Coronavirus COVID-19 - Global Health Pandemic #112

[Auntie Cipation]

The N95 etc are apparently effective to some degree. The cloth masks were not. Am i wrong?

I'm not who you addressed your question to, but I'll offer my understanding anyway.

Cloth masks work to an extent against droplets, as one would expect. If someone standing near you sneezed, and you were wearing a cloth mask, you would certainly appreciate any degree to which the cloth took the hit rather than your face. Same with surgical masks, though they are better since they are a tighter weave, so would catch more than regular cloth would.

N95s would catch all droplets, plus, on average, 95% of airborne virus molecules (hence the 95 in the name).

But to your point, I don't recall Fauci ever discouraging folks from wearing cloth masks -- am I misremembering?

What I recall is that during the n95 shortage was when the campaigns appeared with fabric patterns, for folks to make their own cloth masks.

Only later did it become apparent how much better the n95s were, because covid is airborne, not always in droplets. I mean, the opening in the weave of cloth is much larger than the covid molecule, so lots of them could go right through the mask.

But they weren't zero usefulness -- some percentage of the virus would still be caught up by a cloth mask, just by luck or because some molecules took the form of droplets big enough to be caught by the fabric. If that's all that was available, they were definitely worth wearing, as opposed to bare face. But not 95% effective like the n95s.

Again MOO

 

[Gemmie]

I wanted to tell you guys my recent vaccine experience and get your opinions.

Backstory: So, I went for a Covid and flu vaccines last week. Never have I gotten multiple vaccines at the same time, always just one at a time. I fully expected to either feel my normal lack of energy, or worse, more so due to getting 2 vaccines at once. Every Covid vaccine I've ever had, and I've had a lot, I was run-down and felt punky the day after. Due to this I always plan for a down day.

Experience: While I can't be sure which the first vaccine administered was, I'm guessing it was the Covid vaccine for reasons I'll explain in a moment. So, the sound of the injection was like there was air in the syringe. Like a bubbly pffffft noise. Never, ever have I heard a vaccine make a noise before that I've noticed.

The next day I felt 100% normal. I wasn't moving in slo-mo as per usual, and I had a energy and was doing housework, etc., which I would have NEVER been able to do after all previous Covid vaccines. Due to the pfffft noise, and no punkiness the day after, I can't help but wonder if I wasn't given a full dose. Hence not feeling the normal next day slowness.

Question: What do you guys think about that? Has anyone that has gotten a recent Covid vaccine, that used to always feel run down the next day, end up feeling 100% normal energy this last time? I'm wondering if perhaps my body is now used to them so no more run down feeling. I'll know for sure come September when I get my next one.

Whining about it: Due to this I'm worried that I won't be protected for the next 6 months which is a tad concerning. But there's nothing I can do. I won't and can't ask for another one because of my suspicions. I went 5 days early this time and they turned me away because it was too soon, so no way are they going to give me another vaccine a week later. I wish they had been a little open about being early by less than a week. I wouldn't have gotten a vaccine that went pffffft.

 

[gremlin444]

Even though I rarely see anyone wearing masks anymore (unless I look in the mirror) it's extremely rare to see someone wearing them properly. Gaps galore. It's been this way since the beginning. People were wearing them, but not properly. I used to "mask watch" (like people watching) and back when everyone was required to wear them, literally only 1% wore them properly. And N95s were rare as well.

Then there were those that wore them like chin adornments. Yeah, that's helpful. Not. Then one woman had a handmade CROCHETED mask on with holes as big as peas. I just shook my head to myself and steered clear.

I am not looking forward to our next pandemic now that I know how the human race handled the last one. Horribly IMO.

I was just at a Chicagoland Costco...it's 75 degrees and warm today, but there were still at least 6 other people that I saw in the third of the store that I was in who were masking. Which is nice to see. Every time I go there, all the sample servers are wearing full on n95s, which both surprises and delights me that they are protecting themselves.

I'd saw Dec-Feb of this year I saw an increase in mask wearing in my area, especially as school absences soared with flu and Covid.

Many area schools are on spring break now, so we'll get the same surge here in all respiratory illnesses in a week after the increased travel that we've seen before. Hopefully measles doesn't come back with anyone, especially anyone coming home to O'Hare airport....the exposure possibility #s there are terrible to think about.

