Fleet and Priscilla White speak out

I already looked up who can do what and when. The only stumbling block I hit was exhumation has to be requested in writing by "next of kin".

My understanding of the legal definition of next of kin means closest blood relative - parents, children - unless there are none (as in this case) and then the pecking order is unclear. Hence the question. I was just wondering if anyone knew.

Aside: a family can request a private exhumation in Georgia but the request must be approved in writing by the next of kin and all expenses are the responsibility of the family. Of course if the family wants to skip the expense they can petition the state blah blah blah
 
I already looked up who can do what and when. The only stumbling block I hit was exhumation has to be requested in writing by "next of kin".

My understanding of the legal definition of next of kin means closest blood relative - parents, children - unless there are none (as in this case) and then the pecking order is unclear. Hence the question. I was just wondering if anyone knew.

Aside: a family can request a private exhumation in Georgia but the request must be approved in writing by the next of kin and all expenses are the responsibility of the family. Of course if the family wants to skip the expense they can petition the state blah blah blah

Next of kin would be JR first, then BR. Think they wanna dig her up? LOL!
 
BPD could have requested to exhume the body; the Ramseys could have refused. Then, BPD could have taken the matter before a judge, and if they could show cause, have had the body exhumed regardless. The Grand Jury could have had the body exhumed.
No one wanted it done.
...

AK
 
BPD could have requested to exhume the body; the Ramseys could have refused. Then, BPD could have taken the matter before a judge, and if they could show cause, have had the body exhumed regardless. The Grand Jury could have had the body exhumed.
No one wanted it done.
...

AK

I believe the BPD did want the body exhumed. But it was up to the DA to obtain a warrant from a judge. He was the one who refused.
 
I have attached the latest legal pleadings to the second post of this thread.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Fleet and Priscilla White speak out

Legally speaking, the judge's determination makes sense. Morally speaking, it is a hot mess. But, They left it open for the Whites to ask for the documents after the case is closed. I do not see why a judge could not simply take and redact any documents for case-sensitive data. Everybody does it. Laziness?
 
I believe the BPD did want the body exhumed. But it was up to the DA to obtain a warrant from a judge. He was the one who refused.
yes. BPD had everything in place. the GBI in ATL had no objections and in fact was eager to participate. the intent was to begin at 3am, to re-examine the "stun gun" marks and JB's pelvic area, and to have the child re-buried within hours. the sole family notification requirement was a phone call as the backhoe was firing up. AH waffled yet again, fearing unfavorable publicity, and the opportunity was lost
 
Legally speaking, the judge's determination makes sense. Morally speaking, it is a hot mess. But, They left it open for the Whites to ask for the documents after the case is closed. I do not see why a judge could not simply take and redact any documents for case-sensitive data. Everybody does it. Laziness?
Some of the JBR case documents, pertaining to NK, were released 12 years ago; the judge's ruling & order:

http://web.archive.org/web/20030422104519/http://www.holoworld.com/ramseyreports/RulingandOrder.pdf
 
yes. BPD had everything in place. the GBI in ATL had no objections and in fact was eager to participate. the intent was to begin at 3am, to re-examine the "stun gun" marks and JB's pelvic area, and to have the child re-buried within hours. the sole family notification requirement was a phone call as the backhoe was firing up. AH waffled yet again, fearing unfavorable publicity, and the opportunity was lost
Source, please?...
 
the Schiller/Thomas/Kolar books are my usual lookups
Thank you, gramcracker.

gramcracker said:
yes. BPD had everything in place. the GBI in ATL had no objections and in fact was eager to participate. the intent was to begin at 3am, to re-examine the 'stun gun' marks and JB's pelvic area, and to have the child re-buried within hours. the sole family notification requirement was a phone call as the backhoe was firing up. AH waffled yet again, fearing unfavorable publicity, and the opportunity was lost.
This isn't quite how I've interpreted the events leading up to the decision of inaction, but I understand how your opinion was formed. Steve Thomas attributed a statement to special agent John Lang of the Georgia Bureau of Investigation that implied Alex Hunter was solely responsible for the final call. However, the entirety of Thomas' portrayal in IRMI causes me to doubt this was the case, p. 305-306:
"We came very close to exhuming the body of JonBenét Ramsey.

Throughout February we wrestled with that vexing question, because experts said the body might yield information on a wide range of points, from the vaginal trauma to settling the stun gun theory. The very idea was anathema to us all, and everyone agreed that before proceeding we needed assurances that vital questions would indeed be answered. Otherwise we would look like monsters.

The problem was psychological, not tactical or physical. The child had been laid to rest, and digging her up was almost unthinkable. This was one of the most shocking actions a government could take.

Commander Beckner said he was leaning toward doing it and assigned me to call once again upon the Georgia Bureau of Investigation for help. 'No problem,' said GBI special agent John Lang. He soon came back with the details from the GBI attorneys, who said the only thing they needed was a comprehensive search warrant, medically researched and specific, with the facts clearly delineated, stating why we needed an exhumation.

Legal and strategic details were worked out simultaneously. A tent would shield the site from any media or helicopters. A coroner and our forensic and medical experts would be standing by to work in a private GBI facility. Remove the body around 3 a.m., take her away in a secure convoy for the tests, return and rebury her the same day.

