FL - Jennifer Kesse, 24, Orlando, 24 Jan 2006 - #3

[crypto6]

You bring up a good point


In the 70's, perp.'s would simply leave victims behind. However, with DNA comes physical evidence that is indisputable in court.

So, does anyone think the improvements in forensics, such as DNA, has led to more people who are "missing", who may have been found not alive in the 60's and 70"s?

In other words, do you think it is possible the dirtbag rapists, murderers, etc. are now hiding victims to prevent police from getting DNA samples left behind?

that is what I was gettin at.

left

LC: Interesting point. If the perp is that sophisticated, he would attack her outside with no possible traces to him in the condo. If that's the case then he wasn't coming back into JK's condo to rob or for any other reason, so the car drop-off point is important logistically. That Bo tracked back to JK's condo would fit with the perp going back there to work or get his vehicle. I wonder how much leeway the handler gave Bo, since if the guy was a worker there, Bo could find him. If they let Bo snuffle and he didn't find anyone on the grounds, then the perp came back for his transportation.

Also another scenario, which may be my wishful thinking, but someone who stalks may have such an obsession that 4-5 hours with the victim won't suffice, so maybe she was (is?) kept alive longer. That fits in with the timing of the abduction, with the stalker saying to the BF "You've had her, now at the first possible opportunity, she's mine. Forever."

Crypto6

 

[nanandjim]

Forgive me if this has been discussed or seems farfetched as I am not as knowledgeable about this case as some others.

Anyway, I have read that her brother had a party at her house when she was away and some guy left his cell phone there asking that she return it. How far away does this guy live?

My thought is that if I am just getting back into town, tired and having to go to work the next day, packaging up and mailing someone's cell phone back to them is not my first priority. I may take it to work and package it there if I got the chance and send it from there. However, I'm not going out of my way that night.

Could the guy have called and told her he left it there and would swing by and get it? I know that the cell phone is missing. However, this guy could have thrown it away to cover his tracks. Has this guy been thoroughly investigated?

 

[leftcoast]

Forgive me if this has been discussed or seems farfetched as I am not as knowledgeable about this case as some others.

Anyway, I have read that her brother had a party at her house when she was away and some guy left his cell phone there asking that she return it. How far away does this guy live?

My thought is that if I am just getting back into town, tired and having to go to work the next day, packaging up and mailing someone's cell phone back to them is not my first priority. I may take it to work and package it there if I got the chance and send it from there. However, I'm not going out of my way that night.

Could the guy have called and told her he left it there and would swing by and get it? I know that the cell phone is missing. However, this guy could have thrown it away to cover his tracks. Has this guy been thoroughly investigated?

Good question:

JK's brother had use of JK's condo for the weekend. Supposedly, the friends who stayed at the condo with Logan were all long time family friends. One of them, supposedly, left his cell phone on JK's nightstand or something, and asked JK to send it overnight.

I could be wrong, but, from the evidence I've seen, I think he lives in Tampa, or about 1 1/2 hours from JK's condo. Hence, that is why he wanted it overnighted, versus driving the distance to retreive the phone.

Supposedly, LE has questioned ALL of the young men who stayed their that weekend. Plus, the picture of the suspect does not look like any of them, according to all reports.

However, it would have been wise for LE to start the investigation with those young men. In my opinion, LE would have to be incompetent to have missed such a likely suspect. Therefore, I think they have been eliminated as suspects, after interviews, photo's of POI, etc.

You are right, I would have also sent that phone from work. Most big companies have daily UPS or FEDEX pickups. HOwever, there was a rumor that JK was looking for a place to send the phone from.

that is why her cell phone records, landline, etc, are so important in this case.