I understand some people worry about being looked at/comments if they mask in public. My family and I don't care. I'm 52, could care less what others think, and thanks to long Covid now have two new autoimmune disorders. My medical bills already suck enough, my pain levels restrict my livelihood and enjoyment of life (hard to be a sign language interpreter when you can't reliably bend your fingers), and no amount of snarky comments or stares are bad enough to justify me risking losing whatever small recovery/gains I have gotten. My 17 yo feels the same way because long Covid has ruined his high school experience, caused him to have to drop his life long dream of studying aerospace engineering due to his limitations, and continues to jeopardize his ability to graduate in a few months. And yeah, we're bitter about it.

Sorry for the rant! Trying to get this kid across the finish line so he can move on to his next stage of life and hopefully succeed in his alternate course of study (meteorology....great timing for that, sigh), and it makes me so frustrated.

 

[Gemmie]

I'm not who you addressed your question to, but I'll offer my understanding anyway.

Cloth masks work to an extent against droplets, as one would expect. If someone standing near you sneezed, and you were wearing a cloth mask, you would certainly appreciate any degree to which the cloth took the hit rather than your face. Same with surgical masks, though they are better since they are a tighter weave, so would catch more than regular cloth would.

N95s would catch all droplets, plus, on average, 95% of airborne virus molecules (hence the 95 in the name).

But to your point, I don't recall Fauci ever discouraging folks from wearing cloth masks -- am I misremembering?

What I recall is that during the n95 shortage was when the campaigns appeared with fabric patterns, for folks to make their own cloth masks.

Only later did it become apparent how much better the n95s were, because covid is airborne, not always in droplets. I mean, the opening in the weave of cloth is much larger than the covid molecule, so lots of them could go right through the mask.

But they weren't zero usefulness -- some percentage of the virus would still be caught up by a cloth mask, just by luck or because some molecules took the form of droplets big enough to be caught by the fabric. If that's all that was available, they were definitely worth wearing, as opposed to bare face. But not 95% effective like the n95s.

Again MOO

A lot of those cloth masks had a slit in them so you could put a coffee filter inside to (hopefully) help more than just the cloth mask. We've come a long way from homesewn masks, thank goodness.

SOURCE

 

[Mo Thuairim]

I wanted to tell you guys my recent vaccine experience and get your opinions.

Backstory: So, I went for a Covid and flu vaccines last week. Never have I gotten multiple vaccines at the same time, always just one at a time. Every Covid vaccine I've ever had, and I've had a lot, I was run-down and felt punky the day after. Due to this I always plan for a down day.

Experience: While I can't be sure which the first vaccine administered was, I'm guessing it was the Covid vaccine for reasons I'll explain in a moment. So, the sound of the injection was like there was air in the syringe. Like a bubbly pffffft noise. Never, ever have I heard a vaccine make a noise before that I've noticed.

The next day I felt 100% normal. I wasn't moving in slo-mo as per usual, and I had a energy and was doing housework, etc., which I would have NEVER been able to do after all previous Covid vaccines. Due to the pfffft noise, and no punkiness the day after, I can't help but wonder if I wasn't given a full dose. Hence not feeling the normal next day slowness.

Question: What do you guys think about that? Has anyone that has gotten a recent Covid vaccine, that used to always feel run down the next day, end up feeling 100% normal energy this last time? I'm wondering if perhaps my body is now used to them so no more run down feeling. I'll know for sure come September when I get my next one.

Whining about it: Due to this I'm worried that I won't be protected for the next 6 months which is a tad concerning. But there's nothing I can do. I won't and can't ask for another one because of my suspicions. I went 5 days early this time and they turned me away because it was too soon, so no way are they going to give me another vaccine a week later. I wish they had been a little open about being early by less than a week. I wouldn't have gotten a vaccine that went pffffft.

I don't know about the pffft noise but the last two winters I have had my Covid and flu vaccines at the same time and felt totally fine afterwards except for sore arms. I definitely had fatigue and a slight fluey feeling after my first two or three Covid vaccines way back when, but after the subsequent ones whether alone or with the flu shot I felt normal.

 

[Gemmie]

I don't know about the pffft noise but the last two winters I have had my Covid and flu vaccines at the same time and felt totally fine afterwards except for sore arms. I definitely had fatigue and a slight fluey feeling after my first two or three Covid vaccines way back when, but after the subsequent ones whether alone or with the flu shot I felt normal.

