Has Your Opinions of Ron's Involvement Changed?***POLL ADDED***

[oceanblueeyes]

I always believe truth lays in between the lies.

If this case ever comes to an arrest I think it will be Joe Overstreet that will be arrested for murder and Tommy for aiding and abetting or accessory to murder.

IMO Joe is no scapegoat. Joe is getting a pass because his kin has told so many different stories that it has muddled the investigation.

No one had a score to settle with Ron Cummings but Joe Overstreet.

IMO

 

[LCoastMom]

Could Misty and Tommy being trying to force JO into telling what happened? What if Ron and JO are the ones who know what happened, TN would know that, hence her not wanting to cast suspicion on JO. What if the fight over the gun, where ever it was, wounded up with Haleigh being shot. It freaked em both out and hence the madness. Maybe Misty and Tommy only know bits and pieces. Or maybe I have finally gone off the deep end...lol.

I don't think you've gone off the deep end and goodness knows I don't feel like I have a clue, what happened to lil' Haleigh; but if she were the victim of gun fire, wouldn't there be a visible crime scene and blood somewhere?

With LE called the night/early morning following the last time Haleigh was reportedly seen by anyone outside the family - IIRC she was in school on Monday - so figure about 14-15 hours from when Haleigh was last seen, until searchers were actually looking for her - could a crime scene be completely demolished, no blood found or DNA left behind?

The theories on this thread all sound plausible to some extent, depending on which way the wind is blowing.

My issues with all the possible perps or witnesses "after the fact" is ever changing stories - if any of them had told the truth from day 1, then their story would not have changed/Haleigh would have been found, months ago.

Ron was at work... well part of the night at least.
Misty knows nothing about what happened to 'that little girl'. Maybe, maybe not. LDT - FAILED Miserably.
Tommy "ditto"
TN showed up at the house at 3:30ish AM fully dressed (including her LE jacket) almost before LE arrived.
GGMS saw the kids eating supper out on the front steps, temps in the 60's - GGMS had a conversation with Misty. Hmmm

What has always bothered me; the 911 call, Ron crying, tossing himself on the ground like a 3 year old, Misty's where-about's the first couple days, the T-shirt in Haleigh's missing poster - showing up in the laundry, the 'blanket is in the van they took'. Ron's smirk when he replied to every question "IDK - I was at work!"

I just don't know... but a lot of people do, about half of them are in jail

 

[Chablis]

If Ron called Misty 90 plus times that night, there was a huge problem going on. He either had it, left work and found her and all heck broke loose. Or something happened before work, and he was trying to establish an alibi that he was at work calling, I dont know. He had to have known the phone records would show what was going on.

 

[kant]

If Ron called Misty 90 plus times that night, there was a huge problem going on. He either had it, left work and found her and all heck broke loose. Or something happened before work, and he was trying to establish an alibi that he was at work calling, I dont know. He had to have known the phone records would show what was going on.

Big ole yes here too. And in the grip of a trauma, emergencies, strife, etc folks dont always think of phone records and whatnot. The multiple calls hink me big time too. Get outta my head, Ms Chablis. (Miss Jackson if ya nasty) Sorry I cant stop quoting song lyrics. Please feel free to smack me.

 

[1Chump]

OK here's what I think:

I will be the first to admit that I believed without a reasonable doubt that Ron had done something to Haleigh and then she magically "disappeared". IMO, you could not explain away Ron's actions and those of his family without suspecting that they knew all along what happened to Haleigh. No one really wants to think that a father could hurt his child let alone cover up what actually happened to her. I do not believe that Misty led Ron to believe whatever happened to Haleigh was his fault. IMO, the Cummings knew exactly what happened....the fact that I believe that Misty was their "fall girl", in the beginning, the Cummings tried to keep Misty happy by any means. They controlled everything Misty said. IMO, the Cummings job was to paint Misty as the perfect girlfriend in the public's eyes but IMO, they wanted her to also appear as a liar, so if and when she decided to tell the truth no one would believe her. It worked out rather well for them. IMO, the Cummings were thinking that, if they kept Misty happy and spoke highly of her, then Misty would continue to be on their side and go along with the script. Misty did just that although she didn't have all her details together. As long as they rallied around Misty, their secret was safe. LE said early on in this case that Misty was the "key" and said that Misty was not being truthful with them....That did not seem to bother the Cummings then, so why are they concerned now?

