IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #32

[Foxfire]

03-02-2013 comment #1540

Quote: Otto

"The Washington State Attorney General’s Office also conducted research on child abduction murders and made the following observations based on its review of over 775 cases between 1968 and 2002:
in 76 percent of the murders of an abducted child, the child was murdered within 3 hours of the abduction;
in 89 percent of the cases, the missing child died within 24 hours of disappearing;
in nearly 60 percent of the cases, more than 2 hours passed between the time someone realized the child was missing and the time police were notified; and
the primary motive for the abductor was sexual assault"

The Federal Bureau of Investigation's Efforts to Combat Crimes Against Children

http://www.justice.gov/oig/reports/F...8/chapter3.htm

 

[Foxfire]

Why would Michael Klunder be in the Waterloo Iowa area?
http://www.alltheiowa.com/Local/Iowa/Waterloo/hog+farm+or+feedlot/C


http://www.argusleader.com/viewart/...issing-Iowa-girl-intensifies-around-hog-farms


He said search efforts were focused on that site and six other hog farming properties that Michael Klunder knew and could access through his work for his father-in-law, who managed them.
______________

(Photo of Klunder's red Toyota pickup truck at link)
http://wqad.com/2013/05/23/missing-iowa-girls-blood-found-at-hog-confinement/

Police said this red Toyota pickup truck belonged to Michael Klunder, the man accused of kidnapping two Dayton, Iowa-area girls after they got off their school bus Monday, May 20, 2013.
Iowa Department of Public Safety spokeswoman Jessica Lown said investigators have been reviewing Klunder's cellphone records to try to track his movements after the abduction, and have been receiving tips from residents who may have seen his distinct red Toyota pickup truck. It's not clear precisely how they developed the information that triggered the expanded search, she said.

Police released a photo of Klunder's truck, which had a temporary paper license plate on the back window, a Tommy Lift tailgate and a silver toolbox located on the driver's side. Investigators asked anyone who may have seen the truck Monday to come forward.

___________________
deja vu?

http://www.trutv.com/library/crime/serial_killers/predators/robert_pickton/6.html

Robert Pickton: The Vancouver Missing Women

 

[roseofsharon]

My theory still hasn't budged one iota. :sigh:

It's worth noting that Klunder stalked his prey, like most abductors. He parked where his prey was likely to be (eg a school bus stop) and called them to him. He didn't even have to get out of his car. :maddening:

Lizzie and Lyric were intercepted...not stalked. :moo:

But why would L and E be at a school bus stop ... school was out for the summer.

 

[SapphireSteel]

But why would L and E be at a school bus stop ... school was out for the summer.

I never said L&L were at a bus stop...:waitasec:

I was comparing one abduction to another. (Kathlynn).

Who knew the girls would be riding without an adult, around the Lake, where they (allegedly) had never been before? Did Klunder sit around Meyers Lake on the off chance that someone young, alone, and suitable would happen by? I doubt it.

If you accept the bikes were left as they fell, the girls were clearly intercepted while riding down the pathway.

This means that someone knew they would be there, and was waiting for them, as opposed to Klunder who went to a place where children are likely to be, made his selection, then almost without effort, abducted his victims.

He did not sit in a vacant bike path hoping some girls would come along without an adult, who fit his preferences. He went hunting in a victim rich environment, as predators do.

:moo:

 

[Marilynilpa]

I never said L&L were at a bus stop...:waitasec:

I was comparing one abduction to another. (Kathlynn).

Who knew the girls would be riding without an adult, around the Lake, where they (allegedly) had never been before? Did Klunder sit around Meyers Lake on the off chance that someone young, alone, and suitable would happen by? I doubt it.

If you accept the bikes were left as they fell, the girls were clearly intercepted while riding down the pathway.

This means that someone knew they would be there, and was waiting for them, as opposed to Klunder who went to a place where children are likely to be, made his selection, then almost without effort, abducted his victims.

He did not sit in a vacant bike path hoping some girls would come along without an adult, who fit his preferences. He went hunting in a victim rich environment, as predators do.

:moo:

IMO, you hit the nail on the head.

 

[tlcya]

MK didn't stalk his victims IMO. His victims were all ones who presented themselves at a convenient time. Stalking to me indicates watching, following, lurking. I don't think MK did that with his victims. He took the toddlers from their front yard if I recall, he attacked a schoolmate who he encountered and assaulted her in the bathroom, and the recent girls he kidnapped he encountered when they got off the bus. None of that appears to have involved much stalking or preplanning. His victims were random and convenient. MOO

We do not know enough to say if our girls were stalked or intercepted.

 

[Bootsctr]

http://globegazette.com/news/local/...11e2-b7e0-0019bb2963f4.html?mobile_touch=true

It won't open for me Foxfire. . . :scared:

 

[Bootsctr]

Not quite sure what this means...do you mean all but the oblivious think the girls were sexually assaulted?

