GA - Kendrick Johnson, 17, Suspicious Death, Jan. 10/11, 2013, #2

[Kimberlyd125]

I think they simply want the truth and are very distrustful of the investigation. I can't say I blame them. If he were mine, I'd want proof too.


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A new investigation into the Kendrick Johnson case leaves the family with a sense of gratefulness, but Kenneth Johnson says although the feds are reopening the case. He tells us he won't have closure until someone is locked up for his son's death.

http://m.wtxl.com/mobile/news/local/...9bb30f31a.html


BBM

 

[gxm]

This is what I picture when he's reaching for the shoe. He is up on the mat with his right arm extended and he is bracing himself with his left hand on the top of the mat. He keeps trying to reach deeper for the shoe and inserts the upper portion of his body in the mat, still holding on with the left hand. Remember his arm gives him 2-3 more feet of reach. He ends up loosing his grip with his left hand.

He is found with his right arm in front of his face, which is how he would have ended up, if he were reaching for the shoe. His left arm was at his side bent toward the back. That's the position I would expect his left arm to be in, if he lost his grip with his left hand and fell in.

It appears he's in a hurry as he runs across the gym towards the mats in the video. He most likely was rushing to get the shoe also and getting frustrated. He may not have had enough time to go ask for help, or move mats, etc. and all he was focused on was getting to class. Rushing can end up in accidents happening because your not really thinking, your in a hurry.

Now, it can be argued as some have suggested, that as he was reaching for the shoe someone horsing around, pushed him in and just left him there. The video tapes, should have revealed any persons that were in the gym for the minutes that this happened. The investigators have stated they have questioned everyone and verified the whereabouts of the people that the parents suspect.

There are thousands of pages of reports and hours of video. Many, many hours have been put into the investigation. Unless someone admits that they pushed Kendrick in the mat as some have speculated, then I don't see how the parents have a case for murder. I don't see anything that a prosecutor would take to trial.

I don't see all these things that the attorneys and others are stating as having any basis of fact or evidence. I see a lot of emotion and a lot of reaching that is taking away focus from facts and evidence. The accusations of this being a racist crime, a coverup and the flat out naming of minors killing Kendrick, that were found not to be present at the location during that time period, IMO are unfounded.

IMO, your scenario of KJ reaching for his shoe and someone pushing him or making him lose his balance is the only "foul play" theory that would conform to the timeline: an opportunity that presented itself to the prankster with KJ already in position. But IMO where that theory falls apart is I don't believe that the prankster would have left him there to die. I think they would have helped him get out once they realized that he was stuck. JMO. OMO. MOO.

 

[BeginnersLuck]

IMO, your scenario of KJ reaching for his shoe and someone pushing him or making him lose his balance is the only "foul play" theory that would conform to the timeline: an opportunity that presented itself to the prankster with KJ already in position. But IMO where that theory falls apart is I don't believe that the prankster would have left him there to die. I think they would have helped him get out once they realized that he was stuck. JMO. OMO. MOO.

Exactly! It's hard for me to comprehend someone hitting him on the neck and then shoving him down into a mat or rolling him up in a mat and then placing the mat in the rear of the stacked mats. If someone would have harmed him, they IMO, would not have stuck him in a mat, they would have just quickly left the area. It's a school with 3,000 students plus staff. It didn't happen before or after school, when people weren't present. I see nothing to be gained by a whole bunch of people conspiring to coverup a murder. As pastor Rose said, why would everyone risk their jobs and reputation. LE and the school admin are very compassionate about the lives of children and justice.

Lowndes High School - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Lowndes High School is now one of the largest high schools in the state of Georgia with a student enrollment of over 3000 students and 170 faculty members.

 

[Yoda]

IMO, your scenario of KJ reaching for his shoe and someone pushing him or making him lose his balance is the only "foul play" theory that would conform to the timeline: an opportunity that presented itself to the prankster with KJ already in position. But IMO where that theory falls apart is I don't believe that the prankster would have left him there to die. I think they would have helped him get out once they realized that he was stuck. JMO. OMO. MOO.

