moving to a very rural area. They were more or less outcasts due to the actions of their eldest son. They were active in church, prominent biz owner & perfectly normal. Obviously, they had nothing to do with the murder their son committed.

Do you think Mom Watts will face scrutiny in her hometown? Eventually, she will need to be in public. People will point, stare, whisper, maybe worse. How will she cope?

 

[Mellowmelly]

That's a good idea. Maybe someday he will find a confidant and discloses everything we would like to know.

We can hope !

 

[Thepoet]

'Shan'ann Watts' parents want the world to know the good side of their daughter."

In a sneak peek at ABC News' 20/20, Frank and Sandra Rzucek try to stay strong as they share just some of the many good attributes of their daughter.

"She'd do anything for her children," Frank shared with Amy Robach. "She just loved her children and wanted them to have everything growing up."

Sandra added, "She was fun, full of life. She did so many things. She had her hand in everything. She was amazing."

Chris Watts' In-Laws Speak Out After Their Daughter's Tragic Murder"

Courage and dignity. It'll be rough, but I'll watch because they deserve to be heard.

 

[Gardener1850]

What was up with CW googling those Metallica lyrics? I don’t follow Metallica, so I have no frame of reference. Does anyone understand the meaning of that?
“Smashing through the boundaries, lunacy has found me” and “Pounding out aggression, turns into obsession/Cannot kill the battery/Cannot kill the family.”

With the twisted and somewhat literal way CW's mind works he might have thought "Cannot kill the family" would serve as proof he would never do something like that.

Then again, I sort of wonder if he looked it up to write it in a card or letter to someone, like all those cards he sent to NK where he quoted song lyrics. I can't imagine who he would address those lyrics to though-- his parents maybe?

 

[Loveallmyhorsesdogsandcats]

Let’s hope not. She should have nothing to say. Remember, she hadn’t known him long
We should know, from her interrogation transcripts, all that she knows.
I don’t see how the Rs could prevent her from profiting if some rag mag offers her a few bucks. She’s free to do as she chooses. Not sure she’s bright enough to recall what she told LE. She could slip up if she did an interview for a rag mag.

On another note, many years ago, a guy I went to s hood with caught his wife in bed with his hunting buddy. He promptly shot his once buddy in the head, killing him. He then phoned 911 & waited on his porch for the MSP. He served 20 years in Ionia State Pen. His story received some media attention. Not like the crimes of today. Anyway, he has 6 brothers and at the time his parents were alive and lived in a small town in WI. They ended up moving to a very rural area. They were more or less outcasts due to the actions of their eldest son. They were active in church, prominent biz owner & perfectly normal. Obviously, they had nothing to do with the murder their son committed.

Do you think Mom Watts will face scrutiny in her hometown? Eventually, she will need to be in public. People will point, stare, whisper, maybe worse. How will she cope?

I don’t think it will bother Cindy, I think she has pretty thick skin. As to NK not keeping straight her interviews with LE, they are all on you tube for her to refer too. I wonder if she has watched them?

 

[JerseyWasHome2]

Another thing I thought was freaky was when CW searched Google for Mount Colima and "preserved an image of the volcano spewing lava and smoke" He did that on 8/12 at 10:45 a.m., right after sending SW photos of the girls. (Discovery pg. 2116).

Things were about to erupt. Was the search a coincidence? Or was he expressing what was about to happen?

YES! Had the same thought!

 

[NuttMegg]

Everything she said seemed to be very self-centered and not at all recognizing what had happened and why she was there.

For instance going on and on about how she and her sister dealt with their parents' divorce, how they absolutely loved having bunk beds, and how she thought the Watts girls would have loved that.
-------------------------------
I couldn't believe it -- they are DEAD, MURDERED by her illicit boyfriend. And more power to the cop/agent, he kept bringing her back to his questions.

And, no, of course she had never contemplated marriage with CW......she barely knew him.

 

[Tortoise]

Another thing I thought was freaky was when CW searched Google for Mount Colima and "preserved an image of the volcano spewing lava and smoke" He did that on 8/12 at 10:45 a.m., right after sending SW photos of the girls. (Discovery pg. 2116).

