Gilgo Beach LISK Serial Killer, Rex Heuermann, charged with 4 murders, July 2023 #10

[Betty P]

On the Atlantic City financial records in the MBB superseding bail application, there's a transaction from The Body Shop, which sells all kinds of lotions and creams, some are herbal (tea tree oil). Aloe vera. That's definitely a place to go if you want something to soothe poison ivy, which LISK would have had from all his time in the brush. And which I'm sure RH has had quite often because his face has that reddish look to it like it's been consistently subjected to harsh/abrasive conditions over a long period of time. He ironically has the check in date at the Skyline of Friday the 13th, I think, and that transaction is the 15th. MBB was last seen July 9th. I think when all is said and done, he'll have committed all the Gilgo murders and beyond, with victims in other regions.

I noticed the same thing. From his photos, it appears he has eczema or something similar.

 

[CuriousCricket]

Did anyone look over the Atlantic City financial records for the hotel change on the MBB indictment? They changed from Flagship (AE's hotel w/the kids, I guess) to Skyline (RH arrives). Someone must have wanted that change pretty badly because I used to travel for work and changing hotels in "mid-swim" like that is something of a nightmare, and this was an actual vacation. If you can avoid all of that, why not do it? Could this have been the motivation for the change? Flagship amenity note:

Fees​

You'll be asked to pay the following charges at the property:​

Deposit: USD 100 per stay
Resort fee: USD 15.91 per accommodation, per night
The resort fee includes:
Business center/computer access
Children's club/arcade access
Fitness center access
Housekeeping
In-room coffee
Pool access
Spa tub access
WiFi access (may be limited)

VS

Skyline amenity note:

The resort offers internet access at its cyber center (30-minute limit if anyone is waiting) and complimentary Wi-Fi for all units.
------------

So wondering if Flagship guarantees stable internet for the most part in common areas, but either way, it looks like you'd have to pay the resort fee to get it, and if you have to pay a resort fee to get it, it may somehow (?) make it easier to track online activities if they ever had to do that for any reason because everyone isn't "herded" together for free internet, by the looks of things.

A simple search turns this up: Welcome to NYC.gov | City of New York
Poison Ivy
Poison ivy is a plant found in many parts of New York City as well as throughout the United States. It is often found in wooded areas; wetlands; open lots; parks; and yards. This plant may cause a range of symptoms when people touch or eat the leaves, stems or berries, or breathe in smoke when it is burned. All parts of the plant cause an irritating rash on the skin

Sawgrass is found along freshwater

 

[amaraya]

Poison ivy is rampant on the island.

 

[CuriousCricket]

Poison ivy is rampant on the island.

So, it might be very interesting to know exactly what was purchased at The Body Shop. It prob would not be THE tidbit but when enough tidbits stack up, you get a full picture.

 

[Just K]

Right here: Long Island

We also looked into longislanderotica.

 

[Just K]

Wow, it sure is. Thanks! Page 135 is dated Sept. 3 2008. Found a way to get back to at least 2005, listed as "old posts". I'm looking with names and a year. I'm not interested in registering or logging in.

Definitely: Look for Andy, Springfield Man and Mickey Mouse

 

[Just K]

Definitely: Look for Andy, Springfield Man and Mickey Mouse

Oh, and on a suspicion, maybe check for any Hellboy references

 

[minazoe]

Did anyone see the full press conference just now on NN?

 

[sds71]

Suffolk County prosecutors handed over a trove of documents to the defense for alleged Gilgo Beach serial killer Rex A. Heuermann — including nearly 3,000 police tips — as the former Manhattan architect appeared briefly Tuesday in a Riverhead courtroom.

Suffolk Assistant District Attorney Nicholas Santomartino told the court it had provided to the defense — at its request — the police department's “lead log” to the defense containing 2,944 tips received by the public since the inception of the case until Jan. 2. Prosecutors provided the log as well as the full file on the first 25 tips.

Heuermann, 60, of Massapequa Park, dressed in a dark suit and tie and handcuffed, did not address the court. State Supreme Court Justice Timothy Mazzei set Heuermann's next court appearance for April 17…

Brown said in the discovery he's so far reviewed, there have been “significant” leads provided to police and said in at least once instance, police were close to charging another unnamed suspect.
“We were informed, among other individuals, that there was another individual that the prior district attorney of this county was prepared to charge with these crimes,” said Brown, referring to former Suffolk District Attorney Timothy Sini. “We haven't received any of that documentation. We expect that it will be forthcoming, but that's very important, extremely important to this case. So we're waiting for the documentation.”

