General Discussion and Theories #4

[SnooperDuper]

Just to add, the TB accolades are 193 words, achievements total 649 words - 30% of the space was devoted to the TB case. To me, that speaks volumes.

 

[Alethea Dice]

Well clearly derogatory is the wrong word to use when MK is being lauded for his achievements in the Bosma case.

Surely the case is the biggest of MK's career, and the case he would be known by, professionally.

I don't at all see how if could be a dishonour, or derogatory, for MK to be honoured for his work on the Bosma case.

This is after all a Governor General awarded medal - surely they don't give such a thing for mere involvement in high school sports.

It's clearly the correct word when the rest is ignored and belittled. It lessens the merit of everything else he has done throughout his career. I guess if you've never heard of the other cases, and you don't think being a positive influence and mentor to youth is important, or that teaching and sharing investigative techniques matter, then you may think that the only thing he would be honored for is his work on the TB case. But repeating it over and over again doesn't make it true.

 

[Alethea Dice]

Just to add, the TB accolades are 193 words, achievements total 649 words - 30% of the space was devoted to the TB case. To me, that speaks volumes.

Congratulations. You came up with about the same percentage as I did, only I didn't have to count the words.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Congratulations. You came up with about the same percentage as I did, only I didn't have to count the words.

Neither did I - MS Word did.

 

[SnooperDuper]

It's clearly the correct word when the rest is ignored and belittled. It lessens the merit of everything else he has done throughout his career. I guess if you've never heard of the other cases, and you don't think being a positive influence and mentor to youth is important, or that teaching and sharing investigative techniques matter, then you may think that the only thing he would be honored for is his work on the TB case. But repeating it over and over again doesn't make it true.

I really doubt that MK would have received this award if not for his work on the TB case, especially given the timing.

Again, I feel that the police work on this case was so thorough and so excellent that it had to be acclaimed.

 

[Alethea Dice]

:bored: fftobed:

 

[swedie]

I'm curious to learn more about the jury selection process ~ particularly when it comes to a high-profile case such as this one. I can't imagine how on earth it would be possible to find any local citizen who has not already formed an opinion regarding the guilt or innocence of the accused in this case. I suppose that I could be way off base in that thinking, given the fact that I spent a great deal of my time in this forum, particularly in the early months of the investigation. Any insight from our Legal Eagles here?

Factoria, I am not a legal eagle but hope I can shed some light on your questions for you. The jury selection for TB's case will likely start very soon into the new year. My guesstimate would be the first week of January, possibly second week, but that's cutting it pretty close to the actual trail date of January 18th. Jury selection typically takes approximately four days thereabouts.

It's not uncommon for people to form opinions, especially in high profile cases such as this one and the lawyers and judges are well aware this happens often. Sometimes there will be a request for a change in venue. JMO but I really can't see the venue changing in this case because it is such a high profile case here in Ontario, and not sure it would do much good kwim. I suspect the judge knowing this, and taking into consideration location of witnesses and probably a dozen other related reasons, he might just turn a change in venue down. Time will tell. What the lawyers for both sides would be most interested in finding out from each juror is, Would your ability to judge the evidence in this case without bias be affected by anything you have heard or read about this case in the media?

This is an Ontario government link from the Ministry of Attorney General, The Annual Jury Selection Process which contains all the information you may be interested in Factoria. It also includes informative video links. HTH and MOO.

https://www.attorneygeneral.jus.gov.on.ca/english/courts/jury/jury_selection_process.asp

 

[Juballee]

I really doubt that MK would have received this award if not for his work on the TB case, especially given the timing.

Again, I feel that the police work on this case was so thorough and so excellent that it had to be acclaimed.

^ watch the video in this one. Kavanaugh is being acclaimed in part due to his work on the TB case. Isn't it quite early to be handing out medals?

What I am hearing here is that he deserves acclaimation, just not yet in some people's opinions.

I personally think that saying that MK would not have gotten the award without TB's death is diminishing his all his earlier professional accomplishments. I would like to imagine that he got into LE to make a continous positive impact on his community, and I personally don't think that one high profile case that happens to be fresh and relevant enough to warrant a higher word count was the tipping point that made him a cop worth recognizing for his contribution.