Good to know, thanks. I'll let you guys know how I feel the day after I get my covid and flu vaccines in September. Back to being punky for a day, or feel my normal energy?

 

[Gemmie]

I was just at a Chicagoland Costco...it's 75 degrees and warm today, but there were still at least 6 other people that I saw in the third of the store that I was in who were masking. Which is nice to see. Every time I go there, all the sample servers are wearing full on n95s, which both surprises and delights me that they are protecting themselves.

I'd saw Dec-Feb of this year I saw an increase in mask wearing in my area, especially as school absences soared with flu and Covid.

Many area schools are on spring break now, so we'll get the same surge here in all respiratory illnesses in a week after the increased travel that we've seen before. Hopefully measles doesn't come back with anyone, especially anyone coming home to O'Hare airport....the exposure possibility #s there are terrible to think about.

I understand some people worry about being looked at/comments if they mask in public. My family and I don't care. I'm 52, could care less what others think, and thanks to long Covid now have two new autoimmune disorders. My medical bills already suck enough, my pain levels restrict my livelihood and enjoyment of life (hard to be a sign language interpreter when you can't reliably bend your fingers), and no amount of snarky comments or stares are bad enough to justify me risking losing whatever small recovery/gains I have gotten. My 17 yo feels the same way because long Covid has ruined his high school experience, caused him to have to drop his life long dream of studying aerospace engineering due to his limitations, and continues to jeopardize his ability to graduate in a few months. And yeah, we're bitter about it.

Sorry for the rant! Trying to get this kid across the finish line so he can move on to his next stage of life and hopefully succeed in his alternate course of study (meteorology....great timing for that, sigh), and it makes me so frustrated.

No need to apologize for the rant. I am soooo sorry to hear of your troubles. It's heartbreaking and I don't even know you.

I hope you and your kid can somehow get better and move on from long Covid. I wish you both the best.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

I wanted to tell you guys my recent vaccine experience and get your opinions.

Backstory: So, I went for a Covid and flu vaccines last week. Never have I gotten multiple vaccines at the same time, always just one at a time. I fully expected to either feel my normal lack of energy, or worse, more so due to getting 2 vaccines at once. Every Covid vaccine I've ever had, and I've had a lot, I was run-down and felt punky the day after. Due to this I always plan for a down day.

Experience: While I can't be sure which the first vaccine administered was, I'm guessing it was the Covid vaccine for reasons I'll explain in a moment. So, the sound of the injection was like there was air in the syringe. Like a bubbly pffffft noise. Never, ever have I heard a vaccine make a noise before that I've noticed.

The next day I felt 100% normal. I wasn't moving in slo-mo as per usual, and I had a energy and was doing housework, etc., which I would have NEVER been able to do after all previous Covid vaccines. Due to the pfffft noise, and no punkiness the day after, I can't help but wonder if I wasn't given a full dose. Hence not feeling the normal next day slowness.

Question: What do you guys think about that? Has anyone that has gotten a recent Covid vaccine, that used to always feel run down the next day, end up feeling 100% normal energy this last time? I'm wondering if perhaps my body is now used to them so no more run down feeling. I'll know for sure come September when I get my next one.

Whining about it: Due to this I'm worried that I won't be protected for the next 6 months which is a tad concerning. But there's nothing I can do. I won't and can't ask for another one because of my suspicions. I went 5 days early this time and they turned me away because it was too soon, so no way are they going to give me another vaccine a week later. I wish they had been a little open about being early by less than a week. I wouldn't have gotten a vaccine that went pffffft.

I noticed a large difference in my after-reaction when I switched from Moderna (expected post-shot punky feeling and low fever plus sore arm) to Pfizer (no punky feeling, no fever, one time sore arm only, one time ZERO noticeable effects). Could it be that you got a different brand this time?

Also, you might contact a public health nurse to ask about the bubbly sound and whether that might indicate a less than full dose. Maybe they can reassure you it doesn't.

I can't remember where you are located but in my corner of California the shots are now only offered to the general public at a commercial drugstore, and last time they didn't even make a notation on my card with date, lot number, etc. So if I wanted to, I could theoretically go a month later to a different drugstore and ask for a covid vax -- they don't seem to be tracking it at all anymore. YMMV of course, but something to think about. Maybe the public health nurse could also advise whether there is any risk to getting two shots close together -- I wouldn't think it to be a problem based on my experience.

