FL FL - Michelle Parker, 33, Orlando, 17 Nov 2011 - #21

[Thor]

If it was a random car jacker, then I don't believe he would have faked the text. He would have just tossed the cell or taken the battery out and sold it later in another city.

But Dale, that is another story altogether. I believe he was somewhat panicked, because he saw that text from her brother, and he worried that her family was going to start missing her earlier than he thought they were. And imo, he still had her hidden somewhere on his property or in his truck or workplace. He KNEW that they knew that the last place she had been was his condo, so he needed to buy himself some time. And it worked.

The reasoning above here is that if something is inconsistent with logical reasoning then Dale must have been panicking, and yet this whole affair gives us a perp that is not panicking, he hides a body, he hides evidence, (all of them possibly) and the police can't find any concrete evidence of it all. IMO No, the perp does not panic, and he is not in a hurry either, no one is coming to look for Michelle just yet, not even close. He plans his moves carefully and methodically, he makes no apparent mistakes ... he does not panic.

 

[SleuthDecay]

How do we know Michelle went right up to the door upon her arrival? Maybe the twins had fallen asleep and she sat in the car playing a game on or taking pictures of herself with her cell phone (or whatever) until 4.

Has Dale himself come back and said oops, he was wrong about the time?

[BBM] That remark seems very catty and unnecessary. It makes me not want to take this post seriously. JMO

 

[Skully]

From what I can see, they may even share a tower. I think I saved tower links for Orange County in Caylee's case. I'll do a quick search to see if I can locate it.

I read or heard he had an eye witness that he was at Sr's with the kids at 4:30. So the 4:26 ping is on Hoffner heading West, which would be the correct direction if going to Sr or the Mall to dump the hummer.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Bern, the cell tower off of Hoffner would be pinged even if going over the Nela. There's another one in the Oak Ridge area right by I4, which is near where those divers were searching that canal near Dale Sr's other home. So basically I'm thinking that Dale could have been over the Nela & just about to his dad's when the cell pinged off of the tower near Hoffner. That whole area would utilize the Hoffner tower. Check out this link...

http://www.city-data.com/towers/cell-Orlando-Florida.html

 

[Skully]

Bern, the cell tower off of Hoffner would be pinged even if going over the Nela. There's another one in the Oak Ridge area right by I4, which is near where those divers were searching that canal near Dale Sr's other home. So basically I'm thinking that Dale could have been over the Nela & just about to his dad's when the cell pinged off of the tower near Hoffner. That whole area would utilize the Hoffner tower. Check out this link...

http://www.city-data.com/towers/cell-Orlando-Florida.html

Just so I understand this correctly, the ping on Hoffner could be pinging East of where Dale actually was, pulling up to his Dads place or very near it. But the cell tower makes it look like it is behind him (the cell phone) and he is actually West of it?

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Just so I understand this correctly, the ping on Hoffner could be pinging East of where Dale actually was, pulling up to his Dads place or very near it. But the cell tower makes it look like it is behind him (the cell phone) and he is actually West of it?

It would depend which tower that cell was closest to. Since we know the ping was in the Hoffner area, it's pretty safe to say it pinged from the Hoffner tower. The Hoffner tower is located between Hoffner & Nela. The next tower it looks like is near I4 in the Oak Ridge area. So, I'd Dale arrived at his dad's at or around 4:30, and if he was coming from his home off of Goldenrod, then in all seriousness that ping off the Hoffner tower could be him. Bern, check out the map at that city-data site. It shows 3 main towers in that area for cellular antenna usage. View it large & close. If its not Dale, then the perp would have to be somebody driving the same path. Literally. Not saying it's Dale, still don't feel comfortable stating that, but the probability & possibility is there.

 

[telemag]

[BBM]

Ok, but you've already speculated that Michelle was the one who sent the text because she didn't feel like giving DE a ride, so she lied to him. There are problems with that theory, IMO. Unless someone can address those problems convincingly, I just can't believe that Michelle sent the 4:26 text.

What problems?

 

[Jersey*Girl]

It just now dawned on me that people might be confused as to what a ping is. When someone informs a cell pinged in a certain area, it doesn't necessarily mean an exact address. The ping itself is off of a tower. Only the location of the tower is concrete. The cell that pinged would need to be investigated in the area it pinged from. Where I live, we have a tower 7-8 miles from my home. My phone could ping from that tower.

 

[Thor]

It would depend which tower that cell was closest to. Since we know the ping was in the Hoffner area, it's pretty safe to say it pinged from the Hoffner tower. The Hoffner tower is located between Hoffner & Nela. The next tower it looks like is near I4 in the Oak Ridge area. So, I'd Dale arrived at his dad's at or around 4:30, and if he was coming from his home off of Goldenrod, then in all seriousness that ping off the Hoffner tower could be him. Bern, check out the map at that city-data site. It shows 3 main towers in that area for cellular antenna usage. View it large & close. If its not Dale, then the perp would have to be somebody driving the same path. Literally. Not saying it's Dale, still don't feel comfortable stating that, but the probability & possibility is there.