Given the possibility that the young man drove back to ORlando to retreive the phone, he certainly should have been questioned and looked at extensively. Don't forget, the Kesse's, Rob, everyone close to the family, have looked at the photo of the POI, and nobody recognizes him. So, I'm convinced it probably isn't him. Of course, he should be questioned. I also want to know if any of the friends had any local Orlando friends over at the condo that weekend. WAs it just the young men, or did they have other's at the condo?

good question

left

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I am glad to see they finally released the video and renewed media interest in this case. In my personal opinion, it was foolish of LE not to have released it immediately. Their rationalization did nothing to help this case and leads that could have come while this was fresh in local minds could be lost now. The poor quality of the video itself and the pics of the suspect probably won't solicit any leads directly, but keeping the story in front of the public can always help.

I have always thought it possible she went missing the night before. I thought the scenario of her showering and then putting on casual clothes to ship off that phone in the morning before work made no sense. They said she was at work on time every day which meant she would most likely have dressed for work and dropped it on the way.

They said her purse, the ipod, and both cell phones were missing. I have given that a lot of thought. If she were at home and talked to her boyfriend that night, wouldn't it make sense her cell phone be near the bed instead of in her purse since she expected to talk to him again the next morning early? Would an abductor inside her apartment have the time or the opportunity to grab the cell and her purse while struggling to get her out? Not likely, leading me to believe she was abducted outside the apartment and those items were already in her purse. There are many reasons she might have been out the night before, but not that morning without being ready for work. (If she simply went out to her car to get something, she wouldn't have taken her purse either.)

I have never been to Florida and am not familiar with her area. Someone mentioned Navy. Is there a large Navy population there? It would certainly be worth checking into. I never thought of that possibility. I thought it might be someone working at the complex which would have meant easy access for walking back from her car. However, if a military person were staying at the complex for even one night...he could have slipped out from under any radar in this case and been long gone.

I hope her parents find some answers soon. My heart truly goes out to them. Maybe the break they need will surface with the release of this video. I have wondered about Jennifer often and kept her in my prayers.

(My computer crashed and it took me awhile to get a new one. I am relieved I am finally back online and back to WS!)

 

[nanandjim]

...Given the possibility that the young man drove back to ORlando to retreive the phone, he certainly should have been questioned and looked at extensively. Don't forget, the Kesse's, Rob, everyone close to the family, have looked at the photo of the POI, and nobody recognizes him. So, I'm convinced it probably isn't him. Of course, he should be questioned. I also want to know if any of the friends had any local Orlando friends over at the condo that weekend. WAs it just the young men, or did they have other's at the condo?

good question

left

Thanks, LC. There also could have been an accomplice that helped by driving the car back to where it was left after JK's disappearance. So, the guy may not have been at the party, but he may have been a close friend of a person who was at the party. He could be keeping quiet out of fear of being charged as an accessory after the fact or because he was involved in the crime in some way.

Hopefully, police have put pressure on the friends at the party. The party participants are definitely people of interest to me. Some people that you think are your friends may not be. Plus, there may have been others there that were not known that well.

I can tell you that I would not let my brother have a party with his friends at my place while I was away, especially if I were a single woman living alone. Too many things could go awry, to include people now knowing where I live or the possibility of someone making a copy of the key without my brother's knowledge to people stealing things from my place, etc., etc...

 

[leftcoast]

You are welcome. It is great to get everyone's different ideas and viewpoints.

I totally agree with you. Who's to say the guy with the cell phone missing didn't ask a local friend to run by JK's and pick up the phone for him, and drive it down. Anything is possible.

Anybody who says that "I know so and so, and he would never do anything like that" is kidding themselves. Look at Radar, he had everyone fooled.

But, given all we have raised here, you can see why Orlando PD has a long list of possible suspects. It is amazing how many people we come across in our daily lives.

I still think that video is going to solve the case. Finally, we get a look at the perp, the walk, the confidence, the determined gait, and knowing exactly where he was going.

Somebody out there knows who this guy is.

If I was the Kesse's, I would offer 100,000 to whomever gives me the guy's name, and why they think it is him. the 1,000,000 is for a safe return. Why not offer a huge amount just for the identity, and make it sincere, and make certain it is paid.

