IA IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, & Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #32

[threecrazykids]

http://www.kcrg.com/news/local/Evan...rs-Searching-for-Driver-of-SUV-212788251.html

Heather and Drew are talking now too...:facepalm:

 

[threecrazykids]

According to this reporter (at the end) Heather and Drew have heard the white SUV chatter before and that this is nothing new.

 

[Foxfire]

At the time LE searched 7 Bridges and didn't find anything, they were probably relying on the statistic that says that most bodies are dumped within something like 75 feet of a roadway.

When time, personnel and resources are all limited, the people in charge are stuck with trying to figure out how to get the most bang for their buck. Relying on the statistics to indicate the most likely zone for finding bodies, they missed the actual bodies (which were something like 300 feet from the nearest road). I'm not going to badmouth them for that, they made the best decision they could at the time they made it.

Grainne Dhu, compliance of the victim/s is the first rule of prey in abductions. imo, if L & L were compliant to the abductor's demands, they may have been forced to walk near the location where their bodies were located in 7 bridges park.

The video below shows vehicle access to L & L's remains location..

MISSING NO MORE: Readlyn man hunted near site where Evansdale cousins were found - YouTube

MISSING NO MORE: Readlyn man hunted near site where Evansdale cous

 

[palaminodee]

Actually, LE is following the gold standard in identifications by not asking the witnesses to agree on a photo.

Human memory is malleable. Research shows that picking out a photo or creating a sketch of a perp solidifies that particular image in the witness's mind. There has been a bunch or research done on photo and actual lineups, for instance. One simple, easy to execute change that increases the accuracy of witness IDs by a considerable percentage is to present each photo or person in the lineup separately.

Research shows that when a group of photos or persons are presented, the witness tends to pick out the person in the group who most closely resembles the person they saw. When the photos or persons are presented individually, the witness only has their own memory to compare with, making for a much more accurate ID.

This creates a huge investigative problem; for instance, if the witness starts out saying "light coloured" and with encouragement progresses to saying "white" then perps known to own a light blue vehicle will tend to be eliminated. And in court, of course, such a discrepancy can be a huge problem for the prosecution. In reality, what the witness saw was a light blue vehicle in the shadow of a building and the change of light conditions fooled their eye.

As that story illustrates, it's far better to get too many tips than it is to have someone withhold information because they assume someone else turned in the same information or because their memory differs in detail from information already released.

So, in Lyric and Elizabeth's case, what if someone remembers seeing a vehicle on Maiden Lane but in their memory, it was a white full sized van? If they see a photo of an SUV, they may decide that what they saw wasn't relevant or that they were mistaken.

Tangential comment: my 17 year old full sized van just went into a coma a few weeks ago. I gave it to a friend who has been good to us and he's gotten it running again, figures it has another 150K miles in it. He does his own vehicle work (is a NASCAR mechanic for fun), so had the skill to track down the wiring short without paying a small fortune.

My father is in love with his 20+ year old Mazda and thinks it is the perfect car.

My vet is still driving and babying the BMW she was given as a high school graduation present... that was more than 30 years ago.

None of us looked particularly out of place in older vehicles. It's not like California, where you see older vehicles that look pristine, almost like they've been restored but it's not unusual to see an elderly vehicle still on the road, wrinkles, age spots and all.

It is true that midwestern winters are hard on vehicles but it is also true that a lot of Iowans are frugal at heart and when they buy a new vehicle, they intend to get the full 300,000 miles out of it. In fact, that van was the first time I ever let go of a vehicle with less than 200K miles on it.

It also depends on the person.
Personally, i can identify most older vehicles, I have no idea why, but I have the attention to detail.
I have to remind myself some don't.

 

[Marilynilpa]

A combination of new and old information prompted law enforcement Monday to renew a request for the public’s help in the ongoing investigation of the disappearance and deaths of cousins Lyric Cook-Morrissey and Elizabeth Collins.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...11e2-be6a-001a4bcf887a.html?comment_form=true

 

[24Roses]

I would think by now LE would now if MK had a white vehicle in July 2012, or they are keeping it to themselves to see if anyone else comes forward about a white vehicle. Also, wouldn't LE know if anyone from Evansdale owns a similar vehicle. Maybe car lots and junk yards may remember if someone traded or got rid of a white SUV?