Things were about to erupt. Was the search a coincidence? Or was he expressing what was about to happen?

It seems very symbolic to me.

 

[Layla123]

I’m wondering if there is a connection between any of these behaviors;

1. Trying to get Shanann to instigate the divorce that he wanted by telling her he didn’t love her anymore.

2. Planning the murders to be a disappearance, rather than murder - staging an intruder sex attack and murder of the children as witnesses which would be easier to stage if he just left the back sliding door open. This way he has no problem with cameras not picking up her exit out front, the car being in the garage, possessions in the house etc.

3. Murdering them all (most likely) in their sleep so they don’t see him as the attacker.

4. Hiding their bodies. Rather than leaving them somewhere to be discovered, like gassed in the car. This way (assuming they’re not found) he gets to not have to deal with them again, no funerals.

I think it all looks like hiding and diversion. Is it passive-aggressiveness? He described himself to the FBI agent as being non-confrontational and I think that was the general consensus of everyone who knew him too. The shouting his neighbor talked about could have been him starting to leak aggression, producing an internal crisis and destructive or rebellious behaviour such as starting an affair, because the alternative might mean facing the death of easy-going Chris. Forbidden feelings surfacing from childhood maybe, so blame it on current circumstances, wife, marriage and kids, all lumped in together as one - his current life. The threat of facing the repressed rage he felt at his mother was maybe surfacing and he re-packaged it.

I read a very academic article, years ago, theorizing how some killer who killed his parents was motivated by survival of self. His parents forced him to do everything they wanted him to do without taking into consideration who he was, what he liked, or what he wanted to do. As a result he totally lost himself, and the only way he thought he could survive was to kill them. I think that explanation works for what CW did. He came from a home where he did everything his parents wanted him to do, and he moved into a marriage where he did everything his wife wanted him to do. He never learned the life skill of speaking up for himself, and since he spent his entire life doing what others expected of him, he probably had no clue who he was, anyway. I’m thinking of his interest in NASCAR, that was really his Dad’s passion, they went all the time together when he was growing up, but CW left the profession as soon as he got far away from his parents. As for SW, the happy family lifestyle and the roles each partner must play was her dream, not CW’s. He always did what he was told, but none of it was his idea. I think NK represented breaking free from it all for him, and he liked the freedom. I think SW was his first serious relationship, and when he met NK, he realized how much he had missed. I think he thought SW was never going to let him go, or at least not until after a really big ugly fight to keep him, and he felt like the most expedient way to break free was to kill her and his children.

 

[human]

They are very nice homes and I would consider it upper middle class

In MN, houses that are so close and so cookie cutter are not upper middle class. They remind me more of housing projects in MN for low income except the houses are bigger in the SW neighborhood.

I am sure they are built with the lowest of quality of materials. An upper middle class home would have crown molding. The doors in the interior would be thick with wide molding around them. The baseboards would be several inches high. There would be built ins. There would be landscaped yards.

Those without money have the trappings. The fancy car, for instance. Where I lived in MN, those with old money had beautiful homes but out in public, you would not guess they had money. One woman drove a Subaru. They have no reason to try to impress.

 

[Abba's Tears]

Coleman thought he was smarter, but his staging was so elaborate that even if he got it right, it wouldn’t have fooled anyone.

The story he was trying to sell, is one that simply doesn’t happen.

Much like the scenario that CW was trying to sell.

Peterson was probably the smartest of the bunch in regards to actually carrying out the crime.

Of course, he made countless mistakes as well.

I guess the smartest ones are the ones we'll never know about... I don't think there are many, but there undoubtedly are some of them out there.

 

[Becky Starkey]

I thought the same, except that then later in the video, he radios in that this is a medical case and that Shanann has diabetes. I think he thought they'd find her collapsed somewhere. If he thought it was suspicious, wouldn't he have asked for backup? I found it interesting that police don't seem to go in pairs there, that he was completely alone. Although he had NUA and NUA's son with him when they went inside I guess.

