ID - 2 year boy accidentally shoots and kills mother in walmart in ths US

[sonjay]

GardenLady & I have said we wanted it, not that it would happen, nor that we have any power to make it happen. Noone is gonna take your guns away from you.

There's something of a circular argument going on here. Essentially, your message here goes something like this:

"We would take away your guns if we could, but we can't, so we won't, so you're paranoid for thinking that we would."

Frankly, the only reason guns haven't been banned is because gun owners are so vigilant in protecting our rights. Because certainly the forces that support gun bans would have done so if they could have.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Just curious -- what does it mean to you beyond 'criminal'?

I use the Merriam-Webster definition.

noun \ˈthəg\

: a violent criminal

That differentiates a from some petty criminal who is a shoplifter or someone caught with pot or something along those lines.

http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/🤬🤬🤬🤬
ETA

I think that using the word "" in denoting these miscreants is being too nice.

 

[sonjay]

How can one live their life to guaranty they will not have contact with an armed felon? It can happen anywhere. I posted up thread where an innocent lady was shot by a convicted felon in an affluent low crime area near me. What did she do wrong? Nothing.

I will continue to use the word "" where I feel it works in getting my point across.

Susanna Gratia Hupp simply went to Luby's for lunch with her parents.

Susan Gonzales was watching television in her own living room.

Linda Herman was at home with her two kids.

The 15-year-old son of a sheriff's deputy was at home with his 12-year-old sister when he used an AR-15 to defend himself and his sister from 2 home invaders.

A 45-year-old woman was at home, asleep, in her home in an upscale gated community when 4 thugs invaded her home, tied up her son, and raped her.

Yeah, that's the ticket, just live your life so as to avoid the thugs. Don't we wish it were that easy.

I personally prefer the word "." Using a 3-syllable word like "criminal" just sounds too sophisticated to use in describing the violent lowlifes who do this sort of thing.

 

[sonjay]

Just curious -- what does it mean to you beyond 'criminal'?

A more interesting question might be, What does it mean to CoolJ?

I use it the way ranch does: violent criminal. Not mere shoplifters, or people who sell loosies, or jaywalkers. I mean, violent people who use force to prey on weaker people and hurt or kill people. Or, attempt to hurt people; sometimes their intended victims are prepared to defend themselves. The people attempting to hurt them are still thugs, though.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

Yeah, that's the ticket, just live your life so as to avoid the thugs. Don't we wish it were that easy.

I personally prefer the word "." Using a 3-syllable word like "criminal" just sounds too sophisticated to use in describing the violent lowlifes who do this sort of thing.

SBM


There's plenty of cases where innocent people doing absolutely nothing wrong have been assaulted, seriously injured or killed by thugs. That's a fact that can't be denied.

The Second Amendment affords all Americans the right to bear arms in self defense. Not all Americans chose to utilize that right. I'm fine with that. Just don't try and abridge my rights to defend myself.

JMO.

 

[Deleted member 39678]

There's something of a circular argument going on here. Essentially, your message here goes something like this:

"We would take away your guns if we could, but we can't, so we won't, so you're paranoid for thinking that we would."

Frankly, the only reason guns haven't been banned is because gun owners are so vigilant in protecting our rights. Because certainly the forces that support gun bans would have done so if they could have.

BBM

I think that the American public has been lucky in Supreme Court rulings. The President appoints the Justices and the Senate confirms those appointments. That's why voting is so important.

Time will tell if we stay lucky. JMO.

 

[Sonya610]

I think it is a great idea for Big Brother to keep a tight rein on who is buying guns. I mean eventually you are going to get it ,right? What's the rush?

See and that is WHY most states do not have gun registration. So the government does NOT have a handy list of people to visit during a crisis or any other time.

The government illegally seized guns during Katrina -- many were NEVER returned:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q2BXH0JfOc

 

[sonjay]

See and that is WHY most states do not have gun registration. So the government does NOT have a handy list of people to visit during a crisis or any other time.

The government illegally seized guns during Katrina -- many were NEVER returned:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Q2BXH0JfOc

I was so proud that my state was one of the first, after Katrina, to pass a law prohibiting the confiscation of firearms during a state of emergency.

It's sad that such a law is needed, but at least our legislators stepped up to the plate to make sure that what happened there doesn't happen here.

My husband lived in Miami when Hurricane Andrew hit. He knows first-hand the value of having a firearm during the aftermath of such a disaster.

LE absolutely cannot be counted on in a situation like that; you're on your own. I guess some people believe that they would have the ability to fight off roving gangs of thugs in a situation like that with baseball bats and knives. I know that I don't have that ability.

 

[Sonya610]

LE absolutely cannot be counted on in a situation like that; you're on your own. I guess some people believe that they would have the ability to fight off roving gangs of thugs in a situation like that with baseball bats and knives. I know that I don't have that ability.

Yes, LEO cannot be expected to handle things. In addition if troops get involved then folks need to realize they are no longer seen as individuals, but as problems that need to be "managed".

Sadly the folks that had their property stolen in the video didn't realize that, they were HONEST which is why they were targeted, the honest law abiding people are the easiest to control so they have their rights trampled on FIRST.

It also supports keeping multiple firearms, if they ask and you say you DON'T have a weapon they may say you need to come with them because you are defenseless, if you say you DO then they may take it. Admit to having one weapon and make it your least expensive so you can hand it over if required (if the poop hits the fan it isn't about being "right" or proving a point, it is about survival).

 

[kline]

Or the guy who shot the dad in the movie theater.