This case is going to be solved, and it will be because of that video, and the media attention.

left

 

[nanandjim]

...This case is going to be solved, and it will be because of that video, and the media attention.

left

I wish that the video and the still photo would be aired on national television with the "new" reward (that you suggested) being offered. I agree that if someone knows the person, the impression from the video and photo will seem familiar.

 

[leftcoast]

I agree

And I think Orlando PD should not exclude any scenario's, suspects, etc.

It is still possible the POI was simply doing a favor for someone, it was a carjacking gone wrong, someone who knows JK but lives out of town, etc.

My level of confidence in Orlando PD has shot up big time. Many police organizations will not change their minds, and will keep on the same path.

OPD has now assigned new detectives, released the video, and is considering every person called in as a suspect again.

Even if this guy was from out of town, and just happened upon JK, the release of that video will lead to a name. Nobody is that big of a hermit to go without notice. Heck, even the unabomber, who had nobody in his life, had his handwriting recognized by his estranged brother.

this will lead to the answer.

left

 

[Myserty64]

Where is Jennifer?

It is just about as important to find Jennifer as it is to find the perpetrator.

If this is indeed a homicide case a DA can baulk at prosecuting with only a confession and the same applies with not having a body.
A confession can be withdrawn as soon as a trial gets underway.

I have always thought that Jennifer is close to the area of the Mosaic and Huntington complexes.
I have also always considered this to be a crime of short duration so the time span of four hours between the abduction and the car being dropped is a concern.
I do appreciate there are those who hold the view that this crime could have taken considerably longer, even a few days.

There are a lot of bodies of water in Orlando and also a lot of concrete poured with all construction sites. Also I note that some think the suspect could even be a garbo. We all know what comes to mind if that is the case.

In view of some of the terrific posts here it seems to me the suspect could be a teenager. If that is the case he surely couldn't have gone to elaborate lengths to hide a body.

This is a perpetrator who has had more than his share of luck in evading the OPD.

I hope left is correct in that this case will be solved soon.
I hate to rain on parades but I think it has to be very soon. All the leads so far have led nowhere and a report I heard said the guy in the video is the one and only suspect.
This case is 16 months old and was cold until this latest video was released.

The Kesse family need closure so they can begin to rebuild their lives. I truly hope it happens in the next week or two.

 

[leftcoast]

good post Mystery

I agree, finding JK is the first priority, not the prosecution. that is why that tape should have been released last summer, at the latest. Once LE finds the POI, I see no problem prosecuting this animal. He must have left a partial print, or something in that car.

I also feel Jk is close (within 10 miles) of the scene.

Perp.'s like to work where they feel comfortable, have some knowledge.

As for the age, I do think he is younger, but, I'm thinking closer to 25-30. Usually criminals get smarter with age, and not leaving behind incriminating evidence, evading police for 16 months, moving the car, etc, makes me believe this is a seasoned criminal, or someone with LE knowledge.

The construction angle is an interesting one. Given the construction in the area, the dirt on JK's front quarter panel, and maybe those pants (of the POI) are fitted at the bottom for construction, ie concrete layer.

However, the shoes appear to be soft, without a heal, and do not appear to be construction type of gear. One could almost argue they are a type of tennis shoe, skateboard shoe, that type of thing.

Don't kid yourself, now with camera's at Mosaic, if the perp. does work or live there, LE can use the new camera's to compare photos with the POI. Sure, the POI could not belong to Mosaic, but, if he does, he might just be on candid camera, with LE watching his every move.

left

 

[nanandjim]

...maybe those pants (of the POI) are fitted at the bottom for construction, ie concrete layer...

However, the shoes appear to be soft, without a heal, and do not appear to be construction type of gear. One could almost argue they are a type of tennis shoe, skateboard shoe, that type of thing...

Two thoughts: Could the pants have a band around them to keep them tight to the leg at the ankle to keep them out of the way when riding a bicycle?

