IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #3

[sweetpea33]

Ollipop....as I have ridden the trails between waterloo and CF I have actually seen piles of empty boxes of ephedrine (sudaphed) while riding. so the girls stumbling upon a meth lab would be a possibility. I have also heard of drug dealers selling on the trails, but have not witnessed it myself

 

[Pensfan]

I am not assuming anything, was going off some earlier conversations about Lyric maybe being "groomed."

I do think totally random is less likely, but that is JMO.

Fixated child molesters are the predators that “groom” victims and these creeps are not child abductors or killers. Groomers/fixated pedophiles believe that they are in love with the child and they don't want to hurt them.

This is a description of the sicko that abducts and murders children:


• Gender: All offenders were male; females did abduct, but none killed
• Age: Mean was 27, range was 14–58, 72% were younger than 30
• Race: majority white, interpret with caution
• Marital history: 60% were not married at time of offense, 24% were divorced, 8% were in common law marriages, 8% were married
• Children: 56% had no children at time of offense, 16% only had one child, 20% had two children, no one had three children, and 8% had four or more children
• Education: Little formal education; only 8% had some college education
• Occupation: Most had lower-level unskilled jobs, only 8% had skilled positions
• Military: 76% did not have military history
• Religion: 88% grew up in a Christian household and 72% still considered themselves Christian
• Animal abuse: 20% had history of animal abuse
• Psychiatric: 36% had a psychiatric diagnosis prior to offense, perhaps an underestimate
• Family background: 56% lived with both biological parents during childhood, 40% had mothers that were unemployed, 16% reported having occasional instability and disruption in their household
• Family incarceration: 24% reported at least one parent had been incarcerated
• Offender incarceration history: 40% had previous incarceration, almost half had a juvenile offense history
• Childhood behavior patterns: Chronic problems from birth to age 12, including enuresis, isolation, lying, arson, and alcohol and drug abuse
• Adolescent behavior patterns: Increase in drug and alcohol abuse, isolation was significant problem, and decrease in enuresis and arson
• Adult behavior patterns: No one reported enuresis; lower levels of arson and lying; drug and alcohol abuse were elevated
• Sexual behavior history: 28% were sexually molested, 20% had printed collection, no one had video collection, 88% were heterosexual, 20% identified themselves as pedophiles
Psychopathy: Only 4 of 20 offenders classified as psychopaths
http://www1.csbsju.edu/uspp/CrimPsych/CPSG-6.htm

Pensfan
verified psychiatric mental health nurse

 

[FrayedKnot]

Cook said officials also took a computer from her home --- she said it hadn't been used since late last year --- and searched her attic Wednesday.
snipped-
Read More: http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/ly...128-11e1-af57-0019bb2963f4.html#ixzz211pWN7rz


bbm if that is the case I am very curious how/where Lyric was getting on FB and friending people, within the last month or so.
Is there a public library?? Friends?

I may be a bit skewed, but I am kinda surprised that any household in 2012 does not have a working computer with internet access.

Even cases we read about where the family is all but destitute, they have FB pages and play Farmville and have commented on a blog and have email.

This is really the first hinky feeling I have gotten over the family. No working computer in over 6 months? Really?

And FTR, I totally accept that I may not have a true picture of average America.

 

[nikkiw319]

I checked out the owners of that garage with partial foundation over by the wooded area on the county assessors parcel map. Looks like it is co-owned by a father and adult son perhaps. Typed both of their names into the court records search and didn't find anything weird.

Links if anyone wants to do the same:
http://www2.co.black-hawk.ia.us/website/bhmap/viewer.htm
https://www.iowacourts.state.ia.us

Maybe Ollie has some insight on that house too. Early this fall it looked like they were trying to build a structure. Sadly, it looked as though it was being built by someone who had no business doing so. It was old boards, things were very uneven, it was just strange. Then, over the months, it looked like someone had been taking it all back apart and then there was nothing there really. I remember having some conversations with my husband when we were riding the trail about what on earth they were doing there.