 

[Foxfire]

It also depends on the person.
Personally, i can identify most older vehicles, I have no idea why, but I have the attention to detail.
I have to remind myself some don't.

palaminodee, hopefully at least one of the three VOI witnesses has this ability. Many vehicles also have decals or other ways of identifying them.

A photo or photos of the type vehicle of interest should be shared via ms media to prevent confusion, imo. Most missing/murdered person's cases are solved due to tips from the public. We live in the age of communication. The American public is analogous to a security camera across the landscape.

It is encouraging to see investigators changing their strategy to include the public.

 

[Marilynilpa]

http://www.kcrg.com/news/local/Evan...rs-Searching-for-Driver-of-SUV-212788251.html

Heather and Drew are talking now too...:facepalm:

"It's hard too just because you are hoping for more information, you know, something like more would come out than this vehicle description, but we are just always waiting for the day to find out what really happened,” said Elizabeth’s Father Drew Collins.

http://www.kcrg.com/news/local/Evan...rs-Searching-for-Driver-of-SUV-212788251.html

Drew wants to know what happened, which makes more sense to me than Heather's previously stated desire to not know the details.

Even if this white SUV lead doesn't pan out, maybe new tips will be generated. As many of us have stated, someone knows something.

 

[Squeeze]

I would think by now LE would now if MK had a white vehicle in July 2012, or they are keeping it to themselves to see if anyone else comes forward about a white vehicle. Also, wouldn't LE know if anyone from Evansdale owns a similar vehicle. Maybe car lots and junk yards may remember if someone traded or got rid of a white SUV?

See, exactly. That's my point. They could be trying to confirm that he was in the area. Maybe he somehow missed the surveillance cameras and they need eyewitness accounts. Also explains all the hype about the video of the white van at the Casey's on River Forest. They obviously weren't looking for just any random white van.

 

[Foxfire]

A combination of new and old information prompted law enforcement Monday to renew a request for the public’s help in the ongoing investigation of the disappearance and deaths of cousins Lyric Cook-Morrissey and Elizabeth Collins.

http://wcfcourier.com/news/evansdal...11e2-be6a-001a4bcf887a.html?comment_form=true

The paper temporary license plate on MJK may be an indication as to why the VOI has been released to the public by investigators, imo.

Did MJK own or have access to another vehicle on July 13, 2012? Did MJK have a company owned vehicle? Did MJK have associates/sidekicks? If so did they have access to other vehicle/s?


<sniped & BBM from above linked article>


Smock said the newly released information was a combination of old and new reports.

&#8220;Earlier on, within the first two or three months of the girls going missing, as we were interviewing people ... a couple of different people identified the vehicle as being on Arbutus,&#8221; Smock said. &#8220;A few months ago, we received some information from another party who had seen a similar vehicle on the east side of the lake.&#8221;

The latest information came from a woman who assumed police had already been told about what she saw, but they had not, Smock said.

He said no description is available of the person or persons in the vehicle.

Additionally, the abduction of two girls in Dayton and the subsequent murder of one of them grabbed investigators&#8217; attention just days after they received the latest information on the white SUV.

Officials are investigating if the suspect in the Dayton case, Michael Klunder, who committed suicide, is linked to Lyric and Elizabeth.

&#8220;We are still working on that,&#8221; Smock said.

 

[Dr. Know?]

Thanks Foxfire!

Additionally, the abduction of two girls in Dayton and the subsequent murder of one of them grabbed investigators&#8217; attention just days after they received the latest information on the white SUV.

That kind of puts it all out there. I've read a few months after E&L's abduction the tip came in, a few months ago, and now it's days before K&D were abducted.

 

[Snowbunny]

I did a search on google for 1990 SUVs and here are a few:

1990 Land-Rover Range Rover Vogue SE Series I
1990 Ford Trucks
1990 Chevrolet S-10 Blazer Tahoe 4WD SUV
Jeep Cherokee Laredo 1991 - Land Rover LRX - Zimbio

Hope it helps!

