Holly Bobo found deceased, discussion thread *Arrests* #7

[pearl]

When the defense attorneys begin to file their motions to suppress evidence, will these be sealed?

 

[Tugela]

Yes, I do know all of this.
LE uses tower dump request as one of their extra investigative tools to help to see if they see something unusual or to see if someone who they are suspecting was around. For example let say by child abduction LE request it to see if any known pedophile was somewhere around who wasn't living there, or maybe even if he was living in the area. Then they have a reason to question him. Nothing less, nothing more. They request it to have a starting point or to strenghten their theory. The key is indeed the time of their request and what exact data they are requesting the cell company to preserve. But LE knows this as I have seen this requests in several cases here before. In Europe is used too.
It's not a proof of anything, not a solution. It is a helping tool, a filter. Sometimes it can help, sometimes not, as some perps are smart enough to know not to bring their phone to the scene of a crime, or yes, in case they live somewhere there they can say yes, I was home.

Only if they use the phone to make a call/text, then there will be a record that can be tied to a tower.

 

[Orgona]

Only if they use the phone to make a call/text, then there will be a record that can be tied to a tower.

Respectfully this is IMO not true. Maybe it was true 7-8 years ago, but not in the last few years. The cellphone companies are keeping record of more things than they are advertising.
As you also know every cell phone is pinging the nearest available tower to be in signal range in order to keep sending and receiving text, data and calls at any time. Naturally, there is also a record of this which is included in the tower dump.

LINK

The court orders in the Colorado case show police got "cellular telephone numbers, including the date, time and duration of any calls," as well as numbers and location data for all phones that connected to the towers searched, whether calls were being made or not Police and court records obtained by USA TODAY about cases across the country show that's standard for a tower dump.

The cell phone providers even get paid for providing the tower dump, although in the big scheme of things those paid amounts are not that big of a sum.
[URL="http://www.scmagazine.com/tower-dump-of-consumer-mobile-data-a-popular-police-snooping-tactic/article/324789/]LINK[/URL]

For providing the data, T-Mobile received $11 million from law enforcement, while AT&T received $10 million. Verizon was paid around $5 million in 2012.

With this I leave this subject as it is, because I don't want to derail the thread any further.

 

[Tugela]

Respectfully this is IMO not true. Maybe it was true 7-8 years ago, but not in the last few years. The cellphone companies are keeping record of more things than they are advertising.
As you also know every cell phone is pinging the nearest available tower to be in signal range in order to keep sending and receiving text, data and calls at any time. Naturally, there is also a record of this which is included in the tower dump.

LINK


The cell phone providers even get paid for providing the tower dump, although in the big scheme of things those paid amounts are not that big of a sum.
[URL="http://www.scmagazine.com/tower-dump-of-consumer-mobile-data-a-popular-police-snooping-tactic/article/324789/]LINK[/URL]



With this I leave this subject as it is, because I don't want to derail the thread any further.

Respectfully, I prefer to rely on what the Justice Department and the FBI says is retained, not what a newspaper interprets that to mean.

 

[Mr. Noatak]

The game is afoot.

 

[wfgodot]

The game is afoot.

I love that expression; but what do you mean?

 

[Tulessa]

I love that expression; but what do you mean?

Quarry is on the run.

 

[SteveS]

Respectfully this is IMO not true. Maybe it was true 7-8 years ago, but not in the last few years. The cellphone companies are keeping record of more things than they are advertising.
As you also know every cell phone is pinging the nearest available tower to be in signal range in order to keep sending and receiving text, data and calls at any time. Naturally, there is also a record of this which is included in the tower dump.

LINK


The cell phone providers even get paid for providing the tower dump, although in the big scheme of things those paid amounts are not that big of a sum.
LINK



With this I leave this subject as it is, because I don't want to derail the thread any further.

Thanks for your helpful contributions. Information from someone such as you who has knowledge is NOT derailing, and is much appreciated.

 

[Mr. Noatak]

I love that expression; but what do you mean?

My opinions only, no facts here:

The term “the game is afoot” is widely-attributed to what Sherlock Holmes would say when a crescendo of information has the potential to yield a break-through in understanding and solution of a criminal case. This term is originally from Shakespeare, King Henry IV Part I in 1597.

As long as the Prosecution holds exclusive title to evidence in a criminal case, we know nothing. Once the evidence is shared with the Defense (“Discovery”), there is potential to know something about what actually happened, BEFORE the trial begins. If the evidence is overwhelmingly harmful to the Defendants, the Defense should remain fairly silent. If the Prosecution evidence is wishy-washy, the Defense would be expected to imply this in a news conference or whatever, before the trial.

Thanks for asking.

 

[justwannahelp]

I'm just jumping in here after reading through pages and pages. It's not a case I followed closely but I have checked in a couple of times. I just want to add something --because I'm putting myself in the victim's shoes--for some reason I think it would bother holly to see people speculating that she knew well the man that kidnapped her into the woods. I don't think she was led voluntarily into those woods. If I'm right, she must be bothered by that assumption.