Another thought, the kids know there are cameras in the gym. Even if they forgot about the cameras, prank or not, as soon as they heard LE was reviewing the footage I would think they would have come forward if only to cover themselves. Plus, I would think if it was a prank, the prankster would have shared the story of how he/she/they pulled one on KJ. IMO it would have been on twitter, instagram, etc. to all their buddies/friends. Jmo

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

A new investigation into the Kendrick Johnson case leaves the family with a sense of gratefulness, but Kenneth Johnson says although the feds are reopening the case. He tells us he won't have closure until someone is locked up for his son's death.

http://m.wtxl.com/mobile/news/local/...9bb30f31a.html


BBM

Because at his point he believes someone killed his child. I would feel the same. It seems like someone else was involved to me. Hopefully if it was indeed an accident, They can find a way to prove that because right now we have too much that to me, says someone hurt him.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

The young man was 5'10" and with one arm outstretched above his head, it is clearly possible.
6 feet is 72 inches.
5" 10" is 70 inches with an arm outstretched at least another 2" and probably 12".
Horrendous sad accident.
The mat was in the middle of other obviously heavy mats.
This case was investigated for four months by the Georgia Bureau of Investigation and the local Sheriff's Office which called in the GBI immediately. The autopsy was done by a Physician of the GBI. I have no reason to believe that the GBI, the Sheriffs Office, the school and "highly influential" people in the town joined in a conspiracy in this tragic death. A pair of fresh eyes is always good and a further investigation can't hurt. Bring in Dr. Braden and Perper for a 3rd autopsy.

That does not mean that he can reach 6 ft down to the floor and then get back. It is a tiny tube. He has to go all the way in there with no way out to get that shoe. No way. I was trying to get something that fell on the side of my dryer today Even laying across it and reaching down, I could not get it.

I don't believe for a moment that he went in that mat head first to reach anything.

 

[noZme]

Another thought, the kids know there are cameras in the gym. Even if they forgot about the cameras, prank or not, as soon as they heard LE was reviewing the footage I would think they would have come forward if only to cover themselves. Plus, I would think if it was a prank, the prankster would have shared the story of how he/she/they pulled one on KJ. IMO it would have been on twitter, instagram, etc. to all their buddies/friends. Jmo

Right! I cannot imagine a conspiracy among teens having held tight for 10 months. The pressure in Valdosta - someone would have leaked if only to cover for themselves for having been a lesser player.

So if there had been only one assailant? Well, the investigation & all the facts point to nothing but a very unfortunate, tragic, freak accidental death. However, I do not expect some people will ever let go of the murder theory.

 

[Salem]

IMO, your scenario of KJ reaching for his shoe and someone pushing him or making him lose his balance is the only "foul play" theory that would conform to the timeline: an opportunity that presented itself to the prankster with KJ already in position. But IMO where that theory falls apart is I don't believe that the prankster would have left him there to die. I think they would have helped him get out once they realized that he was stuck. JMO. OMO. MOO.

It's interesting to think about. It seems that it would have been very difficult for KJ to get to the bottom to reach his shoe. It was a very tight space, so tight he couldn't get out and he couldn't breathe. That must mean, if he did this on his own, he had to work his body down the tube, so to speak. It doesn't seem like he could just stick his head in and slide down, kwim? If you had to work your body down and in, how far would you go? I would get scared, myself and get out. I would not have let my feet leave the floor. And I don't believe it was a "fall in" because I don't think that is possible. What ever happened, it had to be deliberate, because the space was just too tight for a "fall in."

If there was a prankster, maybe the prankster didn't realize KJ was stuck? Maybe he hightailed it before KJ could get out and give him/her the whatfor, kwim?

If your shoulders are 20" wide and you raise both arms above your head, does that reduce the width by some amount? I meant to measure Mr. Salem last night, but didn't get it done, but it seems to me, by raising both arms above your head, the shoulder width would be reduced by an inch or two?

Salem

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

It's interesting to think about. It seems that it would have been very difficult for KJ to get to the bottom to reach his shoe. It was a very tight space, so tight he couldn't get out and he couldn't breathe. That must mean, if he did this on his own, he had to work his body down the tube, so to speak. It doesn't seem like he could just stick his head in and slide down, kwim? If you had to work your body down and in, how far would you go? I would get scared, myself and get out. I would not have let my feet leave the floor. And I don't believe it was a "fall in" because I don't think that is possible. What ever happened, it had to be deliberate, because the space was just too tight for a "fall in."

If there was a prankster, maybe the prankster didn't realize KJ was stuck? Maybe he hightailed it before KJ could get out and give him/her the whatfor, kwim?

