IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #22

[Dr. Know?]

There's so many directions my thoughts are taking me. I do sleuth when I shouldn't I'll admit. I just don't post it.

garrr....still many new avenues since the girls have been found. Too many at the moment but some are sticking. The process of elimination. Doubt I'd figure it out before LE ever, just a fact.

Thanks for the link Otto!

 

[Dr. Know?]

Ssshhhhhhh. Don't tell Otto. But if they can tell me if it's county owned it might save me from a hit or miss searching for an owner. Thank you. j/k otto. I appreciate your help. I haven't attempted to search the accessors site yet. Hopefully tomorrow though.

 

[otto]

Ssshhhhhhh. Don't tell Otto. But if they can tell me if it's county owned it might save me from a hit or miss searching for an owner. Thank you. j/k otto. I appreciate your help. I haven't attempted to search the accessors site yet. Hopefully tomorrow though.

No problem. Here's a map. I've highlighted an area in red in the top map showing land that appears to be public land. The map below shows the ownership. The other land is privately owned and, given what we know about where the children were located, I think it's quite possible that it was on private land.

Also, the link I posted at the bottom of the last page should take you straight to the correct location on the map. If you select the i (information) in the upper left part of the map, and then click on the parcel, it tells you the name of the owner and there's additional information below the map.

 

[mnegri1973]

Just throwing this out here but I grew up in Jasper county with is about an hour and a half or so from E'dale. I have family who lives there and knows the family and really once an Iowan always an Iowan. Even if you move out of state. I feel so badly for the families but I know the case is in good hands. They will find who did this.

But back to my original point, even if the name of the park was not well known, I would bet my left foot that the local teens, young adults, or even shady chars KNOW the area. I knew most if the back roads, farm roads, and out of the way places in most of central Iowa being that I was always the designated driver. Who ever committed this horrible crime is local and knew where to go.

May The Lord bless and watch over the families and bring them comfort.

Mel~


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

 

[Dr. Know?]

I'd look up heavy internet activity in the area before the girls went missing, especially anyone visiting the 7 Bridges websites where they were found. jmo It would elimate the traveler aspect possibly or add to it. jmo

Thank you Otto. I have to do some shopping tomorrow but I'll be back.

 

[LucyOso]

I'd look up heavy internet activity in the area before the girls went missing, especially anyone visiting the 7 Bridges websites where they were found. jmo It would elimate the traveler aspect possibly or add to it. jmo

Thank you Otto. I have to do some shopping tomorrow but I'll be back.

That is a good idea. I know I grew up in a rural place and there were plenty of places that locals or people from near-by counties (good people looking for a picnic spot, shady people needing a spot to deal drugs, kids looking for a place to party) know about.

There is also the possibility the girls witnessed some crime, like a drug deal or rape, or an affair and acting their ages (truthful), said they were going to tell the cops. It could be a case of being in the wrong place at the wrong time. Someone was smart enough to know the lake would be drained first. I guess I worry that focusing only on RSO can limit views of the situation. :twocents:

 

[hollyblue]

RNER, yesterday there were a lot of hunters out. It was the last day of deer season one for shotgun, so anyone who had tags for season one and hadn't gotten a deer was out. I know there were at least 8 to 10 hunters in the square mile around my property just judging from the sounds of gunshots.

I told my husband last September that I thought the girls' bodies would be found at the beginning of season one for shotgun, the end of season one for shotgun, the beginning of season two for shotgun or the end of season two for shotgun. Those are the four deer season days with the most hunters out unless the weather is totally awful but that hasn't been the case this year.

Frankly, I personally would not go out looking for a body on any of those four days because I don't want to end up with a Darwin Award. I would wait until today or Friday, the days in between the two shotgun seasons.

The vast majority of hunters are sensible people who follow safety guidelines like it was a religion but there's always a few out there who are idjits. Just as there are always a few idjits driving in the first snow season of the year or letting off firecrackers during a drought summer around the fourth of July. <eyes rolling>

I confess to being one of the idjits that will get out on the roads the minutes the snow stops after a nor'easter dumps a foot or more of snow, but I do know how to drive in it, vs waiting a few hours when the real dummo idjits get out there. I hit the convenience stores for fresh coffee and just drive around enjoying the scenes of snow...imagining what the countryside was like before all the highways and vehicles had to be a factor to be cautioned with. I would have to contend with them the next morning going to work! Did the same on my old jogging trails....before joining WS and realizing....not such a good idea as I trail ran vs asphalt or concrete.

***My car was always well prepared with an emergency kit, etc..anything I might need....just in case.. even tho I lived in the outer suburbs of Philly. The only problem I ran into one time was a real idjit that left his pick-up sitting in the middle of a narrow back road...on a hill the night before!!! Little nerve racking to back back down it and do a K turn at the bottom.