Lang said Georgia law would be researched to determine if advance parental notification was needed, because the GBI would do it strictly by the book. But they would not allow it to become entangled in back-and-forth negotiations with Team Ramsey lawyers. Notification, if required, would be given by a brief call from a cell phone at the grave site, with a backhoe already in place. When the call ended, they would dig.

In a matter of days, the GBI said Atlanta was ready to go.

But the operation was then canceled because the negatives were greater than the possibility of finding conclusive evidence. Once again Lang was astonished at Boulder-style justice. 'I may not be the most educated guy around, but hey, Mr. Prosecutor, let the chips fall where they may. Either place your bet or fold, because this case ain't going to get any better."
 
Thank you, gramcracker.

This isn't quite how I've interpreted the events leading up to the decision of inaction, but I understand how your opinion was formed. Steve Thomas attributed a statement to special agent John Lang of the Georgia Bureau of Investigation that implied Alex Hunter was solely responsible for the final call. However, the entirety of Thomas' portrayal in IRMI causes me to doubt this was the case, p. 305-306:
"We came very close to exhuming the body of JonBenét Ramsey.

Throughout February we wrestled with that vexing question, because experts said the body might yield information on a wide range of points, from the vaginal trauma to settling the stun gun theory. The very idea was anathema to us all, and everyone agreed that before proceeding we needed assurances that vital questions would indeed be answered. Otherwise we would look like monsters.

The problem was psychological, not tactical or physical. The child had been laid to rest, and digging her up was almost unthinkable. This was one of the most shocking actions a government could take.

Commander Beckner said he was leaning toward doing it and assigned me to call once again upon the Georgia Bureau of Investigation for help. 'No problem,' said GBI special agent John Lang. He soon came back with the details from the GBI attorneys, who said the only thing they needed was a comprehensive search warrant, medically researched and specific, with the facts clearly delineated, stating why we needed an exhumation.

Legal and strategic details were worked out simultaneously. A tent would shield the site from any media or helicopters. A coroner and our forensic and medical experts would be standing by to work in a private GBI facility. Remove the body around 3 a.m., take her away in a secure convoy for the tests, return and rebury her the same day.

Lang said Georgia law would be researched to determine if advance parental notification was needed, because the GBI would do it strictly by the book. But they would not allow it to become entangled in back-and-forth negotiations with Team Ramsey lawyers. Notification, if required, would be given by a brief call from a cell phone at the grave site, with a backhoe already in place. When the call ended, they would dig.

In a matter of days, the GBI said Atlanta was ready to go.

But the operation was then canceled because the negatives were greater than the possibility of finding conclusive evidence. Once again Lang was astonished at Boulder-style justice. 'I may not be the most educated guy around, but hey, Mr. Prosecutor, let the chips fall where they may. Either place your bet or fold, because this case ain't going to get any better."
What negatives? What could be negative about it? Yes JBR would be disturbed but it would be about finding justice for her. It would have been conclusive as to a stun gun and sexual assault most likely because it would have been a different ME? Or the same.

To me, They did not want the real answers. IMO
 
What negatives? What could be negative about it? Yes JBR would be disturbed but it would be about finding justice for her. It would have been conclusive as to a stun gun and sexual assault most likely because it would have been a different ME? Or the same.

To me, They did not want the real answers. IMO
I suspect some BPD investigators on the case, including Thomas, feared a tissue analysis would prove them wrong. Egos drove this case into the ground...
 
I suspect some BPD investigators on the case, including Thomas, feared a tissue analysis would prove them wrong. Egos drove this case into the ground...

I do also. I think they had a plan, an agenda and they were afraid it would indeed prove there was a stun gun and no previous sexual abuse.
 
yes. that's what I remember reading. re the negatives, I shudder to think how the Ramsey team would have spun an exhumation, regardless that it was intended as an additional investigative tool. I don't see how the likelihood of the spin can be overlooked. well, yes. actually I can

The problem was psychological, not tactical or physical. The child had been laid to rest, and digging her up was almost unthinkable. This was one of the most shocking actions a government could take.
 
yes. that's what I remember reading. re the negatives, I shudder to think how the Ramsey team would have spun an exhumation, regardless that it was intended as an additional investigative tool. I don't see how the likelihood of the spin can be overlooked. well, yes. actually I can

How does one spin an exhumation. It is done to gather evidence. That is simple and clear.

If you think there is evidence to be had you go for it. Your goal should be truth not covering your own tookus.
 
memo from SS --> JR: Your goal should be truth not covering your own tookus

cc: PR (wherever she is)
 
the Schiller/Thomas/Kolar books are my usual lookups
PMPT clearly states that BPD had considered to exhume the body, but decided against it. (p. 889; 1215 & 1530) This is essentially what Thomas says: But the operation was then canceled...

I don’t recall Kolar’s version, and I’m not interested enough to look for it (why doesn’t this book have an index!? Geez). But, if anyone has a page number...
...

AK
 
What negatives? What could be negative about it? Yes JBR would be disturbed but it would be about finding justice for her. It would have been conclusive as to a stun gun and sexual assault most likely because it would have been a different ME? Or the same.

To me, They did not want the real answers. IMO
It’s hard to imagine what “negatives” Thomas was talking about, but I suppose he might have meant the “psychological” negatives. He does refer to it (exhumation) as “one of the most shocking actions a government could take.” He says that the “very idea was anathema,” and that they “would look like monsters” if the exhumation did not provide definitive answers.

I think that this is just another example of Thomas targeting his true nemesis: Boulder-style justice.
...

AK
 

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