Greece - Caroline Crouch, 20, tortured and murdered, Athens, 11 May 2021 #4 *ARREST*

[tayaway]

How could he even think, between plotting the murder of his child bride, wooing a 40 year old mistress, gay and bi trysts, sex trafficking minors, drug running, contract killing..
Did I miss anything?

Feeding the neighborhood kittens.

 

[everybodhi]

Feeding the neighborhood kittens.

Squeeze in some exotic vacations

 

[tayaway]

Do we know the age of the hypnopsychgynaecounsellorist?

No I had been looking for it myself. I have seen her picture and predict that she is in her late 40s or early 50s.

I swear I've read articles where she's been both 57 and 60, depending on the news outlet. Tracking down this MSM info, though, it like trying to find a needle in a haystack.

ETA: EM did mention that she has children over 30. She was a 20-year-old child, I saw her as my child, imagine that my children are over 30 years old and she is 20. Ήταν ένα 20χρονο παιδί, την έβλεπα σαν παιδί μου, φανταστείτε ότι τα παιδιά μου είναι πάνω από 30 ετών και εκείνη είναι 20.

 

[Estelle]

OK, returning to the unfortunate plot with a stream. Didn't B inspect the terrain before buying it?? It seems a house can be built there but the streambed must be changed. Which means massive amount of money and permissions from all kinds of agencies. But maybe when in his "blurry mind" he thought about sanctuary for fish???

Hahaha. In my country, we use a conveyancing solicitor who gets the plan of the land and the easements, streams, etc would be on the land plan. I remember reading a media article where the previous owner seemed to be selling the plot of land privately to B. Maybe B did not use a solicitor or consult his architect/engineer father first. Perhaps he was in a hurry to buy it. Now B's father will have to sort it out. I often wonder what the dynamics of B's family were like - especially his father - as we have seen his mother and brother.

 

[everybodhi]

How could he even think, between plotting the murder of his child bride, wooing a 40 year old mistress, gay and bi trysts, sex trafficking minors, drug running, contract killing..
Did I miss anything?

Bringing some prior discussions including their MSM links forward in the thread so that my synopsis of these posts is within TOS:

Plotted murder

The assessment that the crime was premeditated is expressed by the Professor of Criminology, Nestor Kourakis, emphasizing that the evidence does not prove that the perpetrator was in a boiling state.

"From the thermometer of the victim and the forensic examination it appears that the victim was asleep around 4:01 in the morning and that the perpetrator attacked him to strangle him with the pillow, as it actually happened around 4:11. Therefore, the homicide took place in a calm mental state of the perpetrator and not in the context of a mental overstimulation due to a sudden emotional overload, excluding his calm thinking, so there would be a boiling of mental momentum ".

Another element cited by Mr. Kourakis is interesting,noting that the pilot was "inspired" by his instructor's robbery. "The confessed perpetrator during his testimony also referred to an incident of" carbon "robbery that happened to a fellow helicopter pilot and his trainer in July 2018. It is, however, impressive that in that robbery the robbers were also three and hooded men, the dog was abused and the pilot's wife was similarly abused and in danger of dying from drowning, but had previously managed to lower the hood of one of the criminals. It is possible, then, that the confessed perpetrator had already worked out his plan for days, in order to present himself and his wife as victims of the same robbers and in this way to present a convincing story, "drawn from life '' .

Γλυκά Νερά: Νέες αποκαλύψεις για την ψυχρή συμπεριφορά του συζυγοκτόνου - «Ήταν σαν να έπαιζε έναν ρόλο» - TheCaller

They don't even need the memory card to prove premeditation. Caroline's watch recorded a sleeping pulse for over two hours when she was smothered. Any arguments between them must have ceased before Caroline fell asleep.
Plus he didn't pause between killing Caroline and going down to hang the puppy, the latter done because people wouldn't think he would be capable of that, so the 'house invasion' as a narrative was obviously thought through well in advance.