 

[tlcya]

my understanding is that the two witnesses came forward pretty promptly (within the first month of the abduction) and that the third witness came forward a few months later.

Certainly the previous reports indicated that the SUV tips are not new or recent by any stretch. Interesting catch that.

 

[SapphireSteel]

Grainne Dhu, compliance of the victim/s is the first rule of prey in abductions. imo, if L & L were compliant to the abductor's demands, they may have been forced to walk near the location where their bodies were located in 7 bridges park.

The video below shows vehicle access to L & L's remains location..

MISSING NO MORE: Readlyn man hunted near site where Evansdale cousins were found - YouTube

MISSING NO MORE: Readlyn man hunted near site where Evansdale cous

I have posted about this before and our resident map maker, Otto, is adamant this hunter indicates the incorrect area.

Personally I think the hunter is right. I think the film clip shows the correct area and the maps we have on here are less than accurate.

:cow:

 

[SapphireSteel]

I knew about it.

This whole thing is getting more inexplicable by the day.

LE seem so casual about it all.

:cow:

 

[Foxfire]

I have posted about this before and our resident map maker, Otto, is adamant this hunter indicates the incorrect area.

Personally I think the hunter is right. I think the film clip shows the correct area and the maps we have on here are less than accurate.

:cow:

Luv Otto's maps which have, and continue to help tremendously in many crimes that we have sleuthed here at websleuths. I see no reason to doubt the ole local retired firefighter and his spouse who owned property nearby and knew the neighboring farmer personally.

Something that jumped out at me was the remark by the FF's spouse about there being picnic tables there at one time. I could visualize possible outings there by MJK and his family, or the school for boys that he attended in Bremer county.. jmho

 

[Foxfire]

I knew about it.

This whole thing is getting more inexplicable by the day.

LE seem so casual about it all.

:cow:

RE: I knew about it

Knew about what? The white SUV witnessed on 07/13/2012 at the park, near the bike path?

 

[SapphireSteel]

RE: I knew about it

Knew about what? The white SUV witnessed on 07/13/2012 at the park, near the bike path?

No.

The existence of a mystery white van in Evansdale that day.


The request for the Elk Run Heights van driver to contact them, for example, implies a white van involvement to me, even though LE have not confirmed this.


Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, and Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #18



I remember when LE first asked for the driver of the white van sighted at Caseys to contact them. The language they used was very strong. I regret not copying and pasting this (the articles have since changed) but they said the driver DOES have knowledge that will help them.

Not that he may know something, or that he may be a witness, or they want to eliminate him, but that he "has information".

The strong language may indicate their belief at the time that a white van was used, or at the very least the driver of that white van was in a place at a time that he was almost guaranteed to have seen something...but it turns out, he didn't.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, and Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #18



Plenty more at the links.

 

[cindersoot]

OMG! I'm finally back....what has been the main topic? Oh, please fill me in, I have been having fits trying to zoom in and out on my blackberry, UGH.. now my pc is back, yea!

 

[Foxfire]

No.

The existence of a mystery white van in Evansdale that day.


The request for the Elk Run Heights van driver to contact them, for example, implies a white van involvement to me, even though LE have not confirmed this.


Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, and Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #18


I remember when LE first asked for the driver of the white van sighted at Caseys to contact them. The language they used was very strong. I regret not copying and pasting this (the articles have since changed) but they said the driver DOES have knowledge that will help them.

Not that he may know something, or that he may be a witness, or they want to eliminate him, but that he "has information".

The strong language may indicate their belief at the time that a white van was used, or at the very least the driver of that white van was in a place at a time that he was almost guaranteed to have seen something...but it turns out, he didn't.

Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Found Deceased IA - Elizabeth Collins, 8, and Lyric Cook, 10, Evansdale, 13 July 2012 - #18



Plenty more at the links.

SapphireSteel, I think that there is still confusion about the white van.

LE is describing a white SUV which is not the same vehicle as the van sighted at Caseys'...and has nothing to do with that incident. This is why the release of photo/s of the vehicle/s of interest is very important, imo..