I'm thinking whichever of these 3 suspects that took her that morning was raging towards her for her not being sexually interested in him. Wasn't Zachary Adams at the coon hunt? Maybe Holly ignoring him made him mad. So in his mad meth state, he figured he'd force her to notice him. He probably insulted her that morning near her car and shouted something like, "so you think you are too good for me you little bleep?!!" Shocked, she probably shouted back something sassy- rightfully so! They argued more. Then he took her at gunpoint- his intention all along. I think this is the quarreling the brother heard. That doesn't mean she knew him.

This is all my speculation. But I just don't think she KNEW knew the kidnapper. Maybe in passing - like the coon hunt--but not much more. Maybe she knew of his bad reputation??

I just wanted to jump in and say that.

I also think the sketch her friend, Ms. Wood gave of the creepy guy staring at them at the coon dinner looks very much like Zachary Adams. Furthermore, I think the sketch Heather Sullivan gave of the man that tried to but failed at kidnapping her ALSO resembles Zach Adams. Heather has many of the same features as Holly too. Maybe He had a thing for blondes. Don't freaks like him usually go after similar looking women?

The poor family of Holly. I just can't imagine what they have gone, are going, and will go through😔. There are awful cases I've followed, but this one just seems to drag out with all sorts of gossip and twists and turns and so many men involved--some potentially involved that aren't in custody or are dead from suicide. Good grief, what that poor girl went through. The multiple perps make it so much worse for so many reasons- obviously the repeat violations, but also I'm sure at one point she may have had hope in one of them showing some compassion towards her and letting her go or stopping one of the others from further violating and abusing her. The fear, pain, terror, disgust, loss of hope, and just total disappointment in not one of them showing ANY compassion. Holly, you are in a MUCH better place now dancing with the Angels!

 

[Tugela]

Thanks for your helpful contributions. Information from someone such as you who has knowledge is NOT derailing, and is much appreciated.

<modsnip> The link I provided regarding the sorts of material that is retained, together with provider retention policies was a document generated by the department of Justice and the FBI in 2010. Holly went missing in 2011, so the DOJ document covers the situation at that time.

Regarding the USA Today article, this blog posting explains exactly what they are talking about. The information in the tower dumps contains the call detail records for a particular base station. That would include things such as calls, texts and data usage. The phone companies retain that information because it is important for billing purposes. The non specific ping data may be retained for a short period of time (24-48 hours IIRC), but longer than that probably not because of the sheer volume of data it entails.

You don't understand just how enormous the ping data pool is. There are something like 150-200 million cell phones in the US. A record is probably going to be about 10-20 bytes in size at least, which would equate to about 2-3GB of data every time the collective phones ping. If a phone pings every 10 minutes, that would be about 52000 pings a year. Taken across all the phones in the country, you are talking about a truly massive amount of data that would have to be stored (around 50000 hard drives worth). The cost of keeping all that information when you take the medium, infrastructure and maintenance into account would be hundreds of millions of dollars. Why would the phone companies spend all that to keep information that is completely useless to them?

Police can track someone using pings in real time. Doing it after the fact is not so easy, because that sort of data is not retained very long at all.

 

[Tugela]

My opinions only, no facts here:

The term “the game is afoot” is widely-attributed to what Sherlock Holmes would say when a crescendo of information has the potential to yield a break-through in understanding and solution of a criminal case. This term is originally from Shakespeare, King Henry IV Part I in 1597.

As long as the Prosecution holds exclusive title to evidence in a criminal case, we know nothing. Once the evidence is shared with the Defense (“Discovery”), there is potential to know something about what actually happened, BEFORE the trial begins. If the evidence is overwhelmingly harmful to the Defendants, the Defense should remain fairly silent. If the Prosecution evidence is wishy-washy, the Defense would be expected to imply this in a news conference or whatever, before the trial.

Thanks for asking.

I don't agree. The defense would not be doing what you suggested if they had any sense because it would telegraph their case to the prosecution ahead of the trial and thus place them at a disadvantage. There is nothing to be gained by doing that and a lot to lose.

They don't need to win in the court of public opinion, they need to win in the court of law.

 

[SteveS]

The information she provided/implies isn't true.

Simply put, from what I have learned from past experience in this forum, I trust that Orgona is credible and more reliable and has it right when sharing the following:

Originally Posted by Orgona
"Respectfully this is IMO not true. Maybe it was true 7-8 years ago, but not in the last few years. The cellphone companies are keeping record of more things than they are advertising.

As you also know every cell phone is pinging the nearest available tower to be in signal range in order to keep sending and receiving text, data and calls at any time. Naturally, there is also a record of this which is included in the tower dump.

LINK - The court orders in the Colorado case show police got "cellular telephone numbers, including the date, time and duration of any calls," as well as numbers and location data for all phones that connected to the towers searched, whether calls were being made or not Police and court records obtained by USA TODAY about cases across the country show that's standard for a tower dump.

The cell phone providers even get paid for providing the tower dump, although in the big scheme of things those paid amounts are not that big of a sum.