 

[Mo Thuairim]

I noticed a large difference in my after-reaction when I switched from Moderna (expected post-shot punky feeling and low fever plus sore arm) to Pfizer (no punky feeling, no fever, one time sore arm only, one time ZERO noticeable effects). Could it be that you got a different brand this time?

Also, you might contact a public health nurse to ask about the bubbly sound and whether that might indicate a less than full dose. Maybe they can reassure you.

I can't remember where you are located but in my corner of California the shots are now only offered to the general public at a commercial drugstore, and last time they didn't even make a notation on my card with date, lot number, etc. So if I wanted to, I could theoretically go a month later to a different drugstore and ask for a covid vax -- they don't seem to be tracking it at all anymore. YMMV of course, but something to think about. Maybe the public health nurse could also advise whether there is any risk to getting two shots close together -- I wouldn't think it to be a problem based on my experience.

All (7?) of mine have been Pfizer. I remember being really exhausted after the first few but I discovered I didn't really need my planned down day after the later ones. I wonder why we get a sore arm sometimes and sometimes not. Both my arms ached for quite a while after my last flu-Covid combo but the other time I only had one sore arm, and with some Covid shots I had no arm pain at all!

 

[Teche]

I wanted to tell you guys my recent vaccine experience and get your opinions.

Backstory: So, I went for a Covid and flu vaccines last week. Never have I gotten multiple vaccines at the same time, always just one at a time. I fully expected to either feel my normal lack of energy, or worse, more so due to getting 2 vaccines at once. Every Covid vaccine I've ever had, and I've had a lot, I was run-down and felt punky the day after. Due to this I always plan for a down day.

Experience: While I can't be sure which the first vaccine administered was, I'm guessing it was the Covid vaccine for reasons I'll explain in a moment. So, the sound of the injection was like there was air in the syringe. Like a bubbly pffffft noise. Never, ever have I heard a vaccine make a noise before that I've noticed.

The next day I felt 100% normal. I wasn't moving in slo-mo as per usual, and I had a energy and was doing housework, etc., which I would have NEVER been able to do after all previous Covid vaccines. Due to the pfffft noise, and no punkiness the day after, I can't help but wonder if I wasn't given a full dose. Hence not feeling the normal next day slowness.

Question: What do you guys think about that? Has anyone that has gotten a recent Covid vaccine, that used to always feel run down the next day, end up feeling 100% normal energy this last time? I'm wondering if perhaps my body is now used to them so no more run down feeling. I'll know for sure come September when I get my next one.

Whining about it: Due to this I'm worried that I won't be protected for the next 6 months which is a tad concerning. But there's nothing I can do. I won't and can't ask for another one because of my suspicions. I went 5 days early this time and they turned me away because it was too soon, so no way are they going to give me another vaccine a week later. I wish they had been a little open about being early by less than a week. I wouldn't have gotten a vaccine that went pffffft.

I've received every available COVID-19 vaccine as prescribed. I also get a flu vaccine yearly. This fall, I received both the flu and Covid-19 at the same appointment. I do sometimes have soreness at the injection site. So far, I've only had the Moderma Covid-19.

 

[Gemmie]

All (7?) of mine have been Pfizer. I remember being really exhausted after the first few but I discovered I didn't really need my planned down day after the later ones. I wonder why we get a sore arm sometimes and sometimes not. Both my arms ached for quite a while after my last flu-Covid combo but the other time I only had one sore arm, and with some Covid shots I had no arm pain at all!

Good info which I forgot in my post! I should have included that it was Moderna, which I've had before, as well as Pfizer.

 

[gremlin444]

I can't remember where you are located but in my corner of California the shots are now only offered to the general public at a commercial drugstore, and last time they didn't even make a notation on my card with date, lot number, etc. So if I wanted to, I could theoretically go a month later to a different drugstore and ask for a covid vax -- they don't seem to be tracking it at all anymore. YMMV of course, but something to think about. Maybe the public health nurse could also advise whether there is any risk to getting two shots close together -- I wouldn't think it to be a problem based on my experience.