Since the drug bust, now we have Teresa and Annette changing faces and talking real bad about Misty. Like I said, I really didn't notice Teresa/Annette flip flop on Misty until after she got locked up. I asked myself "what changed"? IMHO, I think that the Cummings felt that their secret was not safe anymore. They could not control the situation with Misty behind bars, and I think that worried them. I will never forget Teresa-"you think she's gonna talk" statement. Never will. IMO, Teresa was very much worried about Misty talking. So, because they couldn't control Misty any longer, and their secret was not safe any longer, what do they do? They started to bad mouth her, treating her as their enemy. And with that being said, Misty still wanted GMF to call and tell them about the search of the St.JOhns River...where Teresa and Annette spent hours searching after that phone call. IMO, that was Misty's way of showing the Cummings "see I'm still on your side". I believe that was because bits and pieces of the truth were starting to come out.

It seemed pretty clear, to me at least, that Ron and Misty were targeted in that drug bust. And that fact, at one point, confirmed to me that Ron and Misty had something to do with what happened to Haleigh. It's hard to separate the two cases because in my mind, we would not have seen one (drug bust) if it wasn't for the other (Haleigh case). But when I heard that Ron would testisfy on behalf of the STATE if there ever is a trial concerning Haleigh, that made me think that Ron had crucial information for the STATE in regards to Haleigh. The SAO accepted the deal. I just don't know how that would be, if they thought he was directly involved in whatever happened to Haleigh.:waitasec: That's the part that gets me and now have me sitting on the fence as to whether Ron had a hand in what happened to his daughter. I will admit though that I do not know how those plea deals work.
So if LE is not considering Ron a suspect, then clearly they think that he knows something, because once again, the SA accepted the deal. IMO, LE knew from the get go that Ron had information, but he was not willing to give it up. When Ron stop cooperating with LE, IMO, it wasn't because Ron was being truthful with them. I think they were on to Ron early in this case and because of that, Ron got him a criminal defense lawyer and didn't want to speak with them anymore. So he didn't. For months...
So if LE thought Ron had crucial information early on and they considered Misty "the key", clearly they both were protecting someone, but who?
IMO, if they were not protecting Ron, they were protecting someone very close to him....like his mother, Teresa. Some don't think that Misty would cover for Teresa...but I think she would if Ron told her too.

JMO of course

coffee anyone?

The only reason I can possibly think for Ron to get a deal is he has to testify under oath TRUTHFULLY. Ron does not know what the SA knows. Ron has no idea what "evidence" they have. If the SA catches Ron in a lie, the SA can revoke the deal.

I am hoping the SA has set the trap and Ron is going to take the bait.

 

[suspicious1]

The only reason I can possibly think for Ron to get a deal is he has to testify under oath TRUTHFULLY. Ron does not know what the SA knows. Ron has no idea what "evidence" they have. If the SA catches Ron in a lie, the SA can revoke the deal.

I am hoping the SA has set the trap and Ron is going to take the bait.

Hey 1Chump! I've missed you!:innocent:

Honestly, I do not know how plea deals work. Wouldn't SA know what Ron is going to say or testify to? Are you thinking that they know what he's going to say, and it is not going to jive with the evidence and information that they have, so therefore, Ron is being set up? If that's the case then, dropping Ron's 2 highest charges, was all part of the set up?