Child bride

snipped
As we can see by MSM even today, they are still trying to paint it out to be a consensual adult relationship, she dying at 20 instead of 19, and he being 32 instead of 33. Every little tweak helps his image, including referring to him constantly as 'the pilot' instead of spouse killer or the confessed murderer.

Wait what?

He meet her when she was 14?

40 year old mistress

The "bomb" exploded! There is a 40-year-old married woman with whom Babis Anagnostopoulos cheated on Caroline!

A big revelation comes to light about the relationship between Babis Anagnostopoulos and Caroline and what led to the crime in Glyka Nera, with the rumors about a third person "igniting". The secret that Caroline's family knew comes to light and changes the facts regarding the treatment of the pilot imprisoned in Korydallos, who had previously taken care to pocket a lot from Caroline's family. According to the information, Caroline's family, together with her legal representatives, were investigating rumors about the 32-year-old's relationship, contact or acquaintance with a woman from the wider professional environment.

The name of this woman, who is around 40, is known to the Authorities, with the investigation into the relationship of the 40-year-old with the murder of Caroline, in progress. However, she, through her legal representative, emphasizes that her contact with the pilot "has nothing to do with Caroline's murder". The same investigation revealed that in the last period of time that the police are investigating, no information has emerged from the mobile phone and the digital traces of the 32-year-old, contact with the 40-year-old woman. However, the authorities are further investigating the specific relationship between the two, examining additional digital evidence.

Φονικό στα Γλυκά Νερά – Έσκασε η «βόμβα»! Αυτή είναι η 40αρα παντρεμένη

Gay and bi trysts, sex trafficking minors

My take on these interesting questions.

My son asks: Were C's parents giving B money to keep C alive?

My answer is that C could have known about B's illegal activities for some time and even told her parents about it. But she was too afraid to report it to the police as B is the father of Lydia. She may have insisted that B stop these activities or she would leave him. So B told her that if she wanted him to stop, her parents would have to pay the 1,000 euros per month as he could not afford to keep a baby and wife who is not working on his income of 3,000 euros per month. The parents agreed but C found out that B did not stop his activities so C was threatening to leave him again and expose him.

Me: Was the secret that B is gay/bi or involved in a minor sex trafficking ring?

The answers to both of these questions could have some truth to them. Many men have married as a cover for their gay/bi sexuality to gain respect in their communities and some have murdered their wives when their secret became known. The Anni Dewani case comes to mind.
Murder of Anni Dewani - Wikipedia

Others think they they can lead a secret life and their wives will never find out. There are two possibilities in B's case. C could have searched B's mobile and found activity on a dating app such as grindr (which is for gays) then looked at his bank account and found out that he was spending money on overnight hotels and dinners and put two and two together even asking him what these were all about or keeping it secret.

Although B has denied any connection to Stavros and that he never went to his restaurant. The media reported that C knew Stavros as the couple often dined there. However, the media has never reported that Stavros was gay but there has been no mention of Stavros having a partner or ever having been married. The media did report that B often took Stavros on helicopter trips specifically to Mykonos.

Gay Mykonos Guide 2021 - bars, clubs, hotels & beaches

Mykonos is the most popular gay destination in Europe. It's where the international gay jet set congregates every year in the summer months.

Did C find out that Stavros was gay and questioned B's relationship with him?

Were Stavros and B engaged in human trafficking by helicopter perhaps in the past (if not recently) of immigrant women or even young boys? Maybe they stopped in 2018 and have pretended not to know each other since.

Greek Cops Bust Prostitution Ring Exploiting Migrant Women

Drug runner

AHA!
Luxury life of Caroline Crouch's killer husband probed over 'drug run links'

Reports suggest he was flying cash and drugs to islands. One source said: “We are looking into the finances of the suspect. "We need to know how he funded his lifestyle.” An accomplice has not been ruled out and there are claims he was mixed up with a criminal gang in Athens where he lived.

