FL - Sara Morales, 35, shot dead by motorcyclist she hit with car, Orange City, 20 Nov 2021

[Cryptic]

Yes, I thought as much. I posted and excerpt where is said that the person legally there has no obligation to retreat when met by force. (paraphrased). I took that to mean that she had ever right to point her gun at them and tell them to get off her property.

Was she met by force? Somebody inquiring about deliberately damaged property is not "force".

There is alot of bad SYG information out there promulgated by You Tube self defense "gurus". Even in SYG states, pointing weapons at trespassers is simply not a good idea. That goes double when one knows that the trespasser is inquiring about damaged property.

 

[Cryptic]

It's also reasonable to assume that at least one of the men could have gotten inside the house.

I also suspect had Sara's boyfriend or father done the same thing, he'd be considered a hero.

One cannot point weapons at people based on what they "could do". For example: What horrible things could you do? Or, for that matter, what horrible things could I do?

There is a lot of bad self defense information out there. Pointing weapons at people based on what they might / could do is not a good idea. Likewise, pointing weapons at trespassers inquiring about damaged property is not a good idea either.

 

[PremeditatedCrime]

One cannot point weapons at people based on what they "could do". For example, what horrible things could you do? Or, for that matter, I what horrible things could I do?

There is a lot of bad self defense information out there. Pointing weapons at people based on what they might / could do is not a good idea. Likewise, pointing weapons at trespassers inquiring about damaged property is not a good idea either.

It's common sense that any woman (or even man) followed home by three men is in danger; it's also common sense that mother and daughter could be in danger. It's perfectly reasonable to assume Sara, her mother and/or daughter were in danger.

 

[Warwick1991]

There is no proof that Ms. Morales intentionally damaged or hit any motorcycles. It is exceptionally difficult in any collision to establish what someone was thinking and whether their actions were deliberate. In this regard, we only have the point of view of those who are alive.

There is no proof that Ms. Morales first entered her house, and then went outside after obtaining a firearm. Some accounts in this thread indicate that Ms. Morales never reached the house, and was shot after she got out of her car.

 

[moonriverfarm]

I imagine that the men will not use SYG, but just cite self defense. Even if the men were trespassing, one cannot make trespassing in and of itself a capital crime- as some other individuals just found out.

In the end, the deceased did not give prosecutors a lot to work with:

- Intentionally damages the property of another. Leaves the scene. Is followed .
- Enters her house, presumably to obtain a weapon. Goes back outside
- Announces that she is female, points out that the men followed her, then orders them to "leave her alone".
- She then points the weapon at somebody who might have been trespassing.

Though the order of the last two steps maybe reversed, the over all circumstances would not justify a male's actions, nor should it justify a female's actions either.

I am not giving the men a "blank check". They should face some criminal charges if they provoked Sara, by say blocking a public road and not letting her pass. Likewise, if the parties knew each other and the incident was an avoidable continuation of past drama.

I thought it was determined that there was zero damage to the man's motorcycle? So she did not damage his property.

 

[Cryptic]

I thought it was determined that there was zero damage to the man's motorcycle? So she did not damage his property.

The police describe it is a "hit and run" crash.
Watch: Bodycam shows tense moments after library assistant was shot in road rage incident

 

[Cryptic]

I would be terrified if one man who was abusive to me followed me home and then confronted me on my property, let alone three.

So would I. Then again, if I intentionally damaged his property and then drove off....

 

[Cryptic]

The police also stated that Sara entered the house, called 911, and then went outside with a gun to confront the men. We now know that Sara probably exited her CAR with the gun, as per Sara's 911 call.

So why should we believe anything that the police state, regarding this specific case?

I am going with the police until clearly proven otherwise.
-

 

[Sillybilly]

ADMIN NOTE:

This post lands at random.

When a Mod or an Admin removes a post, it is for a violation of Websleuths TOS, not for some nefarious reason.

Posts get removed if they are to a non approved source. If the 911 call is available via MSM or from LE, it is allowed.

To continue to discuss the content of the removed post and challenge moderation is not allowed. To suggest WS staff have some ulterior motive in removing a post is totally insulting and highly offensive to our hard working staff.