I don't know 1Chump, maybe you can help me understand it all. But this is what I think: I think that the SA knows exactly what Ron is going to say and testify to if there is ever a trial for Haleigh (which IMO they know is coming soon). I think that whatever Ron has told them is helping their case in some way. I always felt that Ron knew exactly what happened to his daughter but I also felt that he had direct involvement. But what if he didn't have any direct involvement and LE knows this? I think that when there is a trial for Haleigh, Ron will not go untouched. In exchange for his testimony I think that Ron will be charged with a lesser crime like obstruction of justice or tampering with evidence, you know, that kinda thing. I do not think that Ron is innocent in all this but I don't see the SA making a deal with someone who they felt was the "main" suspect in Haleigh's disappearance. Does that kinda thing happen often? I'm not sure.

IMO, Ron is guilty of something, what? I don't know. IMO, the SA knows of his guilt and they accepted the deal with Ron, to help seal their case against the "main" suspect in Haleigh's case. Like I said before, I think Ron will be charged with a lesser crime. Does that make any sense? Have I had one too many? LOL

I respect your thoughts and opinions, 1Chump.

 

[ilovemew]

I picked other because I believe he was involved but not directly. I never thought he actually hurt Haleigh himself but his actions, lifestyle, priorities and attitude got his daughter, his supposed 'heart' killed.

NG told Crystal that Haleigh never stood a chance. I believe that but she said it to the wrong parent.

 

[Zoe Bogart]

suspicious, I noticed Teresa/Annette flip flopping on Misty a year ago when TN contacted Mark Nejame and Tim Miller..
IIRC..It was right after Ron C and the Croslins had their BIG fight at GGMS's house and Ron C was arrested.. It was also right after Ron and Misty put the headless rat in the Croslin's mailbox...IMHO.. Thats when TN and GGMS started revving up that bus to take down Misty and anyone else they could think of in order to save Ronald... JMO

Yes, I think they began to change at that time because RC was getting into trouble and more fingers were pointing in his direction, so they regrouped and began turning on Misty - to save RC. I do think they were ready to turn on Misty from the beginning if RC appeared guilty. She was their scapegoat of choice for later. Originally, I thought they were covering for Misty because in essence, covering for RC's babysitter meant covering for RC. They wanted Misty to point blame away from RC, so they needed her for the "kidnap" story.

From the beginning, TN & AS didn't seem to jump on the Joe did it story because they knew how illogical it sounds. Even RC said from very early Joe wasn't involved and claimed there was no fight between he and Joe.

 

[grammieto5]

Nope, I still think he's a loser!

 

[claudicici]

....in the beginning I just didn't know what to think about Ron....I was flip flopping from feeling horribly sorry for him to thinking he is abusive and a complete hot head....
I now believe Ron knew what happened to his precious daughter from the beginning.
I believe Jo has something on Ron and it is BIG,HUGE ,much bigger than an illegal gun...something that also involves the other Cummings....that's why the "there was no fight over no gun with no cousin" and the rat in the Croslins mailbox (because they know) ...that's why TN turned on Misty when she started talking about Joe...the Cummings do not want Joe to start talking.....Misty knew from the beginning ,she gave it away with little clues like "the van they took".....I think it's like the "cry wolf" story,Misty and Tommy lied so many times that noone believes them when the truth comes out.I think Ron promised Joe the gun so he would keep his mouth shut,Joe is crazy just like Grandma Flo says and killed Haleigh because of it.Misty and Tommy were too drugged out to do anything about it.They are not scared of Joe ,they did not tell because Ron told them not to.He was going to take care of it in the end himself but IMO Joe has something HUGE on Ron....