Luxury life of Caroline Crouch's killer husband probed over 'drug run links'

Caroline Crouch killed after 'learning husband smuggled drugs in chopper’

Drug runner or contract killer? So many questions!

Contract killer:

7:15 newswoman: he told us (this story about the fake robbery) about how the police would find the murderers, and now, in the same way, he's telling us that he didn't have an accessory, he did it alone
7:30 AK: Yeah, yeah (sarcastically). And now he's insisting that was alone. Let's hope that there do not exist/aren't tie-ups with other murders . . . I'll leave it there
7:46 newsman: What other murders?
AK: if he was really alone, then he'll pay the price (in the justice system) for what he's done. If he wasn't alone . . . if there was a queue behind him (of criminals), this has to be proven by the authorities and brought to justice

The head of police union, Constable AK, calling Babis an "experienced murderer"

In many interviews, including this one, AK's been hammering on about B's body language and his being completely emotionless after the murder of C. This is the first interview where he's mentioned "tie-ups with other murders." I'm wondering if he's hinting around that this wasn't the first time that B has murdered someone. In other words, is AK [edited to correct initials] hinting around that we're not just seeing the coldness of narcissist personality disorder, we're also seeing experience? An experienced murderer? JMO

I read somewhere that someone wondered whether B had been a "contract killer". It was probably in one of the lists of questions I posted on the last thread posed by Greek locals.

That interview is what made me start thinking Babis may be a contract killer. K said we will be shocked/amazed. He asked, how does he kill his wife, put his baby by her dead mother, hang the puppy, and appear calm afterwords? K also asked, what training/experience did he have to be able to do that? /Paraphrasing

 

[Patrick Jane]

To put those quotes in context, I think there's a difference between experienced killer and contract killer. A contract killer being a professional killer and an experienced killer is someone who has killed before, perhaps one other time.

Yes, that could be an allusion to SD. But I also took it, in the context of the body language discussion, to hint around to something more about B, something like experience. I wouldn't go as far as contract killer, because wouldn't a professional be more clever than to have such a ridiculous staging? Also, I don't think serial killer necessarily either. But I get the sense that there is a feeling that he's at ease because he's done it before. If this is what they're thinking, maybe they're misreading his psychology, maybe he's so at ease because he's a narcissist? But I think AK must have some kind of evidence (of other crimes, murders?) to be going out on TV nearly everyday and dropping these kinds of hints. So the discussion of the body language is the way to hint around in the media, and clue in the public without saying anything about information LE has. JMO

And another way to read AK's comments is that B could be involved with a group which is "tied up with other murders". AK doesn't explicitly call B an experienced murderer. That's just one possible interpretation I made from trying to parse his hints.

 

[Patrick Jane]

How did Halvatzis and his other employees react to one of their colleagues openly dating what appeared to be a 'little girl?' Did they accept it or ridicule him? When in 2016, before or after C's 15th bday? The auto translation which uses 'impressed,' doesn't come across as intended.

BBM

It translates literally as "made an impression on us." That's a polite way of saying, "we definitely noticed that and took note of it." They're not coming right out and saying that they had a bad impression or bad feeling about that, but they're implying it.

 

[everybodhi]

To put those quotes in context, I think there's a difference between experienced killer and contract killer. A contract killer being a professional killer and an experienced killer is someone who has killed before, perhaps one other time.



And another way to read AK's comments is that B could be involved with a group which is "tied up with other murders". AK doesn't explicitly call B an experienced murderer. That's just one possible interpretation I made from trying to parse his hints.

Not just anyone can kill his wife, put his baby by her dead body, hang the puppy, and appear calm afterwords, then comfort his dead wife's mother for weeks, that takes a certain skill set.

 

[tayaway]

It takes a narcissistic mindset, without feeling, he just did it, like taking out the garbage or washing the dishes.

ETA: Great work on the compilation! It takes a lot of work!