The leads are important,” said Heuermann defense attorney Michael J. Brown, speaking to reporters after the court conference. “I think you heard the government this morning say there's somewhere close to 3,000 leads in this case. Obviously some of those leads aren't going to be significant at all. But some of those leads are going to be extremely significant.

Brown said his client has been reviewing discovery in the jail, but is suffering because he's so isolated. Newsday reported previously that Suffolk Sheriff Errol Toulon, Jr., has placed Heuermann in a special housing unit due to his notoriety and threats made by other inmates to potentially harm him.

“The sheriff has been great; they've been permitting him to review the discovery,” said Brown. “He's in this isolation situation … and I get it, it's for his own benefit, I understand it, it's for his own safety. You obviously don't want someone in the jail trying to get their 15 minutes of fame, so that's why he's being isolated. But at the same time, he's not getting any social interaction with anybody else other than a correction officer.”

Asked by a reporter is Heuermann is lonely and depressed, Brown said: “I think that's probably two of the many emotions that he has probably experienced.”

Gilgo Beach killings: Prosecutors turn over almost 3,000 police tips to suspect Rex Heuermann's defense team

"Some of those leads are going to be extremely important," said Michael J. Brown, defense attorney for suspect Rex Heuermann.

www.newsday.com

 

[Betty P]

Brown said in the discovery he's so far reviewed, there have been “significant” leads provided to police and said in at least once instance, police were close to charging another unnamed suspect.
“We were informed, among other individuals, that there was another individual that the prior district attorney of this county was prepared to charge with these crimes,” said Brown, referring to former Suffolk District Attorney Timothy Sini. “We haven't received any of that documentation. We expect that it will be forthcoming, but that's very important, extremely important to this case. So we're waiting for the documentation.”

Well, that's very interesting. Rex H's defense attorneys are attempting to use the Suffolk PD's earlier investigations against the prosecutor's case. Seems its even more helpful that John Ray has helped bring forward so many new witnesses who can testify against Rex H and put him at the scene of some of these murders.

Brown said his client has been reviewing discovery in the jail, but is suffering because he's so isolated. Newsday reported previously that Suffolk Sheriff Errol Toulon, Jr., has placed Heuermann in a special housing unit due to his notoriety and threats made by other inmates to potentially harm him.

Isolating a notorious serial or mass killer in jail for their own observation and safety is SOP in most county jails.

 

[Teche]

Suffolk County prosecutors handed over a trove of documents to the defense for alleged Gilgo Beach serial killer Rex A. Heuermann — including nearly 3,000 police tips — as the former Manhattan architect appeared briefly Tuesday in a Riverhead courtroom.

Suffolk Assistant District Attorney Nicholas Santomartino told the court it had provided to the defense — at its request — the police department's “lead log” to the defense containing 2,944 tips received by the public since the inception of the case until Jan. 2. Prosecutors provided the log as well as the full file on the first 25 tips.

Heuermann, 60, of Massapequa Park, dressed in a dark suit and tie and handcuffed, did not address the court. State Supreme Court Justice Timothy Mazzei set Heuermann's next court appearance for April 17…

Brown said in the discovery he's so far reviewed, there have been “significant” leads provided to police and said in at least once instance, police were close to charging another unnamed suspect.
“We were informed, among other individuals, that there was another individual that the prior district attorney of this county was prepared to charge with these crimes,” said Brown, referring to former Suffolk District Attorney Timothy Sini. “We haven't received any of that documentation. We expect that it will be forthcoming, but that's very important, extremely important to this case. So we're waiting for the documentation.”

The leads are important,” said Heuermann defense attorney Michael J. Brown, speaking to reporters after the court conference. “I think you heard the government this morning say there's somewhere close to 3,000 leads in this case. Obviously some of those leads aren't going to be significant at all. But some of those leads are going to be extremely significant.

Brown said his client has been reviewing discovery in the jail, but is suffering because he's so isolated. Newsday reported previously that Suffolk Sheriff Errol Toulon, Jr., has placed Heuermann in a special housing unit due to his notoriety and threats made by other inmates to potentially harm him.

“The sheriff has been great; they've been permitting him to review the discovery,” said Brown. “He's in this isolation situation … and I get it, it's for his own benefit, I understand it, it's for his own safety. You obviously don't want someone in the jail trying to get their 15 minutes of fame, so that's why he's being isolated. But at the same time, he's not getting any social interaction with anybody else other than a correction officer.”