Also, I think the shoes have a small heel on them, like the patton leather dress shoes that I referred to in an earlier post.

 

[leftcoast]

Two thoughts: Could the pants have a band around them to keep them tight to the leg at the ankle to keep them out of the way when riding a bicycle?

Also, I think the shoes have a small heel on them, like the patton leather dress shoes that I referred to in an earlier post.

Nan.

Yes, the bicycle idea has been thrown around in this forum before. Some of us think it is a possibility, and may explain why the POI needed to use JK's car.

However, other's, believe the pants are simply "chico's" type of pants, and there is not a band around the leg.

As for me, I never like to rule out anything.

I do know that many uniforms, esp. restaurant, etc, use this type of pant in order to prevent employees from tripping, getting the pant leg caught on machinery, etc. Also, some restaurants, grocery stores, simply use this style to keep up with the current styles.

As for the shoes, I dont' know what to think. Could be a dress shoe for military. But, as someone who wears a suit to work, this type of shoe does not appear to go with a man's suit, or dress pants. Casual yes, formal no.

Another thought I had is a certain type of electronics store makes employees wear khaki pants, blue shirt, and black shoes. I don't want to mention the name, but, we all know the shirt could be a light color, such as blue. Actually, it was one of my first ideas.

Other's think he could be a valet, you say military.

Now we know why LE has their work cut out for them. That picture brings up more questions than answers.

One thing I do know. If the POI/suspect was that of my brother, my dad, my best friend, I know I would recognize them. And somebody should be able to recognize the walk, dress, pants, etc of a loved one or neighbor. imo

left

 

[SeriouslySearching]

I am not even %100 positive the suspect is a male at this point! I don't think the lead will come from the video, but from the coverage it is reclaiming in the media from the reward by simply being out there.

 

[Enrique Sparta]

my thoughts on the suspect. from those pictures, i've always thought it was a backwards baseball hat and it was a young man, 18-21, white, short. Means nothing, just my gut feeling. That's just what I see today even after looking at the pictures so many times. I also think he's carrying something rather large, perhaps a briefcase or some kind of package (fedex package containing a cell phone maybe?)

I'm pretty sure based on Rob Allen's comments, JK was in bed the last night she was heard from. He said she had a very busy day and was tired, etc. She likely did not leave after she was last heard from. This doesn't exclude a nighttime abduction though. Just means if it was at night, she was likely sleeping and somebody broke in.

I'd also like to know who was at her place that weekend. Did her brother only invite a few of his close friends and more of a kickback type thing? Or was it a party where friends of friends were invited and even neighbors could come in if they wanted. I'm sure this was quickly investigated by the Orlando PD.

It's very important to know when JK normally made that phone call to her boyfriend Rob. First off did she call every morning? From Rob's comments, yes she did. He thought it was a bit odd he hadn't heard from her that morning. Next...did she almost always call before she left for work? Was it right when she got up? Was it while she ate breakfast? Or did she call on the way to work? Or was it random and no set pattern. Rob would definitely know the answer to this. So far no public comments have given us an answer here. It's potentially crucial. If there was no set pattern, then it means nothing. However if indeed she always made that phone call BEFORE leaving home....then she very likely was abducted while in her home.

A few things point to her having been abducted as she was leaving or in/near her car. Like someone already said, the two cell phones, her ipod, her purse were all missing. This is important. Why would the suspect find all this stuff lying around the apartment if they abducted her in her flat? Also the fact that the suspect was driving her car also indicates she was in or near her car. Why else would the suspect be driving her car? I can only think of what leftcoast said how it was suspicious that shortly after JK's parents alerted the landlord/manager of the Mosaic that she was missing and to see if she was at home....and mysteriously about an hour later or so....the car is dropped off a mile away. This makes me think possibly that somebody in the Mosaic wanted to make it look as if JK had driven off to work for the day.

