CO - The Stalking and Mysterious Death of Morgan Ingram #2

[Cazzie]

They see someone running from the back of the house to the front and ducking behind the neighbors car the night Morgan died.On the video.

Thank you...

 

[rollinginit]

I can't on this computer.

Oh, sorry. I'm sure it will be transcripted tomorrow. There is just so much stuff, it's really hard to get it all down right now.

 

[Cazzie]

OHMMMMMMMMMMMMMM...

I'm stressed...but OK...

This broadcast needs to be heard...

 

[Herding Cats]

I was unable to listen, so I know what I'm doing either tonight or tomorrow morning.

Twinkie, yes, I'd love the email. I'll pm you my addy.

As for date rape drugs, there are a few that are more commonly used than others.

Flunitrazepam is Rohypnol, a benzo class.
Midozalam benzo
Temazepam benzo
Ketamine
GHB
Zolpidem "Ambien"

This is BY NO MEANS a comprehensive list. If Morgan'sFather or Toni could swing by and post the names on her blog or here, it would be super useful.

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[basilcat]

Lorazapem can also cause suicide ideation and lower inhibitions - I wonder if the doctors could determine if it was sublingual or not....
In any case, where did it come from- and was it taken willingly to stave off panic..? f one took too many sublingual pills at once, then could this possibly explain the high dose but no caplet scenario? Just wondering...

 

[Confusion]

Clonazepam is Klonopin (a benzodiazepine) - used mainly for anxiety and seizures
Lorazepam is Ativan (a benzodiazepine) - used mainly for anxiety
Diazepam is Valium (a benzodiazepine) - used for anxiety and sleep
Flurazpam is Dalmane - used for sleep
Amitriptyline - used for depression, migrines and some kinds of pain
Cyclobenzaprine is Flexeril - mainly used for muscle pain (muscle relaxer)

I'm not sure exactly which were mentioned by Toni, but I tried to include all that were mentioned here. If I missed something, let me know.

It would be nice to know if any of the most likely suspects was ever treated for anxiety, seizures and a muscle sprain/strain.

 

[Anna1964]

FWIW, I was prescribed Ativan for a week years ago after my husband passed away, and it had some strange side effects. I had MAJOR memory problems, and went running back to the doctor, and he told me it was the medication. It may be a rare side effect, I don't know, but I think I read about a date rape drug somewhere.....???? Or maybe not. Was something like that mentioned?

 

[Herding Cats]

Doesn't Lorazapem come in sub lingual form that is taken under the tongue and dissolved there - hence no caplets to be found ? Just wondering?

Yes, lorazepam does come in sublingual form, and indeed, that would leave no fragments. But it would go into the blood system, and not the stomach, so if it was found in the stomach content, it would have to have been ingested.

However, lorazepam is a very, very, very small pill. It does not take long to dissolve in the stomach, and effects can be felt very quickly.

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[bearx]

My son takes Clonazepam or w/e the spelling is. We had a hell of a time finding the melt (he's 2). Only one dose (and it's miniscule) comes in the melt and I had to call 6 different pharmacy chains in our major US city to find one that carried it. Even then I ended up paying OOP as my insurance (which normally I don't even have copays for) didn't cover the melt.

 

[Herding Cats]

M was sick earlier in the day and coughing later that night. Could that play into the drugs she was given?

I don't know what drugs were given, but I would think this would be important to the (obviously oblivious) coroner...as it might indicate pulmonary edema...which may be a side effect of some drug or other.

Who was she texting that night, in the dark? Did she let him in through a window? Could that have even happened??

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[AbbeyR]

I'll be honest. After listening to the radio show, I am less convinced about the evidence. I have a lot of sympathy for the Ingrams, and I think it's possible that there was some stalking or other problems... but T's theories seem to go a little far.


- She was stalked by an acquaintance, who belongs to a sketchy crowd. But he may also be a serial stalker?

- The stalker had a complex, and totally silent way of sneaking in and murdering Morgan - holding a date rape drug over her mouth while she slept (can this even happen? let alone that he would still have to get into the room and make contact with her without waking her up) -- and then somehow when she was unconscious making her ingest a drug that was already in the house, that he probably spotted earlier while snooping through their house (though he was never caught in the house). Or he may have injected her with the drug somewhere that is not obvious, like under her fingernails. He did this all silently, sneaking past cameras and in and out of the house, undetected.

- She claims to have video evidence, but the way she said it made me think that maybe LE didn't see anything on the video, but after getting a copy and watching it a bunch of times, she and Steve did. The other photo raised more questions than answers for me... and I wonder, if it was clear, why didn't she bring it right to LE, and why didn't they take it seriously.

On the other hand, the brief tidbits of new information, about the boyfriend for example and her behavior the day she died, make me wonder if Morgan was upset or had something else going on that may have been entirely unrelated to the stalking.

 

[Herding Cats]

FWIW, I was prescribed Ativan for a week years ago after my husband passed away, and it had some strange side effects. I had MAJOR memory problems, and went running back to the doctor, and he told me it was the medication. It may be a rare side effect, I don't know, but I think I read about a date rape drug somewhere.....???? Or maybe not. Was something like that mentioned?

I used Ativan fairly liberally in the weeks after my father passed. I didn't have strange effects, and was so stressed that while I was prescribed 0.5 mg per dose, I took 4 pills the day of his funeral, and still was able to give the eulogy to a huge audience.

There *are* strange, rare side effects, and they can be horrific. Now, if I take 1 0.5mg pill, I will sleep like a baby for 10-12 hours. So it works differently for different people, and also differently at different times for the same person. It's a strange drug.

