GUILTY FL - Lakeland girl, 14, charged with killing newborn son, 19 Sept 2012

[jjenny]

Any 14 yr old in FL who is/was pregnant, was raped, under the current definition of the law.

Do I think some kind of punishment should be given? Yes I do, but I want that punishment to be tempered by WHO got the child pregnant, WHY she was so unable to admit it to anyone, and WHY her mother didn't seek medical care for her, before this horrendous act happened.

If 13/14 year old is having sex with someone her own age, both of these youngsters are engaging in illegal behavior. Each one of them is a victim and a perp at the same time. Obviously that makes for a very stupid law, IMO.

 

[Mama-cita]

Any 14 yr old in FL who is/was pregnant, was raped, under the current definition of the law.

Do I think some kind of punishment should be given? Yes I do, but I want that punishment to be tempered by WHO got the child pregnant, WHY she was so unable to admit it to anyone, and WHY her mother didn't seek medical care for her, before this horrendous act happened.

And what if it was her 14 year old "boyfriend." Kids have sex younger and younger these days. If she was impregnated by a peer, does that make a difference? Does it make her more or less responsible? I am asking honestly because I am honestly trying to ascertain your point of view. I agree mom has a responsibility. There is just NO WAY you don't notice that a girl of such small stature is carrying a 9#4oz baby. That is delusion of Cindy Anthony proportions.

 

[Cappuccino]

And what if it was her 14 year old "boyfriend." Kids have sex younger and younger these days. If she was impregnated by a peer, does that make a difference? Does it make her more or less responsible? I am asking honestly because I am honestly trying to ascertain your point of view. I agree mom has a responsibility. There is just NO WAY you don't notice that a girl of such small stature is carrying a 9#4oz baby. That is delusion of Cindy Anthony proportions.

Yes it would make a difference if she was having sex with a bf her own age. IF. IF.

Little word, with big connotations. We don't know what happened here, so I see no reason to jump to conclusions that she was or wasn't preyed on by an adult. Let's not rush to judgement either way on that one.

What's clear is that she was underage, pregnant, and apparently so unable to tell anyone of her predicament that she locked herself in a bathroom and delivered the baby alone with a pair of scissors. And then killed him and hid his body under her bed, apparently thinking he would magically disappear forever.

This is not an adult crime, its not a crime committed by a juvenile who shows any level of adult type criminal sophistication. Its a horrible crime committed by a desparate young girl who didn't have the sense or the guidance to do anything better. In short, let the juvenile courts deal with her, that's what they're there for.

 

[peeples]

I more think of juvenile courts being useful for shop lifting..that's about it, and MOO but i think more serious crimes should NOT be treated with a slap on the wrist. I WISH juvenile records were publicly available, so we could see the percentage of those coddled children who re-offend and how many of those re-offenses are more serious than the last.
MOO

 

[Mama-cita]

I more think of juvenile courts being useful for shop lifting..that's about it, and MOO but i think more serious crimes should NOT be treated with a slap on the wrist. I WISH juvenile records were publicly available, so we could see the percentage of those coddled children who re-offend and how many of those re-offenses are more serious than the last.
MOO

:clap: I agree 100%. We know well that sociopaths can be identified very young. If someone can kill a defenseless human being in such a brutal and callous manner then what the heck else are they capable of? If someone had caught Ted Bundy that young I woulda hope they would have locked him up and threw away the key.

I have to add that the adorability of the kitten in your avatar is killing me, too cute!

 

[Shelby2]

Well as horrible as what she did is, I can't compare her to Ted Bundy.
A child of 14 is simply not capable of making adult decisions. Apparently, neither were the adults in the house.

 

[Flutterby80]

:clap: I agree 100%. We know well that sociopaths can be identified very young. If someone can kill a defenseless human being in such a brutal and callous manner then what the heck else are they capable of? If someone had caught Ted Bundy that young I woulda hope they would have locked him up and threw away the key.

I have to add that the adorability of the kitten in your avatar is killing me, too cute!

I am wondering if a sociopath would choose to endure the physical pain to herself that giving childbirth alone to a 9+ pound baby would cause. Would a sociopath not take a route that would cause the least physical pain to herself? Can any of our members who are well versed in sociopathy answer this question for me please?

Thanks!

 

[Shelby2]

Sociopaths are very calculating, even at a young age. Recently there was a case of two thirteen year old boys who killed on of their grandmothers with a hatchet to the head. Then they stole her car, wiped it down for fingerprints, put the key and jewelry in the car, hoping it would get stolen and therefore whoever stole it would be blamed for her murder. That to me is sociopathic behavior. I am not ready to label this girl as such.