 

[Myserty64]

[One thing I do know. If the POI/suspect was that of my brother, my dad, my best friend, I know I would recognize them. And somebody should be able to recognize the walk, dress, pants, etc of a loved one or neighbor./QUOTE]

That is a critical point left and it also an aspect that concerns me a lot.
Why?
Because it indicates to me the suspect is not from Orlando or even Florida. Even worse the suspect might not even be from the USA.

I have suggested previously the suspect may even be back in his country of birth.
I hope I am way off the mark but it is my fear never the less.

 

[Myserty64]

As everyone knows the first 48 hours in a murder case is critical. After that trails start to go cold.

This case is 16 months old. A break through is needed this week. Next week the case is in the red zone and after that you can forget a solution in the near future.

Sorry, but that's the way it looks to me.

Just visit the Doe network. There are enough cold cases there to make your head spin.

 

[Beyond Belief]

In viewing the new video, please take a look at: the close ups at the gate. the two original we were shown, then one, and then a quick still when he has gone out of the camera view. there is a significant change inthe reflection in the last still in the rear window of the car. his reflection has either appeared or diappeared. this needs to be blown up and compared.

 

[UK Sleuth]

Well its good to see this thread and case is no longer cold, plenty of activity.

With regard to the suspect(no longer poi) whilst I think there is a lot of validity to the point that he may have left the area and even country I find it hard to believe that this person turned up in Orlando one day and was gone the next.

I'm fully convinced that this person had at least watched and was aware of Jennifer for a while.

They may have only been in the Orlando area a matter of weeks but that's long enough for someone to remember them whether it be wherever they have stayed, bars they have drank in, shops used, a co-worker if they worked, somebody in the local store.

I also feel the suspect has intimate knowledge of the area LE stated that the car had about the right amount of fuel in it.

He has driven pretty much straight to HOTG from somewhere local, he knew HOTG was there.

I feel if he wasnt from the area he would have driven the car further away.(just my gut why dump the car so near and then head back at least in the direction of Jks condo? This doesnt tally with being unrelated to mosaic or the immediate area.)

Remember we are all creatures of habit and providing the suspect hasn't been and gone in a day somebody somewhere in the local community will recognise that photo or has.

There may even be people who think it resembles someone they know but are not 100% and won't come forward, they should do of course.

When the Yorkshire Ripper was on the loose over here his work colleagues use to jokingly call him 'The ripper' because he looked so much like the photofit of the suspect.

None of his colleagues thought for a second that the quiet, mild mannered man could possibly be a savage killer and none of them reported him to the police!

The point im trying to make is in this world ignorance is bliss and whilst a number of us are intimately interested in this case there are thousands of people who live in the area who probably havent even looked at the pictures!

Its good this new footage has come out buy I entirely agree with left it should have happened one month in

My gut feeling remains that this is someone who has worked on the mosaic complex.

The two key factors for me are:

Jennifer thought someone was trying to break into her condo.
Jennifer had stated to her b/f she felt uneasy with some of the workmen around.

Then she dissappears.

For me the suspect looks like a decorator and he heads back in the direction of mosaic, also the hat/cap on his head is often used by decorators so they don't get paint in their hair and it is back to front so they can see what they are doing easier.

I'm not dismissing others opinions just giving my take on it.

 

[LaMer]

Hey Enrique

Good job emailing the Orlando PD.

One thing, I did view a local broadcast on the web, and it appears that the Kesse's had to "beg" Orlando PD to release that video.

Supposedly, that video was known to the Kesse's for over a year, and the Orlando PD mistakenly issued it to the media.

The media did not publish it per request from OrlandO PD.

But, Drew and JOyce KEsse finally demanded ORlando PD release that video. It sounds like Orlando PD was against it.

I agree with the Kesse's. Now, everyone knows JK was abducted, it wasn't rob, etc.

We all said the right things. Not one person tried to blame Rob, or act as if JK took off. Sure, Rob should be looked at, but, now we know for sure what time the car was dumped, and it doesn't look like Rob or anyone the Kesse's know.