And yes, it's a commonly used "date rape" drug...

Best-
Herding Cats

 

[Cazzie]

Another telling thing...the cell phone was out of Morgan's custody left at a friend's house overnight...so there is a window of opportunity for it to have fallen into the wrong hands and was cloned.

Dang! Really?

Which nite? And where did she leave it? And who was there?

 

[Anna1964]

I used Ativan fairly liberally in the weeks after my father passed. I didn't have strange effects, and was so stressed that while I was prescribed 0.5 mg per dose, I took 4 pills the day of his funeral, and still was able to give the eulogy to a huge audience.

There *are* strange, rare side effects, and they can be horrific. Now, if I take 1 0.5mg pill, I will sleep like a baby for 10-12 hours. So it works differently for different people, and also differently at different times for the same person. It's a strange drug.

And yes, it's a commonly used "date rape" drug...

Best-
Herding Cats

It really affected me badly. It is almost funny now, but I had my son take me in to the doctor while I explained to him mommy may have to go away for a little while. I thought I was losing my mind. Had already called GM to watch him. LOL. I had hours just gone. Just Blank.

 

[annemc2]

Clonazepam is Klonopin (a benzodiazepine) - used mainly for anxiety and seizures
Lorazepam is Ativan (a benzodiazepine) - used mainly for anxiety
Diazepam is Valium (a benzodiazepine) - used for anxiety and sleep
Flurazpam is Dalmane - used for sleep
Amitriptyline - used for depression, migrines and some kinds of pain
Cyclobenzaprine is Flexeril - mainly used for muscle pain (muscle relaxer)

I'm not sure exactly which were mentioned by Toni, but I tried to include all that were mentioned here. If I missed something, let me know.

It would be nice to know if any of the most likely suspects was ever treated for anxiety, seizures and a muscle sprain/strain.

Have any of you guys ever, ever seen flurazepam used in clinical practice in the past 20 years? I know I haven't. Dr Google didn't do a good job of telling me if it's commonly used in vet med (a cursory search said no, though).

If someone around there has some Dalmane I would think they would have gotten it from a very very old school doc and it would be easy to trace. JMO.

 

[hambirg]

Lorazepam comes in a concentrated liquid oral form. You are suppose to use a special dropper and mix it with juice.

It does have an amnesiac effect and is a benzodiazepine. . .same as Rohypnol.

 

[MayraMM]

Have any of you guys ever, ever seen flurazepam used in clinical practice in the past 20 years? I know I haven't. Dr Google didn't do a good job of telling me if it's commonly used in vet med (a cursory search said no, though).

If someone around there has some Dalmane I would think they would have gotten it from a very very old school doc and it would be easy to trace. JMO.

I run into it every now and then, but not that often. Ambien or Sonata are far more common. I don't even see Lunesta that much anymore, and that's a relatively new drug.

 

[hambirg]

It really affected me badly. It is almost funny now, but I had my son take me in to the doctor while I explained to him mommy may have to go away for a little while. I thought I was losing my mind. Had already called GM to watch him. LOL. I had hours just gone. Just Blank.

I was given lorazepam after my Dad died. I was a zombie. . .seriously! I probably couldn't remember my name if asked. That whole week of the funeral was a complete blur. Btw. . .my Mom had to take them away from me. I guess I liked being a zombie. :blushing:

 

[Confusion]

Have any of you guys ever, ever seen flurazepam used in clinical practice in the past 20 years? I know I haven't. Dr Google didn't do a good job of telling me if it's commonly used in vet med (a cursory search said no, though).

If someone around there has some Dalmane I would think they would have gotten it from a very very old school doc and it would be easy to trace. JMO.

BBM
Not that I can remember. I tried Lunesta for a while, but it didn't work for me. I've used Ambien for quite a while now, and it's much better. The problem with most of those older sleep meds is that they caused you to be tired most of the day too. The problem with all of them is that they only work if you use them, so I'm still posting at 6 am a lof of times. :waitasec:

 

[Cazzie]

I'll be honest. After listening to the radio show, I am less convinced about the evidence. I have a lot of sympathy for the Ingrams, and I think it's possible that there was some stalking or other problems... but T's theories seem to go a little far.


- She was stalked by an acquaintance, who belongs to a sketchy crowd. But he may also be a serial stalker?

- The stalker had a complex, and totally silent way of sneaking in and murdering Morgan - holding a date rape drug over her mouth while she slept (can this even happen? let alone that he would still have to get into the room and make contact with her without waking her up) -- and then somehow when she was unconscious making her ingest a drug that was already in the house, that he probably spotted earlier while snooping through their house (though he was never caught in the house). Or he may have injected her with the drug somewhere that is not obvious, like under her fingernails. He did this all silently, sneaking past cameras and in and out of the house, undetected.

- She claims to have video evidence, but the way she said it made me think that maybe LE didn't see anything on the video, but after getting a copy and watching it a bunch of times, she and Steve did. The other photo raised more questions than answers for me... and I wonder, if it was clear, why didn't she bring it right to LE, and why didn't they take it seriously.

On the other hand, the brief tidbits of new information, about the boyfriend for example and her behavior the day she died, make me wonder if Morgan was upset or had something else going on that may have been entirely unrelated to the stalking.

I had no clue that the person in the photo discussed (a while back) was M's b/f-ex b/f. I kinda wondered, but photos of friends can be misinterpreted. Nonetheless. it mite just be nothing more than a "fact".

I'm confused about whether we can discuss things said on the broadcast. ARGH!!!