If your shoulders are 20" wide and you raise both arms above your head, does that reduce the width by some amount? I meant to measure Mr. Salem last night, but didn't get it done, but it seems to me, by raising both arms above your head, the shoulder width would be reduced by an inch or two?

Salem

BBM, I thought about it too. It is certainly a possibility that someone thought he could get out and left, but then why not come back and check??
I agree he could not have just fallen in. Even in the video someone posted with that kid in the mat trying to recreate the noise, He did not move all the much or fall out when they put the mat back on its side.

 

[gxm]

It's interesting to think about. It seems that it would have been very difficult for KJ to get to the bottom to reach his shoe. It was a very tight space, so tight he couldn't get out and he couldn't breathe. That must mean, if he did this on his own, he had to work his body down the tube, so to speak. It doesn't seem like he could just stick his head in and slide down, kwim? If you had to work your body down and in, how far would you go? I would get scared, myself and get out. I would not have let my feet leave the floor. And I don't believe it was a "fall in" because I don't think that is possible. What ever happened, it had to be deliberate, because the space was just too tight for a "fall in."

If there was a prankster, maybe the prankster didn't realize KJ was stuck? Maybe he hightailed it before KJ could get out and give him/her the whatfor, kwim?

If your shoulders are 20" wide and you raise both arms above your head, does that reduce the width by some amount? I meant to measure Mr. Salem last night, but didn't get it done, but it seems to me, by raising both arms above your head, the shoulder width would be reduced by an inch or two?

Salem

I think he could have slipped/slid further down (with gravity assisting) into the mat as he maneuvered his body and stretched his arm out to grab the shoes. Trying to back out would then be impossible because gravity is now working against him and there wouldn't be enough room to gain leverage to wiggle up and out.

The scenario of a prankster would involve someone breaking KJ's grip or leverage and sending him further into the mat.

IMO, there's just not enough time to knock KJ out, roll him in a mat, and rearrange the mats without anyone noticing what was going on.

Apparently it is not uncommon for kids to walk on the mats. So I'd like to know if the video shows any kids playing on the mats the day KJ went missing. If so, why didn't they notice his body?

 

[vlpate]

Kendrick Johnson: New video does not show how Valdosta teen died

My goodness, whatever did investigators do before video? If they were counting on this video to prove their case, they probably have no case. IMO

According to Lt. Stryde Jones with the Lowndes County sheriff's office, because some of the cameras are motion activated, they didn't capture Johnson entering the mat because he didn't come within range of the motion sensors.

I think taking a look back at previous videos might help soothe the family's concern. They need to check old video to see if anyone has ever been seen by, or on the mats when in the gym alone (not setting off sensors). Has there ever been video showing the top of the mats...how long has the video been blurry and surely there is video of the ball hitting the camera....unless they only keep the video for a certain period of time and then record over. Not at all sure how that works.

 

[Reader]

Exactly! It's hard for me to comprehend someone hitting him on the neck and then shoving him down into a mat or rolling him up in a mat and then placing the mat in the rear of the stacked mats. If someone would have harmed him, they IMO, would not have stuck him in a mat, they would have just quickly left the area. It's a school with 3,000 students plus staff. It didn't happen before or after school, when people weren't present. I see nothing to be gained by a whole bunch of people conspiring to coverup a murder. As pastor Rose said, why would everyone risk their jobs and reputation. LE and the school admin are very compassionate about the lives of children and justice.

Lowndes High School - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

BBM - But yet didn't I read that only 2 of the regular teachers and one substitute teacher attended Kendrick's funeral? That's kind of cold to me, no matter what his parents have said or done, he was still a member of that school.

 

[vlpate]

It's interesting to think about. It seems that it would have been very difficult for KJ to get to the bottom to reach his shoe. It was a very tight space, so tight he couldn't get out and he couldn't breathe. That must mean, if he did this on his own, he had to work his body down the tube, so to speak. It doesn't seem like he could just stick his head in and slide down, kwim? If you had to work your body down and in, how far would you go? I would get scared, myself and get out. I would not have let my feet leave the floor. And I don't believe it was a "fall in" because I don't think that is possible. What ever happened, it had to be deliberate, because the space was just too tight for a "fall in."

If there was a prankster, maybe the prankster didn't realize KJ was stuck? Maybe he hightailed it before KJ could get out and give him/her the whatfor, kwim?

