First Hand Knowledge Of What It Feels Like To Be Strangled!!

julianne said:
I'm not disputing any known facts that have come out of the investigation. Not at all. I didn't say that anywherein my post. I think it's highly probable she was being abused. I just don't think it was a result of excessive and rough douching---which, by the way, IS nothing but speculation & there were no facts uncovered that supports that. I also don't think it was a result of excess or rough wiping by Patsy, which is more speculation. Speculation is good and answers can come about because of it, but when nothing supports that speculation, then nothing supports it and it's time to move on to the next item.

I think it's important to keep an open mind (I am not at all implying that you're not--I'm speaking in general terms) and it seems to me that many times people who are convinced that Patsy did it seem to bend otherwise normal issues or information into something sinister and dark when it relates to Patsy, as if to add to the list of negatives about her and if the list gets long enough then she had to do it. Almost as if there is such a deep-seated, personal hatred of Patsy (from complete strangers, no less-but I can understand that hatred if one thinks she is guilty of murder) that it's like trying to fit a big square box into a little circular hole---- Personally, I am still a fence sitter, but I must admit that Dru's posts and her (or his) theory is the most logical theory based upon the facts of the case that I have ever read anywhere.
What I have informed of was there is more fact to support the bathroom issues than many wish to believe. Steve Thomas did not pluck it out of thin air. Nor did an overactive imagination implant this idea mysteriously into his brain. I think there are a lot of facts surrounding this case. Or supporting evidence to the facts that just never met the light of day. And will not unless it is ever taken to trial. However I totally respect your opinion and your right to it. In the matter of this Murder anymore it is choice what one believes. Till trial IDI theory is at least as speculative as any other theory. JMHO
 
JMO8778 said:
that's true,I don't rule out JR;he has a huge need to appear extremely EASY-GOING and not an angry type person at all..even though he knows he SHOULD appear angry at the 'killer'...but that need outweighs the latter..so...why is that?? He doesn't want to appear to be the type of person who could commit this crime,although that of course doesn't mean he did do it.But it's very suspect to me,esp when he talked about JMK,and him being just a 'regular guy'.HUH???
Oh...but he IS "angry". There is actually an interview where he pounds his fist (once...and VERY lightly)...on some sort of table or something. :rolleyes: Yep..he is FIGHTING mad...that "intruder" had better watch out. If JR gets his hands around his neck, he will choke the life out of him. I am sure that after "watching" that interview...with the "angry" John Ramsey...that "intruder" is shaking in his boots. Sheesh......:doh:
 
SuperDave said:
Okay, here goes.

And keep in mind I am just spitballing.

I've expanded at some length on my "Snow White" theory in the past, and I've cited several psychoanalysts to support me, such as Jamie Turndorf, et al. "Who's the fairest of them all?" "Not you."

I told my brother the only reason she fed JB pineapple was because there were no poisoned apples around. It was a bad joke, I admit. I wasn't in a very good mood at the time.

But the one I've been struck with only came on recently. I was reading three quotes. Two by Michael Kane, one by a Dr. Rusty Morris. Morris believes Patsy suffered from Munchausen-by-Proxy. Munchausen'S Syndrome is where a person feigns misfortune, most often illnesses, to attain sympathy. The Proxt kind is where they attain sympathy through other people. And who's more sympathetic than a child in pain. The most notable cases of this disorder are the ones where parents harm their children, even kill them. Morris points to the many doctor visits JonBenet made in her life.

Leading from there, I read the two quotes from Kane. He said in one interview that the biggest thing that leapt out at him was how overdone the staging was, almost to the point of being ridiculous. It was a theatrical production and Patsy was a theatrical person.

Not much change for a dollar there. But the clincher was where Kane actually said that Patsy enjoyed being known as the mother of a dead beauty queen. Wow. That got me to thinking. At first, I went down that path to explain why she chose to stage a horrific crime rather than call for help: she knew JB would die, no matter what anyone did, and since JB had been so spectacular in life, she HAD to be spectacular in death.

Everyone still following me?

But then, I started wondering if maybe it was a premeditated killing for that reason. It started to fall into place. The only thing that kept me in the "accident" camp was that I've always maintained that the staging was so sloppy is because it was such a spur-of-the-moment panic deal. But now I wonder if it wasn't just the works of a delusional person.

You folks get all of that?

When Patsy developed cancer, she received more than enough attention. She was even featured in a womens magazine....

Patsy loved attention.

Her cancer is in remittance in 1996, she is turning 40, the attention is waning.

JonBenet is murdered and Patsy gets more attention than she did when she had cancer.
 