Asked by a reporter is Heuermann is lonely and depressed, Brown said: “I think that's probably two of the many emotions that he has probably experienced.”

Gilgo Beach killings: Prosecutors turn over almost 3,000 police tips to suspect Rex Heuermann's defense team

"Some of those leads are going to be extremely important," said Michael J. Brown, defense attorney for suspect Rex Heuermann.

www.newsday.com

Suffering from isolation. Oh, well.

 

[snooptroop88]

Look, I know some people don't like John Ray, and I don't want to offend here. But I think John Ray has done so, so much for this case, and so much for the victims. I really think the world of John Ray and am very grateful to him. He helps people that otherwise might be muted and frightened. I also don't know why people insist on mocking his clothes, which has nothing to do with anything of any substance. (I actually like some of his clothes and think he has good taste.) The defense is not going to be able to use anything uncovered by JR or anyone to any significant advantage, IMO. Yes, they'll try, but there's too good a case against RH. If they do ultimately end up charging anyone as an accomplice, it's going to be truly wild. I'm still thinking there was not an "accomplice" per se, but I don't know, obviously.

Right, he's not suffering so much in isolation that he can't write Keith Jesperson about the lack of butter for his bread. (RH is probably a foodie. Pretty sure they have a charge for Jose Andres' restaurant on that AC financial statement, and another place that's a well-known foodie haunt). One day, definitely not soon, but one day maybe RH will be trying to bargain away details of his other crimes for some butter, who knows? "Will Talk For Butter" If he is guilty and that's LISK, I shudder at the idea of the actual kill count. Also wondering if there was any head trauma in his past, like with Jesperson and many other SKs, including Ramirez.

 

[CuriousCricket]

Look, I know some people don't like John Ray, and I don't want to offend here. But I think John Ray has done so, so much for this case, and so much for the victims. I really think the world of John Ray and am very grateful to him. He helps people that otherwise might be muted and frightened. I also don't know why people insist on mocking his clothes, which has nothing to do with anything of any substance. (I actually like some of his clothes and think he has good taste.) The defense is not going to be able to use anything uncovered by JR or anyone to any significant advantage, IMO. Yes, they'll try, but there's too good a case against RH. If they do ultimately end up charging anyone as an accomplice, it's going to be truly wild. I'm still thinking there was not an "accomplice" per se, but I don't know, obviously.

Right, he's not suffering so much in isolation that he can't write Keith Jesperson about the lack of butter for his bread. (RH is probably a foodie. Pretty sure they have a charge for Jose Andres' restaurant on that AC financial statement, and another place that's a well-known foodie haunt). One day, definitely not soon, but one day maybe RH will be trying to bargain away details of his other crimes for some butter, who knows? "Will Talk For Butter" If he is guilty and that's LISK, I shudder at the idea of the actual kill count. Also wondering if there was any head trauma in his past, like with Jesperson and many other SKs, including Ramirez.

People with strong, flamboyant personalities seem to create strong feelings in other people. They are either loved or hated. Frankly, I'd rather have a big personality than none at all. But it takes all kinds. . . .

I have to smile when people wonder if RH is "depressed". Well, honey, there are certain circumstances you're either depressed and/or sad or a blooming idiot. Who on the planet facing a long, complicated court trial for murder, the remainder of life in prison, separated prob from others just to stay alive would not have the very good sense to be depressed? Perhaps some would survive depression by being hopeful of being found innocent, but RH is combing through all the evidence. He knows what he facing. Depression and isolation sound like reasonable emotions.

 

[Izzylizzy]

It's difficult to believe they didn't prep for that and do a better job.

Banfield included here.
This is one of the worst interviews yet.
I don't know what to make of this.
Banfield or Lorraine.

 

[Justice101]

Well, that's very interesting. Rex H's defense attorneys are attempting to use the Suffolk PD's earlier investigations against the prosecutor's case. Seems its even more helpful that John Ray has helped bring forward so many new witnesses who can testify against Rex H and put him at the scene of some of these murders.


Isolating a notorious serial or mass killer in jail for their own observation and safety is SOP in most county jails.

But they didn't charge the other individual earlier. So, he was a suspect, just like anyone else, but they DID NOT charge him so this looks like a nothingburger

 

[minazoe]

How can we say for certain that these people just left her with Rex...could they have participated or seen more than they are saying? Sounds like she was locked outside with no clothes on, or she was trying to get away..how is it that she did not get away? How is it that the detective did not ask this girl if she wished to be left there? why did they not insist? maybe they were all high.