 

[hollyblue]

For one I'd think the sheets are covering where the girls bodies were found. Two, to preserve the insects (dead or alive) & vegetation also dead or alive to determine a TOD. jmo

The ME did come back to the site today along with others.

^^^^That. I would have thought the FBI would have had their forensic anthropology or cadaver experts out there. I was kind of surprised to hear the ME was returning. To me, that may show there were scattered remains. ??? How often does ME return to the crime scene...anyone know?

 

[writer7]

If you look at the helicopter view that shows the road and vehicles and also the two sheets, I think you can see a path that begins to go into the woods. If you follow that straight (just visually), you run into a spot that's between the two sheets. I think the perp may have carried one body at a time, and he got a little off-course when carrying the second body. Also, surely he didn't care how close together they were



He put them near the river yet felt comfortable that nobody would smell the decomp? What about canoers, etc? Do they just not use that area much, or was it because the water was so low? Was the drought predicted?

I almost think he came from the water somehow. His boat floated a bit, so the bodies are farther apart because of that? They are closer to the shore than anything.

I do wonder about the paddleboater again. I think it may be a person big on spending time in small boats (maybe a fisherman, too?). He probably owns at least one. He may have been at Meyer's Lake boating that day, just by chance. Just speculation

 

[GrainneDhu]

I confess to being one of the idjits that will get out on the roads the minutes the snow stops after a nor'easter dumps a foot or more of snow, but I do know how to drive in it, vs waiting a few hours when the real dummo idjits get out there. I hit the convenience stores for fresh coffee and just drive around enjoying the scenes of snow...imagining what the countryside was like before all the highways and vehicles had to be a factor to be cautioned with. I would have to contend with them the next morning going to work! Did the same on my old jogging trails....before joining WS and realizing....not such a good idea as I trail ran vs asphalt or concrete.

***My car was always well prepared with an emergency kit, etc..anything I might need....just in case.. even tho I lived in the outer suburbs of Philly. The only problem I ran into one time was a real idjit that left his pick-up sitting in the middle of a narrow back road...on a hill the night before!!! Little nerve racking to back back down it and do a K turn at the bottom.

Hollyblue, driving within your personal skill level isn't being an idjit. The idjit driver is the guy who passes you, fishtailing wildly and then has to slam on the brakes because he suddenly realises there was a vehicle in front of you. Or the driver who slides off the shoulder of the road, gets out of her car and stands on the shoulder with her cell phone glued to her ear while she calls her BFF to moan until the tow truck arrives and doesn't think "gee, I slid off here, I might not be the only one to slide here..."

When I could drive, I loved driving in the snow and I never got into any accidents or caused any accidents. An idjit driver does both because they don't stop to ask themselves if they have the skills and equipment needed for those driving conditions.

 

[GrainneDhu]

^^^^That. I would have thought the FBI would have had their forensic anthropology or cadaver experts out there. I was kind of surprised to hear the ME was returning. To me, that may show there were scattered remains. ??? How often does ME return to the crime scene...anyone know?

Depends on the ME. Some are very hands-on and want to check the scene for themselves, others are less likely to go see (both types can be competent).

Without knowing more about the specific ME in question, it's hard to know if that visit signifies anything in particular.

 

[GrainneDhu]

If you look at the helicopter view that shows the road and vehicles and also the two sheets, I think you can see a path that begins to go into the woods. If you follow that straight (just visually), you run into a spot that's between the two sheets. I think the perp may have carried one body at a time, and he got a little off-course when carrying the second body. Also, surely he didn't care how close together they were

He put them near the river yet felt comfortable that nobody would smell the decomp? What about canoers, etc? Do they just not use that area much, or was it because the water was so low? Was the drought predicted?

I almost think he came from the water somehow. His boat floated a bit, so the bodies are farther apart because of that? They are closer to the shore than anything.

I do wonder about the paddleboater again. I think it may be a person big on spending time in small boats (maybe a fisherman, too?). He probably owns at least one. He may have been at Meyer's Lake boating that day, just by chance. Just speculation

BBM

I agree with the statement I bolded. Both girls were small enough for many adult men to carry individually but I think that they were too heavy together to be carried at the same time.

Yes, the drought was predicted (at least, my weather witch of a neighbour did) and it was in full swing by the middle of July. I doubt anyone was canoeing the Wapsipinicon River, it was at historic lows last summer. There were lots of places where the water was only ankle deep (according to a friend of mine who lives in the Waterloo/Cedar Falls area). If he came in by water, he'd almost have to have come in via innertube. And that just doesn't seem very likely to me.