 

[Wendy101]

I am sorry but, a 8 , or even 7 year old understands if they were stab a baby in the head with scissors the baby will be hurt. Also, to open the scissors up like pliers.. the sharpness on the scissors would cut the baby.. so were they cuts or were they actual stab wounds?? That girl knew what she was doing. She wanted that baby to be dead, locked herself in the bathroom with a pair of scissors as her weapon of choice.

These children that are committing MURDER have to be judge harshly.. The next girl that decideds to have sex and fall pregnant, will follow suit if there is no just punishment. I am sick and tired of all these youth gettin a slap on the wrist for MURDER.. Because of their age..

most gangs now get the underage members to do the killings.. Anyone wana guess why?? Yup, no or lack of punishment.

As for this girl , regardless if she was raped, or if she was just enjoying her sexuality, ended up pregnant. She choose NOT to get an abortion, she CHOSE not to give birth in that bathroom and secret the baby out to a place someone would find him, she CHOSE to MURDER him!

This girl is no victim in my eyes, never will be. The DEAD baby is the ONLY victim in this case as far as I am concerned.

This girl also LIED to her mother. I do not hold this mother reesponsible for her daughters LYING.. What could the mother do, tie the daughter up and make her pee on a stick infront of her...?? the mother probably did notice her daughter was pregnant.. She asked, the daughter lies.. What is the mother to do.. Get physical with the daughter and disrobe her to have a look? Then what? The mother has no rights regarding her daughters pregnancy... She could TRY to guide her to to the right thing... BUT the bottom line, it is up the the MOTHER who is pregnant with the child..to do what SHE wants to do... in this case MURDER... the ony person at fault here is the murdering daughter.

 

[Flutterby80]

I am sorry but, a 8 , or even 7 year old understands if they were stabs baby in the head with scissors the baby will be hurt. Also, to open the scissors uo like pliers.. the sharpness on the scissors wiuld cut the baby.. so were they cuts or wwere they actuak stab wounds??That girl knew what she was doing. She wanted that baby to be dead, locked herself in the bathroom with a pair of scissors as her weapon of choice.

These children that are committing MURDER have to be judge harshly.. The next girl that decideds to have sex and fall pregnant, will fallow suit if there is no just punishment. I a, sick and tired of all these youth gettin a slap on the wrist for MURDER.. Because of their age..

most gangs now get the underage members to do the killings.. Anyone wana guess why?? Yup, no or lack of punishment.

As for this girl , regsrdless if she was raped, or if she was just enjoying her sexuality, ended up pregnant. She choose NOT to get an abortion, she CHOSE not to give birth in that bathroom and secret the baby out to a place someone would find him, she CHOSE to MURDER him!

This girl is no victim in my eyes, never will be. The DEAD baby is the ONLY victim in this case as far as I am concerned.

Well I'm not sure if she didn't choose to have the baby and drop him off somewhere, and neither are you. That may have been her initial plan, but until you go through childbirth, you have noooooo idea the pain involved. She may have freaked out and resorted to the scissors.

Of course, she may have planned to brutally murder him all along too.

My point is, none of us know her intent. We don't know whether she became pregnant because she had sex with a child her own age, whether she was raped by someone older or what. We don't know a lot of things.

I understand abhoring the death of this poor, innocent baby. I don't think any of us would be here if we didn't feel this way in general.

What I don't understand is the willingness to jump to conclusions before the facts are known. If/when it becomes record that she killed her baby in cold blood, as opposed to some sort of panicked psychotic break with reality, I will jump on the "charge her as an adult" bandwagon.

FYI, I am NOT making excuses for her. Whatever her story, she will be, and should be, punished. To what degree, that remains to be seen.

My opinion only.

 

[lisalei321]

Well I'm not sure if she didn't choose to have the baby and drop him off somewhere, and neither are you. That may have been her initial plan, but until you go through childbirth, you have noooooo idea the pain involved. She may have freaked out and resorted to the scissors.

Of course, she may have planned to brutally murder him all along too.

My point is, none of us know her intent. We don't know whether she became pregnant because she had sex with a child her own age, whether she was raped by someone older or what. We don't know a lot of things.

I understand abhoring the death of this poor, innocent baby. I don't think any of us would be here if we didn't feel this way in general.

What I don't understand is the willingness to jump to conclusions before the facts are known. If/when it becomes record that she killed her baby in cold blood, as opposed to some sort of panicked psychotic break with reality, I will jump on the "charge her as an adult" bandwagon.

FYI, I am NOT making excuses for her. Whatever her story, she will be, and should be, punished. To what degree, that remains to be seen.

My opinion only.

Ditto^^^

I think more needs to be known about this.