I don't understand why he wasn't allowed to just bust in the house? Some time had already went by before he got there, every second would matter if a pregnant lady was in the house somewhere passed out. That was very nerve racking to me even though I knew she wasn't in there. And whether the husband gave them permission or not. If it were me or a family member or friend in that position I would want the police or whoever came first to bust into the house and help the lady. That was a lot of time wasted.

 

[Becky Starkey]

Sorry Tricia, I take 100% responsibility for the sex toy discussion, it was mostly me

I think it was a discussion worth having. It shows that Chris had want he wanted and still did what he did. And aren't we all trying to understand why he did what he did so we can stop acts of horrible violence like this in the future?

 

[dgfred]

Yeah... but if they do bust in and find something it will not be able to be used against CW. No warrant.

 

[Trudie]

I don’t think it will bother Cindy, I think she has pretty thick skin. As to NK not keeping straight her interviews with LE, they are all on you tube for her to refer too. I wonder if she has watched them?

Bet she repeatedly watches herself. Has anyone started a for her? We know she wants money & feels like a victim.
I don’t care what CW told her about his divorce, the stage it was in (or not). NK knew the moment she stepped foot in SWs house the arrangement CW had related to her was not true. So her butt shoulda been outta there. IMO
He was spot on when he noted in her bday card “big things are gonna happen”, huh?

 

[Layla123]

I can understand those reactions as first immediate reactions. One of the issues I have with NK's interviews is that she never seems to move on from that first reaction to realize why the police are asking her for things like her friend's info and for all the data from her phone. She is offered counseling and a lady came in to talk to NK about the positive things she could do to try to get new employment and move on with her life before her name came out in the press. From what I saw, NK was not receptive to the advice being offered. She spoke to LE for hours and over several days. She had multiple chances to change her tune and days to think about why they were asking for all this info from her. They were investigating a quadruple homicide and she was going to be a main witness. They had to verify what she said.

Unless there are more interviews not released yet, it seems NK never gave them "Jim's" last name. They clearly would have that when they got her phone records though. So why bother holding that back and freaking out that LE might contact Jim? She cooperated but only when really pushed by the investigators-- the giving over of her phone, for example, came with a bunch of delaying and drama on her part. She used it as an opportunity to complain about her situation and how it was affecting her personally instead of just saying-- can your tech transfer my contacts to my new phone? Everything she said seemed to be very self-centered and not at all recognizing what had happened and why she was there. The investigator didn't care about all the details of her conversation with her "drunk" friend Charlotte! They just wanted to know what was said about the kids. But NK seemed to lack understanding of why they wanted those texts. By stonewalling and dramatizing everything she is creating more work for the investigators and guaranteeing that LE will look into the people she says she doesn't want them to interview. There's a reason the DA said she was "mostly forthcoming" and I think her interviews reveal it. MOO.

I agree pretty much with what you said here, but I did sense total shock, horror, and fear in NK that turned her into pretty much a rambling basket case. I can understand that reaction, what CW did was as bad as it gets, the worst nightmare anyone could imagine being a part of. I think she was a nervous wreck, and not in her right mind, so I’m cutting her some slack.

 

[Trudie]

I missed a lot here because of work. The phone call on youtube from SW's friend Christina contains her talking to Cindy too?? Cindy IMO played a big role in hurting their marriage. What a shame. Also, CW is going to prison in Wisconsin! Someone posted Co. has a max security prison, why not there??

Because of threats against him by inmate population. Too risky for the COs, other inmates & CW. The CO supermax is for problem inmates. CW hasn’t been a problem, thus far. Not in jail/prison, anyway.

 

[Steelhead]

Yet according to the Watts SW was controlling. Father Watts' only understandable words ar the very start of his interview.
About Shannan.
" She was a very controlling woman".
It just makes me sick.

Me too.

bbm- Interesting he said, "very." Basically implying that there are different levels of controlling women and SW's was "very".

I wonder if he has any other "controlling" women in his life?