Family wants to keep life support for girl brain dead after tonsil surgery #1

[shana]

As well, it could have been a 'stickless' popsicle wrapped in some kind of paper or cardboard.

 

[meme4]

I am not gonna blame anyone for what happened to this child until the hospital speaks, we have only one side being told and they are beginning to look a little less than forthcoming...This child id dead, brain dead, her brain has probably turned to mush, there is nothing there.....I would give my last breath for my child, but there is no way I would do the things they are doing...To me it is undignified.....
l

 

[MLO]

Google uvulopalatopharyngoplasty and popsicles and you will find a ton of sites of patient instructions actually recommending popsicles as a source of fluids:

eg.
http://www.windsorent.com/post-op/uvulopalatopharyngoplasty-uppp/

Ok, silly question, does a popsicle have to have a stick? What do you guys call the long thin ones that come in a plastic tube? Like the hydration ones? Is popsicle a specific term? We call both an icey pole, and I don't know anyone who uses different terms for sticked or stickless ones.

 

[MyBelle]

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/8579865/?i=4&from=/8579866/related
Acoording to this and in my nursing experience, it is also often done with a tracheostomy to prevent post operative issue. It is also not recommended that any other procedures be done at the same time
Had she been given a trach,they would have been able to pack her better to aviod serious bleeding.

Moo

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Nothing about that procedure fits with the mother's idea it was to be an in and out procedure. According to the mother's affidavit, she wasn't told in advance that a trip to ICU would be needed and was told all the bleeding was normal.

 

[Elley Mae]

The hospital told the court she had the surgical procedure. In a case where a child lost four pints of blood through her nose and mouth does there really have to be a news story for you to believe the surgical removal of tissue tissue from the mouth and throat involved sutures?

http://www.ohioentdocs.com/resources/files/UP3 Pre-post.pdf?size=199838

Could she have been cauterized? versus sutures.

 

[SeekingJana]

Ok, silly question, does a popsicle have to have a stick? What do you guys call the long thin ones that come in a plastic tube? Like the hydration ones? Is popsicle a specific term? We call both an icey pole, and I don't know anyone who uses different terms for sticked or stickless ones.

BBM. Icey pole, that is so cute.
I'm used to giving Peds. patients Ices that are frozen in a CUP. NO stick of any type. They are spooned into the mouth gently. Most kids love them, except the lemon ones, which should be illegal they are so sour. :tantrum:

 

[otto]

This case isn't about consent or risk, it is about a complication that apparently was not anticipated by the ICU.

The patient was sent to ICU after surgery because there were anticipated complications.

 

[MyBelle]

Google uvulopalatopharyngoplasty and popsicles and you will find a ton of sites of patient instructions actually recommending popsicles as a source of fluids:

eg.
http://www.windsorent.com/post-op/uvulopalatopharyngoplasty-uppp/

are those instructions for a pediatric patients? I doubt it.

 

[otto]

It should come as no great surprise that many many people rely on & listen to their doctors and most people never bother to actually read the paper work. Doctors make comments like its quick, in & out same day...fix you right up..quick recovery time..etc etc... Never once has a doctor said to me..."have you considered the very real but remote possibility this procedure could kill or or leave you brain dead or in a persistent vegetative state?"



Oh and my ALL TIME FAVORITE doctor minimization " you may experience slight discomfort"


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Why anyone would choose to gloss over the risks when they are giving informed written consent is beyond me. I always ask about the risk of death ... that seems to be worth at least a short discussion.

 

[MyBelle]

The patient was sent to ICU after surgery because there were anticipated complications.

Not according to the child's mother. Her affidavit is upthread.

 

[MyBelle]

When Jahi came out of surgery, she appeared healthy and alert, and was eating a Popsicle, her mother said. The girl was talking and reading notes before blood began pouring from her nose and mouth, she said.

Handwritten notes that Jahi wrote after her surgery -- one read, "Am I OK?" -- are missing too, family members said.

Her family has not left her side during her hospital stay, including Sealey, who has slept in Jahi's room.


