Family wants to keep life support for girl brain dead after tonsil surgery #1

[jjenny]

Respectfully snipped for space.

The reason so many are assuming that her higher brain is not functioning at all is that the doctors who examined her testified so.

...the results of that examination indicated that Ms McMath had sustained an irreversible cessation of all functions in the entire brain, including her brainstem....

...reports of all these EEGs confirm that Ms McMath has no cerebral activity.

http://media.nbcbayarea.com/documents/CHO+-+Physician+Decls.pdf

Exactly. Her whole brain is dead. Her higher brain and her brain stem. There is nothing getting perfused up there.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

I'm glad your ok!



I'm on more medication now than I have ever been. If I am prescribed something I always get online to the website that you can list your meds and see if any interact. I do this before I take anything, even over the counter now. I also research for myself the side effects. I research doctor recommendations. Doctors do have differing opinions and not everyone is informed on everything. It's my body and I want to know what I am putting into it. Also, I am the one that knows my body best.



I encourage everyone to do this for themselves as well.

I agree. I do this too.

I have an app on my iPhone and iPad called Medscape. It has an interaction checker.



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[MyBelle]

Given that she was *scheduled* to be sent to the ICU after the surgery, which is not typical nor routine, I find it hard to believe that the risks were glossed over.

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The question becomes when was she scheduled to go to the ICU? Were there unanticipated complications during the surgery? The hospital attorney has proclaimed it was a "complicated" surgery but conveniently left off the point in time it became complicated.

 

[Kaliste]

And an update from the GoFund site:

"I would like to thank each and everyone of you for your financial donations and prayers. I was just informed that the hospital my daughter was going to be airlifted to has backed out due to lack of Cooperation from Children's Hospital Oakland. My family and I are still striving to find a location that will accept her in her current condition. All donations will go torwards the fight to keep her on life support. Let us pray that some one will have the heart to accept her despite what Children's Hospital says. So that we can get her air lifted away from this place as soon as possible"
http://www.gofundme.com/Jahi-Mcmath

 

[BeginnersLuck]

But did the additional physicians perform their own tests or did they rely only on the tests performed by the hospital and didn't perform tests on her themselves?

Here is one article with video that talks about the testing

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/loca...ctor-to-Review-Brain-Dead-Teen-237021531.html

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/loca...McMath-of-Oakland-Legally-Dead-237179681.html

Then there is Dr. Fisher who was appointed by the court to examine her.

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking...th-neurologist-present-test-results-at-closed

Fisher told the court in an open hearing that the Oakland girl "meets all the criteria of brain death." Fisher, chief of pediatric neurology at Lucile Packard Children's Hospital, performed an electroencephalogram, or EEG, to measure activity in the brain and another test to see if blood was flowing to the brain.

Shanahan, who specializes in pediatric neurology and has performed more than 300 brain-death exams, testified that two tests she performed on Dec. 11 confirmed the diagnosis of brain death. In one of the tests, Shanahan said, doctors briefly removed Jahi from the breathing machine to see if she could breathe on her own but the teen was not able to do so.

Have you see the official court documents? I was trying to find them but couldn't.

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

The question becomes when was she scheduled to go to the ICU? Were there unanticipated complications during the surgery? The hospital attorney has proclaimed it was a "complicated" surgery but conveniently left off the point in time it became complicated.

It was reported that the ICU was scheduled prior to the surgery. As I recall, this was from family statements.

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[MyBelle]

Here is one article with video that talks about the testing

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/loca...ctor-to-Review-Brain-Dead-Teen-237021531.html

http://www.nbcbayarea.com/news/loca...McMath-of-Oakland-Legally-Dead-237179681.html

Then there is Dr. Fisher who was appointed by the court to examine her.

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking...th-neurologist-present-test-results-at-closed



Have you see the official court documents? I was trying to find them but couldn't.

Thanks for the links. Because she is a minor, I doubt the official court records are going to become public soon.

 

[Donjeta]

http://media.nbcbayarea.com/documents/CHO+-+Physician+Decls.pdf

 

[Karmady]

The question becomes when was she scheduled to go to the ICU? Were there unanticipated complications during the surgery? The hospital attorney has proclaimed it was a "complicated" surgery but conveniently left off the point in time it became complicated.