 

[TxLady2]

....in the beginning I just didn't know what to think about Ron....I was flip flopping from feeling horribly sorry for him to thinking he is abusive and a complete hot head....
I now believe Ron knew what happened to his precious daughter from the beginning.
I believe Jo has something on Ron and it is BIG,HUGE ,much bigger than an illegal gun...something that also involves the other Cummings....that's why the "there was no fight over no gun with no cousin" and the rat in the Croslins mailbox (because they know) ...that's why TN turned on Misty when she started talking about Joe...the Cummings do not want Joe to start talking.....Misty knew from the beginning ,she gave it away with little clues like "the van they took".....I think it's like the "cry wolf" story,Misty and Tommy lied so many times that noone believes them when the truth comes out.I think Ron promised Joe the gun so he would keep his mouth shut,Joe is crazy just like Grandma Flo says and killed Haleigh because of it.Misty and Tommy were too drugged out to do anything about it.They are not scared of Joe ,they did not tell because Ron told them not to.He was going to take care of it in the end himself but IMO Joe has something HUGE on Ron....

So what would stop Joe from coming out with whatever he has on Ron now? If his name is being smeared and he is being accused of murdering Haleigh, don't you think it would be pretty simple to tell them what he knows, in order to get his own butt out of the sling?? Why would he sit back and smirk and let half the world believe he is a child killer? If he knows anything, NOW would be a good time to get it all out in the open. Unless he wants Tommy and Misty to go down for whatever happened, but then why would he be protecting Ron? Blood is thicker than water. He would be protecting his own kin, rather than a two-bit drug pusher... doncha think?
I don't believe he knows anything on Ron, any more than Tommy does. Or Misty. Else all 3 of them would have blown the lid off this case a long time ago.
But that's JMO.

 

[dodie20]

OK here's what I think:

I will be the first to admit that I believed without a reasonable doubt that Ron had done something to Haleigh and then she magically "disappeared". IMO, you could not explain away Ron's actions and those of his family without suspecting that they knew all along what happened to Haleigh. No one really wants to think that a father could hurt his child let alone cover up what actually happened to her. I do not believe that Misty led Ron to believe whatever happened to Haleigh was his fault. IMO, the Cummings knew exactly what happened....the fact that I believe that Misty was their "fall girl", in the beginning, the Cummings tried to keep Misty happy by any means. They controlled everything Misty said. IMO, the Cummings job was to paint Misty as the perfect girlfriend in the public's eyes but IMO, they wanted her to also appear as a liar, so if and when she decided to tell the truth no one would believe her. It worked out rather well for them. IMO, the Cummings were thinking that, if they kept Misty happy and spoke highly of her, then Misty would continue to be on their side and go along with the script. Misty did just that although she didn't have all her details together. As long as they rallied around Misty, their secret was safe. LE said early on in this case that Misty was the "key" and said that Misty was not being truthful with them....That did not seem to bother the Cummings then, so why are they concerned now?

Since the drug bust, now we have Teresa and Annette changing faces and talking real bad about Misty. Like I said, I really didn't notice Teresa/Annette flip flop on Misty until after she got locked up. I asked myself "what changed"? IMHO, I think that the Cummings felt that their secret was not safe anymore. They could not control the situation with Misty behind bars, and I think that worried them. I will never forget Teresa-"you think she's gonna talk" statement. Never will. IMO, Teresa was very much worried about Misty talking. So, because they couldn't control Misty any longer, and their secret was not safe any longer, what do they do? They started to bad mouth her, treating her as their enemy. And with that being said, Misty still wanted GMF to call and tell them about the search of the St.JOhns River...where Teresa and Annette spent hours searching after that phone call. IMO, that was Misty's way of showing the Cummings "see I'm still on your side". I believe that was because bits and pieces of the truth were starting to come out.