 

[Shelby2]

No. Just SAY this girl gets a 'slap on the wrist'. No way would that cause other girls to do the same thing, thinking there would be no consequences.
And I DO blame the mother for not noticing, this girl was 14! She should have brought her to the Doctor!!!

 

[jjenny]

No. Just SAY this girl gets a 'slap on the wrist'. No way would that cause other girls to do the same thing, thinking there would be no consequences.
And I DO blame the mother for not noticing, this girl was 14! She should have brought her to the Doctor!!!

I am not following your logic here.
Why is that you think it wouldn't cause other girls to do the same thing, thinking they could get away with it?

 

[Flutterby80]

I am not following your logic here.
Why is that you think it wouldn't cause other girls to do the same thing, thinking they could get away with it?

If she was thinking of consequences, she wouldn't have gotten pregnant in the first place. She wouldn't have left her baby in her room for several days.

Fourteen year olds often aren't champions of thinking of consequences.

Do you think the next fourteen year old girl who is going through this will stop and say "Wait! That one girl got in big trouble over in that other state that one time, so I better do things differently"?

 

[Mama-cita]

If she was thinking of consequences, she wouldn't have gotten pregnant in the first place. She wouldn't have left her baby in her room for several days.

Fourteen year olds often aren't champions of thinking of consequences.

Do you think the next fourteen year old girl who is going through this will stop and say "Wait! That one girl got in big trouble over in that other state that one time, so I better do things differently"?

I don't know any 14 year old that would stab a baby with scissors and strangle it to death. That's the red flag for me. In my nursing career I took care of 14 year old pregnant moms. The fact that this girl could do this is a huge red flag.

 

[Shelby2]

I am not following your logic here.
Why is that you think it wouldn't cause other girls to do the same thing, thinking they could get away with it?

Because teenage girls get pregnant all the time. They have abortions, or give up the baby, or keep the baby. (I think it is rare that a girl actually kills her baby, but I don't know the statistics.) I can't imagine a girl thinking this route would be easier. I think most girls would find the idea of killing their newborn abhorrent. Whether they would get away with it or not, one has to be in a certain mind-set to even consider such a thing, and I don't think that mind-set can be changed by simply knowing that another girl got away with it.
Just my opinion.

 

[Shelby2]

I don't know any 14 year old that would stab a baby with scissors and strangle it to death. That's the red flag for me. In my nursing career I took care of 14 year old pregnant moms. The fact that this girl could do this is a huge red flag.

Please don't take this to mean I in any way condone what she did. But did these other moms have support from their families? I am just wondering.

 

[Ausgirl]

Seeing as nobody here has any idea of this child's family circumstances or state of mental health, nothing, it's a both horrible and presumptive to be pointing at her and crying' evil murderess' IMO.

My daughter is just this age. She's very loved and we have a good relationship. No way would she hide a pregnancy from me, though she knows full well I'd throw a monumental fit if she a/ had sex, b/ did so without protection.

No way would my child be in the position to want to cut her own baby out, or strangle and hide it.

Why? We because we have a good relationship. I have done my utmost to make sure she knows she can be open and honest with me, and with herself. And f it came down to it and she was pregnant, she would have no reason to be terrified or hide anything.

That this little girl felt so alone and desperate breaks my heart. It's devastating that her innocent little baby was killed by the person who gave him life. It's wrong, and terrible, and very sad.

But we don't know what pressure that girl was under, whether she has a severe mental illness, whether was molested or not, whether her mother or anyone else in her home was abusive, we don't know anything to be in a position to pass judgement on her.

What I -do- know is, a child with a sound mind and a safe life, from a loving home, is way more unlikely to do something like this than a child who has none of those things.

 

[MsFacetious]

Sheriff Judd said on Nancy they have a very good idea of who the father of the baby is, they believe it is another 14 year old.

The reason they initially believed she had been brutally raped is because she used SCISSORS to pry the baby out of her.
Cutting her vaginal wall in the process.

 

[jjenny]

Any 14 yr old in FL who is/was pregnant, was raped, under the current definition of the law.

Do I think some kind of punishment should be given? Yes I do, but I want that punishment to be tempered by WHO got the child pregnant, WHY she was so unable to admit it to anyone, and WHY her mother didn't seek medical care for her, before this horrendous act happened.

The law is gender neutral. A 14 year old having sex with another 14 year old is engaging in illegal behavior herself. And apparently sheriff believes its another minor who get her pregnant. And so, if two 14 year old are having sex, prosecution can charge each one of them.
That makes for a pretty stupid situation, in which each minor is both a victim and a perp.
So prosecution normally doesn't pursue these type of cases.