Dubbed "Vodka Mom" in scathing Nancy Grace segment, MN woman burns self to death

[otto]

This was NOT a family bed accident. I used to place our kids into our 'family bed' with us when they were little. But it was a HUGE bed, and I was not drunk on a litre of vodka and the kids were not 3 weeks old. It was a risk and I was aware of that and took as many positive steps as I could to keep them safe, because I thought the rewards made the potential risks worthwhile.

She fell asleep on a couch with a newborn, after she drank a full litre of straight vodka. That is not an 'accident.' The baby died because his caretaker was way too drunk to care for him.

Did the lawyer/reporter reveal five FAS children, four of whom now need special care, or did the story end after lashing out at the mother? Were none of the children FAS? Has there been any consideration for the victim's siblings in NG's murdertainment coverage? They are now new victims. What is NG saying now? Does the case still interest her, or is she on to the next prime suspect bashing?

 

[otto]

This is getting nowhere.
I already addressed this.

Maybe I misunderstood, but didn't you say that NG did not address this?

If NG did not address this, then what has she contributed? It seems like she has contributed nothing. Yet, there is a strong possibility that her coverage of the case traumatized an already traumatized mother ... meaning she potentially had a tremendous negative impact on the case; one that resulted in suicide.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Did the lawyer/reporter reveal five FAS children, four of whom now need special care, or did the story end after lashing out at the mother? Were none of the children FAS? Has there been any consideration for the victim's siblings in NG's murdertainment coverage? They are now new victims. What is NG saying now? Does the case still interest her, or is she on to the next prime suspect bashing?

Respectfully, why do you keep asking the FAS question? As far as I know that has not been reported by ANYONE.
So, no matter how many times you ask it, it's not likely gonna be answered here.

I would think the condition, whereabouts, and well being of the surviving children is protected info as they are minors.JMO

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Maybe I misunderstood, but didn't you say that NG did not address this?

If NG did not address this, then what has she contributed? It seems like she has contributed nothing. Yet, there is a strong possibility that her coverage of the case traumatized an already traumatized mother ... meaning she potentially had a tremendous negative impact on the case; one that resulted in suicide.

They are MINORS!
Do you really think their medical records are laying wide open somewhere so NG producers can read them?

It just does not work that way.

 

[otto]

What difference does it make?
If she got drunk every day or if this was the very first time she ever touched alcohol?

She killed her kid THAT night.

She had been charged and was facing 10 years.

What she did was a criminal offense.

SHE did it.

If she was always drunk, throughout her pregancy, then the child should never have been in her care after the birth. That's a given. Since the child was in her care, I would assume that she was not always a drunk, but that something happened between the birth and the death ... something that deserves something more than "the gist of it". There are four new victims. What led this woman to become a complete drunk after the childbirth and what bearing does this have on the other four children?

 

[otto]

They are MINORS!
Do you really think their medical records are laying wide open somewhere so NG producers can read them?

It just does not work that way.

If the child was born FAS, that fact would be in the news ... along with the other alcohol related incidents in the news. Furthermore, no birthing coach, doctor or hospital would leave an unmonitored infant in the care of a complete drunk ... if that happened, the hospital needs to be investigated.

 

[katydid23]

Maybe I misunderstood, but didn't you say that NG did not address this?

If NG did not address this, then what has she contributed? It seems like she has contributed nothing. Yet, there is a strong possibility that her coverage of the case traumatized an already traumatized mother ... meaning she potentially had a tremendous negative impact on the case; one that resulted in suicide.

She set herself on fire A MONTH LATER. She did not watch NG, and then off herself. In that month I am sure there were a lot of triggers, much more depressing and worrisome than anything Nancy Grace said about her. Like maybe the ten years in prison she was facing ?

 

[Kimberlyd125]

If she was always drunk, throughout her pregancy, then the child should never have been in her care after the birth. That's a given. Since the child was in her care, I would assume that she was not always a drunk, but that something happened between the birth and the death ... something that deserves something more than "the gist of it". There are four new victims. What led this woman to become a complete drunk after the childbirth and what bearing does this have on the other four children?

Picking up a bottle and raising it to your mouth is a choice. It was her choice.

I really wish our society could get back to personal accountability.
Some want to sympathize with a victim so bad that they will try to place blame on anybody else.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

If the child was born FAS, that fact would be in the news ... along with the other alcohol related incidents in the news. Furthermore, no birthing coach, doctor or hospital would leave an unmonitored infant in the care of a complete drunk ... if that happened, the hospital needs to be investigated.

I think you may have just answered your own question then.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

She set herself on fire A MONTH LATER. She did not watch NG, and then off herself. In that month I am sure there were a lot of triggers, much more depressing and worrisome than anything Nancy Grace said about her. Like maybe the ten years in prison she was facing ?

That is exactly why she killed herself IMO.

 

[otto]

Respectfully, why do you keep asking the FAS question? As far as I know that has not been reported by ANYONE.
So, no matter how many times you ask it, it's not likely gonna be answered here.

I would think the condition, whereabouts, and well being of the surviving children is protected info as they are minors.JMO

My point is that either this woman was suddenly drunk and in need of something other than national persecution, or she was a complete drunk all of the time and someone really dropped the ball in leaving an infant with a drunk. By omitting all information about whether this woman was suddenly drunk or always drunk, it's simple to simply focus on what a bad, bad mother she was for being drunk and suffocating her child while practicing the "family bed" on the sofa. There's nothing investigative about that, nothing about advocating for any victim and no benefit for anyone in relation to the NG broadcasts. It is quite likely that her broadcasts had a negative impact, but nothing to suggest that they had a positive impact.