 

[hollyblue]

snipped for brevity- oh Hollye, that made me think of a place a friend found yesterday poking around-
Deerwood Park campground +42.46075, -92.30817
and I also noticed a Bamboo Ridge campground and read about it - locals is it open now?? +42.44956, -92.31872

both are very closeby- I wonder if LE checked for any checkouts around Friday/Sat??
Or if anyone noticed any 'unusual' guests?

Wow! Both very, very close. Thanks!

http://goo.gl/maps/Hz36

http://goo.gl/maps/8TUH

 

[sweetpea33]

I may be a bit skewed, but I am kinda surprised that any household in 2012 does not have a working computer with internet access.

Even cases we read about where the family is all but destitute, they have FB pages and play Farmville and have commented on a blog and have email.

This is really the first hinky feeling I have gotten over the family. No working computer in over 6 months? Really?

And FTR, I totally accept that I may not have a true picture of average America.

alot of the people I know don't have working computers in the home because most people have smart phones, with access to computers at both school/work. especially kids...they all have smart phones around here!

 

[Ollipop]

There are houses on one side of the lake, and the interstate is on the other. I've never seen a boat on the lake. Granted, I've only lived here a year and only drive by it probably 1-3 times a week, I've never seen a boat, and I'm not sure why a boat would go on it, as it isn't very big.

Other locals: Do you think Aunt Tammy may be "off" on her distances? On JVM she'd say "It was about 300 yards that way and then 300-500 yards..." that's 3-5 football fields! I don't really think that area is that big? Am I way off base here? For her to say the dogs ran 300-500 yards into the wooded area seemed really far off to me.

She might be off, or she might be referring to the woods to the west of the lake. I haven't seen JVM (honestly don't even know what JVM stands for). Those woods might be about 500 yards away from where the bikes were found. They're less dense, though, and the girls would have to walk the length of the lake, in plain view of anyone across the lake (see my pics) and anyone on the road.

 

[GrainneDhu]

If he did he never admitted to the press,....unless I missed it. I wish the MSM would have ask about any fingerprints that might have been found on the bike, purse or phone. It seems LE wants to keep the public focused on the lake, when we know (from scanner thread) there is much more going on. Then add to what they most definitely are keeping close to the vest.

Reporters at one of the previous press conferences asked about fingerprints or DNA on the bicycles and the LE spokesperson (I think it was Abben) said very firmly that such information would not be released.

So no point in going there again today.

 

[Pensfan]

I may be a bit skewed, but I am kinda surprised that any household in 2012 does not have a working computer with internet access.

Even cases we read about where the family is all but destitute, they have FB pages and play Farmville and have commented on a blog and have email.

This is really the first hinky feeling I have gotten over the family. No working computer in over 6 months? Really?

And FTR, I totally accept that I may not have a true picture of average America.

Maybe they use a smart phone to access the internet?

 

[mahoolin]

Been SuperDad all day, just catching up.



There is a local transient or two. I am a disc golfer (was, anyway) and I and several of my discing friends consistently see the same couple guys on bikes - old, haggard, drunk, but very friendly. Earlier this spring, a member of my disc golf league (there is a course in Deerwood Park, a block from Meyers Lake), mentioned he'd sort of befriended a homeless guy (one of those two transients I'd seen and still see once in a while), and was taking him some blankets because its cold out. I have heard of a small camp on the other side of the interstate, in the woods near the river. By camp, I mean where one or two ppl sleep. I am certain the local police know of these ppl, I've seen them talking to them. I've personally talked to them once, when they were resting on the bench on the west end of the lake. They were articulate, friendly, but drunk. I had my kids with me. They were respectful, and did not strike me as dangerous or creepy in any way, just downtrodden. I've never seen either begging, loitering, or panhandling. They travel by bike, they keep to themselves, they apparently don't cause trouble.