He can't discuss the details due to HIPPA and the family's refusal to consent to disclosure. And he didn't "proclaim" it complicated. He merely said it was. And it apparently was from inception. As I understand the msm and the medical posters here, there were three separate procedures to be performed on an obese minor with breathing issues, among others, already. She was scheduled to go to the ICU prior to the surgery. It was not merely a routine tonsillectomy on an otherwise perfectly healthy child. Also, it appears that whatever complications happened, began well after the surgery since she was reportedly alert and requesting a popsicle shortly afterward. Looks like the bleeding began sometime between transfer from the recovery room to ICU and when the family first was allowed to visit her there about 30 minutes later.

jmo

 

[Softail]

It isn't a scam. I don't believe the mother was aware the facilities would require procedures that the hospital is refusing to do prior to transport.

I disagree. At this point, it is my opinion that they are playing people's emotions. She won't be transferred anywhere that I can see. Her lawyer is working for free. Hospital bills covered. So what will this money be used for? Ok funeral expenses, and then what? :waitasec:

The fund site has been updated, they are at $19,830, the mother says:

Updated posted by Latasha Nailah Winkfield 1 hour ago

Please continue to pray for Jahi....

Please continue to pray for Jahi.

http://www.gofundme.com/Jahi-Mcmath

To me that says please continue your donations. The girl is deceased. There is no bringing her back. Yes, I do think this has become about money for the family. :twocents: I don't mean to sound harsh, but that is how I see it.

 

[Tulessa]

$19,830.00

 

[Cubby]

They will ALL make money. The family will make about 2/3rd's and the lawyer will make 1/3. Grief and greed are not mutually exclusive. I believe that this family is not so ignorant that they actually believe there's any hope of anything but fairly soon "death" as they have chosen to define it. jmo

I can't help but think the family is aware that delaying an autopsy may hide any trauma inflicted by their suctioning the blood from Jahi. Inconclusive would be better for the family because it excludes the possibility the hospital was not at fault. If the suctioning is the COD that clearly explains why the family may be so adament about keeping her on life support.

back to trying to catch up.

 

[sherbetjello]

I can't help but think the family is aware that delaying an autopsy may hide any trauma inflicted by their suctioning the blood from Jahi. Inconclusive would be better for the family because it excludes the possibility the hospital was not at fault. If the suctioning is the COD that clearly explains why the family may be so adament about keeping her on life support.

back to trying to catch up.

Well, I would assume that there could be a paper trail with staff, doctors and nurses that would disclose that, if the case of Jahi healing/decomposing would cover actual evidence.

I have, however, wondered the same thing since I heard about her eating the popsicle right after surgery.

 

[krimekat]

He can't discuss the details due to HIPPA and the family's refusal to consent to disclosure. And he didn't "proclaim" it complicated. He merely said it was. And it apparently was from inception. As I understand the msm and the medical posters here, there were three separate procedures to be performed on an obese minor with breathing issues, among others, already. She was scheduled to go to the ICU prior to the surgery. It was not merely a routine tonsillectomy on an otherwise perfectly healthy child. Also, it appears that whatever complications happened, began well after the surgery since she was reportedly alert and requesting a popsicle shortly afterward. Looks like the bleeding began sometime between transfer from the recovery room to ICU and when the family first was allowed to visit her there about 30 minutes later.

jmo

exactly! HIPAA laws secure privacy.

Jahi's surgery was far from routine even without her pre-dispositions

 

[MyBelle]

He can't discuss the details due to HIPPA and the family's refusal to consent to disclosure. And he didn't "proclaim" it complicated. He merely said it was. And it apparently was from inception. As I understand the msm and the medical posters here, there were three separate procedures to be performed on an obese minor with breathing issues, among others, already. She was scheduled to go to the ICU prior to the surgery. It was not merely a routine tonsillectomy on an otherwise perfectly healthy child. Also, it appears that whatever complications happened, began well after the surgery since she was reportedly alert and requesting a popsicle shortly afterward. Looks like the bleeding began sometime between transfer from the recovery room to ICU and when the family first was allowed to visit her there about 30 minutes later.

jmo

But the hospital HAS discussed details. They publicly disclosed several procedures that were performed and it was more than a tonsillectomy.

