DCA - American Airlines passenger plane collides with Blackhawk over the Potomac River, all 67 on both dead, 29 Jan 2025

[BeginnerSleuther]

Honestly, how I'd take it:
I don't care about her gender, ethnicity, religion, self-identification or disabilities.

I would like to know how she performed in aviation school. Mid-range to top, I'd have no questions. Training accident. Bottom 2%, I'd ask why was she even a pilot at Fort Belvoire?

There's a saying in med school. What do you call the person who graduates last in the class? Doctor.

I suspect it's the same in all industries, including aviation. Someone has to be last (or bottom 2%). It doesn't mean they haven't reached the qualification standard set by whatever governing board.

MOO.

 

[cledco]

good point but they would all or most be strapped in..from what has been reported about sst challenger...they survived when they hit the water etc...there could have been 1 just 1 ...please dont take this as disagreement its more i try hard to justify one action when another of a similar way have different outcomes...

Challenger's crew survived the initial explosion but not impact with the water.

 

[sds71]

The bodies of all three service members have now been recovered from the Blackhawk helicopter, a source familiar with Potomac River recovery efforts tells me.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1885507148408406525

 

[sds71]

Army helicopter was alerted to plane’s presence 2 minutes before collision

www.stripes.com

 

[Boxer]

other two airmen were men....is she solely responsible?

No. Actually the instructor pilot was pivotal.

 

[Boxer]

other two airmen were men....is she solely responsible?

Crew of 3
2 officers and 1 enlisted

There was a crew chief, an enlisted position in the back, a seargent O''Hara.

There was the pilot was the female officer 500 hour pilot.

There was co-pilot WO2 Eaves the 1500 hour instructor pilot.

Crew chief of Black Hawk helicopter involved in fatal crash is remembered fondly

The crew chief on the UH-60 Black Hawk helicopter involved in the crash has been identified as Ryan O’Hara by Parkview High School in Lilburn, Georgia.

www.wlbt.com

 

[Betty P]

Honestly, how I'd take it:
I don't care about her gender, ethnicity, religion, self-identification or disabilities.

I would like to know how she performed in aviation school. Mid-range to top, I'd have no questions. Training accident. Bottom 2%, I'd ask why was she even a pilot at Fort Belvoire?

I haven't followed this story for a few hours. Was there some report in the news indicating experts believe this third member of the helicopter crew is to blame for the accident? I haven't read anything anywhere to indicate anyone knows which of the 3 crew members was responsible for any errors. TIA

 

[iamshadow21]

I haven't followed this story for a few hours. Was there some report in the news indicating experts believe this third member of the helicopter crew is to blame for the accident? I haven't read anything anywhere to indicate anyone knows which of the 3 crew members was responsible for any errors. TIA

There is absolutely nothing credible.

<modsnip - off topic>

MOO

 

[Charlot123]

I haven't followed this story for a few hours. Was there some report in the news indicating experts believe this third member of the helicopter crew is to blame for the accident? I haven't read anything anywhere to indicate anyone knows which of the 3 crew members was responsible for any errors. TIA

No. But since there were scattered reports about the pilot (trainee), and the military is not releasing the person’s name, and why it might be happening, yada, yada… I just said that IMO, anyone, if you think, might be the subject of speculations/accusations/idle assumptions. The only way to answer, IMHO, is to look at the person’s performance in aviation school. Otherwise we’ll find the reasons to accuse till the cows come home.

 

[SouthAussie]

This article gives details on many of the victims (for those who can read it). Details provided by their families.

Just a bit on some of them, I wish I could paraphrase them all but it might infringe copyright.

Sadly, one of the victims - Liz Keys, 33, an attorney - died on her birthday.
A couple - Lori and Bob Schrock, 56 & 58 - were on their way to visit their daughter at Villanova University.
Quite a few of the deceased have young children.
One of the helicopter crew - crew chief Ryan O'Hara, 28 - has a wife and 1-year old son
Sam Lilley, pilot, 28, was engaged to be married this fall
Kiah Duggins, 30, was returning home after spending time with her mum for her mum's surgical procedure

https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/interactive/2025/dca-plane-crash-victims-list-profiles/

 

[Warwick1991]

There is absolutely nothing credible.

<modsnip - off topic>

MOO

It's awful to see this. Apparently, there are many who are jumping to conclusions without considering that a detailed investigation needs to be done by the NTSB.

There are many potential explanations for the collision. There is the possibility of instrument failure on the helicopter. There have been many Blackhawk crashes, with most blamed on pilot error. Some are not pilot error...

As far as the pilots themselves, there are many possibilities - fatigue, disorientation, a distraction, substance abuse or even suicide. With a crew of 3, someone in the helicopter should have been aware of the altitude and the increasingly dangerous flight path, but instruments that weren't giving accurate readings could be an explanation.

IMO it is important to find out the reasons for the crash, and approach the investigation with thoroughness and intellectual honesty.

 

[Seattle1]

Army helicopter was alerted to plane’s presence 2 minutes before collision

www.stripes.com

One more source (US Army) confirming the same that 2 minutes before the collision, ATC alerted the helicopter about the approaching plane, and the pilot responded they see it, and were taking responsibility....