A midlife crisis of sorts..and she may have thought she was cured of cancer.
 
Toltec said:
When Patsy developed cancer, she received more than enough attention. She was even featured in a womens magazine....

Patsy loved attention.

Her cancer is in remittance in 1996, she is turning 40, the attention is waning.

JonBenet is murdered and Patsy gets more attention than she did when she had cancer.
Oh yeah..Patsy DID love that attention. You could tell that by the "get up" that she wore to JB's funeral. What was WITH that outfit?? She was going for the dramatic look, obviously. There's one video of them, where Patsy is crying...and the Ramsey's are crossing the street..I don't know if it was before or after the funeral....but, a car stops for them, to let them cross...and Patsy....(remember now...she is distraught)....waves to the person, smiles and mouths "Thank you". I know that I am being petty...but, she just seemed like a huge fake to me. The crying seemed fake...like it was not sincere,but meant to gain attention and sympathy from other people. The outfit that she chose to wear....to the funeral...was over the top...IMO. For sure...Patsy LOVED attention...and imo....loved being the mother of dead beauty queen.
 
Ames said:
Oh yeah..Patsy DID love that attention. You could tell that by the "get up" that she wore to JB's funeral. What was WITH that outfit?? She was going for the dramatic look, obviously. There's one video of them, where Patsy is crying...and the Ramsey's are crossing the street..I don't know if it was before or after the funeral....but, a car stops for them, to let them cross...and Patsy....(remember now...she is distraught)....waves to the person, smiles and mouths "Thank you". I know that I am being petty...but, she just seemed like a huge fake to me. The crying seemed fake...like it was not sincere,but meant to gain attention and sympathy from other people. The outfit that she chose to wear....to the funeral...was over the top...IMO. For sure...Patsy LOVED attention...and imo....loved being the mother of dead beauty queen.

The outfit and several actions at the funeral were hauntingly like Jackie Kennedy and John F. Kennedy including kneeling to kiss the casket.
 
coloradokares said:
The outfit and several actions at the funeral were hauntingly like Jackie Kennedy and John F. Kennedy including kneeling to kiss the casket.
Yea,I think she PLANNED it that way !! She really did,IMO.She claims not to even remember kneeling b/f the casket,but I bet anything she did recall it,and did it as planned,along w/ the funeral attire get-up. (I'm surprised she didn't have BR salute !!) I know,that was not nice ! JMO.
 
Julianne, thank you! I'm glad you find my theory plausible; as a definite newbie I really appreciate the encouragement.:)

As far as ST's toilet rage theory, I don't think he made it up out of thin air. PR probably was frustrated with JBR's toilet issues and she may have crossed the line into abuse on occasion. What I just can't buy is that sexual wound; why inflict that, if toilet rage is the motive? If it was inflicted before death it wasn't staging, and if PR inflicted it to cover up her own involvement in the crime then she had to know the sexual abuse was occurring and be willing to compromise the evidence of it. It just doesn't make sense to me.
 
Dru said:
Julianne, thank you! I'm glad you find my theory plausible; as a definite newbie I really appreciate the encouragement.:)

As far as ST's toilet rage theory, I don't think he made it up out of thin air. PR probably was frustrated with JBR's toilet issues and she may have crossed the line into abuse on occasion. What I just can't buy is that sexual wound; why inflict that, if toilet rage is the motive? If it was inflicted before death it wasn't staging, and if PR inflicted it to cover up her own involvement in the crime then she had to know the sexual abuse was occurring and be willing to compromise the evidence of it. It just doesn't make sense to me.
Dru there are so many complicated twists and turns to what appears to have been staging . I have many times along with others think that whoever did this, was no criminal mind and just threw everything they could in every direction they could and prayed something stuck. It is also possible that one or the other may not have been aware of all the staging that was involved by the other party. I have often wondered in example if PR did this was she unaware that JonBenet had the wound from the paintbrush? I mean your mind can chase around in circles. What we need desparately is to have a special prosecutor crack this whole thing wide open so we can have all the facts presented in a court of law. JonBenet will never have justice short of that. Thanks though for caring and expressing your opinions. The worst thing in the world is to sweep it under the rug as though it never happened.
 