I have questions.

 

[Betty P]

People with strong, flamboyant personalities seem to create strong feelings in other people. They are either loved or hated. Frankly, I'd rather have a big personality than none at all. But it takes all kinds. . . .

I have to smile when people wonder if RH is "depressed". Well, honey, there are certain circumstances you're either depressed and/or sad or a blooming idiot. Who on the planet facing a long, complicated court trial for murder, the remainder of life in prison, separated prob from others just to stay alive would not have the very good sense to be depressed? Perhaps some would survive depression by being hopeful of being found innocent, but RH is combing through all the evidence. He knows what he facing. Depression and isolation sound like reasonable emotions.

Agree. It's probably dawning on Rex H that the case against him is very strong. I hope he's very depressed. While RH did belong to work and hobby related groups, I don't think his social life was very busy. As a serial killer who developed his own system for screening, stalking and killing victims, he was spending a great deal of time involved with his criminal life.

He may also be a guy who was used to being in charge, controlling employees, customers, family members and victims. Now that he's in jail, his every move is controlled by others. It's a big adjustment, haha. Sorry I had to laugh. I have less than zero sympathy for the guy.

 

[snooptroop88]

Does anyone make anything of the dates of disappearance and proximity to holidays? Put together this chart:

-Karen Vergata, last seen Valentine’s Day 1996
-Peaches discovered on June 28th, 1997, estimated date of death three days prior, so June 25th; her date is situated between Juneteenth and 4th of July, fairly close to July 4
-Peaches’ daughter would have the same date as Peaches
-Valerie Mack, date available is November 19, 2000; Thanksgiving was Nov 23
-Jessica Taylor last seen between July 18 and July 21, 2003; two weeks “post” July 4th, Asa Ellerup has an August birthday
-Maureen Brainard Barnes last seen July 7, 2007; close to July 4th
-Melissa Barthelemy last seen July 12, 2009; July 4th holiday
-Megan Waterman last seen June 6, 2010; Memorial Day was May 31
-Amber Costello last seen September 2, 2010; Labor Day was Sept 6
-Asian male’s date cannot be determined
-Shannan Gilbert last seen May 1 (considered by authorities to be accidental natural causes, but contested); Mother’s Day was on May 9, also "May Day" May 1

Finding May Day particularly interesting/Source: "May Day, in medieval and modern Europe, holiday (May 1) for the celebration of the return of spring."

And the May Day specifically aside for a second, I'm seeing "medieval" mentioned in quite a few different items that I've looked at for potential association with RH. I know there was a certain weapon used in a non-Gilgo case that I think could be him. I'd seen weapons like the hammer used in that case before in a book on medieval weaponry, but I couldn't remember what these weapons were called, so I had searched it. And later, when I was looking into the Melody/Harmony sex club's history (I also think this club might be tied in with other non-Gilgo murders for RH), someone had commented that the goings-on at these clubs was "medieval."

But returning to the holiday dates, some might see this list and say this is backing up the idea that AE's potentially gone for the murders. I know it's definitely advantageous to look at this from the pragmatic/logistical aspect, and I suppose it would fit. But if RH is LISK, leaving that WH grandfather's belt bound up on a victim wasn't at all pragmatic. It was highly risky, "signature" type of behavior, and I'd be watching for any other murders where there are "vintage" items of any kind left at the recovery scene. And wondering if the holidays could mean something other than just murderer's family out of town.

 

[Betty P]

Does anyone make anything of the dates of disappearance and proximity to holidays? Put together this chart:

-Karen Vergata, last seen Valentine’s Day 1996
-Peaches discovered on June 28th, 1997, estimated date of death three days prior, so June 25th; her date is situated between Juneteenth and 4th of July, fairly close to July 4
-Peaches’ daughter would have the same date as Peaches
-Valerie Mack, date available is November 19, 2000; Thanksgiving was Nov 23
-Jessica Taylor last seen between July 18 and July 21, 2003; two weeks “post” July 4th, Asa Ellerup has an August birthday
-Maureen Brainard Barnes last seen July 7, 2007; close to July 4th
-Melissa Barthelemy last seen July 12, 2009; July 4th holiday
-Megan Waterman last seen June 6, 2010; Memorial Day was May 31
-Amber Costello last seen September 2, 2010; Labor Day was Sept 6
-Asian male’s date cannot be determined
-Shannan Gilbert last seen May 1 (considered by authorities to be accidental natural causes, but contested); Mother’s Day was on May 9, also "May Day" May 1

Finding May Day particularly interesting/Source: "May Day, in medieval and modern Europe, holiday (May 1) for the celebration of the return of spring."