I have "inside" info that I was not comfortable mentioning before seeing this from JVM, but I can confirm all of the above. I have no specific knowledge of DM's criminal record, but do know that he and Misti are in the process of terminating their marriage, and from what I understand were not to be around each other. Obviously recent events have made that impossible. I'm not sure what of this is public record. I don't believe they are/were attempting to keep any of this secret, however.

I really am this far back in the thread, but reading this I wanted to mention it since it backs up what I'd said earlier about the pressure in this family and them not exactly wanting to be under the microscope.

I'm honestly not sure I should be mentioning this at all, but did because I see it was brought up on national TV.



Yup, that is my suspicion as well. Either someone hid there and lured them into an awaiting vehicle, or did so back up by their home, and either hurriedly dumped the bikes back behind the lake, or left them and some other kids, now too scared to speak up, hopped on them and rode them down there. Obviously confirming that someone spotted the girls near the lake solidifies only one of those possibilities.

I suggested that they were maybe not missing from the lake yesterday. I agree that unsuspecting vandals could have corrupted a crime scene unknowingly and could be hesitant to come forward now. Probably a pretty common occurrence.

I do think we're spending a lot of time and energy on the lake though, and if the perp intended to throw LE off, well, it really worked on us here too. I think we need to think about other possibilities too.

Lots of twists and turns since last night - over 30 pages - wow! I can't read them all, but I gather one dad has meth problem and multiple arrests, which alters my thoughts of Lyric being somewhat naive. Children in environments like that are often wiser beyond their years, usually having seen and heard too much, and if the girls spend a lot of time together, it had to have affected Elizabeth on some level too.

What if Lyric was approached by someone with a way to help her dad? If she's not alienated from him and still has a decent relationship - why wouldn't she?

Wouldn't the idea of an abduction connected to the dad depend on size of the meth operation though? Small time, or well-entrenched, well organized far-reaching operation? Far-fetched but I wouldn't rule it out.

I'm hoping and praying those girls are not in the lake, and that this is all unraveled and the girls are home safely very soon. I'm trying to think positive.

:moo:

 

[FrayedKnot]

Maybe they use a smart phone to access the internet?

Ahhhh, like yours truly? Lol!

Very good point. I have a desktop and laptop and I still do most of my interwebz on my iphone.

Excellent point. Hink averted!

 

[Kamille]

According to a couple different interviews, Lyric's father DM was at his mother's house, napping. And had his 16 year old son (Lyric's brother) with him. It's difficult for me to believe that both his mother and his 16 year old son would lie to conceal his activities or that both would be able to lie convincingly.

I imagine that his adrenaline has been on full flow ever since Friday, he hasn't gotten enough sleep and he's on edge. Under those conditions, some people cry, others shut down and some people get angry. And being full of adrenaline and exhaustion, well, I know I don't have great emotional control under such circumstances.

Well I can certainly see how his alibi is kind of suspect. How many 30 something people "nap" at around noon? I don't think we've ever heard whether his mother was at home because I thought he stated at the beginning that he was at home with his son. Don't recall him mentioning his mother. And I don't know anything about the 16yr old so I don't know whether he would lie for his father.

Of course a "napping" alibi is a convenient one that does not have much leeway for error. It means that you were not on a phone, not on a computer, not watching television or otherwise awake and alert to activities going on around you and therefore you cannot trip up when questioned about any of those activities.

Now perhaps he was doing something he shouldn't have been doing that has absolutely nothing to do with the disappearance of the girls. Call it back luck or bad karma that this had to have happened at an "inopportune" time for him. And maybe that is why the focus is on him if LE do not believe his alibi. It doesn't pay to lie to LE about anything in these types of investigations IMO.

MOO

 

[nikkiw319]

I'm going to agree with Ollie. I've seen many people who have fallen into meth and it's nearly impossible to escape. It's the most addictive of drugs. As a social worker in this community, I have watched meth destroy everything for so many people and it's truely not what they want but they no longer have any control over their lives.