Anxiously awaiting an answer here ...

 

[katydid23]

The reasoning above here is that if something is inconsistent with logical reasoning then Dale must have been panicking, and yet this whole affair gives us a perp that is not panicking, he hides a body, he hides evidence, (all of them possibly) and the police can't find any concrete evidence of it all. IMO No, the perp does not panic, and he is not in a hurry either, no one is coming to look for Michelle just yet, not even close. He plans his moves carefully and methodically, he makes no apparent mistakes ... he does not panic.

Well we will agree to disagree then. Imo,anyone who has just killed their ex would be somewhat in a state of panic. Even if they carried things out in an orderly fashion, they would be emotionally hyped up and somewhat stressed.

And if you look back at my OP, I said "I believe he was somewhat panicked, because he saw that text from her brother,..."

So nowhere did I say he was PANICKED and acting irrationally. I simply stated that while he was acting in an organized fashion, and handling his loose ends, he got the text from her brother. asking her where she was, which might put him in a 'somewhat panicked' state, because he was in the middle of his murderous actions.

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Hoffner cell tower

5794 Hoffner Avenue (Lat: 28.478278 Lon: -81.307556), Type: Pole, Structure height: 29.6 m, Call Sign: KNKA253
Assigned Frequencies: 880.020 MHz, 880.020 MHz, 880.020 MHz, 880.020 MHz, 880.020 MHz, 880.020 MHz, 835.020 MHz, 835.020 MHz, 835.020 MHz, 835.020 MHz... (+14 more)
Grant Date: 10/05/2004, Expiration Date: 10/01/2014
Registrant: At&t Mobility LLC, 1120 20th Street, Nw, Suite 1000, Washington, DC 20036, Phone: (202) 457-2055, Fax: (202) 457-3074, Email: [email protected]

Read more: http://www.city-data.com/towers/cell-Orlando-Florida.html#ixzz1wxxesjVY

 

[katydid23]

You assuming a scenario where the kids fall asleep in the car and Michelle knocks at Dale's door after leaving the kids unattended in the car. I am assuming a scenario where the kids are awake and MP brings them to Dale's condo. Either way, it is hard to imagine IMO Dale's reason in killing her right there or soon after with the kids present, asleep or not as opposite to another day. If an altercation took place, and he killed her or abducted her right there, the logistical problems become surreal here and too many to enumerate.

What logistical problems? They are not insurmountable, imo. We have given you several scenarios in which he could have carried out those logistically. Do you have reasons that they could not have worked?

 

[Jersey*Girl]

Anxiously awaiting an answer here ...

I'm up on the air, Thor, bc there's so many antenna towers on that very same area. I'd really have to sit down, take my time, and map it out BUT including main cell towers as well as antenna towers. I'm thinking yes, it's possible. I'm not an expert in this area, though, but I am somewhat tech savvy. Please don't take that out of context.

 

[Thor]

Well we will agree to disagree then. Imo,anyone who has just killed their ex would be somewhat in a state of panic. Even if they carried things out in an orderly fashion, they would be emotionally hyped up and somewhat stressed.

And if you look back at my OP, I said "I believe he was somewhat panicked, because he saw that text from her brother,..."

So nowhere did I say he was PANICKED and acting irrationally. I simply stated that while he was acting in an organized fashion, and handling his loose ends, he got the text from her brother. asking her where she was, which might put him in a 'somewhat panicked' state, because he was in the middle of his murderous actions.

IMO Nobody can know with certainty what was going through the perp's mind at the time, list of all panic level, unless one is there to check the perp's pulse. A degree of anxiety is not inconsistent with not panicking since the perp seem to have disposed of the body and all evidence of the crime so efficiently as to leave possibly no traces behind. Also there is no reason for him to be in a hurry necessarily since no one is coming to look for Michelle anytime soon, (unless he needs to establish an alibi and that opens up a whole lot of separate issues) therefore less reason for panicking.

 

[Thor]

I'm up on the air, Thor, bc there's so many antenna towers on that very same area. I'd really have to sit down, take my time, and map it out BUT including main cell towers as well as antenna towers. I'm thinking yes, it's possible. I'm not an expert in this area, though, but I am somewhat tech savvy. Please don't take that out of context.

I was just being somewhat humorous, take your time, you and Bern are doing outstanding sleuthing here, don't let me interfere further.