And apparently the complications are unusual for a tonsillectomy according to the physician quoted in this article. The bleeding began after Jahi arrived at the ICU and I have to wonder if the ICU nursing staff were aware of the other surgical procedures performed in addition to the tonsillectomy.

Thebner says complications can arise during a tonsillectomy because the affected area has a lot of blood vessels.

"Anytime you go into surgery, it is unusual to have these complications, but they are real despite the fact that they are low risk," she said. "This was a highly unusual complication."

Back in the intensive care unit, Jahi quickly took a turn for the worse.

Read more: http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/nation...s-it-wants-to-keep-life-support#ixzz2ou0Z9ypG

 

[MyBelle]

I can't help but think the family is aware that delaying an autopsy may hide any trauma inflicted by their suctioning the blood from Jahi. Inconclusive would be better for the family because it excludes the possibility the hospital was not at fault. If the suctioning is the COD that clearly explains why the family may be so adament about keeping her on life support.

back to trying to catch up.

If Jahi started bleeding profusely because of trauma, the suctioning didn't cause the trauma.

 

[krimekat]

But the hospital HAS discussed details. They publicly disclosed several procedures that were performed and it was more than a tonsillectomy.

And apparently the complications are unusual for a tonsillectomy according to the physician quoted in this article. The bleeding began after Jahi arrived at the ICU and I have to wonder if the ICU nursing staff were aware of the other surgical procedures performed in addition to the tonsillectomy.

Thebner says complications can arise during a tonsillectomy because the affected area has a lot of blood vessels.

"Anytime you go into surgery, it is unusual to have these complications, but they are real despite the fact that they are low risk," she said. "This was a highly unusual complication."

Back in the intensive care unit, Jahi quickly took a turn for the worse.

Read more: http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/nation...s-it-wants-to-keep-life-support#ixzz2ou0Z9ypG

not details which would be covered under HIPAA (her medical record)

Jahi's family discussing the case allows for the facility/CHO to comment on the family's disclosure of info . . . such as it NOT being a routine surgery

 

[al66pine]

Posting a medical/health are provider's phone number on FB to encourage others to call
as part of a 'keep-the-patient-alive-campaign'?
Summoning a flash mob in a hospital lobby? Who does this?

Does the family believe the general public's 'phone vote' should influence medical decisions for a particular patient?

Has 21st century US life morphed into one never-ending 'reality' show,
where viewers vote participants 'off the island' and dictate medical treatment?

JM2cts and I may be wrong (steps off soapbox). :seeya:


This FB site https://www.facebook.com/keepJahiMcmathonlifesupport
was linked several posts back, but I just noticed the following there from Dec. 23:
<modsnip>

A commenter there replied as follows, which also expresses my thoughts:

 

[Karmady]

I can't help but think the family is aware that delaying an autopsy may hide any trauma inflicted by their suctioning the blood from Jahi. Inconclusive would be better for the family because it excludes the possibility the hospital was not at fault. If the suctioning is the COD that clearly explains why the family may be so adament about keeping her on life support.

back to trying to catch up.

There seems to be a boatload of animosity from the family toward the hospital. What's not clear is whether there was any of that going on prior to the surgery or in the ICU before her situation deteriorated so dramatically. It's entirely possible, imo, that her grandmother adopted an "I can take better care than they can" approach wrt the suctioning and maybe some other things. Idk. I feel pretty sure there's more to this wrt to the actions taken by the family in the ICU. I can't imagine trying to cover that up, but who knows. People do crazy things and this situation certainly has more than its share of cray cray. The idea of watching my dead child lying in a hospital bed for days or weeks on end knowing what's going on inside her body -- even knowing a little bit about it -- just makes me want to hurl. jmo

 

[Wyle_E_Coyote]

But the hospital HAS discussed details. They publicly disclosed several procedures that were performed and it was more than a tonsillectomy

Not exactly... this was part of the submissions to the court and was released by the court not the hospital.

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