Has Your Opinions of Ron's Involvement Changed?***POLL ADDED***

[dodie20]

snipped:

Even though a juvenile aged 16 or 17 may be tried as an adult in criminal court in some states, a juvenile cannot be put to death in any state due to the decision in Roper v. Simmons.

http://www.ncsconline.org/wc/courtopics/FAQs.asp?topic=CapPun#FAQ207

thanks, & in my mind anyway, this might explain certain behaviors.

 

[dodie20]

If only we could answer the question about why people return to their abusers. We'd solve a lot of crime.

my daughter was in a destructive relationship, & I can't explain why she kept going back...except to avoid the emotional pain of not being with the man she loved.

 

[dodie20]

So, is this determinatin based on the age at the time the crime was committed or when charges were filed?

age at the time of crime, I hope...otherwise, too many vindictive LE would wait until they were legal, to press charges.

 

[bessie]

Bessie, IIRC The LVA Misty took revealed there was no "pee" blanket...
I'm also choosing to believe Tommy's attorney when he stated Tommy said Haleigh was deceased many hours before that 911 call was ever made..

The LVA is considered less reliable than the LDT by professionals. So, the results should be taken with a large grain of salt. Nevertheless, Ward rated Misty's statement: "The blanket smelled like pee." as a "Probable False". He added the comment: "This is very suspicious. Something going on with the blanket."

http://www.artharris.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/TJ-Ward-LVA-report-resized-2

I can't derive anything conclusive from that.

As for the timeframe, we're in agreement. The incident could've occurred as early as about 7:30-8:00 pm if we believe AS, earlier if we don't.

 

[Snowbunny]

my daughter was in a destructive relationship, & I can't explain why she kept going back...except to avoid the emotional pain of not being with the man she loved.

Dodie, I'm going through the same thing with my daughter, and the reason they keep going back is because they don't have any self-esteem and self respect. My daughter tells me that she can't stand to be alone and she can't afford to make it on her own. Those are the main reason anyone stays in an abusive relation ship and they usually end up with people who have to be in control. I think that's the main reason Misty puts up with Ronald.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

If Tommy's & Misty's stories are close, there's just got to be more to why Joe took Haleigh. I can't see someone getting enraged over a targeted theft not being available. Now, if Ron was hiding a gun that he had stolen from Joe? maybe. I can at least understand the frustration. or if Ron had offered the gun as a payment for a drug debt? maybe. Dealers do have their own set of laws when it comes to pay up time. But I'm just not believing that a foiled robbery attempt, caused this man to retaliate, by taking a child. That's crazy & risky, & I don't think someone who was that enraged & crazy, could just shut it off, & have the presence of mind, to pull off a successful disposal & cover-up. I would think that he'd still be raging & crazy. & then leave town the next day? scheduled departure or not, I would think he would be compelled, by these unscheduled events, to stick around & make sure his intimidated witnesses stayed intimidated.

I can dodie. I think whomever did this was a nut job that reacts to events strangely.

Joe didn't like being hoodwinked by Ron Cummings the first time and then he comes back to show Ron he can still steal from him and once again Joe is the loser and Ron outsmarted him once again. Some men are very competitive they don't like anyone to make them look like an idiot or get the one up on, them much less two up on them. They dont like losing and another guy getting the best of them. It highly ticks them off.

Why would he be raging the next day? He knew this time he got even with Ron. He knew he had taken the most valuable treasure Ron had and he knew Haleigh was never coming back to Ron alive.

Oh I think Joe knew that Misty and Tommy knew him better than anyone, and what a nut job he could be. Just because he checked out the next day didn't mean he couldn't sneak back into town at anytime. One thing that has always struck me about Misty and Tommy and that is they don't seem to have much of a backbone. I think they were cowards when it came to Joe O. I am sure he threatened them that if they told they would go down with him too and he was their blood kin.......so they kept his secret because they were trying to cover their own butts too.

Yes, it crazy to do such a thing and his own family said Joe Overstreet is crazy. There is a lot we don't know about JOs true demeanor imo. He supposedly stabbed his sister over a piece of baloney. Does this sound like a man that erupts violently over the slightest thing and acts crazy? It sure does to me. And we dont know what else he has been capable of doing in the past.