 

[katydid23]

You assuming a scenario where the kids fall asleep in the car and Michelle knocks at Dale's door after leaving the kids unattended in the car. I am assuming a scenario where the kids are awake and MP brings them to Dale's condo. Either way, it is hard to imagine IMO Dale's reason in killing her right there or soon after with the kids present, asleep or not as opposite to another day. If an altercation took place, and he killed her or abducted her right there, the logistical problems become surreal here and too many to enumerate.

She was in his driveway or directly in front of his condo. She did not need to leave them unattended at all. He probably saw her from the window, as he was expecting her any moment.

As for his reasoning, I think there are a few possibilities. One, it is pretty coincidental that within an hour of her going missing, Dale was seeing himself on the court TV show for the first time. He never saw the edited version, and he looks and acts like an idiot. And he may have seen and heard the things Michelle said about him on national television, right then for the first time. When you are actually taping the show, you probably miss a lot of what the other people are saying and doing. And just then, that afternoon, he was seeing what Michelle said for the first time. I think that made him very angry. Also, the day before she went missing, Michelle was apparently looking at homes online, that she could move into with her kids. There is speculation that she was moving in with her new boyfriend. So i have wondered if maybe she gloated to Dale that afternoon, about the fact she was moving in with her new guy, and how much the kids liked him and all. ?

 

[katydid23]

IMO Nobody can know with certainty what was going through the perp's mind at the time, list of all panic level, unless one is there to check the perp's pulse. A degree of anxiety is not inconsistent with not panicking since the perp seem to have disposed of the body and all evidence of the crime so efficiently as to leave possibly no traces behind. Also there is no reason for him to be in a hurry necessarily since no one is coming to look for Michelle anytime soon, (unless he needs to establish an alibi and that opens up a whole lot of separate issues) therefore less reason for panicking.

But he did not know if anyone was going to come and look for Michelle soon or not. He knew that her family knew that she had been there , last thing before she went missing. So how did he know that her brother or father might not have come and asked where she was, and looked for her Hummer or not?

And there would have been plenty of reason sfor him to be in a hurry, because according to many of our scenarios, her Hummer was most likely still sitting in his garage at the time that text was sent. So he would have been kind of panicky, imo. But that would not prevent him from successfully throwing away the evidence and following through with his checklist.

 

[southern_comfort]

[BBM] That remark seems very catty and unnecessary. It makes me not want to take this post seriously. JMO

It wasn't meant to be. It looks like that's an activity she engaged in frequently. I was simply throwing out reasonable ideas of what she might have done to kill time in the car for a bit if she didn't want to wake the twins and didn't want to spend time chatting with Dale. I also mentioned playing games on her phone, but I have no idea whether she did much of that. We do know she liked to take pictures of herself.

 

[Jazzmaster]

IMO Nobody can know with certainty what was going through the perp's mind at the time, list of all panic level, unless one is there to check the perp's pulse. A degree of anxiety is not inconsistent with not panicking since the perp seem to have disposed of the body and all evidence of the crime so efficiently as to leave possibly no traces behind. Also there is no reason for him to be in a hurry necessarily since no one is coming to look for Michelle anytime soon, (unless he needs to establish an alibi and that opens up a whole lot of separate issues) therefore less reason for panicking.

I agree. I think Dale knew the 426 text bought him at least a couple of hours. He most likely knew LE wouldn't be called until she didn't show up for work at 730. As she normally arrived early for her shift...I would anticipate he gave himself until 8 or so to hide evidence before LE was notified. This means he needed to be back at Rose by 8:30 at latest. Wouldn't you say? So that gave him about 3.5 hours to hide Michelle. Would he think woods or sinkhole or marsh? Burial? What would be his first instinct on where to hide Michelle? And if she was taken from the condo alive...how long did he keep her under his control and how?

 

[Thor]

She was in his driveway or directly in front of his condo. She did not need to leave them unattended at all. He probably saw her from the window, as he was expecting her any moment.

As for his reasoning, I think there are a few possibilities. One, it is pretty coincidental that within an hour of her going missing, Dale was seeing himself on the court TV show for the first time. He never saw the edited version, and he looks and acts like an idiot. And he may have seen and heard the things Michelle said about him on national television, right then for the first time. When you are actually taping the show, you probably miss a lot of what the other people are saying and doing. And just then, that afternoon, he was seeing what Michelle said for the first time. I think that made him very angry. Also, the day before she went missing, Michelle was apparently looking at homes online, that she could move into with her kids. There is speculation that she was moving in with her new boyfriend. So i have wondered if maybe she gloated to Dale that afternoon, about the fact she was moving in with her new guy, and how much the kids liked him and all. ?

That is a motive for killing her, and there are more then one if you think about it. But why on that very day and under those circumstances? Why not tomorrow, or next week, when the kids are not in the immediate area and he is not the last one to have seen Michelle? Why not at night, in the dark, when few people are around? IMO