Perhaps the award is being timed this way so that it won't appear as if it was only because he lead a high profile case, and his numerous other contributions will be recognized without being overshadowed.

All my opinion only.

 

[Deleted member 102539]

"Counsel, would you like to introduce me to your clients, please?" he asked immediately.


Smich, wearing a yellow and blue striped collared shirt, rose in one corner of the prisoners' box. In the other stood Millard, his most defining feature being the long, thin braid growing from behind his right ear, in contrast with his otherwise shorn hair.

http://www.thespec.com/opinion-stor...on-bosma-case-will-not-impact-trial-timeline/

Smich seemingly stands on stripe pattern and Millard seemingly had no dog biscuits to perform silly, therefore the braid behind one ear ..... I would like to see a painting of DM or both.

https://twitter.com/CityCourtsTO She would do well, I think.

 

[Arnie M]

If the Bosma disappearance had been treated like an ordinary missing persons case , and the truck like a normal auto theft , nobody would have been arrested and the whole thing would be a cold case today

Kavanagh deserves credit for for his instincts and leadership in this case. The eventual verdicts are beside the point. He did his part , and did it well.

 

[Tamarind]

If the Bosma disappearance had been treated like an ordinary missing persons case , and the truck like a normal auto theft , nobody would have been arrested and the whole thing would be a cold case today

Kavanagh deserves credit for for his instincts and leadership in this case. The eventual verdicts are beside the point. He did his part , and did it well.

Why was it not treated as an ordinary missing persons case and the truck like a normal auto theft? I thought it was a missing persons case and a truck theft, according to police and press. I am wondering what was done differently and more importantly IF it was done differently, WHY was it done differently.

I think the eventual verdicts are extremely important as far as Kavanaugh is concerned. Just as in the case of GP Morin etc, things are not always as portrayed. Unless someone already knows the outcome then I think praises for a case that has yet to be before the courts is extremely premature. JMO

 

[Arnie M]

Why was it not treated as an ordinary missing persons case and the truck like a normal auto theft? I thought it was a missing persons case and a truck theft, according to police and press. I am wondering what was done differently and more importantly IF it was done differently, WHY was it done differently.

I think the eventual verdicts are extremely important as far as Kavanaugh is concerned. Just as in the case of GP Morin etc, things are not always as portrayed. Unless someone already knows the outcome then I think praises for a case that has yet to be before the courts is extremely premature. JMO

Do you think Hamilton Police have arrested the wrong people ?

 

[Tamarind]

Do you think Hamilton Police have arrested the wrong people ?

As I said, mistakes have been made before. I believe we won't truly know the answer to your question until some point in the future. How would anyone know the answer to something that has yet to occur?

 

[SnooperDuper]

You have to remember that Project Capella was the largest investigation in HPS history

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/tim-bosma-investigator-awarded-medal-of-merit-1.3257702

Nominations for the medal MK received are received yearly. Surely it is the conclusion of the investigation that triggered MK's award.

Otherwise, it is a very nice medal for doing nothing. If it is all about high school football, why didn't Rob Ford get one too?

 

[cansleuther]

You have to remember that Project Capella was the largest investigation in HPS history

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamilton/news/tim-bosma-investigator-awarded-medal-of-merit-1.3257702

Nominations for the medal MK received are received yearly. Surely it is the conclusion of the investigation that triggered MK's award.

Otherwise, it is a very nice medal for doing nothing. If it is all about high school football, why didn't Rob Ford get one too?

Except for the fact that the investigation is not concluded until the trial is over. Susan Clairmont mentioned this in her AM900 interview - it was actually you that pointed this out, a few pages back:

SC made an interesting point: the detectives on this case will be working the case full tilt right through the trial, investigating fully as any new information comes out. The investigation has never ended and will not end until the trial is over.