Like Zimmerman, and Davi's's killer (his name escapes me at the moment), some of these nuts who are carrying just seem to be spoiling for a fight.

Yeah unfortunately it seems alot more folks are carrying as an act of political posturing,or as a statement of resentment towards certain groups of Americans rather then just taking steps to insure personal safety.
Probably not a good reason to seek out the option of deadly force.

 

[Elley Mae]

I doubt he meant any disrespect but its obvious from your posts that you view The government of the United States of America and many in Law Enforcement as a hostile enemy.
And you feel it is crucial to have the option to respond against them with deadly force.
To some people myself included,that fits the definition of paranoia and living in fear..

bbm, Not sure about Sonjay, I find them to be inept more then hostile. jmo

 

[daisy7]

Please read and comprehend the laws about firearm sales at gun shows.

The laws for all sales of firearms apply at gun shows exactly the same way they apply elsewhere.

The laws are:

FFL dealers must conduct background checks as required by law, regardless of where the sale takes place.

Private sellers are not required to conduct background checks, regardless of where the sale takes place.

There is no gun show loophole. There is no law that specifically exempts gun shows from any law regulating firearm sales.

I'll repeat: The laws for all firearm sales apply at gun shows exactly the same as they apply anywhere and everywhere else.

There is so much misinformation out there about guns and gun laws, it could be a full time job trying to get correct information out there.

BBM. This is the loophole.

Department of the Treasury, Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco & Firearms
June 2000
FOLLOWING THE GUN: ENFORCING FEDERAL LAWS AGAINST FIREARMS TRAFFICKERS
In the ATF trafficking investigations reviewed here, gun shows were associated with the diversion of approximately 26,000 firearms. Trafficking of firearms at and through gun shows was more prevalent in the trafficking investigations submitted by the Southwest (22 percent) and Western (21 percent) regions
when compared to trafficking investigations submitted by the Central (15 percent), South-east (12 percent), and Northeast (8 percent) regions of the United States.

A prior review of ATF gun show investigations shows that prohibited persons, such as convicted felons and juveniles, do personally buy firearms at gun shows and gun shows are sources of firearms that are trafficked to such prohibited persons. The gun show review found that firearms were diverted at and
through gun shows by straw purchasers, un-regulated private sellers, and licensed dealers.

Felons were associated with selling or purchasing firearms in 46 percent of the gun show investigations. Firearms that were illegally diverted at or through gun shows were recovered in subsequent crimes, including homicide and robbery, in more than a third of the gun show investigations.

http://web.archive.org/web/20030331...re-explo_pub/pdf/followingthegun_internet.pdf

Maybe it's better if I call it a background check loophole instead of a gun show loophole?

 

[TrackerSam]

rsbm --

Quote Originally Posted by sonjay View Post

Only the law-abiding are subject to any of the restrictions.
rsbm --


Oh, so you're telling us that crimes are never committed using legally purchased weapons? I'd like to see a source for that, please.

That's really torturing what was said to fit your bias. Please provide an exact quote of anyone saying " crimes are never committed using legally purchased weapons". You can't, can you?

 

[TrackerSam]

The National Media Won’t Report on this Good Samaritan with Gun who Saved Woman from Violent Assault

http://www.thefederalistpapers.org/...with-gun-who-saved-woman-from-violent-assault

He didn't have to fire the gun, he only needed to point it to stop the violence.

 

[Sonya610]

GardenLady & I have said we wanted it, not that it would happen, nor that we have any power to make it happen. Noone is gonna take your guns away from you.

Well look at the bright side, you live in California, a state that has the most restrictive gun laws in the entire nation.

You should be happy there. If you are worried about the gun laws in other states then just pass laws that involve LONG prison sentences for firearms brought into California from other states. Course that won't stop firearms/drugs from crossing in from Mexico, but that isn't really a concern, right?

 

[sonjay]

I doubt he meant any disrespect but its obvious from your posts that you view The government of the United States of America and many in Law Enforcement as a hostile enemy.
And you feel it is crucial to have the option to respond against them with deadly force.
To some people myself included,that fits the definition of paranoia and living in fear..

This thread is much better off without this sort of insulting nonsense.

 

[sonjay]

BBM. This is the loophole.



http://web.archive.org/web/20030331...re-explo_pub/pdf/followingthegun_internet.pdf

Maybe it's better if I call it a background check loophole instead of a gun show loophole?

There is no background check loophole either.

I so prefer facts and perspective over emotion-driven hysteria. Straight from the Bureau of Justice Statistics:



http://bjs.gov/content/pub/pdf/fuo.pdf

 

[sonjay]

That's really torturing what was said to fit your bias. Please provide an exact quote of anyone saying " crimes are never committed using legally purchased weapons". You can't, can you?

The only way to continue to cling to some points of view is to torture what was said by those holding a different view.

What I have said, and what is undeniably true, is that CCW permit holders commit crimes at a lower rate than the general population.

 

[CoolJ]

The only way to continue to cling to some points of view is to torture what was said by those holding a different view.

What I have said, and what is undeniably true, is that CCW permit holders commit crimes at a lower rate than the general population.

Of course they do!! Because criminals cannot be CCW permit holders. It may be a fact, but for me, it is a meaningless fact.

 

[Mrs G Norris]

Just a little gun insanity ..

Parents film baby playing with a gun and do nothing as she puts the weapon in her mouth
http://www.news.com.au/world/north-...pon-in-her-mouth/story-fnh81jut-1227181172978

Machine Gun America theme park lets kids as young as 13 shoot guns
http://www.news.com.au/travel/trave...as-13-shoot-guns/story-fnjpja3r-1227161694430