I'm in Illinois, and I've gotten my last few Covid boosters through CVS (2 different locations).

They aren't updating my card, but on my CVS account I can see a full detailed accounting of both of those vaccines from 2024--including date, brand, lot#, volume, and which arm. I imagine Walgreens does the same. Now whether or not the system automatically throws up a red flag if you try to schedule or get another one too soon, I don't know.

And CVS definitely reports those vaccines to the IL state vaccine database automatically. I just went and checked my account on the database and seem them listed there as well.

So, I think there is more behind the scenes tracking going on than the public is aware of in many cases.

FWIW, after all Moderna shots for the whole time, my last one was Pfizer...and instead of being in bed for 48 hours I was mostly fine.

 

[Gemmie]

I noticed a large difference in my after-reaction when I switched from Moderna (expected post-shot punky feeling and low fever plus sore arm) to Pfizer (no punky feeling, no fever, one time sore arm only, one time ZERO noticeable effects). Could it be that you got a different brand this time?

Thanks for asking that as I stupidly left out that pertinent info! It was Moderna which I've had several times now. I've also had Pfizer in the past.

VERY interesting about zero noticeable effects one time. Maybe this was my "one time". lol

Also, you might contact a public health nurse to ask about the bubbly sound and whether that might indicate a less than full dose. Maybe they can reassure you it doesn't.

GREAT IDEA! I never considered that. I'll do that next week and see what they say.

I can't remember where you are located but in my corner of California the shots are now only offered to the general public at a commercial drugstore, and last time they didn't even make a notation on my card with date, lot number, etc. So if I wanted to, I could theoretically go a month later to a different drugstore and ask for a covid vax -- they don't seem to be tracking it at all anymore. YMMV of course, but something to think about. Maybe the public health nurse could also advise whether there is any risk to getting two shots close together -- I wouldn't think it to be a problem based on my experience.

Also very interesting. I went to a commercial drugstore (RiteAid) and they have all my info in their computer. That's why they turned me down the week before because I was there 5 days before the 6 month anniversary of my last Covid vaccine. But, what I don't know is is that JUST RiteAid data. And they stopped updating our cards over a year ago ("we don't do that anymore") and that "we" was several different places. 3 to be exact. No more filling out the cards but they do have my data in their computer. I THINK they are hooked up to all of my medical records since they also appear to know what I might need. Keep in mind I've only been there twice for Covid vaccines, and several different places before those 2 times. But it appears they know what I need. Same with my mother. They said "We don't see that you've gotten a XYZ vaccine. Would you like to add that today?"

 

[Gemmie]

I'm in Illinois, and I've gotten my last few Covid boosters through CVS (2 different locations).

They aren't updating my card, but on my CVS account I can see a full detailed accounting of both of those vaccines from 2024--including date, brand, lot#, volume, and which arm. I imagine Walgreens does the same. Now whether or not the system automatically throws up a red flag if you try to schedule or get another one too soon, I don't know.

RiteAid threw up a red flag when I tried to get vaccinated 5 days before my 6 month anniversary. I can't speak to other national pharmacies.

And CVS definitely reports those vaccines to the IL state vaccine database automatically. I just went and checked my account on the database and seem them listed there as well.

Good to know. The paperwork I had to fill out asked if I was OK with them letting my medical provider know about the vaccines I was getting that day.

 

[anneg]

All (7?) of mine have been Pfizer. I remember being really exhausted after the first few but I discovered I didn't really need my planned down day after the later ones. I wonder why we get a sore arm sometimes and sometimes not. Both my arms ached for quite a while after my last flu-Covid combo but the other time I only had one sore arm, and with some Covid shots I had no arm pain at all!

I think all but one of my Covid vaccines have been Pfizer, and the other was Moderna. I've had a sore arm every time but not much else in the way of side effects.

 

[Auntie Cipation]

I'm in Illinois, and I've gotten my last few Covid boosters through CVS (2 different locations).

They aren't updating my card, but on my CVS account I can see a full detailed accounting of both of those vaccines from 2024--including date, brand, lot#, volume, and which arm. I imagine Walgreens does the same. Now whether or not the system automatically throws up a red flag if you try to schedule or get another one too soon, I don't know.

And CVS definitely reports those vaccines to the IL state vaccine database automatically. I just went and checked my account on the database and seem them listed there as well.