 

[SnooperDuper]

Except for the fact that the investigation is not concluded until the trial is over. Susan Clairmont mentioned this in her AM900 interview - it was actually you that pointed this out, a few pages back:

That's why it seems a little early to reward MK, but the Governor General's office would already be privy to the facts of the case and investigation. Just as the GG issued a DI because MK came up with solid evidence of a type the court likes, the GG came up with a reward based on that good work. They must have a damn good case.

 

[cansleuther]

That's why it seems a little early to reward MK, but the Governor General's office would already be privy to the facts of the case and investigation. Just as the GG issued a DI because MK came up with solid evidence of a type the court likes, the GG came up with a reward based on that good work. They must have a damn good case.

The Attorney General issued the DI, the Governor General issued the award to MK. Two different people, two different jobs.

 

[SnooperDuper]

The Attorney General issued the DI, the Governor General issued the award to MK. Two different people, two different jobs.

Ooops, sorry, the GG the queen's representative doesn't exactly go about dishing out awards for high school sports, does he?

 

[swedie]

Why was it not treated as an ordinary missing persons case and the truck like a normal auto theft? I thought it was a missing persons case and a truck theft, according to police and press. I am wondering what was done differently and more importantly IF it was done differently, WHY was it done differently.

I think the eventual verdicts are extremely important as far as Kavanaugh is concerned. Just as in the case of GP Morin etc, things are not always as portrayed. Unless someone already knows the outcome then I think praises for a case that has yet to be before the courts is extremely premature. JMO

How was it not treated like any other "ordinary" missing persons case? What do you mean, WHY was it done differently? I'll see if I can explain what I think you're asking. Otherwise maybe you can clarify if you don't think my explanation is sufficient.

When TB failed to return home to the two people who meant the world to him, shortly after leaving with two strange and suspicious looking men, on a test drive, SB's gut instinct told her something was amiss. Perhaps the moment she laid eyes on the two men who showed up at their home, she felt something wasn't right. Then when she tried to call TB's cell phone and he did not answer, she knew something was wrong and contacted LE. LE had no choice but to put out a BOLO for a missing man and his truck. I don't believe this case was handled any different then any other missing persons case by LE. IMO it was the many media outlets that quickly picked up on this story and got the information out there to the public. When it is not in someone's character, to just out of the blue, disappear, not come home when they say they will be right back, and they do not answer their cell phone, IMO that is a good enough reason to contact LE don't you? If you found yourself in SB's situation, would you not make do the same as SB; ask LE make a public announcement requesting the public to BOLO for your husband and his truck? If so, I doubt it would be handled any different then TB's case. Let's just hope the media would show just as much interest also. IIRC and according to the article below, it was 12 hours before LE made their public announcement. ALL MOO.

"Tim has been stolen from us. Tim's world revolves around our daughter. I know she is number one in his mind right now."

The last time she saw him was Monday evening.

"He smiled at me and said he would be right back. I have not seen him since," she said.

"It was just a truck, a stupid truck. You don't need him, but I do. Our daughter needs her daddy. Please let him come home."

http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/hamil...lton-man-pleads-for-his-safe-return-1.1336180

 

[swedie]

Hamilton Police Service on FB has a thorough write up on Sergeant MK. He is certainly being held in high honour for solving TB's case. Congratulations Sergeant Kavanagh. :takeabow: :tyou:

Staff Sergeant Kavanagh is a 31-year veteran of the Service. For 15 of these 31 years, S/Sgt. Kavanagh has been assigned to the Homicide Unit.
One of the Service’s largest investigations in its history was led by S/Sgt. Kavanagh. It was in May 2013, when Tim Bosma was reported missing. This investigation soon developed into a homicide investigation in which D/Sgt. Kavanagh was the Officer in Charge. The investigation caused considerable fear in the community among citizens. The case also attracted international media attention.

Staff Sergeant Kavanagh expertly led the investigation that resulted in the quick arrest of two men and the case is now before the courts. Virtually every member of the Service was directly or indirectly involved in the investigation. An extensive number of tips came in from the community. This was all co-ordinated by S/Sgt. Kavanagh.

https://www.facebook.com/HamiltonPolice/posts/1140883825939908:0