LINK For providing the data, T-Mobile received $11 million from law enforcement, while AT&T received $10 million. Verizon was paid around $5 million in 2012."http://&quot;http://www.scmagazine....opular-police-snooping-tactic/article/324789/

 

[Mightymight]

Tugela, at the bottom of most towers is a small building. If you have never been inside one of those buildings, you would be amazed at the technology and storage capability inside. You are underestimating the resources that are available to the carriers.

 

[Mercurydime]

I used to listen to prank calls on youtube all the time.

Any of you heard of ip relay, caller id spoofing, spamming, Skype, voiceover ip apps, etc...?

If someone with basic internet knowledge wanted to, they could call your house, and have your caller id, ip reader and whatever other identification systems you may have say that the call came from Tokyo, when it actually came from Cleveland. I don't know about "pings", but I'm sure the data could just as quickly be manipulated.

I couldn't convict anyone based on cell phone pings...

I appreciate you folks passion, but I must clarify that cell phone data is as easily falsified as a name on yahoo.

Always interesting to go to my moms' house and answer questions like "Why does 'American Online' not do the news on tv too?"

- mercurydime - class of 2000

 

[tarheelslim]

I used to listen to prank calls on youtube all the time.

Any of you heard of ip relay, caller id spoofing, spamming, Skype, voiceover ip apps, etc...?

If someone with basic internet knowledge wanted to, they could call your house, and have your caller id, ip reader and whatever other identification systems you may have say that the call came from Tokyo, when it actually came from Cleveland. I don't know about "pings", but I'm sure the data could just as quickly be manipulated.

I couldn't convict anyone based on cell phone pings...

I appreciate you folks passion, but I must clarify that cell phone data is as easily falsified as a name on yahoo.

We just had a new phone system put in at work and were taught how to use its ability to "spoof" a number (so you can call from your phone at home but it will look as if it's coming from your work number).

That is completely unrelated to pings though and I don't know that it would even be possible to falsify those. That's a wave coming off your phone that physically connects with a tower (right?). So someone with direct access would have to doctor the information found in the computer on the tower - for someone connected with the phone company to alter those records to change the direction of a criminal case is beyond belief. But I doubt there is even such an ability to change these numbers to begin with (there would be no reason for such a function to exist).

 

[scriptgirl]

Wait, what photo at the coon hunt are you talking about and what about a creepy man staring at Holly? IF Zach had that bad of a rep, didn't Holly and Ms Wood know him on site? Also, how many men were involved with this abduction? And how do we know Holly was raped?

 

[Dogface]

Wait, what photo at the coon hunt are you talking about and what about a creepy man staring at Holly? IF Zach had that bad of a rep, didn't Holly and Ms Wood know him on site? Also, how many men were involved with this abduction? And how do we know Holly was raped?

Ok I am winging this here and am currently on prescription cough medicine so I hope this is coherent.

The coon hunt story comes from a friend who was on a double date with Holly, and said a man was staring at them. That person is believe to have been Shayne Austin, who was found deceased, from alleged suicide, in a Florida hotel after having an immunity deal yanked off the table in regards to Hollys case.

Dylan Adams, the younger brother, has allegedly admitted to the rape of Holly.

The Pearcy brothers were rumored to have a video showing Holly after her abduction, however, as far as we know, no video exists and no charges for that have been filled against them.

So as it stands, 3 people(Zach and Dylan Adams and Jason Autry)are implicated in the crime in regards to charges currently filled. It's unknown if anyone else, like Shayne Austin, may have been involved.

 

[justwannahelp]

Wait, what photo at the coon hunt are you talking about and what about a creepy man staring at Holly? IF Zach had that bad of a rep, didn't Holly and Ms Wood know him on site? Also, how many men were involved with this abduction? And how do we know Holly was raped?

Holly was at coon hunt with her friend, Candace Wood. Here's a link to what Candace says about creepy man at coon hunt. Many think its Shayne Austen, who has since killed himself. I think that it looks like some of the pics of Zach Adams when he's wearing glasses. Candace said she was 85 percent sure it was Shayne when police showed her Shayne. I think there was a big part of her that felt it WASN'T Shayne. But this us just my speculating.

http://www.wsmv.com/story/25397291/bobo-friend-describes-man-in-camouflage-at-coon-hunt

Here's a pic that I think resembles it
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...tudents-mother-sons-fourth-grade-teacher.html

 

[Foxfire]

OT- Just an FYI:

Georgia man arrested in 2005 Tennessee murder case July 31, 2015
http://wkrn.com/2015/07/31/georgia-man-arrested-in-2005-tennessee-murder-case/

HICKMAN COUNTY, Tenn. (WKRN) &#8211; A man from Augusta, Georgia, has been charged in the 2005 murder of a woman in Hickman County, Tennessee.

John Boyer, 58, was transferred to the Hickman County jail this week from North Carolina, to face first degree murder charges.

He&#8217;s accused of killing Jennifer Smith, who was found dead by a highway worker in April 2005 near an abandoned parking lot in Bucksnort, Tennessee.

Authorities say Boyer strangled the 25-year-old to death with a seatbelt in his truck before driving off.
<snipped - read more>