 

[tayaway]

To put those quotes in context, I think there's a difference between experienced killer and contract killer. A contract killer being a professional killer and an experienced killer is someone who has killed before, perhaps one other time.

And another way to read AK's comments is that B could be involved with a group which is "tied up with other murders". AK doesn't explicitly call B an experienced murderer. That's just one possible interpretation I made from trying to parse his hints.

Agreed. Whether a contract job or your wife, a seasoned hitman does the job, not all that mucking about.

 

[everybodhi]

Agreed. Whether a contract job or your wife, a seasoned hitman does the job, not all that mucking about.

The entire point of hiring a hit man is there's no connection to the victim.

 

[Patrick Jane]

I actually changed "impressed" to "shocked" in the post I made. Also was not sure of "little girl" Translation came out as "small" but I thought it should read "young".

BBM

There were a couple of ones in that translation.

The first one in the article that was translated as "little girl" was correct. That word literally means "little girl."

The latter one in the article that said "small (young?)". That word could refer to age or size or both. I would translate it as:

"She was smiling, cooperative, a very positive girl, but she she seemed like (just) a little girl."

In other words, C wasn't mature enough for us to say that the "smiling, cooperative, very positive" was the same as a mature person. C was like a child, like an underage person.

 

[Dotta]

I have 2 observations: sooo... 1.Everybody took notice of her age but nobody intervened, 2. B seems to be a magnet for all kinds of conspiracy theories

 

[tayaway]

New name: Lila Gerolymatou. Have at it. Who is she? Neighbor of B & the late C.

 

[Winterbells]

I swear I've read articles where she's been both 57 and 60, depending on the news outlet. Tracking down this MSM info, though, it like trying to find a needle in a haystack.

ETA: EM did mention that she has children over 30. She was a 20-year-old child, I saw her as my child, imagine that my children are over 30 years old and she is 20. Ήταν ένα 20χρονο παιδί, την έβλεπα σαν παιδί μου, φανταστείτε ότι τα παιδιά μου είναι πάνω από 30 ετών και εκείνη είναι 20.

Ok, so it's not her then.

 

[Estelle]

BBM

There were a couple of ones in that translation.

The first one in the article that was translated as "little girl" was correct. That word literally means "little girl."

The latter one in the article that said "small (young?)". That word could refer to age or size or both. I would translate it as:

"She was smiling, cooperative, a very positive girl, but she she seemed like (just) a little girl."

In other words, C wasn't mature enough for us to say that the "smiling, cooperative, very positive" was the same as a mature person. C was like a child, like an underage person.

I read in another article on the same subject and it was translated as C being a "minor" which I prefer myself.

 

[Patrick Jane]

I read in another article on the same subject and it was translated as C being a "minor" which I prefer myself.

At one point in the article you posted, the person who wrote that article used the precise Greek word for minor/underage in their description.

In 2016, shortly before Babis left Santorini, it became known that he was having an affair with a minor. "We had seen Caroline and we were impressed by her age and their relationship. He did not tell us how old she was, but it looked like she was a little girl. "

Φονικό στα Γλυκά Νερά – Έσκασε η «βόμβα»! Αυτή είναι η 40αρα παντρεμένη

SBM
BBM

The Greek original from the article:

Το 2016, λίγο πριν ο Μπάμπης φύγει από τη Σαντορίνη, έγινε γνωστό πως διατηρούσε σχέση με μια ανήλικη.

«Είχαμε δει την Καρολάιν και μας είχαν κάνει εντύπωση η ηλικία της και η σχέση τους. Δεν μας είχε πει πόσων χρόνων είναι, αλλά φαινόταν ότι επρόκειτο για ένα κοριτσάκι».

 

[Estelle]

I have 2 observations: sooo... 1.Everybody took notice of her age but nobody intervened, 2. B seems to be a magnet for all kinds of conspiracy theories

I guess one day we might find out how C's and B's relationship began. I don't wish to blame C's parents as I don't know the facts about whether their relationship was always behind closed doors or not. Neither parent may not have had any idea that they were romantically involved until C became pregnant (if before marriage) or when they told their parents they wanted to get married. Perhaps they simply thought that B was a friendly man who took C on helicopter rides.