It seemed pretty clear, to me at least, that Ron and Misty were targeted in that drug bust. And that fact, at one point, confirmed to me that Ron and Misty had something to do with what happened to Haleigh. It's hard to separate the two cases because in my mind, we would not have seen one (drug bust) if it wasn't for the other (Haleigh case). But when I heard that Ron would testisfy on behalf of the STATE if there ever is a trial concerning Haleigh, that made me think that Ron had crucial information for the STATE in regards to Haleigh. The SAO accepted the deal. I just don't know how that would be, if they thought he was directly involved in whatever happened to Haleigh.:waitasec: That's the part that gets me and now have me sitting on the fence as to whether Ron had a hand in what happened to his daughter. I will admit though that I do not know how those plea deals work.
So if LE is not considering Ron a suspect, then clearly they think that he knows something, because once again, the SA accepted the deal. IMO, LE knew from the get go that Ron had information, but he was not willing to give it up. When Ron stop cooperating with LE, IMO, it wasn't because Ron was being truthful with them. I think they were on to Ron early in this case and because of that, Ron got him a criminal defense lawyer and didn't want to speak with them anymore. So he didn't. For months...
So if LE thought Ron had crucial information early on and they considered Misty "the key", clearly they both were protecting someone, but who?
IMO, if they were not protecting Ron, they were protecting someone very close to him....like his mother, Teresa. Some don't think that Misty would cover for Teresa...but I think she would if Ron told her too.

JMO of course

coffee anyone?

you had me until the end & the teresa part, lol. IDK...there was a time when I thought that was possible, but once they all splintered, went their own ways, & TN turned on Misty, I pretty much gave it up. I think Misty would've lashed out & turned on her in retaliation...& surely she'd tell on her before blaming Joe? which brings us to Tommy's stories. Where do they fit in? I can only think of one possible reason, & it's a little farfetched. We've all heard about those guys who false confess. Most of those people are nuts or people who've been badgered by cops for a long time. But every once in awhile, a seemingly normal guy confesses, gets himself charged, & while waiting for trial, DNA clears him & leads to the real killer. When asked why he confessed in the 1st place, he just looks perplexed & says he doesn't know why. go figure. & although I don't believe it, Tommy could be suffering from a little of this, a little of the nuts part, & a little of the badgered part. But instead of false confessing, he's false accusing. & once he got going, he didn't see any turning back, so he just kept going. maybe thinking owning up to the lie would get him in more trouble? or maybe he was so obsessed with the case & his sister's problems, & jealous of her 'fame', that he decided to insert himself into the mix? but why would Misty go along with his madness? IDK, but after reading this & seeing how unbelievable it really is, I realize just how cooked Tommy is. I hope his lawyer has a better mind than mine, because there's got to be a better defense for lieing than what I've thought of.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

So what would stop Joe from coming out with whatever he has on Ron now? If his name is being smeared and he is being accused of murdering Haleigh, don't you think it would be pretty simple to tell them what he knows, in order to get his own butt out of the sling?? Why would he sit back and smirk and let half the world believe he is a child killer? If he knows anything, NOW would be a good time to get it all out in the open. Unless he wants Tommy and Misty to go down for whatever happened, but then why would he be protecting Ron? Blood is thicker than water. He would be protecting his own kin, rather than a two-bit drug pusher... doncha think?
I don't believe he knows anything on Ron, any more than Tommy does. Or Misty. Else all 3 of them would have blown the lid off this case a long time ago.
But that's JMO.

Oh I think Joe knows plenty but it isn't on Ron. He is trying to protect his own secrets and involvement. If he knew anything at all about Ron he would be singing like a canary to get the heat off of him.

I think Misty and Tommy were spineless when it came to their "crazy" cousin Joe. And what was just as important to them was that none of them wanted it known they were connected to this crime. It has worked for Joe, because I have no doubt, he told them if they breathed a word about what happened that night, they would go down with him.

Joe lawyered up and has gone silent. IMO, he keeps waiting for the shoe to drop and he is hoping upon hope that his kin has told so many different stories trying to protect their own butts that he will never be punished for this crime and sadly that may come to pass although I do believe that LE is continuing to work the investigation to bring it to a resolution.

Ron didn't even know Joe that well and already Joe had the guts to try and steal Ron's first gun. Then he was so bold and unbalanced imo that he went back and tried to steal another gun. A person capable of doing that is not a normal dude who reacts rationally.

I never thought that Ron and Joe got into an actual physical fight but I do think very heated words were exchanged. I don't think these people would even know the difference in a submachine gun from a legal semiautomatic, that looks very similar to one nowadays. I don't remember reading that LE said that Ron had an illegal gun.