I think this case is close. That dirtbag is going to get caught soon.

left

Hi All! It is SO great to see Everyone here!

I was so surprised to see the newly released video. WOW! I remember reading an article a long long time ago, where it was stated LE had video of the then 'poi' parking the car. Then it came out, the surveilance camera wasn't working, and the article disappeared off the face of the earth, so now I understand what happened eh? At least now, I know I wasn't crazy!

I never really thought Rob had anything to do with Jenn's disappearance. If some did, it was because he was suppose to have been late for work, or maybe it was a meeting. I forget!


Enrique, also a 'Thank You' to you too, for e-mailing LE! Also I am so sad for the Kesses, that they had to demand the release of the video. My heart aches for them, and I pray something will come of this to help find Jennifer.

I really don't understand LE's thinking on this. It seems time was lost on the possibility of someone's memory being sparked if they had noticed something. It was the same poi in the one released, so what's the difference? How would the poi have reacted any differently? :doh:

I have been trying to catch-up and read all the new posts, but I am in FL right now, but live in the NE, and have had trouble getting my computer on line here. I have read so many interesting posts this AM, but will have more time later to really take them all in.

One thing when talking about the time of the abduction, remember when Jenn's brother reached her condo that late morning, he told LE, the shower stall was still wet, indicating Jenn had showered that AM. Somewhere at the time, the time he arrived was given.

I did an experiment in FL at the time with my shower. However I am on the east coast, and of course there would be so many variables, as to the temp, time of year/temp, size of shower?, air-condtioner-ventilation-fan, enclosed not entirely enclosed, door open, etc. My shower stall was 'dry' in two hours time.--so many variable!

Also, about the poi's hat----I had found the 'exact' hat, in my opinion, at Dick's Sporting Goods store. It was a new hat they were featuring at the time, as I saw them hanging on poles at the check-out counter. I was checking out and about had a heart attack when I saw the hat. I did at the time post a link to Dick's site with the hat. I also called LE or maybe it was the 'tip line'. So maybe it was the hat, maybe not. At the time I was definetly convinced it was identical.

Questions I have are like others.
Why park the car there? It was as if it was being hidden, so it wouldn't be found immediately, yet it was so close to Jenn's condo. -or-
Does the poi live close by? To me, it doesn't appear Jenn drove anywhere on her own, ex to the airport or mailing center to mail the package that morning. If she was abducted near her car, remember her parking spot was in the back, if I remember right.

Why were none of Jenn's personal belongings ever found?

It's awful, but I keep thinking, Jenn might be being held somewhere. If so, the good thing is, she could still be alive.


I forget whose Mom it was, but it was the mother of a young gal who had been abducted, but her advice to get attention when in harms way was to yell FIRE!!!!! Everyone pays attention to hearing FIRE!

Praying and thinking of Jennifer and her family!

 

[leftcoast]

Hey la Mar

I believe that JK's brother arrived at around 3pm.

I believe that management checked JK's apartment at 11:15am (or so), and they actually went in and saw nothing amiss.

So, as it relates to the shower, it could have been from anytime.

It is hard to know how fast water evaporates in a shower. It depends on the temperature of the room, if the fan was on, if the bathroom door was open or closed, temperature inside the apartment, type of shower stall, etc.

One thing that is possible, Jk could have showered that am, and that is the most likely. I've always thought she could have been nabbed immediately after her shower, hence, the clothes on the bed, etc.

But, who knows? All of our guesses are just that. Also, some smart perp.'s will actually stage scenes, to confuse the time of the crime, and throw off LE. Moving the car, could be part of such a plan.

left

ps IF a maintanence worker, or neighbor, was stalking Jk, one would think that one could hear the shower go on in the apartment. I know for example, every apartment, I lived in, I could hear when my neighbors got home, when they showered, when they left. Not saying this is a conclusion, but, something to think about.