My parents would not allow me to date until I was 16yo and I had curfews. Usually the boy has to come to the girls' house and you go out to a movie or to dinner. But being on an island, C could arrange to meet B somewhere else and with her mother working, there would be plenty of time that she could secretly meet him.

When my children were teenagers, I was a single parent and I had to monitor their outings by phoning the other parents, etc. if they had sleepovers. I always told my children what I thought about their choices of friends as I did not approve of some of them. I told them that they deserved better. Then they started to rebel by wanting to drink wine or beer under age and I found out both had tried marijuana behind my back. The stories I could tell. I never encouraged them to marry early. They knew they had to get a job as well as study at university full-time and I was not going to pay their fees. They are both university graduates, happily married and bought their first properties in their late twenties and have two children each. It was not easy as they both caused me a lot of angst. Neither my ex-husband nor I have ever helped them financially since they left school. I encouraged them to leave home at 20yo so that they would learn to pay bills, cook and clean, etc. Many parents do not believe in intervening but I'm glad I did. My mother used to say that if you try to intervene, it makes them want the other person more.

Perhaps that's what happened with C as I read that she left the island and lived in Athens with B even before they were married.

 

[Dotta]

I guess one day we might find out how C's and B's relationship began. I don't wish to blame C's parents as I don't know the facts about whether their relationship was always behind closed doors or not. Neither parent may not have had any idea that they were romantically involved until C became pregnant (if before marriage) or when they told their parents they wanted to get married. Perhaps they simply thought that B was a friendly man who took C on helicopter rides.

My parents would not allow me to date until I was 16yo and I had curfews. Usually the boy has to come to the girls' house and you go out to a movie or to dinner. But being on an island, C could arrange to meet B somewhere else and with her mother working, there would be plenty of time that she could secretly meet him.

When my children were teenagers, I was a single parent and I had to monitor their outings by phoning the other parents, etc. if they had sleepovers. I always told my children what I thought about their choices of friends as I did not approve of some of them. I told them that they deserved better. Then they started to rebel by wanting to drink wine or beer under age and I found out both had tried marijuana behind my back. The stories I could tell. I never encouraged them to marry early. They knew they had to get a job as well as study at university full-time and I was not going to pay their fees. They are both university graduates, happily married and bought their first properties in their late twenties and have two children each. It was not easy as they both caused me a lot of angst. Neither my ex-husband nor I have ever helped them financially since they left school. I encouraged them to leave home at 20yo so that they would learn to pay bills, cook and clean, etc. Many parents do not believe in intervening but I'm glad I did. My mother used to say that if you try to intervene, it makes them want the other person more.

Perhaps that's what happened with C as I read that she left the island and lived in Athens with B even before they were married.

You did great! Teens need both discipline, clear rules what they can and cant do and a lot of attention. They should know that whatever problem they face they can always rely on their parents. Talk to them and explain, teach and help. Always keep your promises, never talk with anger. Stress the importance of education, of being independent. But rules must be obeyed while living at home, parents are responsible while the children are minors. Absolutely monitor their friends, gf/bf. Never ever let them run loose. Tough and wise love is always successful. And then they will never say: "I couldnt tell my Mum/Dad because I didn't want to disappoint them". Disappoint?? How can a child disappoint parents when running to them for help? We all help with our heart those whom we love.

 

[Lola68]

https://www.thestival.gr/eidiseis/astynomika/egklima-sta-glyka-nera-🤬🤬🤬-to-smart-watch-kai-to-smart/

"At 06:16:58 the perpetrator dials a number corresponding to Lila Gerolimatou while a previous number was called with the stored name Lazarou etairiko.

There is more on Twitter re links with another ex-Superior Air pilot who has a FB profile v similar to Babis Sofianos but I can't post here