If that's what you mean, I disagree.

IIRC it was Kent Smock who said "we don't even have a gender" in regards to the perp who took the girls.

I understand why everyone thinks Klunder is THE ONE but until LE say so, I personally doubt it.

I don't think of myself as "oblivious", more like, "not jumping to conclusions".

Respectfully, I don't know if Klunder is the one who took L&L, but he is as good as we have got right now. And we all know "we don't even have a gender" doesn't mean if it was a female sex offender that the girls were not sexually assaulted. At this point, I'm still not ruling anybody out, and unfortunately that includes family members too.

 

[Bootsctr]

MK didn't stalk his victims IMO. His victims were all ones who presented themselves at a convenient time. Stalking to me indicates watching, following, lurking. I don't think MK did that with his victims. He took the toddlers from their front yard if I recall, he attacked a schoolmate who he encountered and assaulted her in the bathroom, and the recent girls he kidnapped he encountered when they got off the bus. None of that appears to have involved much stalking or preplanning. His victims were random and convenient. MOO

We do not know enough to say if our girls were stalked or intercepted.

Exactly! We don't know enough to say if our girls were stalked or intercepted. I think Klunder did a lot of driving. He had a lot of time to troll and really accountable to no one. I assume he was not punching a time clock and in-laws trusted that he was taking care of the hog confinements. I think Klunder was in Evansdale on July 13th. I think he was trolling around driving. He drove through Meyers Lake and encountered Elizabeth and Lyric - totally unplanned - lured them to his vehicle just as he did Kathlynn and D - perhaps not with the offer of a job mowing a lawn, but maybe he had a puppy at that time or baby pigs. He subdued them just as he did Kathlynn and D - more than likely zipties. Not sure where he took them to assault and murder them, but he knew he was going to dump the bodies at 7-Bridges and in fact I believe he intended to dump them in the river just as he did Kathlynn. However, when he got to 7-Bridges he saw the river was low and he did not expect that and it threw a wrench into his plan of disposing the bodies, so he put them in the heavy cover of forest and grass. Maybe he planned to come back when the river was higher and dump the remains in the river at that point, or perhaps he was pretty confident the bodies would not be found. Five months later, thanks be to the hunters, the girls' bodies were found. If sexually assaulted, I'm not sure that DNA would remain as the bodies and clothing were exposed to the weather and wild critters. I am hopeful there were fibers or hair, perhaps dog hair that remained in the girls' clothing even after the passage of five months and being exposed to sun, wind, rain, etc. I hope something was retrieved and I hope Klunder's vehicle that he was driving in 2012 can be located. There probably won't be any blood evidence, but you never know... we can hope and we can pray that some trace of the girls might remain in that vehicle. lease:

 

[Marilynilpa]

If there is any evidence Klunder was in Evansdale, I haven't seen it. He has a connection to Bremer County but IIRC, that's the closest we can put him to Evansdale.

Was his job with the in-laws one where he was able to be away for long periods of time without having to account for his whereabouts?

I've always felt the person who took and killed Lyric and Lizzie was someone local who was familiar with Meyers Lake and knew where to park without being seen. To me, Klunder just doesn't fill the bill. JMO

 

[cindersoot]

Autopsy confirmed as Kathlynn. Cause of death, multiple blunt force.

 

[Foxfire]

It won't open for me FoxBluff. . . :scared:

Try this BSCTR;
http://globegazette.com/news/local/...11e2-b7e0-0019bb2963f4.html?mobile_touch=true

or google this: (GlobeGazette)first-victim-says-klunder-demonstrated-violence-early

 

[Foxfire]

Autopsy confirmed as Kathlynn. Cause of death, multiple blunt force.

MK's MO...Read MK's 1st Victim; Gansen's description of the physical violence that she suffered at the hands of the sadistic monster; Michael Klunder. Multiple bruises and over 100 stitches. A Sadistic Sexual Predator/Serial killer's physical violence and deviant behavior escalates and they hone their evil skills with each innocent victim devoured.

If the 12-year-old Dayton, Iowa, girl had not escaped, predator/sk Michael Klunder, would be hunting his next unsuspecting child in another quiet and friendly community with a false sense of security, imo..
This is why Law Enforcement must share all information with the American Public when a child goes missing, especially when there are indicators of a possible stranger abduction as in Elizabeth Collins, and Lyric Cook's case. The present focus by LE is on prosecution. This priority must be changed, to identifying and locating the predator before other innocent victims are taken...imo

'Tragic Irony'- the two Dayton, Iowa, girls/victims were taken only days before National Missing Children's Day; May 24, 2013 ...


http://globegazette.com/news/local/...11e2-b7e0-0019bb2963f4.html?mobile_touch=true

 

[Foxfire]

I never said L&L were at a bus stop...:waitasec:

I was comparing one abduction to another. (Kathlynn).