So, who took the notes if the family has not left her side?



http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking...d-family-girl-brain-dead-after-tonsil-surgery

The family said they were not allowed to see her until more than a half hour after she was transported from recovery to the ICU.

 

[Donjeta]

are those instructions for a pediatric patients? I doubt it.

http://davidandeldredgeent.com/files/post-operative-instructions-for-up3-children.pdf

Here are instructions for UP3 children and it's basically the same.

Diet:
Start with a clear liquid diet (Water; Juices-apple and grape, not orange, grapefruit, or lemonade; Sports
Drinks – 10-K, Gatorade, Powerade; 7-UP or Sprite; Popsicles, or Jell-O) to prevent nausea and/or
vomiting. All drinks and foods should be lukewarm or cool, not hot. Everyone advances differently, but I
recommend advancing to puddings, ice cream, milkshakes, smoothies, and then to soft foods like grits,
oatmeal, yogurt, mashed potatoes, scrambled eggs, applesauce, well cooked rice and gravy, and
pastas/noodles. No scratchy foods for 2 full weeks. (i.e. – chips, popcorn, pretzels, crackers, cookies.)

 

[shana]

There have been published in msm conflicting reports (as usual). Some of the family's own statements appear inconsistent as referenced in this thread.

I will wait for the hospital to have its day in court before condemning it or even suggesting it or one of its staff was at fault.

~jmo~

 

[MLO]

BBM. Icey pole, that is so cute.
I'm used to giving Peds. patients Ices that are frozen in a CUP. NO stick of any type. They are spooned into the mouth gently. Most kids love them, except the lemon ones, which should be illegal they are so sour. :tantrum:

LOL, when my son had his tonsils and adenoids out they gave him lemon cordial. He howled! Then half an hour later he asked for orange juice with the pulp. They tried to feed him jelly and tinned spaghetti, but all he wanted was orange juice and hot chips. He ate them too. I was so stressed watching him eat, but he was fine.

I LOOOVE lemon. The more sour the better. But probably not when I have a mouth full of wounds.

 

[MyBelle]

http://davidandeldredgeent.com/files/post-operative-instructions-for-up3-children.pdf

Here are instructions for UP3 children and it's basically the same.

with all due respect, I don't believe the instructions mean the child should be handed a popsicle in the recovery room.

 

[momrids6]

Her mother states her daughter died, was brought back, and is now brain dead:

http://www.news.com.au/lifestyle/he...move-her-tonsils/story-fneuzlbd-1226785309143

 

[Softail]

I disagree. People here are NOT being respectful of this family- accusing them of being scammers. The hospital and lack of Post-Op care is why Jahi is in this situation. I blame Children's Hospital of Oakland for this situation, not Jahi's family!!!
P.S. Her heart is still beating- nowhere have they referred to her as "their dead child".

Well, no they haven't referred to her as "their dead child", but their Lawyer did say this:

"They told us there is a bed, they care for children like her all the time," Dolan said. "They believe they can provide her with care and support and treat her as if she's a living person."

http://www.mercurynews.com/breaking...ily-faces-difficult-decisions-before-deadline

Seems to me that is the same as being dead. :twocents:

 

[Elley Mae]

There have been published in msm conflicting reports (as usual). Some of the family's own statements appear inconsistent as referenced in this thread.

I will wait for the hospital to have its day in court before condemning it or even suggesting it or one of its staff was at fault.

~jmo~

We should know something in about 24 hours.

 

[SeekingJana]

We have ONE SIDE of things. The family said she had a popsicle.
The family said they " had to" suction her.

We don't know. The medical record is the last word on what was done when, how and by whom it was authorized.

Please- the speculation needs to stop regarding condition at any given point.

 

[gngr~snap]

She had multiple surgucal procedures done at the same time.
IMO this was a huge risk...
It is also not recommended to do nasal surgery at the same time as
UPPP. Add in the tonsilectomy and you have a perfect storm.
50% of patients who had complications had had UPPP and nasal sugery done at the same time 50%
Horrible odds if you ask me.
Moo
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/m/pubmed/9781989/?i=6&from=/8579865/related

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