IMO

 

[EastCoast]

I think we are way over analyzing this. We have main players, Ron, Misty, JO, Tommy, Timmy, not to mention Chelsea and Lindsy and Lisa, Hank, Gma sykes and TN. ok, narrow it down. well we cant. So what do all these people have in common, Ron Cummings, go from there. this is all my opionion only, but Ron knows!!!!

 

[EastCoast]

I am only now second guessing myself as who was involved with Ron. Maybe Joe was, Maybe that is why none of the Cummings want to believe this story, cause they don't want him questioned too much, I don't know.

 

[justus4all]

I feel strongly about saying this as a fact...Perhaps you feel too as well.....Whenever Ron gets in a jam/trouble/corner...TN seems to be there to "help" him "defend" himself...I believe she is very involved in this cover up and making the statement to "hang Misty"..makes her look even MORE involved.

.What changed between her and Misty?? Before she was singing praises about Misty and now she wants to "hang her"????...

 

[Emeralgem]

The LVA is considered less reliable than the LDT by professionals. So, the results should be taken with a large grain of salt. Nevertheless, Ward rated Misty's statement: "The blanket smelled like pee." as a "Probable False". He added the comment: "This is very suspicious. Something going on with the blanket."

http://www.artharris.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2009/09/TJ-Ward-LVA-report-resized-2

I can't derive anything conclusive from that.

As for the timeframe, we're in agreement. The incident could've occurred as early as about 7:30-8:00 pm if we believe AS, earlier if we don't.

GGMS changed the time she was there thrice IIRC...So I don't believe she is a reliable witness, and I don't believe she saw an alive Haleigh either..
I was under the impression the LVA was more reliable than an LDT, but what do I know? Problem as I see it IF the results from any of theses tests are to be taken with a grain of salt, WHY even bother...JMO

 

[suspicious1]

I am only now second guessing myself as who was involved with Ron. Maybe Joe was, Maybe that is why none of the Cummings want to believe this story, cause they don't want him questioned too much, I don't know.

Hey EastCoast, do you think that maybe Ron and Jo are in cohoots? It was weird how the Croslins were fingering Jo, but the Cummings were denying everything that came out about Jo having something to do with Haleigh's disappearance. I couldn't understand that.

I still think that Jo was the "fall guy". Why not blame Jo? He was convenient. He was not from the area....he was labeled by his family as being crazy.....he had recently gotten into it with Ron, Haleigh's father......IMO, in their minds, he was the perfect scapegoat. I also think that Misty and Tommy (maybe Ron too) thought that their problems would leave Satsuma, when Jo did. Maybe they thought LE would leave them alone if they threw suspicion JO's way. But apparently that didn't happen....and now all of them are locked up except for Jo.

JMO of course

 

[suspicious1]

I feel strongly about saying this as a fact...Perhaps you feel too as well.....Whenever Ron gets in a jam/trouble/corner...TN seems to be there to "help" him "defend" himself...I believe she is very involved in this cover up and making the statement to "hang Misty"..makes her look even MORE involved.

.What changed between her and Misty?? Before she was singing praises about Misty and now she wants to "hang her"????...

Justus4all, I don't what changed but one thing for sure is that...something definitely changed between them. I really didn't see Teresa flip flop until AFTER Misty got locked up. So what happened since then? If you add in the fact Teresa seemed worried that Misty would talk-"you thinks she's gonna talk?" From Teresa to Ron in jailhouse visit. IMO, Teresa changed faces. Annette Sykes did too, for that matter. But I think we are seeing their true colors now......so now that makes me wonder why they put on their fake faces in the beginning? There had to be a reason. JMO

 

[Snowbunny]

I was listening to Simon Barrett's blog talk radio show today and Cobra said that he believes that whatever happened to HaLeigh happened prior to Mr Cummings going to work. They also brought it up on the show how it was GGM Hollar that stated that Joe was the one who did it and Tommy just agreed. Tommy never said Joe did it. Cobra seems to think that Joe is Misty's and Tommy's fall guy and Misty is the Cummings' fall girl. Cobra felt that the SA should grant Misty complete immunity for all the drug traffickking charges and any charges where HaLeigh is concerned in exchange for her coming totally clean and giving up those who are responsible for what happened to HaLeigh. He felt she was young and might actually turn her life around, but if not LE will have her back in the slammer before it was all over with anyway if she didn't straighten up. I do agree with Cobra on this one. I say if she can make this case for the state, give up those responsible and give us HaLeigh, then I say put her in the witness protection program, help her get her education and a job. I think the state would be far better off doing this than spending anymore manhours and court costs and not getting anywhere. Its time to bring HaLeigh home.