Their criminal records are public record and everything is on Iowa courts online for both parents.

I may be a bit skewed, but I am kinda surprised that any household in 2012 does not have a working computer with internet access.

Even cases we read about where the family is all but destitute, they have FB pages and play Farmville and have commented on a blog and have email.

This is really the first hinky feeling I have gotten over the family. No working computer in over 6 months? Really?

And FTR, I totally accept that I may not have a true picture of average America.

So many people just use their phones for Internet access anymore. Internet is expensive aroud here, high speed will run $50 a month or so and so many people are using smart phones with unlimited minutes, text, and data for the same price. Waterloo and evansdale have areas of wealth and poverty and Internet is not common in the areas where money is tight.

 

[palaminodee]

I may be a bit skewed, but I am kinda surprised that any household in 2012 does not have a working computer with internet access.

Even cases we read about where the family is all but destitute, they have FB pages and play Farmville and have commented on a blog and have email.

This is really the first hinky feeling I have gotten over the family. No working computer in over 6 months? Really?

And FTR, I totally accept that I may not have a true picture of average America.

Cousin EC's parents have FB pages, could have used their PC
DM and his mother Vicki ? both have FB pages, maybe using their PC's

 

[otto]

The LE spokesperson said the bikes were leaning against the fence when he got there. He said one bike had a kickstand the other did not. He did not confirm how they were found.

Exactly. A man said that he veered around a bike on the path at 12:27. If he veered around the bike and didn't touch it, then there's a good chance the bike did not belong to one of the girls. The girls bikes wear found leaning against the fence. We didn't hear about the color of the bike or any other details from the man that veered around a bike. He didn't say that he moved it and no one else has said the same thing.

Based on that, I think we can eliminate the 12:27 tip from the timeline ... unless ... the man came along the path after one bike had been left on the trail and the other was being retrieved from a vehicle. That is the only explanation I can come up with if the tip is credible, the man only saw one bike, he knew the color of the bike and it was on the path but later moved.

 

[palaminodee]

Well I can certainly see how his alibi is kind of suspect. How many 30 something people "nap" at around noon? I don't think we've ever heard whether his mother was at home because I thought he stated at the beginning that he was at home with his son. Don't recall him mentioning his mother. And I don't know anything about the 16yr old so I don't know whether he would lie for his father.

Of course a "napping" alibi is a convenient one that does not have much leeway for error. It means that you were not on a phone, not on a computer, not watching television or otherwise awake and alert to activities going on around you and therefore you cannot trip up when questioned about any of those activities.

Now perhaps he was doing something he shouldn't have been doing that has absolutely nothing to do with the disappearance of the girls. Call it back luck or bad karma that this had to have happened at an "inopportune" time for him. And maybe that is why the focus is on him if LE do not believe his alibi. It doesn't pay to lie to LE about anything in these types of investigations IMO.

MOO

No job and no vehicle to get anywhere

 

[duchessofdork]

What I just don't get is, if a perp wanted to get rid of a cell phone/purse, why go all the way to the fence? Why not just chuck it in the lake?

 

[sweetpea33]

Mahoollin does bring up a good point...Lyric being exposed to parents who were active meth users may have been around "strangers" often. Typically drug users have lots of different people in an out of the house and such. even though aunt Tammy had taught her what to do if someone trying to take her, if approached by a nice "stranger" she mayhave been fairly easy to lure.

 

[Pensfan]

Evansdale has homeless shelters.
http://www.homelessshelterdirectory.org/cgi-bin/id/city.cgi?city=Evansdale&state=IA
How large is the homeless population there? Is the shelter near the park?
(Twenty-five percent of the adult homeless population suffers from some form of severe mental illness)

Edit: They all appear to be in Waterloo.

 

[Kamille]

No job and no vehicle to get anywhere

Well apparently he had some "friends".

MOO