Immediately after the alert, the air traffic controller asked the helicopter:

“PAT25 do you have the CRJ in sight? PAT25, pass behind the CRJ.”

“Aircraft in sight, request visual separation,” the helicopter crew member responded seconds later, confirming for a second time that they were aware of a plane ahead.

No further communications between the controllers and the helicopter are audible after this exchange. Makes me so sad.

 

[Charlot123]

.

There's a saying in med school. What do you call the person who graduates last in the class? Doctor.

I suspect it's the same in all industries, including aviation. Someone has to be last (or bottom 2%). It doesn't mean they haven't reached the qualification standard set by whatever governing board.

MOO.

True; and we all might remember a person who, in his time, graduated fifth from the bottom in naval academy and yet both his future service and his distinguished life indicated nothing but smarts, loyalty, and honesty.
However, in a situation like this, were he a helicopter pilot, he’d be in the majority and not needing protection. For anyone who might now find oneself in a vulnerable position, performance is the best protection. JMO.

 

[theonewithallthequestions]

So the helicopter pilot is female.

No wonder her family doesn't want her name released until they have time to prepare as well as they can for the onslaught of hate that will be directed at her as a so-called DEI hire.

Edited to add source: https://www.npr.org/2025/01/30/nx-s1-5281246/pentagon-jet-military-helicopter-collision

If the unnamed pilot is in fact female, then sadly yes, I suspect this is the fear of the family

As the father of Ryan O’Hara said (and it’s heartbreaking that in his own time of tragedy he felt compelled to speak out against the toxic vitriol…MOO of course):

"If the other pilot was a woman, I can't imagine...Saying that 'if she was a woman she was less capable than the man.' I can't imagine the horror those parents must be going through," he said. "I don't know who the other pilot was. But I know Ryan respected the people he flew with and trusted them with his life."

Father of helicopter crew chief in D.C. crash reacts to Trump's blame of DEI

Reaction to President Trump's comments about DEI and the Washington, D.C., plane crash is coming from Gary O'Hara, the father of Ryan O'Hara who was crew chief on the Black Hawk helicopter that collided with an American Airlines plane Wednesday. Timothy Lilley is also speaking out about his son...

www.cbsnews.com

Father of Black Hawk Pilot Killed in DC Plane Crash Slams Trump's DEI Excuse: 'You Don't Get to Do Something in the Army Unless You're Qualified'

The father of Black Hawk crew chief Ryan O'Hara, killed in a tragic collision with a jet, has rejected claims that DEI policies played a role in the crash.

www.latintimes.com

 

[ChatteringBirds]

Great compassion is needed for the family of the female pilot, if she's going to be getting a lot of the "blame."

If they were exceeding the maximum altitude or other errors, you have to wonder why none of the three on the helicopter realized it. If -- then it wasn't just her error(s), right?

 

[iamshadow21]

Great compassion is needed for the family of the female pilot, if she's going to be getting a lot of the "blame."

If they were exceeding the maximum altitude or other errors, you have to wonder why none of the three on the helicopter realized it. If -- then it wasn't just her error(s), right?

If it's human error on the part of the helicopter crew, it's on all of them. They're all playing a role in keeping the aircraft flying safely.

For example, I'm pretty sure I read that the person replying to ATC about seeing the plane was male. So, not her.

MOO

 

[SouthAussie]

Great compassion is needed for the family of the female pilot, if she's going to be getting a lot of the "blame."

If they were exceeding the maximum altitude or other errors, you have to wonder why none of the three on the helicopter realized it. If -- then it wasn't just her error(s), right?

This retired Black Hawk pilot (at 45 sec mark) says it is not a single pilot aircraft. That there are two pilots which are required to fly the aircraft, and then up to two crew chiefs in the back. In this case, we know there was one crew chief in the back.
He also says that it takes the coordination of all those members to safely fly the aircraft.


KJRH -TV | Tulsa | Channel 2

 

[SouthAussie]

.
“If the helicopter is 100 feet above the ground and traveling at 120 knots, the pilot has to project forward in time where they’ll be in like 10 seconds,” he said. “A few seconds can make the difference in being in the proper airspace and being wrong.”

Midair Collision Draws Attention to Military Helicopter Training and Previous Accidents

The training of U.S. military helicopter pilots is getting heightened attention following the midair collision between an Army Black Hawk helicopter and a passenger jet.

www.military.com

 

[Boxer]

Great compassion is needed for the family of the female pilot, if she's going to be getting a lot of the "blame."

If they were exceeding the maximum altitude or other errors, you have to wonder why none of the three on the helicopter realized it. If -- then it wasn't just her error(s), right?

She was being evaluated at the time. There are two full pilots, how could they possibly be too high and off course.
As deviation from Route 4 began the evaluator shoild have intervened - unless he asked for the deviation.

 

[Betty P]

No. But since there were scattered reports about the pilot (trainee), and the military is not releasing the person’s name, and why it might be happening, yada, yada… I just said that IMO, anyone, if you think, might be the subject of speculations/accusations/idle assumptions. The only way to answer, IMHO, is to look at the person’s performance in aviation school. Otherwise we’ll find the reasons to accuse till the cows come home.

From what I understand, the person who is the subject of speculation is still living. It’s a case of mistaken identity based on rumor.

I’m going to wait until official word is released from NTSB or FAA.