I don't think the area the girls were found is used often in the summer. There are plenty of other, more attractive, recreational areas to attract hikers, campers, etc.

I doubt he cared or even thought about decomposition. My theory is that he just wanted to put off discovery for a couple weeks. Just long enough for the memory of anyone who knew him to fade about his absence on 13 July.

 

[AmarilloByAM]

I guess I thought that once the girls were found so many of our questions would be answered. Sadly, this is not the case. So many more questions now without answers!!! Hurts my heart.

 

[Adair88]

Mostly I agree with your post but I do not think they were kidnapped. IMO these girls were gone from grandma longer than she claimed. Being a rural child myself I know how kids left out on their own tend to explore. IMO these girls will have on their original clothing. I tend to doubt they were taken by anyone. I think they drowned and then were washed to the spot they were found.

Being a local, it is IMPOSSIBLE that the girls had either wandered there OR drowned and bodies washed away there. They disappeared next to a lake. They were found by a river that flows downstream and does not flow by Evansdale at all. The river by Evansdale is the Cedar River, not the Wapsipinican.

 

[matou]

Just throwing this out here but I grew up in Jasper county with is about an hour and a half or so from E'dale. I have family who lives there and knows the family and really once an Iowan always an Iowan. Even if you move out of state. I feel so badly for the families but I know the case is in good hands. They will find who did this.

But back to my original point, even if the name of the park was not well known, I would bet my left foot that the local teens, young adults, or even shady chars KNOW the area. I knew most if the back roads, farm roads, and out of the way places in most of central Iowa being that I was always the designated driver. Who ever committed this horrible crime is local and knew where to go.

May The Lord bless and watch over the families and bring them comfort.

Mel~


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk HD

I'm thinking young adults, teens. JMO

 

[Adair88]

Hi old pals,

I just read the news this morning. .

FWIW, my two cents:

The girls were abducted by either a stranger or strangers, or a very peripheral acquaintance. I believe they were grabbed and shoved into the abduction vehicle not far from Elizabeth's house where they were last seen.

The were killed in the abduction vehicle. I also believe both girls were sexually assaulted.

Their bodies were dumped within 48 ( but more likely 12) hours in the place where they were found yesterday.

The remains are mostly, if not totally skeletonized and were ID'd by clothing and dental records. There was no "freezer remains" IMO , nor were the girls held alive for more than a few hours after they were abducted.

This crime is not related to the drug convictions of any family members.

The girls may have originally been placed closer together but may have been moved by animal activity.

I do not think any special emphasis need be placed on wording of "bodies" or "remains", nor on the reporting that they were "visually identifiable" , or on the location of the recovery as it applies to the perp's residence. 23 miles is, IMO, pooping where you eat. In other words, if the perp lives in W'loo, E'dale or Brenmer Co., the placement of the bodies is still basically in their backyard.

I wouldn't read too much into the dump site ( sorry) other than that the perp(s) had wheels and needed to get rid of two little girls' bodies. I'm pretty sure the murderer is local, but in a broader sense. Like a tri-county kind of way.

Anyway, just where I sit on this new info. I spent alot of time here in the beginning and honestly, I still think they were nabbed as a crime of opportunity.

JMO

RIP sweet girls.

Very well thought out. I agree 100%.

 

[GrainneDhu]

I guess I thought that once the girls were found so many of our questions would be answered. Sadly, this is not the case. So many more questions now without answers!!! Hurts my heart.

I love your user name! Reminds me of so many late night long distance trips.

I still have hope of answers. It's going to take some time for all the forensic testing to be done on all the items they collected in addition to the bodies. I still have hope that there will be one or more items that have DNA on them that matches DNA found near the bicycles, in which case that person will have a mountain of 'splaining to do.

 

[RNER]

No problem. Here's a map. I've highlighted an area in red in the top map showing land that appears to be public land. The map below shows the ownership. The other land is privately owned and, given what we know about where the children were located, I think it's quite possible that it was on private land.

Also, the link I posted at the bottom of the last page should take you straight to the correct location on the map. If you select the i (information) in the upper left part of the map, and then click on the parcel, it tells you the name of the owner and there's additional information below the map.

You and your maps are amazing!

 

[Eileen730]

I don't think they were found that far apart.

This photo is hauntingly sad!

So desolate. So quiet! How were they ever found.

 

[FrayedKnot]

BBM: I'm in NE Arkansas and we've had some very hard freezes in the past 10 years. That kudzu survives anything and everything.

O/T but I have lived in the South my whole life and can attest to the fact that indeed, kudzu was fashioned by the fiery cloven hooves of Satan himself. That stuff WILL NOT DIE.

Just another example of why introducing invasive, non-indigenous species is a baaaad idea! Like water hyacinth, Japanese beetles and privet. Yipes!