If your shoulders are 20" wide and you raise both arms above your head, does that reduce the width by some amount? I meant to measure Mr. Salem last night, but didn't get it done, but it seems to me, by raising both arms above your head, the shoulder width would be reduced by an inch or two?

Salem

I agree with much of this and with gxm on gravity. Keep in mind the foam inside the mats give, but then sort of clings/tightens onto whatever it comes into contact with (like the floor so it won't slide). We've seen this in many videos of dumb kids in cheerleader mats - they obviously get into the mat just fine, but getting out of it is another story. None of the videos I've seen show someone having a hard time getting in, just getting out. In most cases the mat is already rolled up when they enter it.

Once in, and panicking, he probably went even lower, making his situation worse.
JMO

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

I think he could have slipped/slid further down (with gravity assisting) into the mat as he maneuvered his body and stretched his arm out to grab the shoes. Trying to back out would then be impossible because gravity is now working against him and there wouldn't be enough room to gain leverage to wiggle up and out.

The scenario of a prankster would involve someone breaking KJ's grip or leverage and sending him further into the mat.

IMO, there's just not enough time to knock KJ out, roll him in a mat, and rearrange the mats without anyone noticing what was going on.

Apparently it is not uncommon for kids to walk on the mats. So I'd like to know if the video shows any kids playing on the mats the day KJ went missing. If so, why didn't they notice his body?

BBM that is something he would have known before he even got in there, That is why I don't think he did this willingly. It makes no sense.
I Think the mat suspended him. I think he would have had to fight to go up or down so I don't see him slipping in.

 

[vlpate]

BBM - But yet didn't I read that only 2 of the regular teachers and one substitute teacher attended Kendrick's funeral? That's kind of cold to me, no matter what his parents have said or done, he was still a member of that school.

Do you remember who said this or a link?

Why would anyone keep those kind of tabs on funeral attendees, especially when over 1,000 people attended his funeral? That's a turnout to praise the Lord for, IMO. I'll be lucky if I get 20 (with free pastries).

 

[vlpate]

because right now we have too much that to me, says someone hurt him.

What do "we" have "too much" of? I'm being serious, I can't find anything at all, besides lawyer/media hyperbole and conjecture that points to anything other than an accident IMO.

I would sincerely like to know what it is I am missing. lease: thanks! :loveyou:

 

[gxm]

BBM that is something he would have known before he even got in there, That is why I don't think he did this willingly. It makes no sense.
I Think the mat suspended him. I think he would have had to fight to go up or down so I don't see him slipping in.

I think he was probably holding a precarious position, stretching out one arm and either gripping with the other hand, or using his elbows and/or knees as leverage but he slipped and slid into a position where he lost his leverage/grip. IMO, with the assistance of gravity, he could have turned or twisted in such a way that he slid further down than he intended.

It's just awful to think about. IMO it makes sense that people are drawn to the idea of a karate chop to the neck killing him because, frankly, it's easier to accept. JMO. OMO. MOO.

 

[Tawny]

If your shoulders are 20" wide and you raise both arms above your head, does that reduce the width by some amount? I meant to measure Mr. Salem last night, but didn't get it done, but it seems to me, by raising both arms above your head, the shoulder width would be reduced by an inch or two?

Salem

SBM

That is a good point. If you raise one arm above your head like KJ's right arm was, your shoulder width would reduce significantly. Even just looking in a mirror, raising one arm up and hanging the other, it takes off a few inches side to side.

 

[ScarlettScarpetta]

What do "we" have "too much" of? I'm being serious, I can't find anything at all, besides lawyer/media hyperbole and conjecture that points to anything other than an accident IMO.

I would sincerely like to know what it is I am missing. lease: thanks! :loveyou:

The impracticality of him getting in there himself thinking he had a way out, The Bruising on the neck. The circumstances of death.

 

[Salem]

For me - the discrepancies between the autopsy reports is huge. The strangeness of KJ going all the way to the bottom of the mat. I don't see gravity as being the cause. The complaints from the ME about not being called right away and honestly, I still wonder about the internal organs. So far I have not been satisfied by any explanations of why they were disposed of.

Those are a few things that keep me from believing it was just an accident. I'm not saying those things can't be explained, I'm just saying I haven't seen anything yet that explains them to my satisfaction.

Salem