 

[katydid23]

If the child was born FAS, that fact would be in the news ... along with the other alcohol related incidents in the news. Furthermore, no birthing coach, doctor or hospital would leave an unmonitored infant in the care of a complete drunk ... if that happened, the hospital needs to be investigated.

The baby was three weeks old, and already at home with the mom and the older kids. She was still passed out when they got themselves up and dressed and went to school, without her help. So I doubt they had FAS. But it is sad that they had to get themselves ready while mom was passed out on the couch, on top of a dead baby.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I'm going to bed. Sober. Just in case my DD should need me in the night, I'll be able to tend to her needs.

Night all!

 

[katydid23]

My point is that either this woman was suddenly drunk and in need of something other than national persecution, or she was a complete drunk all of the time and someone really dropped the ball in leaving an infant with a drunk. By omitting all information about whether this woman was suddenly drunk or always drunk, it's simple to simply focus on what a bad, bad mother she was for being drunk and suffocating her child while practicing the "family bed" on the sofa. There's nothing investigative about that, nothing about advocating for any victim and no benefit for anyone in relation to NG broadcast. It is quite likely that her broadcasts had a negative impact, but nothing to suggest that they had a positive impact.

I don't think NG's goal was to be investigative and try to decipher why the mom was drinking so much, and had the previous DUI's. That was not the point of the show and did not need to be the point. It was about mother's being held accountable for their actions.

 

[jjenny]

So the story is only about how much she drank that night and on two prior occassions, but nothing about whether her children all suffered from fetal alcohol syndrome? If she was such a drunk, all of her childre, and especially the youngest, should clearly have had signs of FAS and should have been apprehended by social services. If the children show no signs of FAS, then NG really dropped the ball in not finding out why this woman was suddenly, since the birth of her child, so seriously drunk.

You are way off base here. I don't know if this woman was drinking during pregnancy, but children of women who drink during pregnancy are at risk for FAS. It doesn't mean 100 % of these children will have it. In fact most children don't have FAS even if mother drinks heavily during pregnancy.

"Forty-four percent of women who drink heavily during pregnancy will have a child with Fetal Alcohol Syndrome."
http://www.arium.org/anthology/caschroeder/casfas.html

 

[WholeLottaRosie]

Is she doing this show for the almighty dollar or is she perhaps doing this show to keep the public's attention on missing children and murdered wives and girlfriends?

I am going to give her the benefit of the doubt, given that she spent years as a prosecutor, and is presently the ONLY person doing a 5 night a week show focusing upon current crime victims. Many things that she does drive me nuts. I agree with the fact that she is not always accurate and is a day late and a dollar short quite often. But I don't see anyone else jumping up to take her place in trying to keep these crime victims in the public's eye.

It is weird that some think that SHE is what is wrong with our country today, as opposed to the people she was criticized for criticizing so harshly. That Ryan guy bludgeoned his beautiful young girlfriend, and then pulled her teeth out with pliers, one by one. And nancy Grace is the villain?

If Nancy Grace acted decent without the screaming and half facts I would probably still watch. If she focused on missing people, sure, but, going off on rants against accused and convicting them before a trial is not what the American system of jurisprudence is about.

What I meant by her being what is wrong, is well, the total lack of grace she shows on her show. And what is sad, to me, is her style is what gets the ratings - the screaming and half facts. If the public stopped watching and demanded better television we might get it.

All is MOO.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

I think there are many good topics NG could bring up on her shows that would be much more beneficial in helping to educate society and prevent future tragedies.

In this case for instance she could have brought up the circumstances of the event and then went on to discuss the dangers of sleeping with babies. She could have talked about the possibility of postpartum depression, alcoholism and how families can recognize these symptoms and how important it is for families to encourage their loved ones to get treatment. There has been a lot brought up about the father and why he didn't take the baby and put the baby to bed. This is another problem we have in society, to many people look the other way and allow the unacceptable behavior to continue. The behavior of the sick individual goes on to affect the dynamics of the entire family.

She could have chose to speak on any of these topics but instead she chose to fuel the mob mentality.

NG takes no consideration for the other victims of the babies and mothers death. The family are victims also and her other children have to go to school and be teased by other children that heard about this. What kind of example is she setting for children on how to treat others in society?

 

[believe09]

Otto, again... The point is this mother neglected her baby and put him at risk that caused his death at the ripe old age of 3 weeks.

She got beyond drunk and slept on top of her baby on a COUCH, not a bed. Big difference.

Had this been just an unfortunate accident or an innocent mistake, this "mom" would not have been facing 10 years in prison.

Her actions, and her actions alone killed that baby boy.

Respectfully, that is not true.

 

[hollyblue]

I'm still trying to understand why karma hasn't visited NG. Not saying I wish it upon her...but ????

I saw this show and the pouring of the 17 shots. It was all for drama of course. Not many people out there that doesn't know a shot is an oz and a 1/5 is 17 ozs. Unreal.

ETA: I feel for her other children...such a tragedy.

 

[believe09]

We should "froth at the mouth" over Dad yet not consider Mom's actions? He is not more culpable than Toni is.



Moo

Respectfully snipped. I didnt say he was more. I think his fault is equal because he knew she was significantly impaired, i.e. drunk. Co dependency wouldnt excuse him I dont think unless we consider her being a sufferer of the disease of alchoholism. If she suffered from that disease, well then that brings another level to the entire situation...Did NG mock someone who was overwhelmed by her disease? Was this mom in the throws of her addiction and no one was intervening and it led to the death of her son? And then NG mocked her and as the weeks went on she decided she had no options other than suicide?

We also dont know if the DA brought charges in order to force her into some kind of managed care...perhaps they would have dropped the charges.