So, I think there is more behind the scenes tracking going on than the public is aware of in many cases.

FWIW, after all Moderna shots for the whole time, my last one was Pfizer...and instead of being in bed for 48 hours I was mostly fine.

This is interesting. I've gotten my last several covid vaxxes at Rite Aid, ever since our County Public Health stopped providing them. I know I always have to fill out the form asking if I'm ill that day or have had any other vaccines in the past four weeks.

But I have no idea if it goes into my account or not. I don't even know if I *HAVE* a Rite Aid account! I guess I do, but I don't know how to access it from home.

But I've just remembered something else. Last year sometime, I came across a statewide vax database and looked myself up. Most of my vaxes seemed to be there, but not necessarily all of them. I'll see if I can find it again and post the link here.

EDIT: Here is the page for California's vaccine database. I'd assume most states have this. Digital Vaccine Record

 

[Auntie Cipation]

I just looked up my account on that state database I linked in my previous post, and Rite Aid DID record all my covid shots, including the one last fall when he wouldn't even put it on my covid card. And the two shingles shots I got there in 2020.

Also listed were my annual flu shots which are provided by my County Public Health Dept.

However, shots I have gotten at my local medical clinic (TDAP, primarily, every several years) are not on there. I'll have to ask if they can add it. I'd also love to be able to manually add my childhood vaccines to my digital record, if I can find a way to do that.

Since my last covid vax was in mid October, I'll go back to Rite Aid sometime soon for my next one.

 

[Gemmie]

I just looked up my account on that state database I linked in my previous post, and Rite Aid DID record all my covid shots, including the one last fall when he wouldn't even put it on my covid card. And the two shingles shots I got there in 2020.

Also listed were my annual flu shots which are provided by my County Public Health Dept.

Way cool!

However, shots I have gotten at my local medical clinic (TDAP, primarily, every several years) are not on there. I'll have to ask if they can add it. I'd also love to be able to manually add my childhood vaccines to my digital record, if I can find a way to do that.

Since my last covid vax was in mid October, I'll go back to Rite Aid sometime soon for my next one.

I wouldn't make an appt before your 6 mo anniversary. That's who turned me away for being 5 days early. Now, if only their online scheduler would know that and not let me make an appt too early! It was a waste of time going down there for nothing.

 

[Teche]

Thanks for asking that as I stupidly left out that pertinent info! It was Moderna which I've had several times now. I've also had Pfizer in the past.

VERY interesting about zero noticeable effects one time. Maybe this was my "one time". lol

GREAT IDEA! I never considered that. I'll do that next week and see what they say.

Also very interesting. I went to a commercial drugstore (RiteAid) and they have all my info in their computer. That's why they turned me down the week before because I was there 5 days before the 6 month anniversary of my last Covid vaccine. But, what I don't know is is that JUST RiteAid data. And they stopped updating our cards over a year ago ("we don't do that anymore") and that "we" was several different places. 3 to be exact. No more filling out the cards but they do have my data in their computer. I THINK they are hooked up to all of my medical records since they also appear to know what I might need. Keep in mind I've only been there twice for Covid vaccines, and several different places before those 2 times. But it appears they know what I need. Same with my mother. They said "We don't see that you've gotten a XYZ vaccine. Would you like to add that today?"

Our state has a registry that all drugstores input the vaccine data and write the data on a personal for my record-keeping. The state registry can be uploaded to a wallet app on one’s phone. Unfortunately, I have tried to add it to the wallet app.

 

[Gemmie]

Ugh.

A top vaccine official at the US Food and Drug Administration (FDA) was forced out of his job, US media reports.

Peter Marks offered his letter of resignation to Health and Human Services (HHS) officials on Friday after he was given a choice between resigning or being fired.

"It has become clear that truth and transparency are not desired by the Secretary, but rather he wishes subservient confirmation of his misinformation and lies," Mr Marks wrote in a resignation letter, obtained by multiple US media outlets, referring to the agency's new leader Robert F Kennedy Jr.

Mr Marks was among the healthcare professionals who helped develop Covid-19 vaccines in the first Trump administration.

Peter Marks, top US vaccine official, forced to resign

In his resignation letter, Peter Marks said his new boss, Robert F Kennedy Jr, favoured "misinformation and lies".

www.bbc.com