 

[cvaldez1975]

The police state that she pointed the weapon at the men and admonished them for following her and told them to "leave her alone".

Watch: Bodycam shows tense moments after library assistant was shot in road rage incident – WFTV

but thats what AD told them, and i dont believe it.

 

[JayWill]

Was she met by force? Somebody inquiring about deliberately damaged property is not "force".

There is alot of bad SYG information out there promulgated by You Tube self defense "gurus". Even in SYG states, pointing weapons at trespassers is simply not a good idea. That goes double when one knows that the trespasser is inquiring about damaged property.

How was she not met by force? She was shot dead. Does it take three men to inquire about alleged 'damage'?

 

[JayWill]

The police describe it is a "hit and run" crash.
Watch: Bodycam shows tense moments after library assistant was shot in road rage incident

Respectfully, we are still waiting for the link to the SYG law that says that you have to be inside your house to claim self defense as you have claimed.

 

[steeltowngirl]

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Here is a video of his arrest in front of Ms. Morales’ house.​

Just found this case. Is that his motorcycle in the background of the video? Cannot have been much (if any) damage if he drove it to her house. Did the bike even drop when it was allegedly hit? Why didn’t he just get her license plate number, then call the police to report the incident? If SM and AD were truly strangers to one another, and there’s not more to this story, his story stinks.

 

[Tee7077]

Just found this case. Is that his motorcycle in the background of the video? Cannot have been much (if any) damage if he drove it to her house. Did the bike even drop when it was allegedly hit? Why didn’t he just get her license plate number, then call the police to report the incident? If SM and AD were truly strangers to one another, and there’s not more to this story, his story stinks.

Your reasoning is that because the bike didn't drop she didn't commit a crime by leaving the scene?

 

[steeltowngirl]

Your reasoning is that because the bike didn't drop she didn't commit a crime by leaving the scene?

My reasoning is based on the little that we know as factual. She is deceased and cannot tell her side. I don’t know why she left the scene. Perhaps he threatened her. What I am reading is this guy allegedly chased her down to her home due to an accident (or he claims intentional hit) that damaged his bike. And he then killed her. I see little damage to the bike, and it was still driveable. He apparently was not injured. I’ve ridden long enough to know that if a car hits a bike, it’s going down. Whatever minor damage may have happened, it wasn’t worth chasing a woman down, and killing her.

 

[cvaldez1975]

Just found this case. Is that his motorcycle in the background of the video? Cannot have been much (if any) damage if he drove it to her house. Did the bike even drop when it was allegedly hit? Why didn’t he just get her license plate number, then call the police to report the incident? If SM and AD were truly strangers to one another, and there’s not more to this story, his story stinks.

its not his bike, it is the bike of someone who lives at the home, possibly her bf. htere was no injury or damage. they did get her tag number and decided to follow her for unknown reasons, and i agree, this story is sus af and i dont believe she hit him, there is no ones word but AD and his friends.

 

[tara83]

Your reasoning is that because the bike didn't drop she didn't commit a crime by leaving the scene?

The point to me is they had her plate number and should have let the police hand it.Zero need to follow her home.

 

[Gardenista]

its not his bike, it is the bike of someone who lives at the home, possibly her bf. htere was no injury or damage. they did get her tag number and decided to follow her for unknown reasons, and i agree, this story is sus af and i dont believe she hit him, there is no ones word but AD and his friends.

No, that's his bike in the video and the guy on the 911 call didn't even know his name, so they weren't friends.

 

[Razz]

How was she not met by force? She was shot dead. Does it take three men to inquire about alleged 'damage'?

The men should never have followed her. They had her license plate # and they reported that to police. Police should have handled it and NOT these three men. What were these men hoping to achieve?
Hold her down until police got there?!
<modsnip>

 

[JayWill]

No, that's his bike in the video and the guy on the 911 call didn't even know his name, so they weren't friends.

So, why do you think that one of the chasers who did not know him, would join in chasing her? What would you do if three men on motorcycles were chasing you to your home?