 

[bessie]

I feel strongly about saying this as a fact...Perhaps you feel too as well.....Whenever Ron gets in a jam/trouble/corner...TN seems to be there to "help" him "defend" himself...I believe she is very involved in this cover up and making the statement to "hang Misty"..makes her look even MORE involved.

.What changed between her and Misty?? Before she was singing praises about Misty and now she wants to "hang her"????...

I can think of one reason. Misty lied to them in the beginning. Somehow convinced them Haleigh's death was Ron's fault which led to a cover up and the need to keep Misty quiet. Thus, the marriage and the words of praise. As time went on, TN and AS questioned her story and came to the conclusion she lied. Nothing was said until about this time last year. Late July, actually, after Ron was cleared in the DFS investigation. That's when TN brought in Nejame and Tim Miller, and Misty was subjected to a LDT and the hypnosis, LVA, etc. Shortly afterward, Misty took a powder, and before long we heard she and Ron had filed for divorce. There was a notable change in TN's attitude toward Misty, but she had to be careful about what she said because they were all guilty of withholding information. I think she was hoping the whole thing would be forgotten, just go away. Ron should've listened to his mama and stayed away from Misty. But he's a fool. Now that he's apparently agreed to talk, TN can say whatever she wants about Misty.

If Misty were still covering for Ron, I doubt we'd hear TN calling for her public execution. Seems she'd still be singing her praises and feeding her commissary account.

 

[dodie20]

I was listening to Simon Barrett's blog talk radio show today and Cobra said that he believes that whatever happened to HaLeigh happened prior to Mr Cummings going to work. They also brought it up on the show how it was GGM Hollar that stated that Joe was the one who did it and Tommy just agreed. Tommy never said Joe did it. Cobra seems to think that Joe is Misty's and Tommy's fall guy and Misty is the Cummings' fall girl. Cobra felt that the SA should grant Misty complete immunity for all the drug traffickking charges and any charges where HaLeigh is concerned in exchange for her coming totally clean and giving up those who are responsible for what happened to HaLeigh. He felt she was young and might actually turn her life around, but if not LE will have her back in the slammer before it was all over with anyway if she didn't straighten up. I do agree with Cobra on this one. I say if she can make this case for the state, give up those responsible and give us HaLeigh, then I say put her in the witness protection program, help her get her education and a job. I think the state would be far better off doing this than spending anymore manhours and court costs and not getting anywhere. Its time to bring HaLeigh home.

those are some very interesting comments coming from a guy who spent some quality time with Ron. I don't remember him singing this tune before...I wonder what brought about the change of heart.

 

[Gwen]

I think it is interesting that we have both Lisa Croslin and Teresa Neves saying that whomever did this to Haliegh deserves the death penalty. It might come back to bite one or both of them at a sentencing phase of a murder trial.

I see posturing going on. Teresa has had to fall back and regroup. It is falling apart and she knows it. Why she would be bold enough to say she hopes they hang Misty is a mystery. I think it is a veiled threat to try one more time to scare Misty and remind her that they can and will put her in the hotseat if necessary.

Interestingly, she hasn't spoken publically since she said this. Could be she regrets her words now and on further consideration has decided it was not the right thing to say.....YET. Could be Shoemaker shut her up. She could just be busy. Who knows? I do think she was trying to scare the crap outta Misty though.

 

[Crosby87]

If only we could answer the question about why people return to their abusers. We'd solve a lot of crime.

Misty told her father TN and AS sent HaLeigh over to her house to coerce her into coming back and she went back to babysit the children. Despite what TN says, Ron and Misty were not reunited Monday night and we know Ron utters death threats when he is angry, and since no one was there to stop him, I think he started planning his daughter's murder over the weekend.
IF Ron and Misty fought over the telephone at 8:30 pm, they were arguing over HaLeigh and Ronnie Jr., not Misty's relatives children.