I know from first hand experience that Patsy will get out of control if something doesn't suit her. I have posted this experience many times and won't do it again.I will go to my grave knowing Patsy had a lot to do with JBR's death.
 
concernedperson said:
I know from first hand experience that Patsy will get out of control if something doesn't suit her. I have posted this experience many times and won't do it again.I will go to my grave knowing Patsy had a lot to do with JBR's death.
For the benefit of those of who may have missed it can you guide us to that posting you refer to. Thanks CK
 
JMO8778 said:
Yea,I think she PLANNED it that way !! She really did,IMO.She claims not to even remember kneeling b/f the casket,but I bet anything she did recall it,and did it as planned,along w/ the funeral attire get-up. (I'm surprised she didn't have BR salute !!) I know,that was not nice ! JMO.
Yeah, I have heard that she liked to compare her family with that of the Kennedy's. I think that is weird...the Kennedy's have had their share of death, too. I didn't know about her kneeling before the casket....sheesh....:rolleyes: Oh, I am sure that she remembered it....she had it planned afterall...IMO.
 
concernedperson said:
I know from first hand experience that Patsy will get out of control if something doesn't suit her. I have posted this experience many times and won't do it again.I will go to my grave knowing Patsy had a lot to do with JBR's death.
I have no idea what your experience with Patsy is...but, IMO...she just looked like a real "b".
 
Ames said:
Yeah, I have heard that she liked to compare her family with that of the Kennedy's. I think that is weird...the Kennedy's have had their share of death, too. I didn't know about her kneeling before the casket....sheesh....:rolleyes: Oh, I am sure that she remembered it....she had it planned afterall...IMO.
The fact that Patsy liked to compare the Ramsey family with the Kennedy family...is that in one of the books, or is it linkable to something online? Not saying it isn't true, but out of all the sites, documents & books available on this case, the only place I can ever remember seeing anything akin to Patsy making any comparisons to the Kennedys is from a poster on a message board.
 
julianne said:
The fact that Patsy liked to compare the Ramsey family with the Kennedy family...is that in one of the books, or is it linkable to something online? Not saying it isn't true, but out of all the sites, documents & books available on this case, the only place I can ever remember seeing anything akin to Patsy making any comparisons to the Kennedys is from a poster on a message board.
Yes, it was in one of the books....THEIR book, the one that the Ramsey's wrote together. Patsy compares herself to Jackie Kennedy....talking about the outfit that she wore to JB's funeral. ATTENTION....other posters....please help me find this quote....the reference to Jackie Kennedy, by Patsy. TIA....
 
Ames said:
I have no idea what your experience with Patsy is...but, IMO...she just looked like a real "b".
:confused: How does one "look like a real b_tch?" What physical characteristics does one have to have in order to "look" like a b_tch? This is a valid question---I'm just curious as to what part of Patys' physical appearance, specifically, makes you say that she looked like a real b_itch?
 
julianne said:
The fact that Patsy liked to compare the Ramsey family with the Kennedy family...is that in one of the books, or is it linkable to something online? Not saying it isn't true, but out of all the sites, documents & books available on this case, the only place I can ever remember seeing anything akin to Patsy making any comparisons to the Kennedys is from a poster on a message board.
<<ATTENTION....other posters....please help me find this quote....the reference to Jackie Kennedy, by Patsy. TIA....>>


DOI, chapter 5, pg 35.

"At that moment a picture of Jackie Kennedy abruptly flashed across my mind.
I remembered seeing her wearing a black veil, walking hand in hand with her two children to JFK's grave site"

Incidently she goes on to say "On Sunday, Dec 29, when I came down the Fernies stairs in the black dress to go to the hastily arranged memorial service at St Johns Church, John glanced up and said ' you look beautiful'.

What a gem PR is, on JonBenet's service day, she is still thinking about herself.
 
julianne said:
The fact that Patsy liked to compare the Ramsey family with the Kennedy family...is that in one of the books, or is it linkable to something online? Not saying it isn't true, but out of all the sites, documents & books available on this case, the only place I can ever remember seeing anything akin to Patsy making any comparisons to the Kennedys is from a poster on a message board.
It was in various news converages that as she silently went forward and kneeled and kissed JonBenet's casket.... common knowledge.
 
julianne said:
:confused: How does one "look like a real b_tch?" What physical characteristics does one have to have in order to "look" like a b_tch? This is a valid question---I'm just curious as to what part of Patys' physical appearance, specifically, makes you say that she looked like a real b_itch?
Good question.
 
snowqueen said:
Good question.
I just said to my son the other day, one of the problems Patsy had is the way she looked, meaning her "face". She had that against her from the get. She looks tough, she looks as if she is saying "I didn't do it, I am smarter than you, try and get me, forget it, not going to happen and also face it I am just smarter than all of you". She looks tough and she was tough.

What I mean is she looks like she has the capacity to be what she has been described as.
 

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