Who knew the girls would be riding without an adult, around the Lake, where they (allegedly) had never been before? Did Klunder sit around Meyers Lake on the off chance that someone young, alone, and suitable would happen by? I doubt it.

If you accept the bikes were left as they fell, the girls were clearly intercepted while riding down the pathway.

This means that someone knew they would be there, and was waiting for them, as opposed to Klunder who went to a place where children are likely to be, made his selection, then almost without effort, abducted his victims.

He did not sit in a vacant bike path hoping some girls would come along without an adult, who fit his preferences. He went hunting in a victim rich environment, as predators do.

:moo:

Quote:

Originally posted by cindersoot
03-03-2013, 11:44 AM #1551
The parents said the girls never bike that far, yet Mr. Carpenter stated that he saw them ride past his house on many occasions. Remember when you were a kid, did you ever go against your parents rules? Besides, the lake really isn't that far from Collins house.

 

[ktgirl]

Autopsy confirmed as Kathlynn. Cause of death, multiple blunt force.

I wish we knew the COD for Lizzie & Lyric.

 

[Bootsctr]

Try this BSCTR;
http://globegazette.com/news/local/...11e2-b7e0-0019bb2963f4.html?mobile_touch=true

or google this: (GlobeGazette)first-victim-says-klunder-demonstrated-violence-early

Thanks Foxfire! Google worked!

 

[Foxfire]

I wish we knew the COD for Lizzie & Lyric.

TY, ktgirl for sharing... imo, the COD for Lizzie & Lyric will be synonymous... "sharp & blunt force head trauma with other upper body bruises and injuries"..



Autopsy confirms body belongs to missing Iowa teen
Published 11:01 AM CDT Jun 09, 2013


Read more: http://www.ketv.com/news/local-news...20489064/-/tunt5cz/-/index.html#ixzz2VkJGcTKQ

 

[Dr. Know?]

I hope Elizabeth & Lyric didn't have multiple "sharp & blunt force" injuries. I surely wish Kathlynn hadn't had such a traumatic death as it reads. You look at his first known victim and her attack & Kathylnn's autopsy results, you just want to cry. What an evil man Klunder was. Get them off the streets & keep them off the streets!

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1680082-overview#a1

 

[Foxfire]

I hope Elizabeth & Lyric didn't have multiple "sharp & blunt force" injuries. I surely wish Kathlynn hadn't had such a traumatic death as it reads. You look at his first known victim and her attack & Kathylnn's autopsy results, you just want to cry. What an evil man Klunder was. Get them off the streets & keep them off the streets!

http://emedicine.medscape.com/article/1680082-overview#a1

If sexual predator Michael Klunder is responsible for Elizabeth & Lyric's abduction/murder, and I am confident that he is. Imo, the Justice system is complicit in all four of these children's abductions/murders. Everyone involved in MK's release from prison in 2011, should hang their heads in shame, imo...

http://wcfcourier.com/news/local/up...cle_1042c3a8-c1fa-11e2-8e63-0019bb2963f4.html

DAYTON, Iowa (AP) --- When Michael Klunder enticed two girls to enter his pickup truck near a rural Iowa school bus stop Monday, it was at least his third kidnapping in a long criminal history in which he was ordered to receive sex offender treatment as a teenager, according to police.

Even as authorities searched Wednesday for the still missing 15-year-old, residents and some law enforcement officials questioned why the 42-year-old Klunder wasn't locked up in prison or for treatment. In 1991, Klunder kidnapped a 21-year-old woman, who escaped, and later two 3-year-old girls, who were found alive in a garbage bin.

“It's unfortunate, looking at this guy's history, that he was able to walk the streets,” said Bremer County Sheriff Dan Pickett.

 

[Foxfire]

http://library-resources.cqu.edu.au/..._3/JFSCH12.pdf
(snipped - read more)
Child Abduction: Aged-Based Analyses of
Offender, Victim, and Offense Characteristics in
550 Cases of Alleged Child Disappearance*

While Finkelhor found that young school-aged children (age 5 to
12) were at lower risk for homicide, this study found that school-aged
children (age 6 to 12) experienced a large increase in the risk
of abduction and homicide. Hanfland et al. (16) also found an increase in the abduction and homicide of school-aged children (age6 to 12).
Again, differences in case selectivity may partially account for this finding. Within abduction offenses, there appears to
be a continuum of increasing risk for victims ultimately based on
the increased mobility and independence of the aging child.
Younger children are more often victimized by family members
and acquaintances in protected circumstances, whereas older, more
physically mature children (e.g., school-aged) are abducted outside
of the home by acquaintances and strangers primarily for sexual
reasons.
The data presented in this study were obtained from FBI child
abduction and homicide case files