And the May Day specifically aside for a second, I'm seeing "medieval" mentioned in quite a few different items that I've looked at for potential association with RH. I know there was a certain weapon used in a non-Gilgo case that I think could be him. I'd seen weapons like the hammer used in that case before in a book on medieval weaponry, but I couldn't remember what these weapons were called, so I had searched it. And later, when I was looking into the Melody/Harmony sex club's history (I also think this club might be tied in with other non-Gilgo murders for RH), someone had commented that the goings-on at these clubs was "medieval."

But returning to the holiday dates, some might see this list and say this is backing up the idea that AE's potentially gone for the murders. I know it's definitely advantageous to look at this from the pragmatic/logistical aspect, and I suppose it would fit. But if RH is LISK, leaving that WH grandfather's belt bound up on a victim wasn't at all pragmatic. It was highly risky, "signature" type of behavior, and I'd be watching for any other murders where there are "vintage" items of any kind left at the recovery scene. And wondering if the holidays could mean something other than just murderer's family out of town.

Good points. I had noticed the same about the dates of the murders. The times around holidays may have been opportune due to AE's travel, but also possibly beneficial for extra time off work for Rex H.

He seemed to be somewhat organized and methodical, averse to killing women during cold, inclement weather.

 

[CuriousCricket]

Does anyone make anything of the dates of disappearance and proximity to holidays? Put together this chart:

-Karen Vergata, last seen Valentine’s Day 1996
-Peaches discovered on June 28th, 1997, estimated date of death three days prior, so June 25th; her date is situated between Juneteenth and 4th of July, fairly close to July 4
-Peaches’ daughter would have the same date as Peaches
-Valerie Mack, date available is November 19, 2000; Thanksgiving was Nov 23
-Jessica Taylor last seen between July 18 and July 21, 2003; two weeks “post” July 4th, Asa Ellerup has an August birthday
-Maureen Brainard Barnes last seen July 7, 2007; close to July 4th
-Melissa Barthelemy last seen July 12, 2009; July 4th holiday
-Megan Waterman last seen June 6, 2010; Memorial Day was May 31
-Amber Costello last seen September 2, 2010; Labor Day was Sept 6
-Asian male’s date cannot be determined
-Shannan Gilbert last seen May 1 (considered by authorities to be accidental natural causes, but contested); Mother’s Day was on May 9, also "May Day" May 1

Finding May Day particularly interesting/Source: "May Day, in medieval and modern Europe, holiday (May 1) for the celebration of the return of spring."

And the May Day specifically aside for a second, I'm seeing "medieval" mentioned in quite a few different items that I've looked at for potential association with RH. I know there was a certain weapon used in a non-Gilgo case that I think could be him. I'd seen weapons like the hammer used in that case before in a book on medieval weaponry, but I couldn't remember what these weapons were called, so I had searched it. And later, when I was looking into the Melody/Harmony sex club's history (I also think this club might be tied in with other non-Gilgo murders for RH), someone had commented that the goings-on at these clubs was "medieval."

But returning to the holiday dates, some might see this list and say this is backing up the idea that AE's potentially gone for the murders. I know it's definitely advantageous to look at this from the pragmatic/logistical aspect, and I suppose it would fit. But if RH is LISK, leaving that WH grandfather's belt bound up on a victim wasn't at all pragmatic. It was highly risky, "signature" type of behavior, and I'd be watching for any other murders where there are "vintage" items of any kind left at the recovery scene. And wondering if the holidays could mean something other than just murderer's family out of town.

Who knows what might go on in RH's mind? Perhaps it's not US holidays, but say Norse holidays. or Druid. Your seeing ties to Medieval might suggest that, too. I see more and more mention of Norse in particular popping up. Maybe examine dates associated with those cultures.

MBB being wrapped/restrained with belts is difficult for me to find logical reasons for.

To me, the belts hint of:
an unprepared killer
maybe a new killer
restraints easily available in the setting; so was she killed in RH's home?

While I speculate RH is responsible for all the remains discovered along Ocean Parkway, why would someone go from being so careful to make victim identification more difficult to a scene that included a monogrammed family item? Something major would have changed for the killer. What was it?