I will continue to believe that no one but Joe Overstreet had a score to settle with Ron Cummings and he exacted his revenge, when once again his plans to steal the gun went awry. When he came up empty handed again he saw right before him what he could take away from RC that would bring him to his knees imo.

IMO

 

[Baznme]

I do not think that Ron is innocent in all this but I don't see the SA making a deal with someone who they felt was the "main" suspect in Haleigh's disappearance. Does that kinda thing happen often? I'm not sure.

Snipped for space -

I do think that the SA would make a deal with someone who they felt was the "main" suspect in Haleigh's disappearance. The deal is on the drug charges. He's already agreed to testify in any trial that would involve Haleigh's disappearance. He could end up testifying at his own trial as a result - which I believe will be the case.

 

[suspicious1]

Snipped for space -

I do think that the SA would make a deal with someone who they felt was the "main" suspect in Haleigh's disappearance. The deal is on the drug charges. He's already agreed to testify in any trial that would involve Haleigh's disappearance. He could end up testifying at his own trial as a result - which I believe will be the case.

Thanks, Baz. I do not know how plea deals work. I understand that the deal was about the drug charges but IMO Haleigh's case, weighed in on the decision to drop 2 of Ron's charges. Therefore, Ron has agreed to testify in a trial involving Haleigh. I don't know if I'm explaining it right, but wouldn't the State already know what Ron is going to testify about? I am totally confused, Baz. I need some help.:waitasec:

 

[lonetraveler]

I keep this at the back of my mind when I consider if Ron is involved or not; on the jail tapes of Tommy and Misty, they both talked about the fact that LE are not willing to hear anything about Ron Cummings. Maybe Tommy and Misty did try to tell the truth but LE would have none of it and cut them both off at the knees whenever they mentioned Ron's name. For some reason, I can believe that.

 

[Baznme]

Thanks, Baz. I do not know how plea deals work. I understand that the deal was about the drug charges but IMO Haleigh's case, weighed in on the decision to drop 2 of Ron's charges. Therefore, Ron has agreed to testify in a trial involving Haleigh. I don't know if I'm explaining it right, but wouldn't the State already know what Ron is going to testify about? I am totally confused, Baz. I need some help.:waitasec:

I'd be second guessing what the State may or may not already know but, that doesn't mean that RC knows at this point. RC may think there may never be a trial and if there is, it's going to be someone else charged and on trial......not him. When I heard the SA state the other day that in exchange for the plea deal that there would "truthful" testimony in the event of a trial regarding Haleigh's case, that sent up a red flag to me, they are onto him and he doesn't even realize it. I could be wrong, of course. It may be my wishful thinking that if he needs to be charged, it will be forthcoming. I don't know but it's what I'm thinking at this point.

 

[lil momma]

Ok, i have a question though...

What IF there is NO trial regarding HaLeigh? What if there is never any additional evidence that is found, or that one little piece that solves the puzzle? Then does Ron still get those two charges dropped?

I guess i am asking if the so called "deal" has an expiration date?

(give em a rope they will hang themselves)

 

[suspicious1]

Ok, i have a question though...

What IF there is NO trial regarding HaLeigh? What if there is never any additional evidence that is found, or that one little piece that solves the puzzle? Then does Ron still get those two charges dropped?

I guess i am asking if the so called "deal" has an expiration date?

(give em a rope they will hang themselves)

Lil momma, that's what I want to know too. Good question. It kinda makes me think that they know for a fact that there will be an upcoming trial. I can't see the SA making that kind of deal, if they were not sure if there would be an upcoming trial. Just a thought.

 

[Justin Tyme]

If his 911 call didn't convince me enough already, all of his words and actions since that call have. So, my opinion on RC's involvement have only been reinforced by him. MC may be the key but RC is the lock. This is my opinion...and I'm sticking to it.