After a wife/mother mysteriously disappears, family members usually say the mother would never leave their children because she fears if she leaves, the father will turn on the children, so she stays to protect them. Misty asked TN if it was okay with Ron if she babysat Monday and since Ron was angry with Misty and feels he own his children, I fear he snatched HaLeigh away from Misty and only he knows where HaLeigh is; otherwise he would have looked for her. Dr. Archer said Ron was obsessed Monday night and I think Ron's actions prove he was mentally insane. TN fooled Misty into believing Ron wasn't mad with her and didn't take the situation seriously enough, so she contributed to HaLeigh's demise and I'm sure her guilt is killing her. TN should have immediately snatched the kids away from Ron when Ron started abusing Misty. TN knows her son better than anyone and she how he thinks but she is afraid to stand up to him and because she didn't, look what she is responsible for allowing Ron to get away with. TN was a trustee of Ron's children and she failed to fulfill her obligations to her grandchildren and rather than admit her guilt, she is tranferring it on Misty.

 

[dodie20]

I can think of one reason. Misty lied to them in the beginning. Somehow convinced them Haleigh's death was Ron's fault which led to a cover up and the need to keep Misty quiet. Thus, the marriage and the words of praise. As time went on, TN and AS questioned her story and came to the conclusion she lied. Nothing was said until about this time last year. Late July, actually, after Ron was cleared in the DFS investigation. That's when TN brought in Nejame and Tim Miller, and Misty was subjected to a LDT and the hypnosis, LVA, etc. Shortly afterward, Misty took a powder, and before long we heard she and Ron had filed for divorce. There was a notable change in TN's attitude toward Misty, but she had to be careful about what she said because they were all guilty of withholding information. I think she was hoping the whole thing would be forgotten, just go away. Ron should've listened to his mama and stayed away from Misty. But he's a fool. Now that he's apparently agreed to talk, TN can say whatever she wants about Misty.

If Misty were still covering for Ron, I doubt we'd hear TN calling for her public execution. Seems she'd still be singing her praises and feeding her commissary account.

TN treats all of Ron's exes poorly. IDK why, but once they're out of his life, she pulls her love away, IMO. I would imagine that that's been very hurtful to girls, who thought she cared about them. Well anyway, that might explain some of her animosity towards Misty. I remember how she verbally dug her claws into Crystal every chance she got, & that girl was doing nothing but trying to find out what happened to her daughter. But, looking back, Crystal seemed to take it in stride. I guess she was used to it? but, I was struck with the utter inappropriateness of it all. just like I am now. MOO

 

[Zoe Bogart]

It is just my opinion but I don't think Crystal was there to show Ron support, she has been attending the hearings. She is desperate to know where Haleigh is. She, like many here, do not want Haleigh's and Jr's father to be the one responsible for what happened. If Ron is not responsible (not my opinion) but gets a long drug sentence, it will be hard on Jr. I am not standing up for Ron, just trying to put myself in Crystal's head. I am sure she has been told and has read the accounts Misty and Tommy have given, pretty graphic details about them doing nothing about JO and Haleigh being thrown in the river. She was overheard stating the day LE declared the case a homicide that Joe killed her baby. None of these stories should have come out until or unless there is a trial.

BBM - Not attacking your post, just questioning a quote from AH.

:cow: The thing about that statement of Crystal supposedly saying to someone, "Joe killed my baby", is that it came from AH, presumably from one of his sources, and his sources don't always get it right. Think bones at the river. He's a sensationalist reporter and I definitely have doubts about that statement. If LE told the family "Joe did it", why are they not keeping closer tabs on JO? Why didn't they have a conversation with him that lasted more than an hour when they went to see him in TN back in April? :cow: :cow:

 

[Zoe Bogart]

Mr Cummings' minister stated that he had worked an eight hour shift that night and he mentioned that at the very beginning of this case.

Yes, the minister said it, adding more fuel to the fire, because RC said he worked from 5pm until 3am, which is longer than eight hours. :waitasec: